Of future changes, buffs and nerfs...


Alphane

 

Posted

This is an odd question and one that I’m hoping will garner some interesting answers rather than just another conversation complaining about nerfs. The EM nerf was the first one that’s hit me hard in over 30 months of playing. I didn’t take it well at first but I’ve adjusted and moved on. However, I have noticed a lot of changes recently in the name of game balance and while I expect most of these are due to NCNC taking over the IP, I’m aware that there are probably more on the way. Already the US boards are awaiting a nerf to Regen and to Super Strength (plus possibly Willpower) and it does make me somewhat nervous about rolling any alts that use these sets in case massive changes are made to them in the future.

I like both powersets for concept reasons, not necessarily because they’re ‘overpowered’. Super Strength is a comic book staple, as common as invulnerability. Whereas I find Regeneration a great concept too and makes for an exciting and varied playstyle. I feel no need to stack Rage and Regen, although great, doesn’t feel as ‘overpowered’ as some people make out. So I guess my question is this: Are these sets over powered? If so, why? Are there any other sets out there that are considered game-breakingly powerful?

Ok, so that was three questions, not one. But assuming that no-one here has psychic powers for real and can tell what the Devs are up to, what other changes do you think that we should anticipate? What powers are just waving their little flags and waiting to be nerfed? And (without wanting to start a fight) do they deserve them?

Thanks for your opinions.


@Dante EU - Union Roleplayer and Altisis Victim
The Militia: Union RP Supergroup - www.themilitia.org.uk

 

Posted

Big hitters like Blaze and Bitter Ice Blast are likely going to change animation wise for Blasters and I can see Willpower being somewhat toned down in terms of overall effectiveness.

I don't really see a change to SS coming, at least not any time soon. As for Regen, ehh. It's a funny set, I guess they might up the recharge on Reconstruction a bit.


 

Posted

The reason Regen and possibly WP are thought of as abit funny, is because the effectiveness of the regen component is diffcult to assess mathmatically. If I have 50% Resistance logic tells me I now survive twice as many mobs now it's a lot harder to assess a regen bonuses matnmatical impact the only way I can think to do it requires components such as Ratio of time fighting to time resting,Dmg input per battle! figures that are a lot harder to come by.

Edited to say I said A.S.S.E.S you dumb machine (edited by GR to fix ... assess is not filtered )


 

Posted

They will nerf overpowered sets/powers
They will buff underpowered sets/powers

Like every single nerf and buff previously.

On a more serious note, I would cast a suspcious eye over Granite armour, Fulcrum Shift (and particularly Fire/Kins), Will Power, and Seeds of Confusion. Possibly I would add regen and super reflexes. I would cast a slightly loving eye over Trick Archery (the non hold powers in particular), War Mace, and Smash/Lethal sets/powers in general.

Ultimately I dont think you have anything in particular to worry about. Every single nerf and buff beforehand has been correctly applied (not perfectly, still), and we constantly move towards a greater balance. It's all good.


 

Posted

Personally I doubt they will touch Regen for a while yet. From what I'm told (this was before I came to CoX) that 'nerf regen' was what thought to be one of the definite things that was going to happen every issue simply because Regen got nerfed again and again with every passing issue.

As it stands now it's definitely a good set but you're still the squishiest of scrappers by definition, you have no inherent Defense or Resistence so even with Instant healing still up AVs can pratically oneshot (well two-shot, one part deals the major damage then there's a tick of damage after normally) you because of the large amount of damage dealt so quickly that your health regen simply isn't quick enough.

MoG is interesting, great for taking Alphas or if you're paying attention, firing off when an AV is about to do their big one hit kill style AoE attack but by the time they're about to do a second one, MoG hasn't recharged so your doomed anyway.

Against large groups of normal mobs, yes Regen can outshine others but against heavy hitters...they're not so great as often the damage simply outdoes the regeneration rate and you've already had to pop both heals in order to stay alive in the meantime.

What I Think will happen is Rage will simply be tagged so that it cannot be stacked.

This is just my opinion though.


Badge Earned: Wing Clipper

A real showstopper!

 

Posted

Extremus is probably right that BiB and Blaze will get an animation-time nerf at some point - probably Fireball too - they’re certainly “outliers”, as the Devs call over-performing powers under Castle’s new power balance equation (which places more emphasis on animation time than recharge time like the old system), just like EM’s ET was - and the Devs are aware of that. Obviously melee powersets are getting all of the Devs attention now, probably to make sure some of them integrate properly with Shields in I13, but I’d expect Castle & BaB to carry their rebalancing and animation work into the ranged sets eventually.

We also know that Castle hates Power Boost (from previous posts), so expect more nerfs to that - and probably to anything else overly popular and overly powerful (especially if it unbalances PvP, as we know Castle likes that too from previous posts), which is why I think Super Strength will catch some nerfs somewhere (Foot Stomp and/or Rage would be my bet).

One of my two current levelling projects is an EM/EA stalker (the other is a Crab Spider), so yeah the ET nerf hurt and made him less fun to play. The next character I seriously focus on levelling will be an Ice/Storm Corruptor - am I put off playing him because BiB could get nerfed? Heck no. Any power in the game could get a nerf next week - it’s not always the strongest powers that get negative changes.

You can’t be 100% sure what will happen until the Devs say so, or until it appears in a patch note, so I say play what you want to play now - worry about the future when it happens. Or you could just play powersets perceived as weak/subpar, adjust your expectations downwards, and try to be happy that you’ve done the best you could to avoid nerfs.


 

Posted

As a side note, it seems crippling nerfs (like the infamour burn nerf) are a thing of the past. They are pretty measured now. Despite peoples hysteria over TF and ET, they are only brought down to "normal" functioning. EM remains highest ST damage. Hardly unplayable.

I dont anticipate any collosal nerfs to anything in the future. Moderate, and justified, ones, maybe.


 

Posted

I think you’re right, Regen does seem a lot more balanced these days. It has its downsides as every armour should so I hope it gets left alone.

Granite Armour and Footstomp would worry me, given that I’m concentrating on my Stone/SS Tanker at the moment. I think Granite already has sufficient penalties for remaining in it which admittedly can be slightly mitigated by full IO builds. As someone who only has a passing interest in the Inventions system, I’d hate to see a nerf to tackle IO builds that penalises those without them. Hopefully the Devs are a little more astute than that. Changing Granite for example to a Click rather than a Toggle would cause me to scream from the rooftops. And as for Footstomp, is it really that good? I look forward to getting it but it certainly doesn’t seem to be ‘uber’ from what I’ve seen in teams. I reckon that changes to SS might be to prevent Rage stacking and maybe something on Knockout Blow, either a reduction in damage or removing the Hold effect. But as someone who hasn’t played EM or Stone Melee, I can’t really compare. I guess we’ll see.

I know there’s a lot of balancing left to be done, but I too hope that the days of heavy nerfing are over with and that all that needs doing are tweaks rather than massive change. Fire Blast is certainly swift and damaging so maybe it is a case of animation times rather than recharge times as you suggest. I certainly hope so anyway.


@Dante EU - Union Roleplayer and Altisis Victim
The Militia: Union RP Supergroup - www.themilitia.org.uk

 

Posted

Footstomp is pretty uber to be honest. I dont play US side but from reading the US boards it seems that they are awash with SS/WP Brutes as they are the farmers choice right now.

I play SS paired with EA (arguably the worst possible combo) and Footstomp is the power that changes my toon from being an underperforming single target Brute into an AoE monster. You can get the recharge down incredibly low, it does excellent damage (only KO Blow does more and that;s single target) and it has KD. Of course if it was to be nerfed I think my main toon would be severly crippled because of it (hey maybe they would buff EA at the same time, i can dream right?). So, yeah it's an incredible power but at the same time is the defining power of the set (maybe along with rage). It would be to Super Strenghth like nerfing PSW or Fulcrum Shift would be to Psi Doms or Kins.


 

Posted

Thing about SS is that it's only "that good" on a Brute. I can see them maybe lowering how many you can hit with Foot Stomp, but other than that I'd say the set was pretty balanced.


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
It would be to Super Strenghth like nerfing PSW or Fulcrum Shift would be to Psi Doms or Kins.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure that will happen, probably a few weeks before/after I go back to playing my /kin controller and /psi dom and get to L38

Admittedly my SS/Dark has had Footstomp for at least 18 months with no nerf yet, but then I haven't played him much lately - maybe I should tempt fate and start levelling him again...

Seriously though, the Devs have made it clear with the ET change that they don't consider it acceptable for a powerset to have an overpowered/unbalanced power late in the set just because the set is sub-par at lower levels. Back Alley Brawler couldn't have been any clearer about that when he said: "Going through any number of leves as being 'sub-par' is never going to balance just suddenly becoming uber....leveling is a finite amount of time. Once you're uber, you're always uber."

On that basis I'd expect PSW and FS may well get nerfs at some stage, and possibly even Granite too, in exchange for their powersets getting buffs to their lower-level powers (as it seems EM will get with a Barrage buff).


 

Posted

Agree there. I really cant see PSW or Fulcrum lasting much longer. Quite rightly. And Seeds of Confusion and Granite need a long hard look at too.

Im very pleased with the real effort to balance powers properly. Its been long overdue, and well done.

(PS Take a look at Trick Archery for defenders at some point will you? Like -regen in Poison Gas Arrow?)


 

Posted

There's -regen in EMP arrow, not sure if its in the description but it is very noticable.

If oilslick was reliable and not pet breaking (still) then TA would be balanced


"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"

 

Posted

EMP's -regen is 22 seconds every 300. Hardly ground breaking.

If TA is ever going to be more than a pity slot in the big TF's, it need a very reliable -regen power. TA is mainly about holds/mez (very weak vs AV), and debuffs (the one that really shines vs AV is -regen). Its probably last on peoples lists for the big AVs

Im not saying its not balanced for "regular" missions. I feel it is. But adding a reliable (and conceptually fitting) -regen power to Poison Gas Arrow (probably one of the underperforming powers) would only add a tiny amount of utility in "regular" missions, whilst making it a proper contender vs AVs.

Just a thought, anyway.


 

Posted

TA needs a buff, but adding -regen sure as hell isn't it. It needs something to help overall performance, not just "omg it's an AV we need some -regen lol".


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Granite need a long hard look at too.

[/ QUOTE ]

Could you expand on why please? I've seen Granite Tankers faceplant a few times and the -damage, -speed and -recharge would seem to be a suitable penalty for staying in that armour all the time.

However I agree on a TA buff. As much as I'd like to play my TA/Arch, compared to what other Defender sets can do, it does lack somewhat.


@Dante EU - Union Roleplayer and Altisis Victim
The Militia: Union RP Supergroup - www.themilitia.org.uk

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
TA needs a buff, but adding -regen sure as hell isn't it. It needs something to help overall performance, not just "omg it's an AV we need some -regen lol".

[/ QUOTE ]
-regen would be a big help for teaming though - it does have a very noticeable effect on AVs/GMs - I've been on plenty of GM teams with my brutes with no -regen, where me switching to my /dark MM was all we needed to tip the outcome from "impossible" to "easy" - it's happened so often that my fire brute still lacks the Deathsurge badge, despite having been in several teams for it.