Oh, I love patrols. They add flavor to a mission. I just don't like having to kill them. I especially don't like having to double back and run all the way through a map again because it's a defeat all and some patrol slipped past me. Also, they tend to get stuck in weird places.
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
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Oh, I love patrols. They add flavor to a mission. I just don't like having to kill them. I especially don't like having to double back and run all the way through a map again because it's a defeat all and some patrol slipped past me. Also, they tend to get stuck in weird places.
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Ah, it's the combo defeat all + patrol. I should have read more carefully. I dig.
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I only use Defeat All if there is a plot reason to do so. Even then, I prefer to use smaller maps for it, if there is a suitable one available. I also try to use other options to reduce the enemy counts, such as adding more clickies to use up spawn locations.
I know from reading these forums that some players will skip my arcs because one mission out of four in is a defeat all, but I am primarily creating these arcs for my own enjoyment. If a few other players find them entertaining as well, so much the better.
I avoid defeat alls, don't use them, don't like them.
aside from being annoying, they are anti-climactic.
Defeat the clockwork king - mission doesn't end. You have to hunt down one minion in the corner. That's not a climax, that's lame.
It's all in the use. Does the mission have other objectives? If so, then a Defeat All flag is probably not required. If a mission has a Defeat All objective, it should be on a small, easily-explored map so as to avoid much backtracking to hunt down mobs in hiding.
Sadly, the biggest problem will be those people who don't even give your mission a shot because they see the Defeat All flag, and worse yet, may even deliberately start your arc to give it a low rating. So you'll have to take your target audience into consideration.
I think the stigma behind Defeat All comes from the fact that everyone, at some point in the game, has run into a bad experience with a Defeat All. From the sound of it, many replies in this thread provide evidence to this theory.
"Hello, GM? Yeah, another darned Outcast stuck in the ceiling. Come a runnin'." 
Dec out.
There is an inherent problem with the DEFEAT ALL tag on mission lists. It is that there are actually 2 different versions of defeat all; the DEFEAT ALL ENEMIES ON THE MAP, and then there is the DEFEAT ALL ENEMIES IN THE FINAL ROOM WITH THE BOSS. The Mission Architect makes no distinction between the two with the Defeat All tag, and those are two very different objectives.
Also, A DEFEAT ALL objective is relative because it depends on the size and type of the map. If the map is fairly linear, small, and/or clean of hidey-holes, then it really isn't much of a problem. But if it is a large outdoor map, branching map, or map filled with nooks and crannies (think CoT) then its a nightmare. There is NO way a player can really evaluate this outside of the mission. All (s)he would see is a generic size evaluation (some I would say are misleading) and the tag Defeat All, and if they see UNIQUE for a map description, then all bets are off the table, as it could be anything.
I will still use Defeat All for objectives, but it is an objective that should be used sparingly, and as a story critical element.
That said, I have been on many, many teams that basically mow down each and every enemy group they come across till the mission is spotlessly clean. It is NOT that players do not or will not do Defeat All objectives, after all, most of the mission's XP is locked up in all the enemies through out the map, it is that some players are adverse to that objective having had some really bad experiences with spending hours looking for some small pet or underling lurking in some odd back corner of a lousy map in a mission just to complete it. A few others just want to skip to the End Boss of a mission, slice his throat, and move on to the next mission, which to me seems more like paying for a movie ticket only to watch the last 10 minutes of the movie. This is also why so many object or dislike escort objectives, because the have to go back though all the enemies that they skipped and deal with them.
So, Do use Defeat All objectives, but use them were it makes it a Story Element, and select your map carefully, and above all Play Test it!
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I'm painted myself into a corner again me thinks.
I've seen alot of reviewers, Talen_Lee, dragonslay, and Lazarus, and the top guru of reveiwers hailed by Positron himself, Venture, all seem to agree on one thing:
Defeat All as a flag should never be used.
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"Never" is such a harsh word.
Dasher
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"Never" never means never. It means never. Which means that if ever, there better be an awfully good reason. And probably not even then.
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LOL, ummm, no, what you are talking about is "sometimes".
"Never" means "never" which means (literally) "Not Ever". Period.
If someone uses it to mean "sometimes", they aren't speaking English, they aren't using it correctly or they are deliberately misusing it.
Words have an exact meaning.
Dasher
HELP SAVE THIS GAME!
If we can save this game, I promise I will never complain about Travel Power Suppression again! You have my word on it!
"The customer is always right."
Thanks for all your feedback everyone ^_^ This has given me a bit to think about!
-C.A.
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"Never" means "never" which means (literally) "Not Ever". Period.
If someone uses it to mean "sometimes", they aren't speaking English, they aren't using it correctly or they are deliberately misusing it.
Words have an exact meaning.
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As an English major, I couldn't pass this up. Words *don't* have an exact meaning. Words are, in fact, one of the worst ways to transmit information, as translating abstract concepts into form will always screw something up. The only reason to use words is because, well, we don't have anything else. For lack of a better medium, we talk. We type. We argue over semantics of meaning.
Back on topic: I agree that "Defeat All" makes me groan. Even with a blazingly bright taunt aura, I know it's inevitable that I will miss a minion -- even on a tiny warehouse map, I always need to go back and scour for that one person who escaped me that somehow will cause the cataclysmic dissolution of the universe if left free.
It's annoying. Please don't do it.
"We are looking into the possiblity of maybe someday thinking about maybe implementing something similar to this, in the future."
- Positron
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Oh and if I see "Defeat All" and "Patrol" in the same description...just don't.
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Do patrols themselves put you off? I love patrols, and I use them all the time; I just don't ever make them required objectives. They're great ways to add more enemies to the map and not be hampered by the ambush limit, they also provide opportunites for more speech popups down the line.
I really like the way they liven up escorts-- instead of waiting for the three expected ambushes, you run into a few groups as you head back out. I much prefer that to a long run through an empty building.
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Check... and Mate (poster) - Arc ID# 15095 (comments)
Invasion on Earth BX1132! (poster 1) - (poster 2) - Arc ID# 98943 (comments)
Global @ARH
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