I think there are some guides out there, but heres my take..
ICE ARMOUR
Must have
Frozen Armour: You need Smash/Lethal defence. Period. Never take it off.
Wet Ice: You need Mez protection. Period. Never take it off.
Hoarfrost: You emergency HP boost when luck turns sour. Highly recommended.
Must have (unless you plan to solo exclusively or PvP exlusively)
Chilling Embrace: Protects you (and your team), best aggro magnet in the game. You need it. Take it.
Glacial Armour: Your energy / negative defence. Only take it off if not facing these energy types. However, when facing this damage, you WILL need it.
Energy Absorbtion: ENds your enduranbce worries, and a big boost to defence. More important in biggish teams. Possibly skippable if you plan on very small teams (but wouldnt advise it).
Take it or Leave it:
Icicles: Modest AoE damage. Good if you are in big teams, but by no means necessary.
Hibernate: Emergency button that saves your skin and leaves the rest of the team in big trouble as they start beating up the squishies (and ignoring you). A cowards button. I skip.
Skip It:
I forget its name. Because it is totally useless. It the passive cold / fire resistance one. THe cold resistance is absolutely worthless to you. The fire resistance is tiny and unless you plan on being an absolutely "maxed out" tank this is one to completely avoid.
ICE MELEE (I appreciate i have the order wrong, sorry)
Frozen fists. Take it. No choice
Ice Sword. Take it or leave it melee attack
Taunt. Long debate. I consider it a must for a serious tank.
Ice Slick. Take it. Take it. Take it. This is the reason you took Ice Melee. Amazing protection. 2 recharge slots is all it needs (or one if you are cutting it fine).
Build Up. Generally skip it unless you really badly want to scrap.
Frost: Reasonable short cone. Probably best melee attack but easily skippable.
Freezing Touch: Fairly good damage and hold. A better than average melee attack but also skippable.
Greater Ice sword: Another take it or leave it melee attack
Frozen Aura: Miss. AoE Sleep, wont last more than half a second around you.
Pool Powers:
Flight. Valid option. Air Superiority helps. Hover would grant you a very small bit of extra defence but only recommended if you are going for an absolute all out tank.
Leaping. Valid option. Combat Jumping gives a small defence boost
Speed. Valid option. Hasten always nice. Can be awkward when you need rapid vertical movement in a tricky situation.
Teleport. Not much to recommend it. Can be awkward when you need rapid vertical movement in a tricky situation.
Fighthing. Tough and Weave good for any tank, but Weave is particularly good for Ice tanks.
Fitness. Pretty mandatory, even with energy absorbtion, but you could skip it with energfy absorbtion if you are feeling clever.
Leadership. Not much to recommend it. You dont get good bonuses as a tank. Manuevers eeks out a little more defence for you if you really want.
Presence. Not much to recommend it. Your taunt power is far better, and the Fears are nothing to write home about.
Medicine. Very good for an Ice/Ice tank, as Aid self is much easier to use without interruption (you are defence based, and Ice slicks stops them hitting you)
Stealth. Best to avoid. You could get stealth to eek out a tiny bit more defence if you are going all out tank, but it realy isnt worth it. Reduces your aggro aswell, which is not good.
Hope that helps.
If you elucidate what you are looking for, may be able to give you more direction. Are you looking for PvP, PvE, Solo, small teams, or big teams, or a flexible tank for all.
A pretty good summary but I would argue one point: Hibernate.
If you have Taunt and your aura(s) well slotted then you should have no trouble keeping agro while your HP return to maximum.
Octavian Vanguard
@ohmsEU and @ohms 2
Badging character: Bimble on the Union server, Badgehunter.com and City Info Tracker.
well im looking for a PVE build as i dnt PVP rly at all n teasm r normaly quite large alltho i team with sg alot in sorta 4s or 5s
does that heklp you lol thabnsk abundle uve elpd me out abit already
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Skip It:
I forget its name. Because it is totally useless. It the passive cold / fire resistance one. THe cold resistance is absolutely worthless to you. The fire resistance is tiny and unless you plan on being an absolutely "maxed out" tank this is one to completely avoid.
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It is, however one of only 2 powers that take resistance sets, and since the other one is Hoarfrost, which you will want to fill with heal/recharge, it's actually pretty useful, you can slot it for +3% def, which is virtually indespensable, and the +psi res is nice, even the mez resistance one can help against stacked holds. Taking Tough is a better alternative if you can find enough power slots though.
I really should do something about this signature.
Hey cognito ur post helped me but im going for a pvp ice/energy, can u help me with that?
Well im not a great PvP'er but I know the principles.
From Ice Armour:
YOu probably want Frozen and Glacial armour, but be aware that defence is somewhat lacklustre in PvP. However, you will want both of them on at all times anyway. Glacial armour gives +perception, a useful attribute in PvP.
Hoarfrost for +HP is a must in PvP as well as PvE. Slot it 3 recharge, 3 health - although some Invention combinations would work as well for less slots.
Hibernate is the reason you take Ice Armour in PvP. It is absolutely sick. Slot it with 3 recharge and an Ice tank becomes incredibly hard to take down. Basically an enemy will have to take off ALL your hit points (posibly including hoarfrost) before it recharges, you hit it, and come back into the fold with full hp. THis is almost impossible for anything other than a brute or a blaster to do, and its no joke for them either.
Other Ice armour powers:
Icicles is virtually worthless. Its damage is slow and AoE, and in PvP you want high "Spike" damage and single target effects. I suppose it has some fractional worth in terms of hitting stalkers, but they have very high defence vs AoE attacks so fundamentally its pointless. Skip.
The passive temp protection power is almost as worthless. I would skip. Fire damage is one of the more preferred damage types in PvP, but its still not worth taking this power.
ENergy Absorbtion, whilst great in PvE, is not so good in PvP. YOu will only get endurance / defence of one enemy. Overall, its pretty skippable. However, this puts you in a dilema, because its a bread and butter power in PvE - the backbone of your tanking. And you need to PvE to level. Overall I would say take, and once you hit 50 consider dropping it.
Wet Ice. Take it. No question.
Chliing EMbrace is a must have. Slows, -recharge, and -damage debuffing. All great. One of the reasons to fear the Ice tank.
As a side note, Ice attacks are very popular in PvP, and Ice tanks have superb protection from that. In addition, Ice tanks have very high protection from slows (a crippling and popular debuff in PvP) - watch them glide over caltrops, for instance.
From Energy Melee - I havent had an EM Tank, but the obvious things to say are that Total Focus and Energy Transfer are the reasons to take this power. Slot em big.
WHirling Hands is extremely droppable. You dont want AoE attacks.
Stun isnt (generally) recommended as you have better stuns in Total Focus. Take it only if you have the spare slots.
Taunt is recommended if you are thinking of Team PvP. If you just want to duel PvP its pretty pointless. Taunt needs to be slotted for accuracy in PvP. There are some very good and cheap Invention sets for taunt aswell.
POwer Pools:
General: Unlike PvE, getting two travel powers in PvP is worth consideration. Mobility is the key.
Fitness: Pretty obligatory
Flight: Generally not liked in PvP, due to the amount of -fly although I dont have an aversion to it myself. Note that as a melee toon you may have a job getting to flying / hovering toons without it.
Jump: Tends to be the PvP power of choice. Very little -jump in the game and gives you relatively fast movement.
Superspeed: Impressive mobility but will leave you powerless vs airborne toons if you are a melee toon. A popular PvP choice. Hasten is an excellent power even if you dont get superspeed because it brings hoarfrost, total focus, and hibernate up that much quicker.
Teleport: Virtually impossible to PvP with *just* this travel power, but a popular choice as second power. Teleport Foe is a perennial PvP choice, and Teleport is great to get out of sticky situations (however, you probably wont need to get out of them as an Ice tank)
Fighting: Not so recommended in PvP. Tough is pleasant, but I would avoid Weave.
Medicine: Aid Self, as I said is very good for Ice tanks, and it is an extremely valuable power in PvP. I would recommend getting it.
Leadership: Getting Assault and Tactics is popular because Tactics gives +perception. Worth a think about if you have the spare slots but dont break your build over these (you allready have some +perception from glacial armour).
Presence: For the taunt powers, see my comments above. THe fear powers are very popular in PvP because there is little protection from them. Worth serious consideration.
Well I think thats all I can think of. good luck!
Just a note on Temperature Protection:
As far as I'm aware the only real reasons to take this power are PvP related. It adds 20% to Ice's slow/recharge debuff resistance and lets you slot Resistance set uniques in something other than Hoarfrost. It also gives slight Fire resistance, which together with Psionic is one of Ice's "damage holes".
If you intelligently slot Hoarfrost, you can get away without taking any other Resistance power though... 2x level 50 Heal/Rech and 2x level 40 Heal/Rech, plus the Aegis Mez Resist and Steadfast +Def uniques.
A PvP Ice/Energy Tanker will want (CJ + SJ), (Hasten + SS) and (Hurdle + Health + Stamina) from Pool powers, plus Focussed Accuracy from their Epic pool. The Medicine, Presence or Concealment pools are optional.
Don't drop Energy Absorption either: it can be handy to have an endurance drain, and EA is a powerful one.
I would agree with Maelwys on the above, except to reiterate that Medicine is a very useful power for ice tanks if you want increased survivability (which you may not), and that I find the energy absorbtion power is not workable as a PvP end drain.
ice tanks dont need aid self in pvp, hibernate is gud enough. would go for presence pool personally for the fear since hardly anything has res to fear.
Also, cant u slot res sets in Frozen Armor? iirc it has res to cold.
For me I'd go for Leadership instead of Medicine Pool at high level because Hibernate does well keeping you alive. Tactics + Glacial (and + IO?) gives you good +perception. Not sure I rate Presence that highly since Fear works out as more of a defensive power than an offensive one - in that it's easy to escape from, I see it as a bit like Sleep.
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Also, cant u slot res sets in Frozen Armor? iirc it has res to cold.
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It does have Cold and Fire damage res but you can't enhance it [or to the point, sneak in a Res IO]. You end up with 90% Ice res with Frozen Armour, Chilling Embrace and Glacial Armour anyway.
On the subject of Energy Absorbtion - I would never respec out of it for PvP - it's not something you spam constantly but it can be a real killer if slotted enough and used at the right times; I have toggle dropped people with it. It's also worth noting that it will add another +20% slow resistance if it hits.
this is a build i use currently on my ice/ice tank, it seems to work pretty well
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.30
http://www.honourableunited.org.uk/mhd.php
Level 50 Mutation Tanker
Primary Power Set: Ice Armor
Secondary Power Set: Ice Melee
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Medicine
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Frozen Armor -- EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(3), DefBuff-I:50(7), DefBuff-I:50(15), DefBuff-I:50(17)
Level 1: Frozen Fists -- Acc-I:50(A), Acc-I:50(43), Dmg-I:50(43), Dmg-I:50(43), Taunt-I:50(46)
Level 2: Chilling Embrace -- EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(3), Taunt-I:50(9), Taunt-I:50(15), Zinger-Dam%:50(25)
Level 4: Hoarfrost -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(5), RechRdx-I:50(5), Heal-I:50(23), Heal-I:50(25), Heal-I:50(34)
Level 6: Wet Ice -- EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(7)
Level 8: Hurdle -- Jump-I:50(A), Jump-I:50(9)
Level 10: Taunt -- Acc-I:40(A), Acc-I:50(11), RechRdx-I:50(11), Taunt-I:50(33), Taunt-I:50(33)
Level 12: Hasten -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(13), RechRdx-I:50(13)
Level 14: Super Speed -- EndRdx-I:50(A)
Level 16: Health -- Heal-I:50(A), Heal-I:50(17)
Level 18: Glacial Armor -- EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(19), DefBuff-I:50(19), DefBuff-I:50(34), DefBuff-I:50(37)
Level 20: Stamina -- EndMod-I:50(A), EndMod-I:50(21), EndMod-I:50(21)
Level 22: Ice Patch -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(23)
Level 24: Boxing -- Empty(A)
Level 26: Energy Absorption -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(27), EndMod-I:50(27), DefBuff-I:50(40), DefBuff-I:50(40)
Level 28: Freezing Touch -- Acc-I:50(A), Acc-I:50(29), Dmg-I:50(29), Dmg-I:50(42), RechRdx-I:50(42), RechRdx-I:50(42)
Level 30: Tough -- EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(31), ResDam-I:40(31), ResDam-I:40(31), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+:30(34)
Level 32: Hibernate -- RechRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(33)
Level 35: Frost -- Acc-I:50(A), Acc-I:50(36), Dmg-I:50(36), Dmg-I:50(36), RechRdx-I:50(37), RechRdx-I:50(37)
Level 38: Weave -- EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(39), DefBuff-I:50(39), DefBuff-I:50(39), DefBuff-I:50(40)
Level 41: Stimulant -- Empty(A)
Level 44: Aid Self -- Heal-I:50(A), Heal-I:50(45), RechRdx-I:50(45), RechRdx-I:50(45), IntRdx-I:50(46), IntRdx-I:50(46)
Level 47: Icicles -- EndRdx-I:50(A), EndRdx-I:50(48), Acc-I:50(48), Taunt-I:50(48), Dmg-I:50(50), Dmg-I:50(50)
Level 49: Resuscitate -- IntRdx-I:50(A), RechRdx-I:50(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet
<font class="small">Code:[/color]<hr /><pre>| Copy & Paste this data chunk into Mids' Hero Designer to view the build |
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</pre><hr />
ignore the lvl 49 powers :P didnt know what to pick so just went with that
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ignore the lvl 49 powers :P didnt know what to pick so just went with that
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Jesus man lmao, surely there is something better to take than that!
2 end slots in wet ice and no end slot in ice patch? One use of icepatch is worth approx 40 secs of wet ice and yet icepatch has a 13.8 secs recharge. That extra end in wet ice would so be in icepatch if it was me.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
Ice Patch only lasts for 30 seconds, and laying one certainly doesn't mean you can turn off your mez protection.
Also, there's normally about 20 seconds between Ice Patches on that build, you're looking at it with Hasten up. 10 End isn't much, even if you want a "Perma" patch (every 30 secs or "every new mob"). Look at "Energy Absorption", 13 end and you'll use it every chance you get! But you'll never turn off your mez protection.
SO good is Ice Patch, I put 2 recharge reducers in it. REason? Flexibility. It means I can put it down at any appropriate pause in my (limited) attack chain, and also I can move around to different areas if need by and still pput down the patch.
I wouldnt consider putting an end reducer in it at all. Ice tanks, with energy absorbtion, have a pretty easy time of it with the blue stuff.
SRM, a little point against what you said, well constructive critisism [spelling?]
Get all the healage you can if your going to go into pvp
Hoarfrost
Hibernate
Medicine
Defense kinda fails in PvP - mainly villains though, and depending on the amount of Purple IO's the person your fighting has farmed for
Hibernate can seem an awfully long way away if you have 2 brutes wailing on you, hoarfrost helps - but aid self is a nice little boost =]
I'd personally drop tough + weave for a PvP build n get aid other [high heal on tank] aid self and then hasten [if you dont already have it]
If your low on slots..
Dont slot swift - ever infact [Unless your a granite tank]
Dont slot your travel power [ONE extra slot in fly if you have to]
dont have 3 end reduct in your shields, 2 is optimum
dont slot aid other
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Ice Patch only lasts for 30 seconds, and laying one certainly doesn't mean you can turn off your mez protection.
Also, there's normally about 20 seconds between Ice Patches on that build, you're looking at it with Hasten up. 10 End isn't much, even if you want a "Perma" patch (every 30 secs or "every new mob"). Look at "Energy Absorption", 13 end and you'll use it every chance you get! But you'll never turn off your mez protection.
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Lol what?
Who implied anything about turning the mezz protection off?
Not me. That could be COMPLETELY stupid.
It was a comparison of possible end cost over time. Wet Ice eps versus Ice patch eps (auto'd) and ice patch uses more end over time; more than some attacks that people end slot and I consider it as part of the attack chain. In getting as many attack chains to an end bar I would slot it if nothing better and no there ain't. Ice tanks can go stamina less better by doing so.
Within a fight duration the endurance cost of ice patch can easily outweigh that of wet ice. Outside of a fight duration end rec will cover all toggles nicely.
Lets say you lay ice patch every 10 secs and its for 10 end then its eps is 10/10 = 1 eps and you have wet ice for 0,3 eps. 1 eps is greater than 0,3 and so then I'll end slot ice patch rather than second end slot wet ice.
Although with some AVs you can make it so your comfortable in turning off mezz protection by out ranging their mezz attacks with taunt. If it can't reach you then it can't get you.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
ive already got him to lvl 21 awhile ago and stopped playing him.
i just need to know what powers are nesecity and the pros and cons of the rest as im not a normal tanker player dis is sorta my first.
thanks alot celtic