greenlifechild

What should I use on my white board instead of Sharpies?

Evil Penguins from Mars.

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Thanks to all the Dev's for their work on a great game.

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We love you guys. You really go above and beyond.

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Exactly. If an AT is, across all combinations, underperforming in PvE, per the devs, claiming it's one of the best is absurd unless you are talking about PvP and not PvE.

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What is this PvE you speak of? Is there another person playing all those NPC's? If not, who will I insult when I smack them around with my powers?

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That's exactly my point Energy Cloak is +def all (psi, and toxic included). Yes it's just one power, but the set still get damage mitigation to those damage types.

It's not as great as the other shields in EA but it's still something (guessed to be 7.5%) and you have as much toxic damage mitigation as Invulnerable, Fire and DA

That's not much of a defensive hole.

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Nope. No Toxic Defense for EA. Toxic Defense does not exist in game. EA has some positional defense that works against any attack no matter its type though.

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You forgot to include no toxic resistance in your list while being a smarta$$.

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Wait, there is no toxic resistance?

Wow, put me in the camp with the "Need to get rid of one of the weaknesses" crowd.

Some kind of healing power should really be included as a kind of passive buff in one of the armors or passives.

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I may be giving the devs more credit than they deserve, but isn't it pretty likely that they're aware of all these holes? Rather than 67845302948 more people posting, "Hey, this set doesn't have KB protection" can we have some posts with either: Some suggestions about which powers to change/add/subtract or Some analysis that'll show ElectA to be X% less effective at Brutage than the other sets unless a hole or two is filled?

Neither one of those is as easy as pointlessly repeating the same things over and over again, but maybe they'll get some Dev attention. Unlikely, but possible.

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My biggest problem is the fact that people say take SJ for your immob and KB resistance, except you can only have either superjump or combat jumping on.

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I say get Hover and Teleport for your resistance holes and laugh at immobilizes. Laugh I say!

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Hover also allows you to completely ignore Caltrops and Quicksandlike powers (as long as you don't get too close to the ground).

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My biggest problem is the fact that people say take SJ for your immob and KB resistance, except you can only have either superjump or combat jumping on.

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Both powers have an activation time of 0 and recharge time of 0, and immob doesn't prevent you from activating powers, it's not really that horrible to click a button when needed.

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You completely missed the point. You can NOT travel if you get immobolized.

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Actually, I think you missed his point. If, while SJing along, you happen to be hit with an immobolise, switch to CJ. It gives Immob resist, which will shorten or negate the effect. Then switch back to SJ. The two powers have no activation time and no recharge time, so there's no reason not to.

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when is turning a toggle off not an option? it'd just be for knockback protection, and if you need the knockback protection, then you'd just have to live without jumping for a lil bit

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Please play a stone tanker/brute with regularity if you think it's at all convenient and safe to run around with your status toggle off. Being locked to the ground is only trading one form of limit on travel power for another, it is in no way a solution and is actually worse than what is in place now - at least /electric has a choice between fly and leaping. Stone tank is VERY awkward to play and move around with a fast team without Teleport. Particularly in PVP areas, you would be whacko to turn off your status toggle for 10 seconds just to hop a 1 foot curb.

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*Note* I'm not particularly in favour of this change. I honestly don't care all that much. I'll probably go hover/teleport. *Note*

With this change you'd have three options. Take teleport and the toggle that grounds you. Take Hover/Fly or Hover/Teleport or Hover/SS or Hover/SJ. Take CJ/SJ/Acro. Without this proposed change, you have two options, Acro or Hover. With it you'd have three options.

Many of you seem to be arguing against this change because it would "lock you into taking teleport yadda yadda." No. It wouldn't. You'd still have the option of going the hover root or the Acro root. You'd be losing nothing. Except a passive that most people won't take.

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If you reread your post youll see that in your Defence Calculations youve had to assume that Acc was 100%.

Its the only way your post makes any sence. Flawed as it is.
Otherwise your whole measurement for the Defence side of the equation doesnt work. How can you measure it without the total amount of times swung?

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Ok, I cleared out the previous quotations so this doesn't take up a whole page.

You're correct. I hadn't taken into account the fact that defense is a percentage. *blush* I'd gotten a bit rusty in 4 months of no CoX.

If you're fighting an enemy with a 50% chance to hit, he'll hit you 100 times in 200 swings. You'll take the 5000 damage (or whatever, 50 damage per hit 100 hits). If you have 19.6% defense, his hit chance lowers to 30.4%. Then he'll hit you 60.8 times in 200 swings. You'll take 3040 damage. That makes invincibility even better than my previous (flawed) calculations showed. 19.6% defense makes you take more than 1/3 less damage at that point. 34.8% is even better. Then their to-hit is only 15.2%. You take 30.4 hits for a total of 1520 damage. You're basically taking 30% of the damage you would if you turned invincibility off. Plus it adds to your accuracy. It's an awesome awesome power.

It's not as good if the enemy has a higher base to-hit. Against enemies that have a 75% chance to hit you (base) it only mitigates about half of your incoming damage. Still awesome.

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Not exactly. Invuln has invincibility. There have been many long posts analysing why the defense from invincibility is like 70% of the set's survivability. Adding Dull Pain would still leave Elect armour as an entirely resist set. *shrug* Whatever.

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What's a polite way to call bull*#@%?

"70% of the sets survivablity?" In what possible situation? PvE-ing an army of white minions maybe. But not against mobs teams actually fight or in any situations I reguarly encountered. I respec'd out of Invincibility because IMO it was a waste of endurance. This may change with the recalculation of DEF in I7. I'll reserve judgement. It will remain the same for PvP.

The more I think about /Elec, the more I think it's a well balanced set. Even with the sin of limiting travel power diversity.

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If you'd like me to drag the numbers wizards over here, I can. The defense from invincibility is a huge portion of Invuln's survivability. Huge. It's much much better than any of the passives.

If you're hit 100 times for 100 damage each time and all you have is 50% resistance, you'll take 100 x 50 damage or 5000 damage. If you have even 5 enemies in range with Invincibility on, (assuming it's 3 slotted with def SOs) you get 24.6% defense to anything you have resists to. Subtract Unyielding's penalty and you have 19.6% defense.

Then you'll only be hit 80.4 times. You still have 50% resist. That means you'll take 4020 damage. Instead of 5000. That's almost 1/5 less damage. If you have the full 10 enemies in range, it adds 15.2% more defense. You'll end up taking more than 1/3 less damage. From one power. Plus it boosts your accuracy. "Waste of Endurance" indeed.

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If your fighting an army of things that hit you 100% of the time you really might want to scale back your expectations.

Last time i checked Mob Acc wasnt 100%.


ON another note, Id like to call for the devs to give all us lectric brute testers a level bump so we can test higher level survivability. Plus i wanna se the 38 power in action :P

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If you'll reread what I said, my assumption was you being *hit* 100 times. I said nothing about how many times the enemy swung at you.

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Not exactly. Invuln has invincibility. There have been many long posts analysing why the defense from invincibility is like 70% of the set's survivability. Adding Dull Pain would still leave Elect armour as an entirely resist set. *shrug* Whatever.

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What's a polite way to call bull*#@%?

"70% of the sets survivablity?" In what possible situation? PvE-ing an army of white minions maybe. But not against mobs teams actually fight or in any situations I reguarly encountered. I respec'd out of Invincibility because IMO it was a waste of endurance. This may change with the recalculation of DEF in I7. I'll reserve judgement. It will remain the same for PvP.

The more I think about /Elec, the more I think it's a well balanced set. Even with the sin of limiting travel power diversity.

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If you'd like me to drag the numbers wizards over here, I can. The defense from invincibility is a huge portion of Invuln's survivability. Huge. It's much much better than any of the passives.

If you're hit 100 times for 100 damage each time and all you have is 50% resistance, you'll take 100 x 50 damage or 5000 damage. If you have even 5 enemies in range with Invincibility on, (assuming it's 3 slotted with def SOs) you get 24.6% defense to anything you have resists to. Subtract Unyielding's penalty and you have 19.6% defense.

Then you'll only be hit 80.4 times. You still have 50% resist. That means you'll take 4020 damage. Instead of 5000. That's almost 1/5 less damage. If you have the full 10 enemies in range, it adds 15.2% more defense. You'll end up taking more than 1/3 less damage. From one power. Plus it boosts your accuracy. "Waste of Endurance" indeed.

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I play a lot of Brutes and I want to play an /elec Brute too.

But if /Elec had a "Dull Pain", why play /Inv?
/Elec would = /Inv + Quickness + Slow/EndDrain/TP-resist + Hold-after-"Unstoppable"-crash

(*including leaping pool to close other gaps)

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Not exactly. Invuln has invincibility. There have been many long posts analysing why the defense from invincibility is like 70% of the set's survivability. Adding Dull Pain would still leave Elect armour as an entirely resist set. *shrug* Whatever.

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You know, one of the things that I would have to say is that for stalkers, wouldn't it make more sense for Soul Transfer to actually replace the Disoriented effect with a Placate and Hide effect? Rather then clouding their mind clouding their sight type thing. Considering you have to die to use it, an AoE Placate and hide effect wouldn't be overpowered and would be much more stalker specific.

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No no no! You're a stalker. You have to be like the Shadow and use your power to cloud men's minds. Mind clouding only. No sight clouding for you!

Also, that would require actually changing the power for stalkers rather than just turning Cloak of Darkness into hide and switching Death Shroud for Shadow Dweller and then transplanting the rest of the set. It'd have to be an entirely different power really.

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And what exactly is this set supposed to do? I don't think power sets come with a mission statement. You argued earlier that it should have higher resists, but it seems to have more S/L than either fire or dark armour. No, it doesn't have Invuln level resists, but then again all invulnerability has is resists. They do get dull pain, but the differentiation between invuln and all the other resist sets is that they have utility and/or damage powers.
Quickness, Power Sink, and Conserve power are all utility. Electric armour also has Psy resists.


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What's it supposed to do? Help you survive and mitigate damage. Sure, it does that, but the question is "How well?" You don't need a mission statement, that's common sense.

DA and Fire have a heal, which warrants lower resistance. They also have effective means of secondary damage mitigation. Fire in the form of higher damage potential. DA in the form of crowd control. Electric gets... end drain, which isn't effective unless it's 100%, which would make it ungodly overpowered.

However, Electric also gets an auto recharge boost and the means to generate more endurance, which will aid in staying in the fight longer and defeating enemies quicker. That's the optimistic view. I don't think it will work that way at all. Fire plays the "kill things quicker" card already and it stills gets a heal.

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Yes, Fire plays the kill things faster card. With Burn. Which was nerfed in at least 2 sucessive issues. Nerfed to the point that many people don't even use it anymore. It may be more effective in I7 since it's supposed to be boosted by build up like powers.

So what have fire brutes had since CoV came out? Fiery Embrace? Woo. That's only better than build up if you're fire/fire. So you wait until level 35 to play your "kill things faster card"? I'm not trying to be snippy, I'm really curious. What has fire had for the last issue that made it kill things faster than any other set?

Necro. Again.

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I have to disagree with the acc issue, I think you guys miss your SOs. It seems the same as any other set.

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I understand that this is all very subjective, but I really did seem to get many more misses on my new Elect/Elect brute than on my new Thug/FF mastermind. All the Thug guy has so far is the first two pistol attacks (I just wanted to see what they're like, I'm not trying an iron man build or anything). It may be an accuracy issue, or it might just be an unlucky streak. But they'll never check it out if we don't report it.

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I have Hover with 3 flight SOs in it, and find it rather slow at lvl50. However I have Siphon Speed, and with one siphon I can make it fly. With 3 Siphon Speeds it becomes pretty fast and doesn't suppress. It works great in pvp, it also reminds me to stack Siphon Speed

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Speed up teh Huver.....

>.>

<.<

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To summarize most of the comments so far:

Pluses:
* Endurance recovery
* Slightly above average resists
* End drain protection
* Psionic protection
* Recharge and run speed boost

Minuses:
* No knockback
* No immobilize
* No health recovery/boost


As you have more to add, please post it up. We need a clear summary from time to time to lay out what has been found.

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IMO, the resists, thus far, should be in the Con section. They aren't high enough for what this set is supposed to do.
Caveat: We need to get a Brute up to a respectable level for testing before my statement can be more than speculation.

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And what exactly is this set supposed to do? I don't think power sets come with a mission statement. You argued earlier that it should have higher resists, but it seems to have more S/L than either fire or dark armour. No, it doesn't have Invuln level resists, but then again all invulnerability has is resists. They do get dull pain, but the differentiation between invuln and all the other resist sets is that they have utility and/or damage powers.
Quickness, Power Sink, and Conserve power are all utility. Electric armour also has Psy resists.

The knockback/immob protection is an annoying hole. I don't take acrobatics. I simply refuse to do it. Then again, 3 slotted hover doesn't really bother me. I'd love for them to add knockback protection to one of the powers. A heal would be nice.

I think the elect/elect combo is going to have too many endurance returning powers/passive effects. Honestly, no matter how great Conserve power and Power Sink are, do you really *want* two active powers that help with endurance? Plus the passive effect from the powers? It may allow some people to skip stamina, but the people who like to fight hard constantly (people who tend to play brutes) will probably still need it.

I don't imagine ElectA is going to get all of these changed, but maybe one of them. Which one would you rather have? A self heal or KB protection?

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wouldnt quantum be science or technology?

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You've never played a kheld, have you?

I was refering to PvP. The Quantum Gun temp power. Kheldians take extra damage from Quantum Guns, which are usually only handled by mobs.

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The Quantum Gun doesn't actually do the nictus damage that the enemy guns do. Do not fear it in PvP. It's simply cool looking energy damage.

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Tell that to the Warshade I nearly kicked the crap out of in Siren's Call with my Mastermind. My first (and sadly only shot... ran out of charges at that moment) was with the Quantum Gun... he was in Nova and lost 1/3 of his health... and I'm a Mastermind, so my blasts are normally pretty pathetic.

I woulvd've gotten him if fly and leadership didn't run me out of end... and that scrapper didn't come along.

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Nova Form Khelds have no defenses. It's entirely possible that a gun designed to destroy enemies in a mission has a pure energy (No nictus) blast that powerful. My comment was based on testing done during CoV beta. Maybe they've changed it.

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wouldnt quantum be science or technology?

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You've never played a kheld, have you?

I was refering to PvP. The Quantum Gun temp power. Kheldians take extra damage from Quantum Guns, which are usually only handled by mobs.

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The Quantum Gun doesn't actually do the nictus damage that the enemy guns do. Do not fear it in PvP. It's simply cool looking energy damage.

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What if you could "throttle" your flight speed? Like, turnign on fly and tapping forward gives you a slow hover, whereas pressing and holding forward accelerates you. The faster you go, the more end you burn. While your standing still or just piddling along, you use little end. That'd give an advantage over longer distances, etc.

Another thign I'd like to see implemented is somethign I loved in Guild Wars; if you stood around doing nothing, you started to regen health and end. As soon as you attacked, use an ability, or got attacked, the regeneration went away. Thus, if you stand still for a few seconds after a battle, you're back to full.

I would defintiely welcome some -jump, -tp, -SS powers as well.

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There are actually quite a few -jump and -speed powers in the game. Anything that's -fly will ground your jumping too. At least everything I've ever seen. I've seen lots of slows too. From quicksand in the Hollows on. There isn't anything that's -tp as far as I know, but that's one of the few advantages of the power. You rip a hole in spacetime and travel from point A to point B. What can the average villain do to stop you?

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Blackwand gives bonuses to Magic types.

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Slightly off-topic (shame on me!) but...

Who's the Stephen Brust fan? Just curious.

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Heh. When can we expect Godslayer?

Just read it again. It's still funny. I think this needs to go to the top of the guides area so people can read it and maybe have a happier minute in all the irritation that the recent changes to CoH have brought about.

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hate to say this but... where is my tank?

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i mean when i have to worry about myself it makes it alot harder to keep aggro control... course fact we can only keep what... 14 mobs aggroed on ourselves kinda borks us in large group spillover combat..

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Couple of nights ago I deleted the only tank I ever tried, CFI-CONVICTION. Had a great concept that aligned perfectly with Iron Vixen's ideals. I didn't want to powerlevel, didn't want to herd whole maps, didn't even want to do much damage...I just wanted to be the tanker that keeps the team alive under the worst of the worst conditions. I wanted to be a good tanker, the kind I myself had not been able to easily find when I first started CFI-CONVICTION.

But before I could hit 20, Invul/SS gets hit by I5 and now I6/"ED". While it may not be "doooooom!" for tankers, it is "doooooooom" for why *I* wanted to play tankers and the *way* I wanted to play. I like playing specialists, not the "generalists" the latest rounds of nerfs seem to force us to.

So while I've watched this thread for a while, I'm done. I've deleted most of my heroes, including my two 50s (also gutted by ED...Pure Empaths and Claws/DA) and gone over to CoV. Might be the same "ED" system, but at least I don't have "it used to be like X" memories, so it doesn't feel "nerfed" like all my heroes do.

It's not the last we've seen of each other Iron Vixen...I look forward to your continued involvement with Masterminds. ;-)

My thoughts, and respect, to those tankers who decide to stick with it. =)

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I don't mean to be insensitive to your mood (you are obviously upset about ED), but I was wondering; since you've deleted your only level 50s, can you still make Kheldians? I've seen this question asked several times before, but I've never seen an answer.

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-Maiden Justice is Monica Richter. Her daughter is Miss Liberty who was born in the late 40's. (Statesman and Maiden Justice waited until later in their careers to have children.) Her granddaughter is Ms. Liberty who was born in the early 80's.

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So uh... this means that Tyrant is Dominatrix's grandfather too, right?

Ew.

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No - Dominatrix's mother was a hero - according to her bio named "Miss Liberty" - so it is unlikely that her mother's father was the Tyrant. Probably Miss Liberty-of-Praetorian-Earth's father was some other hero who is a villain in the regular CoH world... my first guess was Lord Recluse but he can't be as he is probably Miss Liberty's mom's brother in that world too? Or maybe it's in Praetorian Earth that Maria Jenkins got the name Maiden Justice first, accounting for the bio error. Whereas in real Earth Monica Richter got it first so Maria had to settle for her 2nd choice.


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Read the above about Dom and Tyrant before you keep thinking such bad things. What do you think this is Passions?