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Originally Posted by UnleashedPower
I have finally given in and made a Fire/Kin after being persuaded by the whole world lol bu i trying to figure out how come no one picks stone for a epic power i mean u get a AoE move and a extreme damage movie..that plus fulcrum shift, siphon power would seem like it would destroy a mob fast then it would be using fire/ or psy? why does everyone pick fire?
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All the boss farmers use stone.
People take Fire Mastery because Fireball is still the best APP AoE in the damage department and some people still use Behemoths, which deal fire damage. However, like Chaos said, most F/Ks that are doing boss farms are using Stone Mastery (myself included).
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"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
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This.
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Originally Posted by Chaos_Creator
All the boss farmers use stone.
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I'm not a Boss farmer and I use stone on my Fire/Kin. I tried Fire and it wasn't bad. But Stone has a defensive shield you can enhance with set bonuses, it has an incredible single target attack (see title, which also stacks with char to hold) and it has Fissure which stacks with Flashfire to stun Bosses.
I *love* the stone epic.
I use /stone app on my plant/kin, it is really good. Very easy to cap s/l.
Seismic smash does the same base damage as the tanker version w/ containment. It is disturbingly good on a /kin troller who never needs to worry about endurance, has capped damage (I hit even cons for like 630 damage with it lol) and uber recharge so it is up often.
It's so good that if I had a good power to sub in it's place I'd drop Strangler and just use Seismic as my ST control, considering that's how I use it already 
I have considered /ice app for that toon as well for boss runs just because each spawn usually lives long enough for icestorm to cycle (a kin can have it up every 30-40 seconds). Icestorm+frostbreath is pretty extreme aoe damage on a troller. Admittedly though, this might be a better option for plant rather than fire as a cone means less effective use of hotfeet.
That said, I also really like earth's embrace. It means I don't need to waste time getting my accolades and still have perma capped hp. I've been very happy with earth app.
The armor even makes you look like a dirt mech 
Stone APP is just very very good! even if it doesn't fit thematically its hard to pass up on a Kinetics controller. Fire I use on my Fire/Rad due to consume is helpful when you run lots of toggles.
I think I may try Ice on my Plant/Kin, although I always don't think rains do any damage 
Freedom Bound!!!
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while deceptive, controller icestorm can do considerable damage.|
Originally Posted by MentalMidget
Stone APP is just very very good! even if it doesn't fit thematically its hard to pass up on a Kinetics controller. Fire I use on my Fire/Rad due to consume is helpful when you run lots of toggles.
I think I may try Ice on my Plant/Kin, although I always don't think rains do any damage |
considering how easy containment is it does base 175 damage. Blaster, corr, and def versions all deal base 117 damage (they all have the same damage cap). Corr version can of course scourge. I can't recall if pets cap at +200 or +300% damage, but anyway it is either good for 525 to 700 damage on a /kin troller.
Add in Frost breath which does another 342 contained (capped) damage and you can see how you'd put a serious dent in any group, even +2-4 bosses.
I'm tempted to give it a try on my plant/kin (maybe fire up the second build slot or xfer to test), but I think it could work very well for a boss farming build where you generally aren't moving from spawn to spawn in under 30-40 seconds.
Ya I'm gonna give it a try right now.
Edit: ok I tried it on a SO build. Icestorm+frostbreath is a very potent aoe combo for a plant/kin that is generally sitting at the edge of the spawn anyway. Strange though you can't slot Acc SO's in icestorm. But it would be IO'd anyway.
I'm very tempted to switch to an /ice app build, but not until i16. The reason I won't for now is because teaming in AE is giving me about 10fps so I've just been solo farming +1 or +2 bosses. The issue is that I need to herd 15+ up. If Creepers is still active it interferes with the herd, so I time my spawn killing so they all die at about the same time creepers expires. With /earth app that has been +2's (provided I pay attention), and +1's if I'm feeling lazy.
The problem right now is that icestorm+frostbreath does a lot more aoe damage than I'm currently doing. However, in i16 I won't need to herd, I can get full spawns back to back to back while solo so CC can be out and doing it's thing. I expect to be much faster then.
I do really like Seismic smash though, and the stone armor looks way cooler than the ice armor (which is strange as you'd think ice would be cooler
)Edit 2: it is +300% dam on the psuedo pet, so x4 base damage.
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Thanks Frosticus! I'm sold!
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Originally Posted by Frosticus
while deceptive, controller icestorm can do considerable damage.
considering how easy containment is it does base 175 damage. Blaster, corr, and def versions all deal base 117 damage (they all have the same damage cap). Corr version can of course scourge. I can't recall if pets cap at +200 or +300% damage, but anyway it is either good for 525 to 700 damage on a /kin troller. Add in Frost breath which does another 342 contained (capped) damage and you can see how you'd put a serious dent in any group, even +2-4 bosses. I'm tempted to give it a try on my plant/kin (maybe fire up the second build slot or xfer to test), but I think it could work very well for a boss farming build where you generally aren't moving from spawn to spawn in under 30-40 seconds. Ya I'm gonna give it a try right now. Edit: ok I tried it on a SO build. Icestorm+frostbreath is a very potent aoe combo for a plant/kin that is generally sitting at the edge of the spawn anyway. Strange though you can't slot Acc SO's in icestorm. But it would be IO'd anyway. I'm very tempted to switch to an /ice app build, but not until i16. The reason I won't for now is because teaming in AE is giving me about 10fps so I've just been solo farming +1 or +2 bosses. The issue is that I need to herd 15+ up. If Creepers is still active it interferes with the herd, so I time my spawn killing so they all die at about the same time creepers expires. With /earth app that has been +2's (provided I pay attention), and +1's if I'm feeling lazy. The problem right now is that icestorm+frostbreath does a lot more aoe damage than I'm currently doing. However, in i16 I won't need to herd, I can get full spawns back to back to back while solo so CC can be out and doing it's thing. I expect to be much faster then. I do really like Seismic smash though, and the stone armor looks way cooler than the ice armor (which is strange as you'd think ice would be cooler )Edit 2: it is +300% dam on the psuedo pet, so x4 base damage. |
Freedom Bound!!!
I use /Fire on my Fire/Kin just because of the theme. Also, I personally cannot stand to be on the ground if I dont have to. I just really love the free-movement feeling of Hover + Siphon Speed. Therefore, I cant use /Stone since fissure requires that I be ground-bound.
There is no doubt that /Stone is better, though.
My personal favorite epic,when theme doesnt conflict, is /Ice, for the fact that I get 2 AoEs.
BTW, to the person that commented on it, Ice Storm doesnt take Acc because it doesnt need it. It has some mega-huge accuracy (I dont think its auto). Huge to the point that accuracy wouldnt really help. That's good, though, because you can skimp on a slot, or go for a higher percentage of slow effect, in addition to max damage and max recharge.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
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It is a myth that rain powers have increased acc. It is perpetuated by the fact that the displayed acc is very high, but that is actually for the summoning of the power (why it needs acc, who knows), not the actual power itself.|
Originally Posted by UnicyclePeon
I use /Fire on my Fire/Kin just because of the theme. Also, I personally cannot stand to be on the ground if I dont have to. I just really love the free-movement feeling of Hover + Siphon Speed. Therefore, I cant use /Stone since fissure requires that I be ground-bound.
There is no doubt that /Stone is better, though. My personal favorite epic,when theme doesnt conflict, is /Ice, for the fact that I get 2 AoEs. BTW, to the person that commented on it, Ice Storm doesnt take Acc because it doesnt need it. It has some mega-huge accuracy (I dont think its auto). Huge to the point that accuracy wouldnt really help. That's good, though, because you can skimp on a slot, or go for a higher percentage of slow effect, in addition to max damage and max recharge. Lewis |
Icestorm has a default acc of 1 or in other words 75% vs even cons. It is slottable with acc SO's on every other AT that gets it (haven't tested tank version tho). I didn't bother to bug it as I don't really care all that much and it probably wouldn't be fixed for a couple years. Not the best attitude, but meh.
Yeah, I knew that not being able to slot ACC is a bug, if only because you can on Freezing Rain. However, are you sure it doesnt have a higher accuracy?
Of course, I'm basing my info off Mids' which isnt at all the same as the game itself, but I usually assume it is more right than wrong. Which is probably a mistake. But Ice Storm and Freezing Rain have 150% accuracy, whatever that means, and Frost Breath has 90% accuracy. So, I have always assumed that Ice Storm didn't need accuracy, so that it didnt matter if you couldnt slot any.
Whats the deal there?
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
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City of Data lists the power as having a 2 accuracy, but the pet it spawns as having a 1 accuracy. So that backs up what Frosticus was saying.
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Originally Posted by UnicyclePeon
Yeah, I knew that not being able to slot ACC is a bug, if only because you can on Freezing Rain. However, are you sure it doesnt have a higher accuracy?
Of course, I'm basing my info off Mids' which isnt at all the same as the game itself, but I usually assume it is more right than wrong. Which is probably a mistake. But Ice Storm and Freezing Rain have 150% accuracy, whatever that means, and Frost Breath has 90% accuracy. So, I have always assumed that Ice Storm didn't need accuracy, so that it didnt matter if you couldnt slot any. Whats the deal there? Lewis |
My newly minted fire/kin took Stone Mastery. Picked up Fissure, Seismic Smash and the ugly ugly ugly ugly ugly ugly but wonderful Stone Armor.
My fire/rad has Fireball/Fireshield and I'm seriously considering respec'ing her next issue into Stone.
Nothing like one shot holding a boss with Seismic Smash!
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While doing over 600 damage! heh. provided you immobed it first.
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Originally Posted by CelestiaCoH
My newly minted fire/kin took Stone Mastery. Picked up Fissure, Seismic Smash and the ugly ugly ugly ugly ugly ugly but wonderful Stone Armor.
My fire/rad has Fireball/Fireshield and I'm seriously considering respec'ing her next issue into Stone. Nothing like one shot holding a boss with Seismic Smash! |
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Hopefully you won't be sucking wind after, fire/rad is my fav, but man endurance is a bish!
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Originally Posted by CelestiaCoH
My newly minted fire/kin took Stone Mastery. Picked up Fissure, Seismic Smash and the ugly ugly ugly ugly ugly ugly but wonderful Stone Armor.
My fire/rad has Fireball/Fireshield and I'm seriously considering respec'ing her next issue into Stone. Nothing like one shot holding a boss with Seismic Smash! |
Freedom Bound!!!
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OK then. If you slot it with set IOs that also have accuracy, do they help? For example, will a Detonation Acc/Dam affect the accuracy of Ice Storm? I have heard that Choking Cloud, which takes no Acc IOs, still benefits in the Acc from an Acc/Hold from the hold sets.|
Originally Posted by jthig32
City of Data lists the power as having a 2 accuracy, but the pet it spawns as having a 1 accuracy. So that backs up what Frosticus was saying.
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Is Ice storm like that?
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
Quote:
The normal versions of icestorm (ie corr, def, blaster) certainly gain by slotting acc in them, regardless of the source, so IO's like detonation work very well. |
Originally Posted by UnicyclePeon
OK then. If you slot it with set IOs that also have accuracy, do they help? For example, will a Detonation Acc/Dam affect the accuracy of Ice Storm? I have heard that Choking Cloud, which takes no Acc IOs, still benefits in the Acc from an Acc/Hold from the hold sets.
Is Ice storm like that? Lewis |
On the other hand tactics does not really benefit the power because the tohit buff pulses so fast and as soon as one pulse expires the icestorm stops benefiting.
I haven't tested the troller version with acc slotting, but it should benefit as well. It is just strange it doesn't accept normal acc SO's/IO's. Very few powers fail to benefit from multi-enhancements unless they are specifically coded to ignore it (such as +rech in pets, and the -def in quicksand). I don't see a reason why icestorm wouldn't benefit, but without actually testing I can't say for certain.
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City of Data has this next to the pet that is spawned by ice storm:|
Originally Posted by Frosticus
The normal versions of icestorm (ie corr, def, blaster) certainly gain by slotting acc in them, regardless of the source, so IO's like detonation work very well.
On the other hand tactics does not really benefit the power because the tohit buff pulses so fast and as soon as one pulse expires the icestorm stops benefiting. I haven't tested the troller version with acc slotting, but it should benefit as well. It is just strange it doesn't accept normal acc SO's/IO's. Very few powers fail to benefit from multi-enhancements unless they are specifically coded to ignore it (such as +rech in pets, and the -def in quicksand). I don't see a reason why icestorm wouldn't benefit, but without actually testing I can't say for certain. |
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| [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs] |
Some parts are set to "ignore", but you weren't very specific.
Defender
* 0.78 Lethal damage
* 0.78 Cold damage PvE only
* 0.16 Cold damage If target is a player
* 1.4 Cold damage If target is a player
* RechargeTime -0.1 for 0.5s [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
Effect does not stack from same caster
* JumpHeight -40% for 0.5s [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
Effect does not stack from same caster
* SpeedJumping, RunSpeed -0.4 for 0.5s
Effect does not stack from same caster
* Max RunSpeed -3.5 for 0.5s PvE only [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
Effect does not stack from same caster
* FlySpeed -0.3 for 0.5s
Effect does not stack from same caster
Controller
* 0.78 Lethal damage
* 0.78 Cold damage
* 0.78 Cold damage PvE only, If target is Contained (Immobilized, Held, Slept, or Stunned)
* 0.78 Cold damage PvP only, If target is Contained (Immobilized, Held, Slept, or Stunned)
* RechargeTime -0.1 for 0.5s [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
Effect does not stack from same caster
* JumpHeight -40% for 0.5s [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
Effect does not stack from same caster
* SpeedJumping, RunSpeed -0.4 for 0.5s
Effect does not stack from same caster
* Max RunSpeed -3.5 for 0.5s PvE only [Ignores Enhancements & Buffs]
Effect does not stack from same caster
* FlySpeed -0.3 for 0.5s
Effect does not stack from same caster
I know the defender/blaster/corr version benefits from acc buffs. I don't see why the troller version wouldn't, but without having actually tested it I can't say with 100% certainty. I could test it tonight if necessary I suppose.
I have finally given in and made a Fire/Kin after being persuaded by the whole world lol bu i trying to figure out how come no one picks stone for a epic power i mean u get a AoE move and a extreme damage movie..that plus fulcrum shift, siphon power would seem like it would destroy a mob fast then it would be using fire/ or psy? why does everyone pick fire?