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hmmmmmmmm sounds interesting. So do Stalkers have the same secondaries as Scrappers or are their at least one or two new ones?
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More or less. Example: you can have a /regen Stalker. But instead of Quick Recovery, they get Hide, and a couple of powers are switched about.
All Stalker secondaries include Hide as their first power. Hide and AS are the defining powers of the Stalker classes.
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and what if you're solo'in? that mean you cant placate? or do they just go back to their non-aggro'd state?
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You can Placate when soloing, but only one target at a time. Stalkers have considerably lower HP than Scrappers, and I think slightly lower damage cap (could anyone confirm that/tell me I'm wrong?) The beta forums had various opinions upon how useful Placate was. I never got it in beta to try it out.
My tactic pre-placate for soloing tough targets was to assassinate each of the characters surrounding a boss, running away between strikes. These are probably minions and you can 1-shot them, even before you get AS. Once all his mates are dead, you go for the boss.
Trying to take on a boss and more than one minion is usually asking to sample the carpet with your face.
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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Ravenswing, are you gonna troll the stalker board and deride the build forever?
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The only "derision" I can see in Ravens thread is the fact that he says theres going to be nerf, which you confirm.
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At the time there were three posts on the entire stalker board and Raven had a comment on all three. Each time a Stalker was portrayed in a less than favourable light. Which is the reason for this persons understandable outburst.
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Um, what are you on? I just went back and looked at the first three posts in the thread and my response. Now, to me, it looked like I stated solid facts regarding the points made in the early posts, and gave additional information regarding Hide and AS.
I guess I could have left out the bit about the nerf, but it is pertinent information regarding a defining power of the AT.
I really suggest you go back and take another look. Then get off your high horse.
I mean, exactly how does "Your first attack on a target while Hidden is an automatic critical" portray Stalkers in "a less than favourable light"?
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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hmmmmmmmm sounds interesting. So do Stalkers have the same secondaries as Scrappers or are their at least one or two new ones?
and what if you're solo'in? that mean you cant placate? or do they just go back to their non-aggro'd state?
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All Secondaries have hide as their 1st tier power. Hide provides a small def buff ( I assume the same as stealth ) but a higher defence against AoE attacks from what I read on the beta boards, it might be as high as 20% against AoEs.
Super Reflexes is like the Scrapper secondary but without Evasion ( I think ) and everything moved up one to compensate for hide.
Regen is like the Scrapper secondary but without Quick Recovery and with everything moved up to compensate for hide.
Ninjitsu is a new one. It has toggles and the final power from super reflexes ( description wise ), doesn't have passives and has a self heal, some smoke and blinding powers and caltrops.
Energy defence is a new one. It's a defence based armour set.
As far as Placate and solo, the placated enemy reverts to its non aggro'd state and start walking back to their spawn point. So it is good to finish off the last enemy of a spawn.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
Ravenswing said:
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My tactic pre-placate for soloing tough targets was to assassinate each of the characters surrounding a boss, running away between strikes. These are probably minions and you can 1-shot them, even before you get AS. Once all his mates are dead, you go for the boss.
Trying to take on a boss and more than one minion is usually asking to sample the carpet with your face.
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I approach it slightly differently.
Up to level 11 I've found this is generally successful for soloing.
Build up + AS one shot's +1 lieutenants and (iirc) allows me to two shot even level bosses. I then scrap the one or two remaining minions. If they're +1 it can be a tense fight, if they're even level it's usually no problem.
Four minions is often touch and go.
The success of this approach can be very dependent on luck. If I miss my AS on a particularly nasty looking group or get a serious case of misses I'm in trouble.
The above is a build (spines/Energy Armour) that's not really using enhancements. I say not really as most of the slots are currently empty apart from one accuracy in each attack and some out of date defence in the first armour (I only seem to find redrec and endrec enhancements which I'm not using in my attacks).
I'm not finding soloing particularly slow using this approach. Not quite running from group to group like an ADD scrapper, but it's not painfully slow.
As for teaming, I'm not having any noticeably greater difficulty finding teams than with my Tank or Defender. I'm also not getting kicked from teams for being useless or leeching. My experience of having another stalker on the team is also positive so far. I'm finding that in these situations the real troublesome good guys in a mob are being taken out almost immediately leaving plenty of canon fodder to be mopped up.
Whether this good fortune continues at higher levels we'll wait and see. 
I think teams of Stalkers could do well.
The issue I found with teams was in making actual use of AS. There were two situations:
The team aggros the mob you're trying to take out, and you lose lock.
The team stands back and you either drop or near-drop the 'boss', only to find your friends can't get to you fast enough to save you from planting when everything else turns around and smacks you.
No one was sure it was a bug, or just a consequence of the x7 multiplier on AS, but generally if you assassinate something, you can expect to aggro everything in LoS, and a few things that couldn't have seen you. Might have been 'fixed' for retail, not sure.
Either way, AS is always going to draw a lot of aggro, and an aggro'd mob can see you right through Hide. Be careful out there, Stalkers!
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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Either way, AS is always going to draw a lot of aggro, and an aggro'd mob can see you right through Hide. Be careful out there, Stalkers!
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I found that if I start the combat, everyone descends on me, otherwise I get maybe the back half of the spawn ( I tend to AS the ones near the back first ). Also if someone opens with an AoE debuff, it reduces the aggro on you.
I think it makes most sense to get someone else to start and then you AS as soon as the enemies start noticing. Most of my face plants were to do with me starting the combat and the team not being ready.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
Agree with Unthing. I'm finding the 'best' tactic is to get in position, let someone else attack first. As you notice the enemy 'heads up' then start your attack. I'm getting some aggro, but not all aggro.
Regarding losing lock, I'm not finding this too much of a problem. Once I've started the attack it continues and hits the target no matter how far away he can run in those few seconds. The only times I seem to be losing lock are if hide is being disrupted and I'm attacked or if some mastermind's pets push me out of the way.
That's the trouble with teams... YMMV. 
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
I'm not sure what level you got to in beta, Raven, and everyone has different experiences depending on chocies, but I solo-ed fine against a lvl6 boss (some snake queen) and 2 minions after taking out all the surrounding minions.
After lvl7 I was teamed and I always waited at the back of a group of mobs next to Lt or Boss, waited for the rest of the team to start aggro, and then used AS/AB to take down the lt/boss (and yes I lost lock perhaps twice with AB yesterday, but on the whole it seemed to work). The AS might peel off a few mobs at me, but I generally ran back to the team if things got a little hairy. The only downside of teaming yesterday was I felt the team would have been able to clear the mishs without me.
Only at lvl13, but hoping to get a few more lvls in tonight via teaming, but may try some solo afterwards and see how it goes. I know now I would change my beginning power choices for later on, but that will have to wait for a respec.
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but I solo-ed fine against a lvl6 boss (some snake queen) and 2 minions
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Nice, but you don't state what level you were when you took it on.
For the record, I think I made level 8 or 9. I'm looking forward to going through it again (hopefully with sufficiently lower lag that I don't want to physically remove the game off the disc with my finger nails) and this time getting Placate and one or two other cool powers.
May not use /regen this time though. The Stalker set doesn't have QR, and some of the other sets look more attractive for use by a Stalker, Ninjutsu in particular. I'm just worried about the nerfing defense-based sets took and how playable they are.
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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but I solo-ed fine against a lvl6 boss (some snake queen) and 2 minions
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Nice, but you don't state what level you were when you took it on.
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Sorry, forgot. I was the same level as boss and minions. Similar to playing my blaster solo (and unlike my scrapper which I can just wade into groups), I find I have to think out my attacks prior to going in. Like a blaster once my health is half or less with at least 2 full health mobs, it's basically time to think about retreat.
Yesterday, the one thing I wish I had was a single target hold or immobilize when I was solo-ing.
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May not use /regen this time though. The Stalker set doesn't have QR, and some of the other sets look more attractive for use by a Stalker, Ninjutsu in particular. I'm just worried about the nerfing defense-based sets took and how playable they are.
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Which powers did you take from regen? I've been relying on my 4 slotted reconstruction to keep me alive. I only got Hide, Recon and Integration so far and haven't played since I got integration. However Ninjitsu looks neat, with effectively a second ( group ) placate and some other powers. It looks like the most stalkery ( and least scrappery ) of the 4 powersets.
I think regen can probably survive the most battering but generally I think the defence sets will let you pull off better stuff.
SR fully slotted may be able to Placate one enemy and AS whilst being attacked by others ( because they miss ).
Ninjitsu has group confuse, sleep and placate powers.
Energy has enemy endurance drain, which if it is as good as defender short circuit might allow you to AS in combat.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
I'm going with Ninjutsu, to be honest. I was quite enjoying it in the beta, and it has a bit fo everything, defense, extra placate, a heal..
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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I think teams of Stalkers could do well.
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They do!
Due to pure chance (the villains of the right level that were looking for a team at the time) I spent tonight teaming with various combinations of stalker teams. Specifically 3 stalkers; 4 stalkers; 3 stalkers & 1 mastermind; 2 stalkers and 1 mastermind.
Between levels 10 and 13, smallish teams heavy on stalkers are quick and a lot of fun. Adding the mastermind seemed to remove a lot of the risk factor.
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Energy has enemy endurance drain, which if it is as good as defender short circuit might allow you to AS in combat.
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does the endurance drain work like power sink in that it gives the endurance to you or does it just get rid of theirs?
man i hate taking stamina 
ninjitsu sounds awesome and will prob b what i take if i roll a villain
What are the Stalker primaries? Sounds like we've got a lot of Ninja Blade's and Spines in the house
Personally i feel stalkers, are underpowered, when it comes to PvP, due to there defences. Its like SR, they'll really only shine at high levels when they have their "elude" power. As for effectiveness in PvP I wasn't impressed, i fought them and they were weak, any clued in PvPer will know that they should carry insights, or use powers which involve +perception. Assassin strike, is all they really have tbh, once out of assassin strike, they really do fall
One stalker was hidden and said "you can't see me :P" how did i respond.... popped an insight and one shotted him, before he used his strike... So much for assassin strike there eh :P
My often used technique is when in PvP zones as my scrapper, i'll be playing the role as a stalker killer, CoD offers +perception. So i usually trick them into attempting to AS me and then take them out. As for assassin strike damage, with my shields up, and them using build up they can get me down to the yellow hp zone, but normally i can kill them as soon as discovered, and normally once they have used AS and are discovered they run....... Which leads me to say stalkers really are one trick wonders tbh, their main tactic in PvP is AS then run, personally that doesn't really hack it as PvP build to me.
As for nerfs due to PvP, they shouldn't really need it, they realy aren't special in PvP, after all anyone that knows PvP will know how to prevent being struck....AoE aura, insights, +perception powers etc etc
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One stalker was hidden and said "you can't see me :P" how did i respond.... popped an insight and one shotted him, before he used his strike... So much for assassin strike there eh :P
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Aside from the fact that the Stalker above was obviously either an idiot, or didn't actually want to attack you and you just blasted him because you're mean ( 
), I agree with your comments. Stalkers can't one shot Scrappers, Tanks, or Brutes (maybe, at high level, with Build-up and a lot of popped reds). Anyone well prepared enough can usually spot them, and a spotted Stalker is dead meat.
That siad, your tactic is going to start falling down when some of the Stalkers start going up in level. Hide+Stealth+Superspeed... You're going to need a fair dose of perception enhancers to see through that, though it is supposedly possible.
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As for nerfs due to PvP, they shouldn't really need it, they realy aren't special in PvP
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Ah, but they can one shot low HP toons (can't do anything else, but they can do that), which is apparently unfair. They will get nerfed, hopefully ONLY in PvP.
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.
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You're going to need a fair dose of perception enhancers to see through that, though it is supposedly possible.
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Focussed Accuracy plus Cloak of Darkness will make "Recluses Suspiciously Redecorated Atlas" a hellhole for Stalkers. Nothing can hide from me at the moment, I doubt they will be able to eather.
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You're going to need a fair dose of perception enhancers to see through that, though it is supposedly possible.
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Focussed Accuracy plus Cloak of Darkness will make "Recluses Suspiciously Redecorated Atlas" a hellhole for Stalkers. Nothing can hide from me at the moment, I doubt they will be able to eather.
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Make sure some people on your team have Tactics too just to be excessive.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
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You're going to need a fair dose of perception enhancers to see through that, though it is supposedly possible.
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Focussed Accuracy plus Cloak of Darkness will make "Recluses Suspiciously Redecorated Atlas" a hellhole for Stalkers. Nothing can hide from me at the moment, I doubt they will be able to eather.
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Make sure some people on your team have Tactics too just to be excessive.
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I only team with Scrappers nowadays, and our tactics consist of "Hit it until it stops twitching, then nuke it.".
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You're going to need a fair dose of perception enhancers to see through that, though it is supposedly possible.
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Focussed Accuracy plus Cloak of Darkness will make "Recluses Suspiciously Redecorated Atlas" a hellhole for Stalkers. Nothing can hide from me at the moment, I doubt they will be able to eather.
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Make sure some people on your team have Tactics too just to be excessive.
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I only team with Scrappers nowadays, and our tactics consist of "Hit it until it stops twitching, then nuke it.".
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Sounds like a valid ( and tried and tested ) tactic to me.
Thinking about it, as Focussed Accuracy is an epic, doesn't that mean that in the PvP zones you get exemped so you can't use it?
My scrapper is getting tactics so all the rest of the team knows he is going to impale everything with spines. Also it means he only needs one ACC in each power ( rather than the 2 he had before ). This leaves the epic free for something more fun.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
Thats why I mentioned "Recluses Suspiciously Redecorated Atlas" which will be for 40+.
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Ravenswing, are you gonna troll the stalker board and deride the build forever?
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I think Q's response about covers it, but I suppose I should respond.
My post states exactly what I think of the Stalker AT. It will be slow to level, because it operates badly solo and in teams. It's primary use is in PvP. If that's what you consider trolling, then I suggest you look up the definition of 'opinion'.
Also, why exactly would I deride a class which, as has been pointed out, I played in beta and will be creating one of tonight in retail?
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Don't get me wrong, I don't mind you expressing your opinion, but it seems only fair on a board that will attract a lot of new players interest that you try to back some of your opinions up with facts or examples.
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There are no facts, Cryptic don't publish facts. All there is is qualitative opinions expressed by those who have played the class. I have played the class and I gave my opinion of the way it playes based on my experience. If you don't like my experience, ignore it.
However, exposing "new players" to an unending stream of positive statements about something is just as bad as them seeing negative comments.
As for the nerf thing: this was discussed at length on the coV beta boards. Cryptic don't like the fact that Stalkers can one-shot weaker classes using AS (please see note below on AS). Various nerfs are being considered, what comes out of them could be something entirely new, but there will be a nerf of somekind, because all the other classes don't like being one-shotted by Stalkers either.
Regarding AS, yes, I know the generic name is Assassin Strike you bunch of pedants. I was specifically referring to the specific powers, which have different names. So get over it.
Disclaimer: The above may be humerous, or at least may be an attempt at humour. Try reading it that way.
Posts are OOC unless noted to be IC, or in an IC thread.