Don't use Rage if you don't want the drop. If you can work around it, do so.
@Jay Leon Hart
Kerensky: this has nothing to do with underwear
Zwillinger: I put on my robe and wizard hat...
Synapse: I had to resist starting my last post off with "Yo dawg!"
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Don't use Rage if you don't want the drop. If you can work around it, do so.
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That rather obvious answer is slight overkill don't you think?
You don't think that a defence drop, 20% endurance drop (which frequently causes toggle dropping) AND a complete loss of all offensive abilities for 10 seconds is enough penalty for a power that basically helps us achieve offensive parity with MOST Tanker secondaries (that dont have this penalty) isn't enough?
Please explain why we should lose aggro management too.
After all, the fact we're willing to take the aggro in that spell, despite being so weakened surely is surely risk enough.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
Please explain why we shouldn't.
After all, the fact that we want all that lovely damage when we're a Tank is surely out of character enough, what harm is a little aggro loss?
@Jay Leon Hart
Kerensky: this has nothing to do with underwear
Zwillinger: I put on my robe and wizard hat...
Synapse: I had to resist starting my last post off with "Yo dawg!"
Leaving aside for a moment the fact that BackAlleyBrawler is currently working on Rage, I really don't see the problem with the "not being able to do anything for X seconds" component.
The Defence deduction is noticable when tanking, but not life-threatening. Rage needs a fairly heavy downside to balance it against other secondaries' "Build Up". Compared with Build-Up, rage is extremely overpowered... you can double-stack it quite easily for an insane amount of accuracy and damage output.
Put simply, that downside is the only-affecting-self component. Taunt is a power that affects enemies, thus you can't use it when you're "only-affecting-self". If you want to keep aggro then use Taunt and/or Footstomp right before Rage wears off. Or simply don't run Rage when teamed if you're worried about possible aggro loss.
Personally I find that in big teams I rarely need more damage, so I only tend to use Rage on smaller teams or when I'm soloing. I can also usually hold aggro just fine through the only-affecting-self bit, but the defence debuff can throw the team momentum off if I'm tanking anything other than S/L enemies.
I vaguely remember back to the days when rage's drop off could be negated by running perma-rage. I seem to remember the devs not liking this and changing things so that when rage dropped, everything dropped and lots of super strength tanks died. After some shouting by the surviving tankers, the compromise of today's rage penalty was arrived at. Most super strength tanks thought they'd got off lightly as it meant that when they were solo or on small teams that needed extra damage they could use rage with not too great a risk, but when on bigger teams where the risk might be greater they found they didn't use rage too often.
As you can probably guess, I can live with today's penalty as I've seen worse.
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Please explain why we shouldn't.
After all, the fact that we want all that lovely damage when we're a Tank is surely out of character enough, what harm is a little aggro loss?
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I am delighted to discover that the devs are indeed starting to listen to common sense.
Because of course it wasn't right that rage drop stopped aggro.
Finally!
Does this mean though that we keep full defense for the duration?
Well, that would be a bonus. I'm happy with the announced fix.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
To me, it can mean that instead of "only affecting self" you do much less damage after suffering an endurance drop and losing some defense.
Teams don't suffer from tanks lacking in taunt control or timing (in my case timing 
).
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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To me, it can mean that instead of "only affecting self" you do much less damage after suffering an endurance drop and losing some defense.
Teams don't suffer from tanks lacking in taunt control or timing (in my case timing ).
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Well Castle defined it as being -9999% damage, which implies SS Tanks can still handclap, for example. And that description doesnt imply that the defence drop is still there. but either way I don't mind.
I personally found the bug bear was the lack of taunt and aggro. If you are 100% concentrating all the time, I guess you can mitigate it by launching taunt at exactly the right moment.
But to me it was a pain and they're doing away with it.
BTW, any other long standing forumite remember how I got flamed seriously for saying .9999% reoccuring? The walls of hell opened up as everyone argued, in an offensive way, that I was wrong for suggesting it's a legitimate term.
Yet another example of me being flamed and being right all along.
Unless someone feels like telling Castle that -9999% doesn't exist.
Sorry to bring that up but after all the flaming I get, when I'm shown to be correct I do feel the need to mention it.
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...
actually, as you can see in my thread, and in your own link its -999% (ninehundred ninetynine) and not -9999% (ninethousand ninehundred ninetynine)
UNION
Officer Cuffz lvl 50 Inv/Nrg Tank
Badge lvl 50 dwarf/human Peacebringer
Dark Air lvl 50 Ice/Cold Corruptor
Ayre lvl 50 Storm/Elec Defender
Total Cat: @Officer Cuffz
"When I say interview, I mean engage in combat and defeat..." -Laura Brunetti, on how to deal with Warriors.
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Well Castle defined it as being -9999% damage, which implies SS Tanks can still handclap, for example. And that description doesnt imply that the defence drop is still there. but either way I don't mind.
I personally found the bug bear was the lack of taunt and aggro. If you are 100% concentrating all the time, I guess you can mitigate it by launching taunt at exactly the right moment.
But to me it was a pain and they're doing away with it.
BTW, any other long standing forumite remember how I got flamed seriously for saying .9999% reoccuring? The walls of hell opened up as everyone argued, in an offensive way, that I was wrong for suggesting it's a legitimate term.
Yet another example of me being flamed and being right all along.
Unless someone feels like telling Castle that -9999% doesn't exist.
Sorry to bring that up but after all the flaming I get, when I'm shown to be correct I do feel the need to mention it.
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For most people the taunt and aggro control was there. It lasted from their actions prior or they stopped the team before the next group. Often enough in the way of taunt and gauntlet was already given. Icetanks have to hibernate in a jiffy and so for all the time that takes making sure taunt duration existed on all the foes had to be done. When blocking oneself (yes running off ) for an unstoppable crash you can leave enough taunt duration so your target is compelled to only be able to hit you (still warrior like). The times I lost aggro with a rage drop were rare. Usually the smaller the team the more my damage mattered. Its -999% damage last I checked. You can still attack but the attacks are weak in damage terms although not as weak as handclap. Threat is modified by taunt and damage so by doing less damage your threat maybe lowered enough for some scrapper to start tanking some of the foes in a large group. I don't know the maths exactly but the idea that you can taunt is nice. It maybe possible that someone can lose aggro during the crash but just in no way as easy.
The change may still mean you have to concentrate ie by losing def then a limb and getting defeated or losing end then a toggle and then getting defeated. Many didn't most of the time anyway but if you don't lose aggro and don't hit the right target and have as much end then having that aggro can drop you. I like the idea that taunt stays and I like the idea of concentration being needed. If I don't need to concentrate somewhere I need to either gimp my toon or play something better.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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BTW, any other long standing forumite remember how I got flamed seriously for saying .9999% reoccuring? The walls of hell opened up as everyone argued, in an offensive way, that I was wrong for suggesting it's a legitimate term.
Yet another example of me being flamed and being right all along.
Unless someone feels like telling Castle that -9999% doesn't exist.
Sorry to bring that up but after all the flaming I get, when I'm shown to be correct I do feel the need to mention it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Every dog has it's day
@Jay Leon Hart
Kerensky: this has nothing to do with underwear
Zwillinger: I put on my robe and wizard hat...
Synapse: I had to resist starting my last post off with "Yo dawg!"
.9999% recuring does exist, it just happens to be exactly equal to 1.000000% recuring. -999% is a very different thing though. -100% would mean you do zero damage If you are unbuffed. The remaining 899% is so you can't do any damage with buffs and enhancements slotted. I expect its particularly aimed at brutes.
I expect a debuff with more than 3 digits would mess up the data tables.
I really should do something about this signature.
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any other long standing forumite remember how I got flamed seriously for saying .9999% reoccuring?
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Has any other longstanding member refused ever to admit to being wrong?
I'm afraid being right all the time does not make you popular.
I really should do something about this signature.
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any other long standing forumite remember how I got flamed seriously for saying .9999% reoccuring?
[/ QUOTE ]
Has any other longstanding member refused ever to admit to being wrong?
I'm afraid being right all the time does not make you popular.
[/ QUOTE ]
I can only think of one 
@Jay Leon Hart
Kerensky: this has nothing to do with underwear
Zwillinger: I put on my robe and wizard hat...
Synapse: I had to resist starting my last post off with "Yo dawg!"
When rage drops you lose substantial endurance and you can't use any offensive powers.
I know this and accept it as part of the kickback for having the power up in the first place. i don't actually agree with this but I can live with it. Except...
Taunt. Taunt is identified as an attack power which is presumably why it is included in the 10 second can't use powers but it's this single angle I take issue with.
It really is one penalty to many in my eyes as it completely nullifies us for those seconds and can really put the team in trouble.
I think the overall penalty is fine wuithout the taunt hit as well.
At least with the taunt being active during rage drop we can do our job even if the personal risk is greater to us.
Without it we are in some cases actually a danger to our own team.
I mean, heck, I can be up and running about 3 seconds after an unstoppable drop.
I don't think, or see any benefit to the fact that taunt should be affected by rage.
Thoughts anyone?
Don't get into a flap. It's only my opinion and I'm thick
Arc 56763 Lord Anarchys heaven
2 mission arc. Bring friends cause Lord Anarchy means business...