TT does more damage. 8.45 + (8 * 6.26) = 58.53. 10* 3.06 = 30.60. 50.08 > 30.60. It gets even worse when you consider that TT also has better DPA (1.848 sec animation for 58.53 damage = 31.67 DPS; 2.244 sec animation for 30.60 damage = 13.63 DPA), they've got roughly the same area (Nightfall is a 1/3rd longer but 1/3rd thinner), the exact same recharge, TT costs less endurance, and TT has a secondary effect (immobilize) to make it better. The only "weakness" of TT (and the reason why it's got such a low recharge and endurance cost for its damage) is that a majority of the damage is delayed, not that the delay is particularly noticeable.
Like I've been saying, Nightfall is bad. Nightfall is atrocious. The dev that suggested bringing Nightfall over with those numbers needs to be slapped upside the back of the head and shown the error of his/her ways.
TT does more damage but it's over a longer period of time. It used to annoy me to no end that the damage over time was so slow. Nightfall does negative energy damage and hence is less resisted, but it looks like it does roughly half the damage of TT to make up for it, though it does the damage in roughly a third of the time.
Both have 20 second recharges. Both have really narrow cones. 
I think you pay too much to get the tohit debuff and the less resisted damage type. If you're into damage as your criteria, you'd probably want TT (though admittedly, the damage over 7 seconds stinks since the target will probably be dead long before the full damage is realized...at least for minions/Lts).
TT does more damage, activates faster, and immobilizes the enemies.
NF just does damage with a tohit debuff.
However, NF is straight Negative Damage, while TT is mostly Smashing Damage with a little Negative Damage.
[edit]misread the cone area[edit]
Here's what gets me, and I wouldn't think that's right. But by the looks of it, only NF can crit.
Now the 5% added bonus for double damage could be a crit ontop of normal scrapper crits. If that's the case...TT will still do more damage.
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
I bet I can guess exactly what's going on. You know how different ATs have different damage mods? Well, each AT has two, melee and ranged. For a Scrapper, their melee mod is 1.125 and their ranged is 0.5 (not a typo).
Tenebrous Tentacles is using the melee mod (presumably to make sure it deals more than garbage damage) while Night Fall is currently using the ranged mod (presumably because it was copied from a ranged AT where it would use the ranged mod).
I'd bug it since all other APP attacks use the melee mod.
[edit: That'd bring NF's total damage up to ~68.85.]
Quote:
From CoD:| Here's what gets me, and I wouldn't think that's right. But by the looks of it, only NF can crit. |
Code:
- 58.5 Negative damage (5% chance) If target is a minion
- 58.5 Negative damage (10% chance) If target is not a minion or player
Nightfall needs to be fixed. There's no way that it is properly balanced in relation to other cone attacks.
On test, I did run around with TT, NF, Torrent, Shockwave, Spin, Eviscerate... it was amusing, safe and painfully slow.
Scrappers should have been given Darkest Night just like brutes.
Be well, people of CoH.
Quote:
Nightfall looks suspiciously like it's using the ranged damage table.|
Originally Posted by Desmodos
Thing is, I'm not understanding the numbers.
|
What happens if you change the AT dropdown from Scrapper to Widow or SoA?
EDIT: Aw, snipe'd. Still, changing AT to either VEAT will verify if that's what's going on.
Some math:
Defender Nightfall
Code:
Ranged Damage Mod10 * 0.11 Negative damage over 2.80 seconds PvE only
Code:
Scr -27.805
Quote:
I'd rather of had Shadow Meld or Dark Obliteration myself.
|
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
From CoD:
Code:
Nightfall needs to be fixed. There's no way that it is properly balanced in relation to other cone attacks. On test, I did run around with TT, NF, Torrent, Shockwave, Spin, Eviscerate... it was amusing, safe and painfully slow. Scrappers should have been given Darkest Night just like brutes. |
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
And if you do the same for tentacles:
8*.1 smashing
.14 neg
8*.1*27.805 = 22.244
.14*27.805 = 3.8927
Total: 26.1367
This does not equal the damage shown for scrapper TT.
Using the melee mod for scrapper: 62.562
50.0496
8.75868
Total: 58.80828 which is closer to what's shown.
So... why does scrapper TT use the melee damage modifier but scrapper NF does not?
Checking Dark Blast: Also using scrapper melee damage modifier.
Castle goofed. Des, your thread, you gonna PM him about this? NM. I just did.
Be well, people of CoH.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by BrandX
I'd rather of had Shadow Meld or Dark Obliteration myself.
|
I would have been very happy with Dark Obliteration.
SI Radio has many DJs and listeners whom hold City of Heroes close to their hearts. We will be supporting many efforts to keep CoH ALIVE!!
Quote:
I did not want to PM with out verifying the numbers. Would not be the first time I misunderstood the data. Glad you PMd him.
|
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
Castle goofed. Des, your thread, you gonna PM him about this? NM. I just did. |
SI Radio has many DJs and listeners whom hold City of Heroes close to their hearts. We will be supporting many efforts to keep CoH ALIVE!!
No problem. I have zero issues shooting off PMs to Castle based on possibly bad information. On the one hand, if the info is good, it gives him something to look into. If the info I'm using is bad/stupid/ridiculous, he gets to mock me soundly.
It's a win-win situation.
Be well, people of CoH.
Wow that looks terrible, I'm sure it will be corrected. Why didn't scrappers get darkest night?
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
Cuz Castle hates heroes.
Be well, people of CoH.
Quote:
Bill, do you have eviscerate instead of shockwave? I am not to keen on shockwave but I hate the idea of eviscerate's activation time.
|
Originally Posted by Bill Z Bubba
From CoD:
Code:
Nightfall needs to be fixed. There's no way that it is properly balanced in relation to other cone attacks. On test, I did run around with TT, NF, Torrent, Shockwave, Spin, Eviscerate... it was amusing, safe and painfully slow. Scrappers should have been given Darkest Night just like brutes. |
Gave it some thought, but no. I'm still sticking with spin/shockwave.
Be well, people of CoH.
Ok, so I've recovered from the news Darkness Mastery got shafted with the Issue 16 upgrades. Now I'm trying to decide if I will replace Tenebrous Tentacles with Night Fall or just stay with TT.
Thing is, I'm not understanding the numbers. I feel like I'm comparing apples to oranges.
These are screen shots of the detailed info screen for each power, taken from Test Server.
Now which one does more damage?