A Guide on How to Fix the PVP issue, please read this Devs and take notes!!
By
capnkangaroo,
Posted on: 2009-08-16 13:36 in Everything about PvP
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Ummm.... I kind of like PvP in it's own separate area that no one ever has to go to if they don't want PvP. That way those who don't want to take part, aren't forced to. I can't really see liking the idea of having to repeatedly decline random Duel challenges either. If I want that, I'll go play WoW and stand around outside Orgrimaar.|
Originally Posted by ZeroMorph
Ultimately this is what I would like to see. All the fat old whiner babies can enjoy their liberal democratic "Everyone is equal regardless" stupid PVP zones, while the rest of us can simply challenge each other to a "REAL" duel anywhere anytime without having to make a long trek to the arena. All the rules would stay the same, PVP zones have their rediculous rules, and PVE zones would continues operating as is.
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Additionally, what you propose requires another major revision... that being that Heroes need to be able to access the Rogue Isles, and Villains need to be able to access Paragon City. This may very well happen with the Going Rogue expansion, but until then, it's no simple undertaking I am sure.
Finally, you seem to think that the Devs are done working on PvP. They aren't. They have said this ever since I13, and every issue since I13 has included further revisions to the PvP system.
The problem is, you are looking at one set of changes, and can not see the other changes that are coming around them. The devs, on the other hand, have a much more complete view of things. Not only how the existing changes will link up with other PvP changes, but how they will link up with other changes which are not directly related to PvP. It's like looking at one piece of a puzzle, and trying to tell someone else, who actually knows what the entire puzzle looks like, where every single piece of the puzzle goes.
And last but not least, if the PvP system is working as the devs intend it to, then, in their eyes, there is nothing to "fix" because it's not broken.
- Garielle
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Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".
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Simple fix, "Block ALL Challenge Requests" Now you don't have to decline because nobody can invite you.|
Originally Posted by Garielle
Ummm.... I kind of like PvP in it's own separate area that no one ever has to go to if they don't want PvP. That way those who don't want to take part, aren't forced to. I can't really see liking the idea of having to repeatedly decline random Duel challenges either. If I want that, I'll go play WoW and stand around outside Orgrimaar.
Additionally, what you propose requires another major revision... that being that Heroes need to be able to access the Rogue Isles, and Villains need to be able to access Paragon City. This may very well happen with the Going Rogue expansion, but until then, it's no simple undertaking I am sure. Finally, you seem to think that the Devs are done working on PvP. They aren't. They have said this ever since I13, and every issue since I13 has included further revisions to the PvP system. The problem is, you are looking at one set of changes, and can not see the other changes that are coming around them. The devs, on the other hand, have a much more complete view of things. Not only how the existing changes will link up with other PvP changes, but how they will link up with other changes which are not directly related to PvP. It's like looking at one piece of a puzzle, and trying to tell someone else, who actually knows what the entire puzzle looks like, where every single piece of the puzzle goes. And last but not least, if the PvP system is working as the devs intend it to, then, in their eyes, there is nothing to "fix" because it's not broken. |
I'm not talking about heroes fighting villains, at least not at first. Before Going Rogue comes out this would be a solution for heroes to challenge heroes in PVE zones with PVE rules, and Villains challenging Villains in PVE zones with PVE rules. After Going Rogue comes out then Villains and Heroes could challenge each other as well.
For Heroes and Villains to challenge each other pre-Going Rogue, we would have to have a PVE option setting for arena battles in Pocket D, I don't see any other way around that, and maybe in the future they could setup a PVP zone with PVE rules.
And sure the Devs may be making changes to the PVP system in every issue, but if you try to improve something thats broken and it's still broken, it's not really an improvement is it.
And last but not least, the PVP system IS clearly broken, simply read the monumentous cries of anger and frustration on the boards. They took something away from one group and gave it to another group, this is not how you solve problems. They should've added to the game, not replaced.
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Okay. They have not yet finished the changes they are planning. If a dev comes along and says, "Okay. We are done with all the PvP changes. See what you think of the new PvP system now," and you still are not satisfied, then by all means cry out. Until then, you don't know if you're gonna like it, because you have no idea what it is.|
Originally Posted by ZeroMorph
And sure the Devs may be making changes to the PVP system in every issue, but if you try to improve something thats broken and it's still broken, it's not really an improvement is it.
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As for your continued statements that the devs don't listen to the players and that everyone is angry about the changes, you need to realize something. The PvP community in CoX is small. It always has been. Even the PvPers will tell you they are a small segment of the population. If the devs are listening to the community, as a whole, to try to get more people involved in PvP, then that is a good thing for the future of the game, overall. Overall, they ARE listening to their players. Just because you happen to disagree with that majority does not mean the devs don't care.
- Garielle
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Originally Posted by Frosty_Femme
I said "ur" which is not a word. It's a sound dumb people make when you ask them to spell out "you are".
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But like I said before, you don't solve a problem by taking away something from one group that has had whatever it was for the past 12 issues, and give it to another group. That just makes no sense and is bad business.|
Originally Posted by Garielle
Okay. They have not yet finished the changes they are planning. If a dev comes along and says, "Okay. We are done with all the PvP changes. See what you think of the new PvP system now," and you still are not satisfied, then by all means cry out. Until then, you don't know if you're gonna like it, because you have no idea what it is.
As for your continued statements that the devs don't listen to the players and that everyone is angry about the changes, you need to realize something. The PvP community in CoX is small. It always has been. Even the PvPers will tell you they are a small segment of the population. If the devs are listening to the community, as a whole, to try to get more people involved in PvP, then that is a good thing for them, overall. Overall, they ARE listening to their players. Just because you happen to disagree with that majority does not mean the devs don't care. |
Here's an anology:
Big Brother is eating a candy bar and little brother wants it. You don't solve the problem by taking away big brother's candy bar and giving it to little brother, no you simply give little brother his own candy bar. Make sense?
You don't take away PVP from hardcore PVPers and give it to noob PVPers, no you simple create a new PVP zone dedicated to noob PVPers. There were 100 better ways to implement this and the Dev's chose non of them. They alienated one group to make another group happy when they didn't have too, it's madness.
They had something like this in SWG
It was fun to watch duels occasionly there while you were in a main city solcialising or waiting for someone....
But
Honestly im not sure if anything in that game should be duplicated for fear the powers that be might come down with the same affliction and do a total revamp of the game and destroy it totally lol
But Kudo's for suggesting idea's and solutions instead of just complaining 
soemthing like this is in that other game that is almost out, and it is awesome. I love it. No traveling somewhere to fight you just click hit dual and start fighting 5 seconds later.
The past few days I've been scouring mmorpg.com for a new mmo to play and ran across a free one called Runes of Magic. It's a complete WoW ripoff but it's completely to own and play.
It too has a right click on the person's avatar and you can select duel, it's so fun and the rules and powers of you character don't change what so ever in duel mode. Your stats are the exact same in duel mode as they are when fighting PVE.
OMG what a concept? Not messing with stats when battling others?!?! OMG!!!
This is what Castle thinks of all of you and all of your ideas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NkoBsMTmkQ
Give up already......
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Trying to earn your red wings I see. *Polishes red wing.*
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Originally Posted by Southern_Comfort
This is what Castle thinks of all of you and all of your ideas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NkoBsMTmkQ Give up already...... |
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When did the arena become a long trek? There are two teleporters that will take you directly to an arena zone and getting /ai'd will zap you there too.
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Originally Posted by ZeroMorph
the rest of us can simply challenge each other to a "REAL" duel anywhere anytime without having to make a long trek to the arena.
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This is a bad idea. All on the spot duals will do is cause the PvE players to start complaining to the Devs. Remember how pissed off people were when they were forced to go into the PvP zones so they could clear the "talk to **** Liaison." People got so sick of getting ganked the moment they stepped in to clear that contact (and being told that if they didn't want to PvP, then to stay out of the zones... even though they couldn't get new missions if they didn't go in) that the Devs moved the Liaison outside the PvP zones. This alone should tell you that most of the player base doesn't want anything to do with PvP and to force it in their face with yet more PvP will do no good.
�Let there be truth, happiness, and waffles�
-Vagabond, Dark Lord & Avatar of Gnarr
The Justiciars
I like this idea. I want to expand on it a bit further.
1. Dueling in city limits spawns police at max difficulty (similar to rikti raids) after 30s. Siren's wail, etc etc. Basically, a Boss, 2 lts., maybe 8 mins. They are aggro'd to the duelers. They are also unaffected by anybody else. You get no drops, xp or inf from defeating the police.
2. If the duelers are defeated they go to jail (similar to mayhem mishes). So, we need a jail in the zones.
3. If the duelers defeat the police, they have averted arrest for the time being or at least another 30s of time if they are still within city limits.
4. Dueling is not permitted in close proximity of trainers, AE building, arbiters, contacts etc.
Dark Bard, Zoobait, Debacle
jmsb
Por vezes d� vontade...
chucknorriss
speak american godamnit
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See, this is where you are wrong. It's not that most of the player base "don't want anything to do with PvP," they don't want anything to do with PvP "WHEN it is forced down their throats. "|
Originally Posted by DocArcus
This alone should tell you that most of the player base doesn't want anything to do with PvP and to force it in their face with yet more PvP will do no good.
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If you are engaged in a PvE mission it's understandable that you aren't expecting nor desire to engage in PvP content. Nor is it fair to force players into PvP engagement when they are participating in PvE content.
This is where the Devs made their mistake when implementing PvP into this game. PvP should NEVER be a requirement for completing PvE content. However, PvE content should be tied into PvP content, in order to entice, encourage and promote PvP content.
This is one of the reasons why I'm so vehemently against PvP rewards (such as PvP IOs). It does not bridge the divide between PvE and PvP. Instead these rewards widen the gaping chasm between PvP and PvE.
Should there be rewards for PvP content? Sure, but the rewards should not have any affect on game play because we want to INVITE PvErs into PvP not alienate them even more.
It's bad enough the Devs thought that changing the rules completely from PvE to PvP would encourage more players to PvP (What kind of train-of-logic is that?) but now the Devs are giving players that PvP a bonus to PvP with IOs..that's fine, but that just alienates PvErs even more (GJ Devs).
P.s. I hate you all, I want my red wing back.
It would be nice if they gave rewards for winning in pvp zones giving people a real reason to actually do things besides just staying in front of each other bases killing each other or doing fight club.
I posted this in an earlier thread but thought it was such a good idea I want other players and the Developers to read it. This would simply solve ALL PVP issues and give EVERYONE what they want, and it would certainly bring back ALL of the PVPer's who left after the I13 disaster. I hope Paragon Studios reads this and takes it into consideration, or something similiar to it.
<Original Post>
You know what would be an awesome idea. Leave the PVP Diminishing Results in place, but only in the PVP zones and arena. However I believe that heroes and villains should be able to challenge each other to a duel in regular PVE zones without interfernce from other players using the PVE rules.
Check out this scenario:
Electric Boy and Fire Girl are just standing around in Kings Row
Dialog:
Electric Boy: "Hey Fire Girl, your costume looks stupid!"
Fire Girl: "Ya? Well I know I could take you down, then who looks stupid."
Electric Boy: "Oh you think so? Care to place 1 mil influence on that?"
Fire Girl: "Ya sure lets do it right here!"
Electric Boy: "OK!"
Electric Boy right clicks on Fire Girl and clicks on "Challenge to a Duel"
Message pops up on Fire Girl's screen and Fire Girl accepts the challenge and the wager.
All surrounding heroes watch the flag drop and hear the siren of a duel about to start.
The Heroes buff up and take their respective corners.
They begin dueling using the exact same rules you always do in PVE, absolutely nothing changes in dueling mode. (With the exception that it's a 50/50 chance to hit each other as opposed to NPCs 25/75 chance of course.)
The duel is over, Fire Girl woops Electric Boy, well of course she did, she was 10 levels higher and since no rules changed, someone 10 levels higher SHOULD win of course. However even if Electric Boy would've beaten Fire Girl because Electric Boy carefully planned out his toon for challenges such as these and not to mention he's already dropped 1.5 Billion worth of enhancements in his toon, that doesn't mean the Dev's should step in like Big Brother and start nerfing Electric Boy's Power Sets.
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Ultimately this is what I would like to see. All the fat old whiner babies can enjoy their liberal democratic "Everyone is equal regardless" stupid PVP zones, while the rest of us can simply challenge each other to a "REAL" duel anywhere anytime without having to make a long trek to the arena. All the rules would stay the same, PVP zones have their rediculous rules, and PVE zones would continues operating as is.
Oh and PS: The Devs DID get one thing right with Defensive Toggles no longer dropping in PVE after being held/stunned, that was the one and only good thing that came out of I13.
Any comments on this idea?