Expand it to maybe 30/35-50 and I'll like it. Use time travel to go back to a whole 1950ish zone and fight retro villains ^_^. Fight along side some old heroes as villains try to warp the time line to eliminate key figures in history to better their standing today.
Sooooo... A Second group of maps accessible through Oroborous or other means to travel back into the 40s and 50s? That's actually a pretty neat idea... Though I think Villains should receive something similar...
Unfortunately during the 1940-50s there were no mediporters: Death was a REAL danger for heroes. and the Rogue Isles were NOT a haven for Arachnos and Villains as we know them, today.
Ergo I would suggest making the 1940s-50s zones a Co-op/PvP zone. Flag yourself for PVP and you can fight anyone else who is flagged for it, high over the city streets or in the sewers. If you're NOT PvP flagged you're co-op.
Thanks to the difference in reporting (lack of digital media, television being more of a -production-, lack of major investigative advances) heroes and villains are both on the streets as Vigilantes, and it's impossible to tell the difference until the villain uses his or her powers on an 'innocent' target.
Have dozens of arcs in the 1940s for heroes, dozens for villains, and even more co-op arcs, as well. Make some of the Co-Op arcs darker and more 'evil' than others, as well.
Make each zone auto-exemp/sk PvP-enabled players to specific levels. There are no Police-Drones, so make the trains and such have the Wentworth's death-aura for NPCs only.
As for the size of the zones and borders: Use the standard 'blue walls' for the borders of zones, rather than war-Walls. There's no -REAL- separation there, but Heroes and villains just don't tend to travel past those areas of the zone.
Maybe put in forests and parks where buildings haven't been built yet. That'll allow you to shrink the zones down a -bit-.
For hospitals and such I'd suggest having the player character rez next to a hospital bed, with a nurse on hand and such. Debt wouldn't be affected and would still accrue as normal.
I'd also suggest that ALL players be given the option of STARTING in the 1940s. And given a choice of 2 contacts (hero/villain or neutral) The Neutral Starting contact assumes that you've come to the past (at level 1) to help keep the time-stream stable against forces beyond Oroborous (and is thereby a Mender) Your Hero/Villain contact assumes you're a hero or villain of the day and talks to you as such. You might be from the future, you might not.
The issues I see with it are: Developer time (EXTREMELY intensive) and money (EXTREMELY intensive) and the population shift of the playerbase. We'll be even further spread out as various players go to the 1940s and never come back.
Yeah. I'm heavily in favor of doing something like this.
-Rachel-
I think we could do with just one zone. A bus station could be used as a portal out. Force walls (just the effect not real war walls around the zone because we are limited to the area to prevent massive timeline saturation. I like the voluntary PvP, maybe if we coudl swipe the mechanic from the "normal" WoW servers.
For those who don't fiddle in that area it works by having everyone default to no PvP, if someone decides to try some PvP they either switch it on or attack a PvP target (PvP NPC or PC with PvP already on). Attacking a player in PvP sets a timer so you can't attack and go PvP immune. I like the idea of 3 sided zone (Red/Blue/CoOp).
Damn it... Now I'm thinking up a story that -isn't- a Nemesis or Rikti Plot. *sighs*
The Timeline of our reality is under attack by the Fifth Column. They took a cue off of Recluse, but chose to go back BEFORE Nuclear Weapons were of major import, to take the world over back THEN! So you've got Requiem and others going back in time to meet up with various other Columnists of history, trying to help take over Paragon during the strike that Atlas fought off.
You're going through the zones fighting off various Columners, the Family, Street Gangs, and new threats that aren't even in the game, yet. Whole 'new' enemy groups that didn't make it past the 60s. Dozens of new Signature Heroes and Villains. Various 'Modern' groups foraying into the past, either stumbling through Oroborous portals or Column ones or doing it on their own (Arachnos\Aeon\Malta..?)
All during the game players who started with the 1940's contact (Hero Or Villain) don't get the Oroborous based Contacts 'til later. Sure there's SOME Co-Op, but itt's 1940s specific, and the contacts treat everyone like they're from the era. However after level 25 for Sided contacts you'll get into the Oroborous contacts and learn what's going on. Meanwhile people who chose the Oroborous contact will have neutral quests throughout, and be on a story-arc chain that leads them to the climactic finale!
The final, climactic battle for the 1940's story arcs is a MASSIVE trio of Co-Op, Hero, and Villain Taskforces that all end in the same place: Independence Port's Valor Bridge. Heroes try to save the Giant Monster level Atlas, Villains have to fight him on the side of the Column forces. Co-Op saves him for the intent of keeping history the same.
The Hero version presumes you're a 1940's hero, trying to help Atlas to stave off the Column's Rise. The last mish of the TF involves watching Atlas Fall, despite your greatest efforts. Time marches on.
The Villain version presumes you're a 1940s villain and are HELPING the Fifth Column to fight Atlas, take over, and you'll gain a position of power afterwards. The final mish of the SF ends with the Death of Atlas. But the damage is already done, and the Column is fractured. You don't get your position of power.
The Co-Op version presumes that you'll help Atlas to last as long as he can, but you -can't- save him as that would destroy the timeline (and possibly keep you from being born!). The last mish of the TF involves watching Atlas fall to the Column, then cleaning up the battlefield with a large group of NPC heroes who are all incensed at the death of Atlas.
Opinions?
-Rachel-
Some how I missed the box set and was thinking of Issue.
I'm not sure I like the idea of a whole 3rd version of the game.
Neither do I, really?
But it's the only way we're going to see another MASSIVE content hike. Whether it's Vigilantes (from my signature) or a Golden Age of heroes.
So far we've had one boxed expansion. It boosted our playerbase substantially, if I recall correctly. The fanfare and advertising around a new edition of City would drum up a lot of new subscribers as well as pulling lost subscribers out of the woodwork. Specifically if they see something in THIS game that none of our competition is offering (Missions in the past, Co-Op zones from level 1, Flagged 'open' PvP in the normal zones)
I could definitely see this as a future launch of another 'City of' game which expands the backstory of the City universe by going BACK to it.
Really... I think a 3rd version of the game could be wonderful... could also be dangerous as the player-base splinters further between the zones. Newbs will wind up in regular Atlas Park wondering where everyone is, for example.
So I'm not gonna say it's the best idea for the future of the game, but it's certainly not the worst!
-Rachel-
So, cut out the box-set game expansion and simply add a co-op zone with voluntary pvp set in the 1940's. Interesting. Not bad.
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Unfortunately during the 1940-50s there were no mediporters: Death was a REAL danger for heroes. and the Rogue Isles were NOT a haven for Arachnos and Villains as we know them, today.
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Priceless.
It's been brought to my attention that I Failed my History of Paragon City course based on a single mistake. =-(
Atlas died on Valor Bridge in Independence Port. NOT in Atlas Park as I had originally typed.
Apologies to the City History Buffs who are going to ridicule me for the rest of my life! It has been corrected in the original post.
-Rachel-
You can already make very nice Golden Age style costume a plenty. There are a ton of retro looking costume parts and patterns. Just what is there that they could possibly add.
I'm in favor of more time travel material. I just can't think of anything Golden Age costume-wise that can't already be done with available options.
Edit: I don't think anything like this necessarily has to be released as a box set that we have to spend more money on, especially in these financial times.
Better to keep subscribers happy then lose a whole lot because of a perceived greediness.
The MA Box will be on the shelves. There is no need to create an "expansion" to get shelf presence.
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(... Flagged 'open' PvP in the normal zones)
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Never going to happen.... ever. But you can keep dreaming.
I don't think I like the idea of level 1 stuff...how does level 25-50 content sound?
*shrugs* Doesn't bother me whether it's 1-50 or 1-20 or 10-14 content only.
I was just coming up with an alternate method of implementing it as full game content, rather than another time-travel foray into the past which, ICly, doesn't fit a whole LOT of character concepts.
-Rachel-
10-14 and 1-20 would be silly though. I just don't trust the guy who just filled out his registration card to travel back before I was born.
Hence why I suggested that some heroes and villains might have been BORN in the past and come to the future later.
The whole thing with the straight Hero and straight Villain contacts at level 1 presume you're NOT a time traveler, but a native of 1940.
-Rachel-
That would be box set worthy then.
It would have to be in the 1950s so VEATs could start there.
Later than that... Crab Spider packs didn't develop in the 50s... And Khelds didn't really show up, either.
So I imagine the VEATs and Khelds would be locked into the 'Neutral' contact. OR Couldn't start there. Instead you'd get NEW Epic ATs for playing there. *shrugs* Not -sure- on the idea, either.
-Rachel-
Lord Recluse starts giving soldiers from the past future tech ^_^.
Hmmm... Arachnos in the 40s was just a shadowy group with no real goal other than survival of the fittest...
Then again I suppose there could be some idealists in the past who eventually meet Recluse in a level 20 Arc or something, becoming their Crab or Fortunata selves after traveling to the future...?
Though with that much involvement it kinda kills the other plan: Fifth Column Patron Power Pools.
That's right! New PPPs for Villains who go through the villainous historical arcs, rather than going through Recluse's cronies!
Though I think I'd keep the heroes lock in the APPs >.>
-Rachel-
As much as the "Nemesis plot" meme is overused, he'd make a fine contact for Golden Age villains, as Brass Monday and the "Emperor of the Americas" takeover would make great trials or SFs, and they'd let villains be part of true "Time to take over the WORLD!!! Bwahahaha!" events, which are kind of lacking in the modern-day Rogue Isles.
Heroes, of course, could help stop him.
If we're looking at new Patron Pools, he'd be a candidate there, too. I'd say the Family would make good patrons as well.
the only thing I can think of with this is known as the time stream effect..
As we all know Enstine once made with in theory that what we do in the past may effect the future, that means that whatever we heroes or villains do in the 1940's - 1950's may affect the change of history.
And of course you know what that means.. it'll open up a can of worms to a whole new reality.
like for example:
the pervention of the Rikti invasion.
pervention to the death of Hero 1.
Stopping the Arachno threat before it get's out of hand.
and this effect would have a tramatic effect on both Paragon City and the Rogue Isle's
That's definitely a good point. Nemesis and the Family would both make great Patrons. But so would dozens of other villain groups in the past that never made it to modern day.
of course, the Devs could (and likely would) sift through and pick out the best groups for having Patrons spring from them...
Of course that would be totally unfair for Heroes... So I'd like to propose that heroes gain Patrons as well in the alternate timeline and current time frame as well. thus APPs should be proliferated to Villains, of course...
So yes. More Patrons for both sides.
And maybe make an Epic Archytype or two that are unlocked by certain badges or something... ATs that span both hero and Villainside. Could even make them 'Incarnates'. An origin AND an Archetype, rolled into one.
Wishful thinking... but yeah!
And States? I think the Time Stream theory is fine and all, but it's completely irrelevant.
Just don't ALLOW the players to change anything. For all intents and purposes everything you DO in the past 'already happened' from the point of awareness where you came from.
Examples:
A Hero uses time travel to attempt to save Hero 1 and the Omega Team. He goes back and winds up heading to the Rikti Homeworld, moments too late. He winds up mediporting back to the present just before the bomb goes off, without Hero 1.
Another unrelated hero goes back to prevent the Rikti invasion by destroying the Superadine stores before Brawler locates the creation factory, which leads to the research into Portals. The hero goes back in time and smashes up three different labs. But, as fae would have it, his information on where the Regulators attacked was wrong! And Brawler and company still wind up finding a Dyne lab.
For the most part that's HOW time travel works in the CoH/V universe. You can never change anything because you're already destined to go back into the past and contribute to the event occurring anyway.
-Rachel-
*edit* Another, further thought: If you go back in time to stop an event from happening (Hero 1's death for example) and accomplish it, there is a Paradox. Because in the future you wouldn't go back in time to save him. Since you didn't go back in time he died. Which leads us back around to the first part. An infinite loop of causality that never ends.
Hence I prefer to assume that going back in time to change the past is, ultimately, futile. By going into the past you're actually -causing- the things to happen.
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the only thing I can think of with this is known as the time stream effect..
As we all know Enstine once made with in theory that what we do in the past may effect the future, that means that whatever we heroes or villains do in the 1940's - 1950's may affect the change of history.
And of course you know what that means.. it'll open up a can of worms to a whole new reality.
like for example:
the pervention of the Rikti invasion.
pervention to the death of Hero 1.
Stopping the Arachno threat before it get's out of hand.
and this effect would have a tramatic effect on both Paragon City and the Rogue Isle's
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm sure you mean prevention and traumatic. And you're getting better but you still need to capitalize more often.
Also, if you read the Join Ouroboros arc you know that the whole "butterfly effect" theory is why they exist. To prevent alterations in the time stream that would cause a temporal paradox
Which is why we have to figure out where (Recluse) all this modern is leaking into the past from.
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Which is why we have to figure out where (Fifth Column) all this modern is leaking into the past from.
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Fixt! =-3
-Rachel-
Okay I posted this in the General discussion but I thought I would add it here as well
I know that the COH Golden Age was a joke (and a good one at that!)
However I was thinking that would make a great box set. new costumes and the ability to fight in Paragon City during the 40's and 50's. This would be great I've long asked for more Retro costumes and it would be fun to have the ability to fight the Axis Powers and protect Paragon from their minions. I know this would be a lot of work, and the boxed set should integrate with COX in some way, similar to how COV and COH complement each other but I would really, really like to see something developed along the lines. anyone else think this is a great idea?
"Everyone does something nerdy. My husband just happens to lead teams of them on missions."