T0ughGuy690_EU

I realise that Max, but I still want to keep the discussions going on what might be good sets for PvP. Since very few of us want to spec into pvp builds pre-50 (I dont either), this is the best source of information. I agree that with specialised PvP chars the discussion would be better, but that doesn't make it useless at this point.

A new attempt:

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Exported from Ver: 1.7.6.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
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Name: Solar Flash PvP
Level: 50
Archetype: Scrapper
Primary: Martial Arts
Secondary: Super Reflexes
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Storm Kick==> Dmg(1)Dmg(3)Dmg(3)EndRdx(5)EndRdx(5)Acc(7)
01) --> Focused Fighting==> DefBuf(1)DefBuf(7)DefBuf(9)EndRdx(9)EndRdx(11)
02) --> Focused Senses==> DefBuf(2)DefBuf(11)DefBuf(13)EndRdx(13)EndRdx(15)
04) --> Agile==> DefBuf(4)DefBuf(15)DefBuf(17)
06) --> Focus Chi==> Rechg(6)Rechg(17)Rechg(19)
08) --> Crane Kick==> Dmg(8)Dmg(19)Dmg(21)EndRdx(21)EndRdx(23)Acc(23)
10) --> Combat Jumping==> Jump(10)
12) --> Practiced Brawler==> Rechg(12)Rechg(25)EndRdx(46)
14) --> Super Jump==> Jump(14)
16) --> Swift==> Run(16)
18) --> Crippling Axe Kick==> Dmg(18)Dmg(25)Dmg(27)Slow(27)Slow(29)Acc(29)
20) --> Health==> Heal(20)Heal(40)Heal(43)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22)EndMod(31)EndMod(31)
24) --> Dodge==> DefBuf(24)DefBuf(31)DefBuf(33)
26) --> Quickness==> Run(26)
28) --> Lucky==> DefBuf(28)DefBuf(33)DefBuf(33)
30) --> Aid Other==> Heal(30)
32) --> Eagle's Claw==> Dmg(32)Dmg(34)Dmg(34)EndRdx(34)EndRdx(36)Acc(36)
35) --> Evasion==> DefBuf(35)DefBuf(36)DefBuf(37)EndRdx(37)EndRdx(37)
38) --> Elude==> Rechg(38)Rechg(39)Rechg(39)DefBuf(39)DefBuf(40)DefBuf(40)
41) --> Focused Accuracy==> EndRdx(41)EndRdx(42)EndRdx(42)TH_Buf(42)TH_Buf(43)TH_Buf(43)
44) --> Aid Self==> Heal(44)Heal(45)Heal(45)IntRdx(45)IntRdx(46)IntRdx(46)
47) --> Cobra Strike==> DisDur(47)DisDur(48)DisDur(48)Acc(48)
49) --> Hasten==> Rechg(49)Rechg(50)Rechg(50)Rechg(50)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Empty(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Empty(1)
01) --> Critical Hit==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Empty(2)
---------------------------------------------


Dropped conserve power for hasten. This lets me drop my recharge slot in my attacks (hasten will have a 40sec downtime, I think I can work with a slightly gimped attack chain for that time, especially if I play a bit evasive at such times). This gives me room for an acc slot on all my attacks. I've seen another SR build with similar end-slotting, and he can fight without ever stopping (while running FA), which is important IMO.
Also played around with some other slots. The 4th recharge on hasten cuts down 5 more secs of recharge, which is acceptable. Besides, where else would I put it? This char has more slots then he needs :P
Any opinions?

You know, I've been thinking a bit today about our corruptor vs brute match. You getting mezzed was my failure as a buffer, and I need to work on this.
Anyways, the reason I had trouble fighting the brutes was their mez effects. Even when I didn't get disoriented, I was a little reluctant while fighting, because they COULD disorient me. Your corruptor lacking a mez buff is really a big downside when you team with a corruptor (nothing you can help however, it simply isn't in your set).

So, I was thinking, 2 /kins corruptors. Both get SBed and IDed. This means they are ultra-fast, protected against mez, and they have a ridiculous selfheal making them tough to kill. I'm quite confident that /kins are very hard to kill, as long as they have mez protection. Even WITH disorients, energy melee brutes have difficulties killing me if I play it right. (yes, transfusion really is that powerfull)

I would be HIGHLY interested to duo with another /kin corruptor this tuesday, fighting 2 brutes or 2 other corrs, and see how we do.
I think it would be a pretty powerfull combo.

Also, X, you think IR is usefull in PvP? Won't it suffer your aura problems? (not getting it on the team)

I'm a /kin. My only (simple) buffs are ID and SB...especially the latter is awesome, true, but it does little to increase survivability of the team, it only increases killrate. I suppose ID can be slotted for dmg resist, but this will only be against energy/smashing, and since it lasts 60 secs I will spend all the match re-buffing my team. That's a Bad Thing, since a corruptor is supposed to be dealing damage as well :P

I'm still curious as to your buffing powerset, because I really do think it matters :P

Anyways, moving onward, I've heard several people claim heals aren't a necessity, buffs are. Alright then. I ask you this: Which buffs? (this question is similar to my last, but now I'm not asking X in particular, I'm asking which villain buffs do you think work)

Ok, a few comments.

First of all, you're getting focused senses awfully late. You will feel this, in the form of debt. I really recommend getting toggles as soon as you can. You get 2 passives before your 2nd toggle. Change this. If you choose between a toggle and a passive, ALWAYS choose the toggle.

Second, I've looked into it a bit, 3 end reduxes on your toggles is overkill. The third slot won't do anything usefull anymore. I say drop one in each toggle, and get 2 max. (except focused accuracy, getting 3 is prolly a good idea there)

Your current attack slotting is 3 dmg - 2 acc - 1 end. This is a very decent slotting, but I did fine with 3 dam - 1 acc - 1 end - 1 recharge. Keeps the attack chain much more fluent.

Also, I think thunder kick is a poor power. IMO, crippling axe kick (CAK) is better. Yes, the animation takes a while, but its your third most damaging attack and most importantly, it immobilizes and slows stuff on top of the good damage. This can be VERY usefull! (especially in PvP)

And finally, personally I think the fighting pool is of limited use. Tough only grants defense against smashing/lethal, and weave gives just a tiny bit of defense. (less then your passives do IIRC)
My advice: drop fighting pool and get medicine (aid other - aid self). This way you free up a power slot, and aid self is AWESOME for a /SR. Slot it 3 heals and at least 1 reduce interrupt (I have yet to experiment with 2 or even 3 interrupt reductions) and whenever you get into trouble, hit aid self. Your defense means you get hit less, and this means you don't get interrupted all that often. Slotted with 3 heals, this power heals more then a lvl 2 healing insp!!! (more then a third of your health)

Sorry for the huge post. I love MA/SR

Hmmm...what buffs would these be?
And how do your teammates look after themselves?
I'd be very interested to hear alternatives to healing (I'm not ready to accept every team needs a /thermal :P), but so far we haven't seem to run into a villain combination that pulls it off. Doens't mean it's not there tho.

Alright so healing is a problem for villains. This means that for serious PvPing, healers are needed. Let's take a look at our options.

Before I continue, Kinslayer, are you ok with us discussing this here, or do you want me to open a new thread in the PvP forum? Will post it here for now, but let me know and I'll move it.

The most obvious choice would be a /thermal corruptor, undoubtedly. With an area and singletarget heal, neither having a tohit, they are probably the best option. However let's look at some other stuff nonetheless.
There's kinetics corruptors, who have (I think) the most powerfull area heal. Personally tho, I think it's of limited use. It works great to heal yourself (I would know), but to heal others is hard. In general ranged types need the most healing, and they SHOULDNT be near their enemies. If they are, they should be there for just a second to launch their attack. Therefore an target-area heal is somewhat useless.

Then we have the radiation set, which has an area heal just as powerfull as thermal's I think. That's it tho, and IMO this set is too weak to do serious healing.
How about Dark then? It has an area heal nearly as powerfull as kinetic's, and its Personbased, which already makes it a lot better then transfusion.
Looking at herobuilder, it seems the MM version of the dark heal is even more powerfull. As a matter of fact, it heals a good deal more then the kinetics heal.

Would /dark be a viable way to heal players? If so, it could actually shift the function of healer to the MM, allowing the corruptor to focus more on (de)buffing. Or would a decent PvP team be forced to a /thermal corruptor? Ofcourse Dark's tohit is a big downside.

And just a random thought, aid other from the medicine pool. If slotted with 3 interrupt reduxes and 3 heal enhances, could this work?

Your welcome Bru :P

I'd also like to add that I like Dr. Death's idea of using an MM as targetter. It's true that one of the many roles an MM can take is a rather passive one (especially an FF one), running a [censored] of buffing auras and using few attacks. This would certainly give him plenty of time to be a targetter.

Good point, was thinking from a bit too ego-centered point of view

Still, he's not as important as a healer, or a controlling char (cont/dom) IMO. Especially when you imagine a risk/defense value, Dr Death ranks rather low. (moderate/low risk, moderate/high defense) While a healer or a dom has no defenses (or few anyways) and definetely presents a great risk, one of those would rank higher.

Ofcourse with a def debuffer on your team, an FF MM's defense would collapse, and he'd be one of the main targets IMO

Actually, the corruptor vs brute battle ended 3 - 2 in favour of the corrs. So it was a victory for us Kin :P

I agree that the lack of heals make things hard. Buffing might help, but really, at some point a player is damaged and needs healing. Without a /thermal this can't be done properly.
As I said during the training, it makes it very important to have 1 person who targets enemies, and that the entire team listens to him carefully. It's hard to do the targetting properly however, IMO, especially if your one of the squishier chars. Ideally, you'd have a stalker at the stealth cap roaming through the battle doing the targetting.

Are we on for tonight?
Kosmos is ready

Hmmm...6slotting stamina really is NOT worth it, if you get into the numbers. I'm very sure of that.

The thing is, my current build cant fight continuously with just the 3 SR toggles running (all 1 or 2 slotted for end). I'm worried that with FA added, I will get into end trouble even more, so I really think I do need those end slots.
I'll look at Hero builder's numbers a little more later, but shouldnt a 2nd end slot take away just as much end use as the first one? ED doesn't get in effect until the 3rd slot, and even then just a tiny bit.

Hey guys,

my MA/SR is closing in on lvl 50 very fast now, and when I hit it I want to respec into a decent PvP build. Since I don't have a supergroup, I'm mostly oriented towards solo PvP in the arena or PvP zones. Also, I don't like exemping, so I'll be aimed at lvl 50 PvP, so I'm assuming I always have acces to all powers.
Anyways:

---------------------------------------------
Exported from Ver: 1.7.6.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
---------------------------------------------
Name: Solar Flash PvP
Level: 50
Archetype: Scrapper
Primary: Martial Arts
Secondary: Super Reflexes
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Storm Kick==> Dmg(1)Dmg(3)Dmg(3)EndRdx(5)EndRdx(5)Rechg(7)
01) --> Focused Fighting==> DefBuf(1)DefBuf(7)DefBuf(9)EndRdx(31)EndRdx(37)EndRdx(40)
02) --> Focused Senses==> DefBuf(2)DefBuf(9)DefBuf(11)EndRdx(34)EndRdx(37)EndRdx(43)
04) --> Agile==> DefBuf(4)DefBuf(11)DefBuf(13)
06) --> Focus Chi==> Rechg(6)Rechg(13)Rechg(15)
08) --> Crane Kick==> Dmg(8)Dmg(15)Dmg(17)EndRdx(17)EndRdx(19)Rechg(19)
10) --> Combat Jumping==> Jump(10)
12) --> Practiced Brawler==> Rechg(12)Rechg(21)
14) --> Super Jump==> Jump(14)
16) --> Swift==> Run(16)
18) --> Crippling Axe Kick==> Dmg(18)Dmg(21)Dmg(23)Slow(23)Slow(25)Rechg(25)
20) --> Health==> Heal(20)Heal(48)Heal(50)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22)EndMod(27)EndMod(27)
24) --> Dodge==> DefBuf(24)DefBuf(29)DefBuf(29)
26) --> Quickness==> Run(26)
28) --> Lucky==> DefBuf(28)DefBuf(31)DefBuf(31)
30) --> Aid Other==> Heal(30)
32) --> Eagle's Claw==> Dmg(32)Dmg(33)Dmg(33)EndRdx(33)EndRdx(34)Rechg(34)
35) --> Evasion==> DefBuf(35)DefBuf(36)DefBuf(36)EndRdx(36)EndRdx(37)EndRdx(46)
38) --> Elude==> DefBuf(38)DefBuf(39)DefBuf(39)Rechg(39)Rechg(40)Rechg(40)
41) --> Focused Accuracy==> EndRdx(41)EndRdx(42)EndRdx(42)TH_Buf(42)TH_Buf(43)TH_Buf(43)
44) --> Aid Self==> IntRdx(44)Heal(45)Heal(45)Heal(45)IntRdx(46)IntRdx(46)
47) --> Cobra Strike==> DisDur(47)DisDur(48)DisDur(48)
49) --> Conserve Power==> Rechg(49)Rechg(50)Rechg(50)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Empty(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Empty(1)
01) --> Critical Hit==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Empty(2)
---------------------------------------------


Any thoughts? I personally was in doubt over my last two powers. At first I wanted to take maneuvers and tactics, but just how many stalkers will I run into that have Stealth+hide+grant invis, I mean, I am going for solo PvP. IMO, it's not worth the 2 powers.
Conserve power will help me a lot to get me through any elude-drops I might get into. Cobra Strike is just a nice control power, and I think it can be used to good effect in combination with Eagle's Claw.
Any comments would be greatly appreciated

Hmmm...that's a fairly limited use for tactics then...

Hmmm...and without tactics you would see anything up to a stalker in hide+stealth? So without tactics all you dont see is a stalker with hide+stealth+grant invis or any char with a heck of a lot of grant invis stacked on him?

Let's say I am SR, and have FA as well as tactics. (and the SR +per power obviously) Is there anything I WOULDNT be able to see? Like what?

Just like people with grant invis will be rare (according to you), the build you describe above will be rare too. First of all, only SR scrappers can achieve the above +per solo. And even then, only the SR scrappers that actually want to invest in 3 +per powers for this end. Ofcourse, there will certainly be those that do this (my SR scrapper will, probably), but in the end, most heroes won't have this kind of perception solo.
As for the CM +per, this is in a team, so it shouldn't be compared with just your own stealth bonus, your team can give you more stealth to counter it.

Elude has both the endmod and run speed buff too (at least the scrapper version). Very occasionally, I use it not for the defence but for the end. This is rare tho. Was fighting an AV today, and I saw my end go down and down and down. Realising I wouldn't last my fight on my toggles endwise, I just hit elude and my problems were solved :P

Yup, disappointing upcome, but that was one hell of a fight. Great fun, altho the learning part wasn't really fulfilled. More people join next week! :P

Will make sure to be there with .Kosmos

Hmm, seems like a lot of speculation on your part, especially in the doubling your base defence. But we'll see

Uhmmm...isn't this the way it works currently?

Will get it for PvP purposes, but in a respec at a later lvl

Before you had an SR, it was weaker then it will ever be again (thinking about I1ish days now), then it changed to a horribly powerfull set due to perma-elude, but this was in a day of many perma-powers making many ATs overpowered. It's seen both extremes, and if it gets "overpowered" it won't be nearly as drastic as perma-elude.