A well slotted Fire/Kin has a heal for 400+ HP every 3 seconds, can refill his end bar anytime he wants, is constantly fighting at the damage cap, has imps constantly fighting at the damage cap, and can Speed Boost an entire team.
I don't think /rad even compares. RI won't matter as you should be capped for smash/lethal anyway. EM won't matter as you'll have perma hasten and transference removes the need for +recovery.
Choking cloud would be good though! Especially stacked with Cinders! And Enervating Field would mean you do more damage - but would it make you hit as hard as a controller at the damage cap? That's the million dollar question. 
Based on my experience with a well IO'ed fire/rad, I'd say the difference is primarily one of speed vs. safety.
Fire/kin can defeat groups at a much faster rate, but stands a greater chance of being defeated if they lose focus. More damage, but less safety & control.
Fire/rad will defeat groups at a slower pace (although not all that much slower), and will have much greater control & safety due to Choking Cloud. Once you are in a spawn with CC running, that's pretty much it. Bosses can be just about insta-held with CC & Cinders.
Fire/rad needs more of an IO investment to work well than fire/kin. It is not cheap. Fire/rad really needs to have perma-AM to be able to run all the endurance heavy toggles, along with the + recovery uniques. Fire/kin is very self sufficient when it comes to endurance.
I am biased, but my opinion is that a good fire/rad will bring more to a team than a fire/kin (and you won't be getting pestered every 5 seconds with 'SB PLZ').
I am running my fully IO'd fire/rad with nearly perma hasten and no recovery uniques other than the Performance Shifter proc and don't have any end problems.
I find I don't need to run radiation infection very often, except on exceedingly hard targets or if I want to utilize the achilles resist proc I slotted in it.
My 'new' fire/kin is now 42 with no IOs but feels infinitely more fragile than my fire/rad did at the same level. Hot Feet without Choking Cloud makes me feel very vulnerable for one thing. I also have fighting pool on my fire/kin, but didn't find I needed it on my fire/rad.
Playing a fire/rad isn't even close to the frenetic experience of playing the clicky fire/kin. Although slightly slower defeating enemies, my fire/rad doesn't suffer from any downtime either.
I also feel that a fire/rad brings more to teams than a fire/kin with all the debuffs and AM.
They both get the job done well. Just depends if you want a little more speed while constantly clicking buttons, or a lot more safety with a more relaxed pace.
Oh, I almost forgot! Having rad's EM Pulse which is a huge radius long duration hold on top of cinders is a thing of beauty. That gives you two aoe holds in addition to all the other controls you get.
That's my 2 cents worth.
Queen of the Amazons, WP/DB
Sound Judgement Son/Son
Cobra Lily Plant/Kin
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Argh! posted fire/thermal stuff in wrong thread!
Queen of the Amazons, WP/DB
Sound Judgement Son/Son
Cobra Lily Plant/Kin
Celestia, FF/Psy
Nefertiri, Storm/Elec
Pixie, Ill/Rad
Guardian Server
I want to echo the statements made by CelestiaCoH and Panzerwaffen. I have both a Fire/Rad and a Fire/Kin. I find Fire/Rad overall more fun to play, even though the Fire/Kin is faster. The fire/kin is also more fragile. While the Fire/Kin is probably more effective with fewer max-IOs, you don't have to fully IO out a Fire/Rad to have perma AM for it to be very effecitve.
I have often been running my Fire/Rad with three friends, all of whom now also have Fire/Rads at 50 (mine was first). Running 4 Fire/Rads simply wipes out anything and everything in this game, and stacked Choking Cloud + Hot Feet wipes out just about everything without having to wait for Flashfire to recharge. Stacked AM means that we can run though everything without stopping.
And, I have been on a team of 8 Fire/Rads -- never seen any team more powerful than 8 Fire/Rads. The speed record on the Statesman's TF was set by a team of 8 Fire/Rads. Simply amazing.
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The question was about farming. If you're farming, a Fire/Kin will drastically out perform a Fire/Rad.
All of the other discussion if valid and I tend to agree that a Fire/Rad bring more to a team.
But for farming, it's no contest.
[ QUOTE ]
The question was about farming. If you're farming, a Fire/Kin will drastically out perform a Fire/Rad.
All of the other discussion if valid and I tend to agree that a Fire/Rad bring more to a team.
But for farming, it's no contest.
[/ QUOTE ]
I disagree, to a certain extent. Yes, kins are faster. But it is not quite as drastic as you seem to imply. A good fire/rad can do a fair job of keeping up with an average fire/kin.
It also depends on what you're farming. As the targets get harder, the gap between kin and rad shrinks quickly. Rad has the advantage on hard targets in my experience.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The question was about farming. If you're farming, a Fire/Kin will drastically out perform a Fire/Rad.
All of the other discussion if valid and I tend to agree that a Fire/Rad bring more to a team.
But for farming, it's no contest.
[/ QUOTE ]
I disagree, to a certain extent. Yes, kins are faster. But it is not quite as drastic as you seem to imply. A good fire/rad can do a fair job of keeping up with an average fire/kin.
It also depends on what you're farming. As the targets get harder, the gap between kin and rad shrinks quickly. Rad has the advantage on hard targets in my experience.
[/ QUOTE ]
Eh, Again Speed over Safety...most of the time when you are playing a Fire kin you don't have time to do all that the poster list above. In between you Immob'ing and stunning a mob you have to worry about healing and sb'ing the team....I only play my kins when I'm full of energy lol.
I've seen with other teams that two kin buds will be lumped together one (Fire/kin) focuses on kicking the most butt while the other kin supports the team.
Also with a /rad teams tend to not notice what you bring to the table.
For farming I recommend a fire/Kin and a Fire/Rad! Speed and safety lol. I have both and I like my fire/rad more for solo farming. You never have to leave mission to go to the hospital lol!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The question was about farming. If you're farming, a Fire/Kin will drastically out perform a Fire/Rad.
All of the other discussion if valid and I tend to agree that a Fire/Rad bring more to a team.
But for farming, it's no contest.
[/ QUOTE ]
I disagree, to a certain extent. Yes, kins are faster. But it is not quite as drastic as you seem to imply. A good fire/rad can do a fair job of keeping up with an average fire/kin.
It also depends on what you're farming. As the targets get harder, the gap between kin and rad shrinks quickly. Rad has the advantage on hard targets in my experience.
[/ QUOTE ]
Well a "good" vs an "average" is going to even things out when comparing just about any two toons.
Again, a Fire/Rad will be safer against harder opponents, but I still don't agree with faster or better. My Fire/Kin farms the Cim wall without using Flashfire or Cinders, and those guys hit hard.
I have a lot of respect for the Fire/Rad, but Fire/Kin is the answer to any farming controller question.
Fire/Kins are great on farms. They're perfect for using a Fallout on! ;-P
Seriously, though, there are so many kins running around these days, its hard to NOT be at damage cap. One more kin isn't going to change things.
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My fire/rad was i think my 3rd 50. It is a BLAST. The combiation can't go wrong... and rads are GREAT on a team, or more importantly a tf. Anythother thing about rad is there is a lot less micro-managing. I also like to be slightly different. I made that toon way before this crazy fire/kin obsession. I have A LOT more fun with that toon, kin is too much. Rad has debuffs, heals, and rez... how can you go wrong?
Can someone post a strong Fire/Rad build that has actually farmed succesfully?
how much faster is a fire/kin than a fire/rad at farming?
i was thinking that fire/rad woud be better for the aoe debuffs and there will be larger mobs with i16 etc