DOuble FF sets?


Angelstar

 

Posted

Heyho folks,

Ive heard that two FF defenders / controllers are the bees knees. Any opinions?

Im sure the stacked def buffs would make everyone an Ice tank, but what about the other powers?

Mez resistance - does this need more than one dispersion bubble?

Is it worth having more than one repulsion / force bubble? do they stack to keep bosses away?


 

Posted

Im fairly sure that one FF defender with Manuvers can get everyone to the 45% soft "Cap" by themselves.

Mez protection for Dispersion Bubble is slightly worse MaG than Integration. It'll cover most disorient/hold/immob mezzes in normal PvE play, but can be knocked off by "Sleep" attacks and does nothing for knockdown.

You might also want to glance at Sonic Defenders: each one grants about +55% resistance to all but psi, a similar AoE Mez shield to the FF set and "Clarity" which is essentially a 'Clear Mind' clone with a faster activation. They don't get the repel field but they do get two 30% -resistance powers, one an ally-anchored PBAoE.

A Sonic + a FF'er, or either type + an Empath can give silly amounts of damage mitigation!


 

Posted

Yup, ff's def buffs are really nice. Two stacked, superb!!

[ QUOTE ]
Mez resistance - does this need more than one dispersion bubble?

[/ QUOTE ]

One is enough... but mind the sleeps!!

[ QUOTE ]
Is it worth having more than one repulsion / force bubble? do they stack to keep bosses away?

[/ QUOTE ]

Repulsion is not needed at all, and one force bubble is all you need to keep bosses away. But keep in mind that all the repelled foes will be attracted by the repeller.


 

Posted

THanks chaps

Im pretty sure that 45% defence from one FF defender is not possible. It would equate to 90% damage / mez/ debuff mitigation which is pretty over powered. I love FF defenders but I havent noticed that ridiculous level of protection (even with manuevers). I used to have a /FF mastermind to level 33 and whilst good, and stacked with robots own FF and manuevers, it certainly wasnt near 90% mitigation.

It seems to Force Bubbles a bit of a waste of time then, thanks for that info.

I suppose two dispersion bubbles is pretty good.. no mez for team bar sleeps I would imagine. Everyone more resistant to mez than a tank. Probably worth running together and the def bonus handy.

Repulsion feild.. has anyone tried to FF defenders/trollers using this in tandem? I would imagine you could do quite nasty pinball manuevers (two FF'ers approaching from different directions) to herd mobs into a corner for perma knockdown? anyone tried this?

Lastly, I have a level 33 Grav/Sonic controller, so dont really want to do the sonic thing again, lovely as it is.

I wish someone could explain to me how KB/Repel magnitude stacks.


 

Posted

Defender numbers are considerably higher for buffs than Mastermind and Controller numbers though.

Looking at my tweaked planner it's:

22.03% for 3-slotted Normal Bubbles
15.74% for 3-slotted Disperation Bubble
7.34% for 3-slotted Manuvers

That's 45.11% to all but Psi for all teammates when they're near the FF'er.
And Dispersion Bubble and Manuvers work against Psi, so that's 23.08% Psi defense.
(Assumes +3 SOs, and won't work for toxic damage because toxic defense doesn't exist!)

[ QUOTE ]
I wish someone could explain to me how KB/Repel magnitude stacks.

[/ QUOTE ]
Can't help you with Repel, but I've noticed Knockdown/Knockups "stacking" to affect some "protected" mobs.

It seems that there's a percentage chance that gets higher as you hit it more often with Knockdown/Knockback powers... so if I used Air Superiority on a Boss it might not knock it down (Air Superiority is meant to have a 100% chance of causing knockback) but if I used it and then followed up with another knockdown/knockback attack, it's more likely the second attack will actually knock it over.

My Katana scrapper against an Elite Boss would usually not be able to knock it down at the very start of the fight, but as the fight progressed the Knockdowns seemed to come more and more regularly... I imagine you'd get a similar effect if you cast Ice Patch on the ground under a tank or scrapper in the arena.

Acrobatics is meant to have very high Knockback protection, much higher than normal melee toon toggles.


 

Posted

tbh i wouldnt trust the hero planner then. I havent noticed 90% damage mitigation from a FF'eilder. If a FF'eilder could truly produce this, alongside team mez protection, with just three powers it would be hideously overpowered? You would just need a FFeilder and 7 fire blasters to blitz through missions at a sick pace.

Might just be me of course... but with scaling defence ( a good thing), a defender who could make 90% of all mez's, damage, debuffs, etc miss... thats just wrong... I mean, compare it with sonic...

(and not in keeping with my observation as FFeilders who are very very good but not astounding).


 

Posted

I just double-checked the figures:

Nofuture quotes 15% base for the bubbles and 10% for dispersion bubble.
This is 1% higher than my builder gives for the two ally bubbles (and would yield 23.6% instead of 22.03%)

This amends the final figure from 45.11% to 46.68% with +3 SOs.

To be honest most FF'ers I've teamed with haven't slotted manuvers, which closes the final gap to 45% nicely.
You won't get any leeway for mob -defense or +tohit abilities though.
And remember that this only applies to Defenders, FF Controllers get considerably lower base numbers.

Comparing it with Sonic, yeah... sonic's buffs seem a tad underpowered (at least in PvE!).
But you get 60% -res and Clarity... and Sonic works on Toxic damage.

+55% resistance is still enough to cap the resistances of Fire Tanks, DA scrappers and nearly cap INV tanks.
It also turns those darn overpowered kat/regen scrappers into even MORE unstoppable killing machines...


 

Posted

Bear in mind that ff defenders numbers are higher that anything /ff, either MMs or trollers. I have been said dispersion bubble cant go beyond the base 9.25% def buffs, but can be slotted in case you got def debuffs on (which would be only worth for pvp purposes, and even then...). My builder seems to counter it, but as you said, builders aren't always trustworth. Still, it should add above 35% def with all 4 def buffs stacking if my builder is right (21.84% melee and ranged from deflection and insulation fields+9.25% from dispersion and 4.875 from maneuvres). Add roughly 5% more in case dispersion could be buffed beyond base and you will be really close to the 45% (which could be achieved with grant invis)

About the mag protection of dispersion bubble, I can tell you that my troller needs 4 troller holds to be affected (I've got acro too, which may, or may not add one more hold needed to the base, never tried without acro to find out).

Having tried the combo repulsion field/force bubble, if you have both at a time and acrob and ss you will be losing end even when not attacking (that is, repulsion and force with 3 endrdx each, and ss and acrob with one each), and the repel effect added won't be noticeable (force bubble range is far wider than repusion's one). About it being worth or not for pve, i guess that depends on personal opinion. I did skip it, but it's really a must if you plan to pvp


 

Posted

I'm playing a force field defender at the moment because I really can't remember the last time I've seen one above lvl 22, and at lvl 28 now fully SO'ed people are regularly surprised by the defence we can give them.

To give you abit of ingame experience from last night I was the only defender on a team of 6, 2 scrappers and 3 blasters fighting +2/3's and no-ones health even dipped out of green through several missions, I was well impressed, I even got a tell afterwards from one of the players saying how he used to think bubbles were a wasted power set but is now turned around on the subject.

As for stacking bubbles with other force fielders, I can't say I've tried this in ages because I haven't seen one, lots of people seem to give up around lvl 22-ish, but I find when teaming with a good empath deaths are extremely rare, as these two sets work really nicely together.


 

Posted

People do tend to be surprised when they team with a Defender bubbler. I got mine to 50, mostly through SG teams and a few repeat PuG's. So many players do assume it's wasted but the second you have someone reliably rebuffing bubbles slotted with SO's you can see the difference it makes and you will find converts. I was able to keep entire teams completely healthy with no defensive help aside from bubbles and the occasionaly medicine pool use. From my experiences at the higher levels that cap number seems about right, but bear in mind thats only if the defender is keeping everyone in maneuvers/dispersion range and LOS which means getting into the heart of the fight...


The pellet with the poisons in the Vessel with the Pessel, the Chalice from the Palace has the brew that is true...

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
I'm playing a force field defender at the moment because I really can't remember the last time I've seen one above lvl 22, and at lvl 28 now fully SO'ed people are regularly surprised by the defence we can give them.

To give you abit of ingame experience from last night I was the only defender on a team of 6, 2 scrappers and 3 blasters fighting +2/3's and no-ones health even dipped out of green through several missions, I was well impressed, I even got a tell afterwards from one of the players saying how he used to think bubbles were a wasted power set but is now turned around on the subject.

As for stacking bubbles with other force fielders, I can't say I've tried this in ages because I haven't seen one, lots of people seem to give up around lvl 22-ish, but I find when teaming with a good empath deaths are extremely rare, as these two sets work really nicely together.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ehem i have my FF/PS defender still going. It's in lvl 22 and still going on.

So i am not into stats so much but i can say these nonetheless;

Forcebubble is great way to handle foes. Especially keeping them away from blasters and controllers. Also it can be used to sneak enemies, i.e. someone trying to stab your scrapper form back, remove from their advantage.

Bubbles has good defences. I also add tp and stealth from power pool and i am going great. Only down side is i can't fight alone very well. Of course i can handle up to 3 enemies in time but more can be deadly.

Also we must keep in mind that i am always find myself as leader. This powers give me great advantage on my biz. IMO a good leader must stay back and organize his/her team, try his/her best to keep them alive. FF gave me that chance and i am happy about it. In players eye we can be less effective than a healer but you can be sure we will survive longer.