Given that the last several years of development have been aimed at canceling out rather than exacerbating factional discrepancies, I would be very surprised by this.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
I'd doubt this method for one reason... It would be an active punishment for switching sides.
While it was stated at HeroCon that there would be something done to reward those who stayed Hero Only or stayed Villain Only, I somewhat doubt side specific enhancements as a method of reward / punishment.
Quote:
Actually, a faction specific IO would be an incentive for staying true for one side if moving towards a different faction would make it less effective. Whether you want to define it as a punishment for switching or an incentive for staying, it amounts to the same thing: a reward for staying true to your faction.
|
Originally Posted by je_saist
I'd doubt this method for one reason... It would be an active punishment for switching sides.
While it was stated at HeroCon that there would be something done to reward those who stayed Hero Only or stayed Villain Only, I somewhat doubt side specific enhancements as a method of reward / punishment. |
Quote:
And yet exacerbating discrepanices remain (hero villain epics, number of TFs/SFs, etc.).|
Originally Posted by Nethergoat
Given that the last several years of development have been aimed at canceling out rather than exacerbating factional discrepancies, I would be very surprised by this.
|
What would be mean spirited is if the villain IO set was substantially inferior to the hero one. That would work the conspiracy theorists who decry dev villain hatred up in arms.
I find this exceedingly unlikely.
Every added set is a pain in the rear of epic proportions for the devs.
It's not consistent with what we understand about the drop system as it exists today. (More code changes required.)
It contrasts dramatically to normalize efforts to normalize rewards across factions. See: merit median rate normalization, accolade powers.
It either changes existing builds (something that has to be a massive no-no except for balance fixes) or requires a huge number of new sets (which introduces new, IO-related balance issues).
In all, I just don't see why the devs would consider this attractive.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Quote:
I agree with the Goat on this one. If the devs have been paying attention, every time they have diversified the number and types of drops, or have expanded the system by adding in another currency, prices have climbed for some things and the costs for others have skyrocketed (Costumes, Merits, AE tickets, PvP recipes are all prime examples) adding goods with out increasing the rate at which those goods are supplied increase the rarity and therefore the price.|
Originally Posted by Fury Flechette
And yet exacerbating discrepanices remain (hero villain epics, number of TFs/SFs, etc.).
What would be mean spirited is if the villain IO set was substantially inferior to the hero one. That would work the conspiracy theorists who decry dev villain hatred up in arms. |
I'm hoping that the devs aren't so blind to the in game economy that they realize this.
The other thing to note would be restrictions on the IO sets that you posit. What happens when you slot one? If the result is that you can't switch sides then the devs have just blown their entire new expansion out of the water which would be a bad thing to do.
Would the IO pop out of the slot when you switch? That would be something that has never been done previously and would also be a bad precedent to set especially considering the costs in time or inf of set IOs.
Would the villian/hero be able to change sides after slotting one without a punative penalty? If so, it defeats the purpose that you posit.
I doubt it happens for any or all of those reasons.
Edit to add - that the TF/SF discrepancy is being adressed by side switching and the so called PPP discrepancy has been blown out of proportion. Villians are generalists, PPPs are nice but aren't nearly as important for the villians in general. Heroes on the other hand, being specialists, have several survival/damage tools withheld from them until they get their APP. The hero exception is the scrapper and look how few APPs there are (especially prior to I16) and how hard most of their APPs suck. The scrapper, like the villians, can get along just fine without an APP/PPP.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
The only way it would make any sense at all is if it followed the PvP IO model- anyone can slot them, but they only drop in one sector of the game.
But that would need a merged market, or a relatively trivial side-switching mechanism.
I don't see why they'd bother- PvP IOs were a lure to PvP.
Players who like heroes already play there, players who like villains likewise, and GR's side switching will be lure enough for those inclined to take characters on the journey to one side or the other.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Quote:
I generally agree.|
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
I agree with the Goat on this one. If the devs have been paying attention, every time they have diversified the number and types of drops, or have expanded the system by adding in another currency, prices have climbed for some things and the costs for others have skyrocketed (Costumes, Merits, AE tickets, PvP recipes are all prime examples) adding goods with out increasing the rate at which those goods are supplied increase the rarity and therefore the price.
|
Quote:
| I'm hoping that the devs aren't so blind to the in game economy that they realize this. |
Quote:
|
The other thing to note would be restrictions on the IO sets that you posit. What happens when you slot one? If the result is that you can't switch sides then the devs have just blown their entire new expansion out of the water which would be a bad thing to do. Would the IO pop out of the slot when you switch? That would be something that has never been done previously and would also be a bad precedent to set especially considering the costs in time or inf of set IOs. |
Quote:
| Would the villian/hero be able to change sides after slotting one without a punative penalty? If so, it defeats the purpose that you posit. |
Quote:
| Edit to add - that the TF/SF discrepancy is being adressed by side switching and the so called PPP discrepancy has been blown out of proportion. Villians are generalists, PPPs are nice but aren't nearly as important for the villians in general. Heroes on the other hand, being specialists, have several survival/damage tools withheld from them until they get their APP. The hero exception is the scrapper and look how few APPs there are (especially prior to I16) and how hard most of their APPs suck. The scrapper, like the villians, can get along just fine without an APP/PPP. |
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Fury Flechette
I'd speculate that the IO would just turn red, much like a SO turns red after outleveling it.
In my scenario, yes, but the IO would turn red upon complete side switching. Admittedly, this probably wouldn't go over well with the player base as a popular game mechanic. |
Then what makes you think it's in the pipeline?
Why would they then cook up some faction-specific IOs that didn't work using the main feature of their upcoming paid expansion?
It just doesn't fit with the direction the game is going.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
I don't think this will happen, but for a different reason. IOs are intended to be optional; and if faction-specific IOs are given out as a reward for not switching sides, then players who're not interested in the IO system can't benefit from them. I think any reward for being an exemplary hero or villain will be more universal in nature.
There ought to be powerful, unique, worthwhile rewards for not switching sides, and I would like more ultra-rare IO set recipes to be implemented in GR regardless, but I don't think faction-specific IOs will ever be a reality.
Quote:
Creating a feature as the centerpiece of a paid expansion then handing out powerful incentives NOT to use it doesn't seem like an efficient use of resources to me.
|
Originally Posted by Laevateinn
There ought to be powerful, unique, worthwhile rewards for not switching sides....
|
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Don't make them faction-specific, just make them give larger/additional bonuses if you are "pure" on either side.
Suggestions:
Super Packs Done Right
Influence Sink: IO Level Mod/Recrafting
Random Merit Rolls: Scale cost by Toon Level
Posi did say in an interview that there would be something of a reward/incentive for staying 'pure' Hero/Villain.
I doubt this idea would be it, but certainly the possibility is there.
Something needs to be in place to stop the 'default' best position being that of getting to Rogue/Vigilante and staying there.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
Quote:
Good point, I hadn't considered that.
|
Originally Posted by Catwhoorg
Something needs to be in place to stop the 'default' best position being that of getting to Rogue/Vigilante and staying there.
|
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Quote:
It would have to be too big an incentive to remain where you are (the advantages are too great at the moment, especially considering the villian's comparative lack of content) and it can't be a punative punishment for migrating (that goes back to the devs observation that the players view that anything less powerful in X state is a nerf).|
Originally Posted by Catwhoorg
Posi did say in an interview that there would be something of a reward/incentive for staying 'pure' Hero/Villain.
I doubt this idea would be it, but certainly the possibility is there. Something needs to be in place to stop the 'default' best position being that of getting to Rogue/Vigilante and staying there. |
I don't see how the reward for staying pure could possibly outweigh the advantages of switching without being vastly overpowered.
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
Quote:
I think Cat's point was that being part of one faction or the other will provide a benefit, while staying in the 'gray area' won't.|
Originally Posted by Miladys_Knight
It would have to be too big an incentive to remain where you are (the advantages are too great at the moment, especially considering the villian's comparative lack of content) and it can't be a punative punishment for migrating (that goes back to the devs observation that the players view that anything less powerful in X state is a nerf).
I don't see how the reward for staying pure could possibly outweigh the advantages of switching without being vastly overpowered. |
As an incentive to 'go all the way' in a switch, instead of just hanging out in Vigilante land running everbody's content for free. =P
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Quote:
Why not? I don't expect characters to be rewarded just for not switching sides. I do, however, expect that there will be (as part of the expansion) content and challenges for characters who stay consistent to their alignment to complete, establishing themselves as an exemplar of their alignment, which gives unique and powerful rewards.
|
Originally Posted by Nethergoat
Creating a feature as the centerpiece of a paid expansion then handing out powerful incentives NOT to use it doesn't seem like an efficient use of resources to me.
|
Rogues/Vigilantes from what we know can enter the 'other' side of the city and can do some portion of the content there.
If there is nothing added to remain a 'pure' hero/villain, then rogue/vigilante becomes the default 'best'
Again, I dont think IOs will be it, but there must be something.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
Quote:
Same thing still applies. I don't think that what ever bonus staying pure gives can possibly outweigh the advantage of being a vigilante without being vastly overpowered (rogue might be a different story though.) In fact as far as the market goes sliding from vigilante to villian might be nerfing yourself unless you are fully outfitted with IOs first.
|
Originally Posted by Nethergoat
I think Cat's point was that being part of one faction or the other will provide a benefit, while staying in the 'gray area' won't.
As an incentive to 'go all the way' in a switch, instead of just hanging out in Vigilante land running everbody's content for free. =P |
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
This is pure speculation on my part, but I think an IO based on what faction you are will come to pass.
Hero specific IO - Set bonuses equivalent to PvP/purple IOs. Significantly less bonuses if you are a vigilante. Completely non-functional or red if slotted in a villain/rogue.
Villain specific IO - Set bonuses equivalent to PvP/purple IOs. Significantly less bonuses if you are a rogue. Completely non-functional or red if slotted in a hero/vigilante.
I don't know the dev's motivation for their insistence of keeping the markets separate in GR, but I suspect that they are planning something like this. Could this be the "reward" for staying true as a hero or villain? It's the only thing to me that makes sense. Supposed dominance of hero players over villain players is a poor justification simply because most players play both factions. I think the separation is due to something more tangible that they are planning or will announce.
Again, pure speculation on my part. As a disclaimer, I have no proof of this whatsoever. However, to me something like this may be one of the reasons why the devs keep the markets separated.