Mastermind AI Issues (19 Nov 2006)


ArtanixUK_EU

 

Posted

I'm sure by now several people may have noticed issues with the artificial intelligence of Mastermind henchmen are still there. Many discussions in the US Forums testify to the fact (including a new official thread), and its been a while since we did this locally too.

So, from the previous listing and as far as I know these are the issues we have identified previously and their status...

Ninja Criticals Remains
Burn Patch/Caltrop/Toxic Gas Fear Effect Remains
Team Aggro Remains
Group Flight Remains
Group Teleport Remains
Stuck Henchmen - Lifts in Missions (Kalgoras) Partially Resolved
Auto TP and Stay Commands (Soul Warden) Remains
Recall Friend + Stay Command (Canine) Remains
Oranbega Portals and Pets (Canine) Remains
Missions with Freaks (Kalgoras) Unknown
Newly Summoned Henchmen Resume Dead Orders (Silver Weasel) Unknown
Passive -> Grant Invis -> Goto -> Aggressive (Sinergy X) Unknown
The Goto Jerks (Soul Warden) Remains
Force Shielding Priorities (Soul Warden) Remains
Robotics vs. Thorn Tree (Dr E Genius) Unknown
Merc Weapon Redraw (Sinergy X) Unknown
Melee vs. Access to Melee (Tchalla) Unknown

Could people who can give a definitive answer if the Unknown problems have been fixed please speak up

Next up are the newly identified AI bugs I've encountered ingame. These may not be game breaking (MM's are getting to L50 just fine), but it certainly puts a cramp on a lot of styles and sets.

Thugs Brute using Handclap/Hurl Boulder to Exclusion
The final henchman in the Thugs Primary is designed to be a Brute - a melee thug. Unfortunately, for whatever reason, he is overly fond of a non-damaging attack (Handclap) and a ranged attack (Hurl Boulder).

Proposed Fix: The recharge times on these may need to be modified from their normal so that the Bruiser is more inclined to go for a melee attack chain.

Workaround: Micromanagement, or not using all the upgrades on the Bruiser

Uneven Terrain Causes Stuck Henchman
This one has been around forever but it ought to be addressed, perhaps in a fix to resolve all stuck pet issues. If a henchman is summoned on uneven ground there is a high chance of them getting stuck.

Proposed Fix: What I'd like to see is that any henchman on Follow who is not undertaking any attacks and has not got any closer to a MM since the AI last checked (every 10 seconds?) gets auto-TP'd. Exclusions for mezzes obviously need to be made.

Workaround: Find flat ground when summoning. Hard to do in some missions!

Henchmen Attacking Untargettable Objects (CoT Crystals)
This has been around forever and I find it odd I've not noted it in these posts before. Henchmen can see and target things that players can not - lava, CoT Crystals, invisible NPC's, Arachnoid Webbing, etc. A lot of these things can not be hurt/are intangible.

Proposed Fix: The AI needs an upgrade so that things that are known intangible/undamageable are no longer considered as valid targets.

Workaround: Passive Stance makes them ignore these sort of things, but Passive is not perfect as it cuts off Bodyguard and Henchmen Buffing

Thugs Upgrade Costume Changes
Not encountered this one myself, but heard about it plenty of times to include it on the list (even though the devs are probably sick to the back teeth with it ). Thugs seem to have a costume change problem, whereby the last upgrade applied denotes the costume they are in.

Proposed Fix: Coding needs to be changed so that if the L32 Upgrade is applied, no further costume changes take place. The code should be mapped across all henchies, just in case too!

Workaround: Annoyingly, reapply the L32 buff

Seeker Drones (Robotics) Getting Stuck
Been happening a while, but quite consistantly these days so I'm considering it an AI problem. Seeker Drones summoned by a Protector Bot are dumb. Very dumb. I can run around a mission and a Seeker Drone left by the entrance can be there when I get back! Problem with this is, if all four Seekers from your Prot Bots get stuck, then thats half your L32 Upgrade not in play until they despawn.

Proposed Fix: They need the same sort of code fix as stuck pets - checking their distance from and progress towards their summoner and auto-TPing if needed.

Workaround: None, they're that dumb. Maybe Recall Friend if you're very bothered!

---

That's all I've got, so over to the Mastermind community! What other bugs have you seen of late with the behaviour of henchmen? How are you working around it? And what kind of fix/behaviour would you want to see?


 

Posted

What is the issue with group teleport? I thought that works ok after trying it out on test server..


 

Posted

Previously it was reported henches don't often get the 2-3 second hover, allowing you to chain it to travel through the air - making it only any good for travelling along the ground.

Maybe its fixed?


 

Posted

One that has happend to me on a number of occasions that I dont see listed is this.

Summoning on uneven or vertical ground

While summoning on uneven/vertical ground its possible for the summoning to just be partial or not happen at all.

It happens when the target circle of a summon is placed on a ledge, for instance the center sewer canal ledge from the water. If you summon while having the circle verticle it can happen, or if the circle is just on an incline like on a cave mission.

Few times I have gotten 1 of my 3 thugs, sometimes none came.


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Previously it was reported henches don't often get the 2-3 second hover, allowing you to chain it to travel through the air - making it only any good for travelling along the ground.

Maybe its fixed?

[/ QUOTE ]

WAs fixed last time I tried it, I dont currently have it on my MM thou.

Tbh, it DID look kinda quirky, but it was working... and thats what matters, right?

Ill try to describe how it was working..
1st teleport: Henchies drop a bit downwards but do hover
2nd teleport onwards: Henchies are hovering with you, but somehow occupy the same space, making it look like only one henchman is with you. When you stop teleporting for 2 secs they spread out again.

Fascinating, isnt it?

I wonder if someone can confirm its working, or Ill ahve to copy my MM ot test and respec again..


 

Posted

got a wierd one, that popped up last night. Dragging insps from the insp bar to the pets on screen, is dodgy at best. But tend to get reds and want to get rid of them

anyway, dragged, and was out of range, insp did the usual trick of going invisible on the insp bar, dragged an awaken over its previous slot which brings the insp back usually. What then happened was new, instead of giving me my red one back, it then used both of them on the pet, and the pet showed 2 enrages had been used on the pet.

Sorry if the explanation is back, not quite an AI error, but a MM bug anyway


 

Posted

[/color]<blockquote><font class="small">Antwort auf:[/color]<hr />
Thugs Brute using Handclap/Hurl Boulder to Exclusion
The final henchman in the Thugs Primary is designed to be a Brute - a melee thug. Unfortunately, for whatever reason, he is overly fond of a non-damaging attack (Handclap) and a ranged attack (Hurl Boulder).

Proposed Fix: The recharge times on these may need to be modified from their normal so that the Bruiser is more inclined to go for a melee attack chain.


[/ QUOTE ]
I am not convinced this would work. The bruiser seems to be perfectly happy standing around doing nothing but wait for Hurl to recharge, so I suppose if the recharge time was longer he would simply wait somewhat longer.
Considering that ninja and zombies have similar (if not as crippling) issues with ranged attacks being preferred over melee this problem seems to be a little bit more complex.




If it has
eyes, you can blind it, if it has blood, you can make it bleed, if it has a mouth, you can make it scream.

 

Posted

Hence "may need" - I have no idea how the AI works - just that it needs fixing somehow


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Hence "may need" - I have no idea how the AI works - just that it needs fixing somehow

[/ QUOTE ]Seems to me (from watching necro knights) that the AI has an "in melee" flag, and if that flag is not toggled on (on the hench types that prefer range even though they have melee powers) then they will stay in range as long as the flag is not on. If it is switched on, they'll pursue targets and try to get to melee for a while, but if left out of combat for a bit, the flag will switch off again.


 

Posted

dropping insps seems to trigger the melee flag sometimes, and once they're in melee, they'll stay that way.


 

Posted

Since we're kind of onto general bugs, etc....

Mastermind Combat Logs
Unlike temporary pets like the Shivan Destroyer, a Masterminds' pets do not properly report their damage in the combat log. Worse, they actually leave gaping big holes in it where the reports should be.

Makes reading the log hard! And for some of us who use HeroStats and other third-party applications it makes some of the tracking useless!

Proposed Fix: Make it work same as temporary pets? Gotta be a bug!

Workaround: None


 

Posted

never noticed that one then again never really tracked what stuff does


 

Posted

Thugs Upgrade Costume Changes
Not encountered this one myself, but heard about it plenty of times to include it on the list (even though the devs are probably sick to the back teeth with it ). Thugs seem to have a costume change problem, whereby the last upgrade applied denotes the costume they are in.


I have found this to be more serious than i realised. When I did upgrade thugs on my men and when I did it didnt upgrade them aswell as the not giving them there new outfit.

How this happens is doing equip thugs and doin upgrade thugs to quick one after the other which results in the glitch

The only thing i can offer to use a temp fix is to upgrade them a bit slower so that the amaintion for the equip finishs


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]

Merc Weapon Redraw (Sinergy X) Unknown


[/ QUOTE ]
I've started a new mastermind, Thugs/dark, wich actualy has the same issue. Once the mob is killed, they instantly put away their gun. Even if there is a 2nd mob next to them, they redraw the gun.

Unlike AR blaster/corrupters (or even primairy weapon of the mastermind), wich keep the weapon 'active' for a period of time.

Possible fix: force henchmen to keep their weapon active for a longer period of time.


50)Sinergy X/(50)Mika.
(50)MaceX/(50)Encore

Sign the petition, dont let CoH go down! SIGN!