Stormbringer

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scrappers!

BAH!

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Also, I'm on your side here: Hurricane doesn't need to be nerfed.

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oh.

what are we arguing about then?

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SILLY SCRAPPER!

TRIXX ARE FOR KIDS!

by denying yourself the dark epic you're throwing away (yes, wasting) your shot at:

1) a ranged (undebuffable by hurricane) hold
2) a ranged (undebuffable by hurricane) attack
3) a ranged (undebuffable by hurricane) immobilize

all of which are very effective against the DREAD STORM DEFENDER!!!

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In exchange, I get:

the ability to ignore hurricane to-hit debuffs
a ranged (undebuffable by hurricane) attack that debuffs defense
a ranged (undebuffable by hurrcane) cone attack that knocks down.
infinite endurance upon demand

I also seem to have an emp glove and stun grenades on my power bar. I wonder how those got there...

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seriously, why deny yourselves PVP glory like this, when it's right there...WITHIN YOUR GRASP!?

yes, YOU TOO can defeat a storm defender.

yes, you, you 97 lb weaklings!

take your i7 respec and be the first on your block to mop the floor with your local storm bully.

that'll be the last time he kicks sand in your face.

so THERE!



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Don't try to trick me into an overkill control build with your wily words!

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scrappers!

BAH!

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here!

i've never played a scrapper, but i've just designed one to destroy storm defenders.

use your ranged hold for teh win!

unless a storm defender has mez protection (from someone else), he'll go down like a sack of turds.

if you're fighting a */storm controller, however...well that's another story.

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ick, I hate triple-D scrappers. I've done my time playing one, and body mastery 4tw. I'll live with finding another way to deal with the Hurricane on my Dark/Dark. Besides, Pet Gaze doesn't exist in three of four PVP zones and you won't even fight it in two prior to defection.

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SILLY SCRAPPER!

TRIXX ARE FOR KIDS!

by denying yourself the dark epic you're throwing away (yes, wasting) your shot at:

1) a ranged (undebuffable by hurricane) hold
2) a ranged (undebuffable by hurricane) attack
3) a ranged (undebuffable by hurricane) immobilize

all of which are very effective against the DREAD STORM DEFENDER!!!

seriously, why deny yourselves PVP glory like this, when it's right there...WITHIN YOUR GRASP!?

yes, YOU TOO can defeat a storm defender.

yes, you, you 97 lb weaklings!

take your i7 respec and be the first on your block to mop the floor with your local storm bully.

that'll be the last time he kicks sand in your face.

so THERE!

here...a more end-friendly version (with taunt!)

---------------------------------------------
Exported from Ver: 1.7.5.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
---------------------------------------------
Name: Selene Daemon PVP (second draft)
Level: 50
Archetype: Scrapper
Primary: Dark Melee
Secondary: Dark Armor
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Shadow Punch==> Acc(1)Rechg(13)Dmg(13)Acc(37)Dmg(37)Dmg(40)
01) --> Dark Embrace==> DmgRes(1)DmgRes(31)DmgRes(34)EndRdx(37)
02) --> Smite==> Acc(2)Acc(3)Dmg(3)Dmg(7)Dmg(15)Rechg(21)
04) --> Murky Cloud==> DmgRes(4)DmgRes(5)DmgRes(5)EndRdx(7)
06) --> Combat Jumping==> EndRdx(6)
08) --> Hurdle==> Jump(8)Jump(9)Jump(9)
10) --> Obsidian Shield==> DmgRes(10)DmgRes(11)DmgRes(11)EndRdx(15)
12) --> Assault==> EndRdx(12)
14) --> Super Jump==> EndRdx(14)Jump(31)
16) --> Dark Regeneration==> Acc(16)Acc(17)Heal(17)Heal(19)Rechg(19)Rechg(21)
18) --> Swift==> Run(18)
20) --> Acrobatics==> EndRdx(20)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22)EndMod(23)EndMod(23)
24) --> Tactics==> TH_Buf(24)TH_Buf(25)TH_Buf(25)EndRdx(27)
26) --> Hasten==> Rechg(26)Rechg(27)Rechg(29)
28) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(28)Run(29)
30) --> Confront==> Taunt(30)Taunt(31)Rechg(43)
32) --> Soul Drain==> Acc(32)Acc(33)Rechg(33)Rechg(33)TH_Buf(34)TH_Buf(34)
35) --> Oppressive Gloom==> Acc(35)Acc(36)DisDur(36)DisDur(36)EndRdx(46)Acc(50)
38) --> Midnight Grasp==> Acc(38)Acc(39)Dmg(39)Dmg(39)Dmg(40)Rechg(40)
41) --> Petrifying Gaze==> Acc(41)Acc(42)Hold(42)Hold(42)Rechg(43)Rechg(43)
44) --> Dark Blast==> Acc(44)Acc(45)Rechg(45)Dmg(45)Dmg(46)Dmg(46)
47) --> Tenebrous Tentacles==> Acc(47)Acc(48)Immob(48)Immob(48)Rechg(50)Rechg(50)
49) --> Cloak Of Darkness==> EndRdx(49)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Empty(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Empty(2)
01) --> Critical Hit==> Empty(1)
[b]---------------------------------------------

wow, that's a lot of toggles.

lemme see if i can whittle that down a bit...

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my shot was not cheap.

it was a good, clean shot.

so there!

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Oh, yeah? How much did it cost you?

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here!

i've never played a scrapper, but i've just designed one to destroy storm defenders.

use your ranged hold for teh win!

unless a storm defender has mez protection (from someone else), he'll go down like a sack of turds.

if you're fighting a */storm controller, however...well that's another story.

---------------------------------------------
Exported from Ver: 1.7.5.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
---------------------------------------------
Name: Selene Daemon PVP (first draft)
Level: 50
Archetype: Scrapper
Primary: Dark Melee
Secondary: Dark Armor
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Shadow Punch==> Acc(1)Acc(37)Dmg(37)Dmg(40)Dmg(43)Rechg(46)
01) --> Dark Embrace==> DmgRes(1)DmgRes(31)DmgRes(34)EndRdx(37)
02) --> Smite==> Acc(2)Acc(3)Dmg(3)Dmg(7)Dmg(15)Rechg(21)
04) --> Murky Cloud==> DmgRes(4)DmgRes(5)DmgRes(5)EndRdx(7)
06) --> Combat Jumping==> EndRdx(6)
08) --> Hurdle==> Jump(8)Jump(9)Jump(9)
10) --> Obsidian Shield==> DmgRes(10)DmgRes(11)DmgRes(11)EndRdx(15)
12) --> Assault==> EndRdx(12)
14) --> Super Jump==> EndRdx(14)Jump(31)
16) --> Dark Regeneration==> Acc(16)Acc(17)Heal(17)Heal(19)Rechg(19)Rechg(21)
18) --> Health==> Heal(18)
20) --> Acrobatics==> EndRdx(20)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22)EndMod(23)EndMod(23)
24) --> Tactics==> TH_Buf(24)TH_Buf(25)TH_Buf(25)EndRdx(27)
26) --> Hasten==> Rechg(26)Rechg(27)Rechg(29)
28) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(28)Run(29)
30) --> Whirlwind==> EndRdx(30)EndRdx(31)
32) --> Soul Drain==> Acc(32)Acc(33)Rechg(33)Rechg(33)TH_Buf(34)TH_Buf(34)
35) --> Oppressive Gloom==> Acc(35)Acc(36)DisDur(36)DisDur(36)Acc(50)
38) --> Midnight Grasp==> Acc(38)Acc(39)Dmg(39)Dmg(39)Dmg(40)Rechg(40)
41) --> Petrifying Gaze==> Acc(41)Acc(42)Acc(42)Rechg(42)Rechg(43)Rechg(43)
44) --> Dark Blast==> Acc(44)Acc(45)Dmg(45)Dmg(45)Dmg(46)Rechg(46)
47) --> Tenebrous Tentacles==> Acc(47)Acc(48)Acc(48)Immob(48)Immob(50)Rechg(50)
49) --> Cloak Of Darkness==> EndRdx(49)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Empty(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Empty(2)
01) --> Critical Hit==> Empty(1)
---------------------------------------------

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i seriously think that if the devs set the attack range floor to 5 feet (or whatever) everything would be fine.

hurricane would be good, but not overpowered.

ranged aoes could still be used.

melee classes could still use melee attacks.

and the devs could finally get around to allowing hurricane to properly debuff the ranged attacks for melee classes instead of this cheap bandaid-fix we have now.

yes, i'm sick of getting ganked by spines scrappers, what can i say?



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While I did say that a range floor would be a good change, I will only agree to it if lightning storm loses its cheap bandaid toggle droppers...

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i thought this was about hurricane.

start your own thread, dood!



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Hey, I can't respond to cheap shots about cheap bandaids with cheap shots about other cheap bandaids?

Besides, I already had my own thread about this a few months ago. I don't want another one.

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my shot was not cheap.

it was a good, clean shot.

so there!

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Okay, so you didn't take a mez from your primary. Somehow Stun Grenades 'won't work' for you, I assume blowing up in your hand or something. You aren't willing to get Teleport, you aren't willing to get Phase Shift, and you aren't willing to devote a lot of time to killing something. You're unwilling to team with a Dominator or a melee character who has tried any of the above solutions. Oh, and you somehow are unable to penetrate a hurricane, something my Claws/Regen can do without a travel power, Focus, or Moment of Glory. Did you know Moment of Glory has Repel resistance, btw?

And, because of all of these, you want Hurricane made useless. Does that sum it up?

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yup.

i dunno.

it's still very easy for people to bring down a storm defender.

it sucks to get trapped in the corner by one, but there are plenty of ways around it.

maybe not for all builds, but for many.

i should know. as a storm controller i still have a really tough time keeping a well-built toon in a corner.

and my controller is built to do just that.

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i seriously think that if the devs set the attack range floor to 5 feet (or whatever) everything would be fine.

hurricane would be good, but not overpowered.

ranged aoes could still be used.

melee classes could still use melee attacks.

and the devs could finally get around to allowing hurricane to properly debuff the ranged attacks for melee classes instead of this cheap bandaid-fix we have now.

yes, i'm sick of getting ganked by spines scrappers, what can i say?



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While I did say that a range floor would be a good change, I will only agree to it if lightning storm loses its cheap bandaid toggle droppers...

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i thought this was about hurricane.

start your own thread, dood!

i seriously think that if the devs set the attack range floor to 5 feet (or whatever) everything would be fine.

hurricane would be good, but not overpowered.

ranged aoes could still be used.

melee classes could still use melee attacks.

and the devs could finally get around to allowing hurricane to properly debuff the ranged attacks for melee classes instead of this cheap bandaid-fix we have now.

yes, i'm sick of getting ganked by spines scrappers, what can i say?

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As of now I have went ahead and posted a warning for those making AT's on our website.

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This isn't to bash Defenfenders, create an argument, etc.
As of this time if you are planning on making a Defender you would be better off making a Controller. You get more Damage, better Damage Mitigation, and in alot of situations your powers operate 25% better. Just a fair warning for those who are planning on creating a defender in this group.


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At least I can put up a warning with confidence.

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it's funny cuz it's true.

well, sorta' funny...

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Storm Summoning

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* Bug: Hurricane, when used to push an enemy who is under the effects of a hold by another player, sometimes pulls or pushes the enemy in a different direction than intended. (Theory: Hurricane repels enemies Immobilized by another player as if that other player (caster of the Immob) were the origin of the Hurricane.)

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This is on my buglist, but I've not been able to reproduce it. In any case, it is almost certainly a code issue, which means until I get a reproducable case, it is problematic that it will be corrected.

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This bug still exists and has existed since early in CoH. I'm more than happy to help test this at any given time.

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* Balance: Snowstorm's recharge debuff is more effective for Controllers than Defenders. ( It appears the defender version is 80% as slowing as the controller version, seems they were reversed. Dark_Pyroblast)

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Controllers AT modifier for Slows is higher than Defenders. I'll talk to geko to make certain this is by design.

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Please consider that all this power does is slow opponants. By designing it in this manner, the devs have designed the power to be more effective for controllers than defenders even though this is a defender primary power and a controller secondary.

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* Balance: ThunderClap's disorient lasts the same duration for Controllers as it does for Defenders, and may crit.

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This should not be the case. The Disorient value is the same for both ATs and the Controller has a 1.25 modifier, while the Defender has a 1.00 modifier. Controllers Disorient should last a bit longer by default.

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Again, we have the problem of a controller secondary power being better than a defender primary (longer duration). Since all this power does is disorient opponants, the longer duration of the controller version of this power means a controller is more effective when using it than a defender. This is the reason storm defenders are so routinely outshined by their controller counterparts. Please reconsider this.

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* Balance: Tornado does the exact same damage and secondary effect for Controllers as it does for Defenders.

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Defenders should do slightly more damage with Tornado, while Controllers Disorient should last a bit longer. It sounds like a wash, but I'll run it by geko to see if we want to change this.

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Again, why should a defender primary power be functioning at approximately the same level of effectiveness as a controller secondary. No wonder no one rolls storm defenders.

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* PVP: Hurricane does not debuff the ranged attacks (APP, Claws/Focus) of Scrappers and Tankers as it should. (Stormbringer) It also debuffs the range of Blaster melee attacks to zero. (Soyuz)

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The current system is working as designed. We may eventually get code put in that more adequately handles Melee AT's with Ranged attacks and Ranged ATs using Melee attacks, but it is fairly low on the priority list.

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Although working as designed, the current system was (i believe, please correct me if i'm wrong) introduced as a temporary fix for a coding problem that prevented melee ATs from launching melee attacks against someone using hurricane. The band-aid the devs placed on the boo-boo was simply that hurricane would not debuff ANY attacks from melee ATs--melee or ranged. This overkill was introduced as a temporary fix and has lingered like a bad smell, unfairly penalizing hurricane users against melee ATs in pvp by denying them one of the most useful and defensive secondary effects (-range debuff) of their primary defensive power (hurricane). I repeat, this fix was to be temporary, until the devs could recode the melee attack/hurricane interaction. This issue STILL needs to be addressed.

Thanks for your time, Castle. I appreciate you looking into these issues.

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I grabbed a copy of the "Defender Issues" post a couple weeks ago and am working through it in my spare time. Considering the length of it, I will probably have gotten through it sometime in Janurary.

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it is now mid-january.

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Thank you dawg. You the man.
CC

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THIS GUY...

and his crew...

are a-okay.

bailed me out of an adamastor mess the other day.

and didn't laugh at me when i kept getting myself killed like a noob.

well, they didn't laugh much.

thanks again, man.

was fun.

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Dont play the set myself but from what I can tell they are in more demand now than ever, in some casses teams usually dont do to well without them. So where is it exactley they need attention? maybe Storm? or Archery?

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We've got issues abound. Chances are you really wouldn't notice them unless you played a defender. Yeah, the entire TA set is an issue.

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The uselessness of every defender secondary in PVP is an issue.

Cheers!

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Some people just don't realize that defenders are not happy that more and more people are saying "We need a healer."

Just because "Healers" are wanted in teams does not mean that defenders don't have issues. Hobo, please do not remind me about how pitifull my damage is in PvP.

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It's not just pvp, ED evicerated my damaeg in PvE as well. I did the first FBZ taskforce just recently, inf act we started it a week before ED came in and finished a week after ED was live, and I was flat out stunned how badly my damage was hit. I REALLY did not think it would have had such a large impact on me or defenders in general but now litterally I offer no damage worth mentioning to my team in PvP OR PvE. Which is even more infuriating when a controller can put out such a steady stream of relatively good damage.

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plus the controller gets mez protection via the epic power pools.

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there are also still cases where controller secondaries are performing as well as defender primaries.

(cough cough)

storm.

(cough cough)

THANK GOD!!!

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Bug. We neglected to give Stalkers and Brutes the immunity to the Range Debuff that Scrappers and Tankers get. I fixed it internally yesterday...it'll hopefully make it to you folks "Soon(tm)"

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Why is this the conceptual solution? Wouldn't it make more sense to make MELEE attacks, regardless of source, immune from range debuffing?

There is no reason why Scrapper ranged attacks are immune to range debuffing

There is no reason why Blaster melee attacks are vulnerable to range debuffing.

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as i recall, this "tank/scrapper range -range debuff immunity" was to be a temporary fix awhile back. it was originally implemented because ALL tank/scrapper attacks were being -range debuffed--melee and ranged. because of this tankers and scrappers were not able to execute melee attacks at all.

i'm not sure how or why this temporary solution has become the norm.

a much more reasonable solution, and i believe the original solution suggested at the time by the devs, was to make all melee attacks immune to the -range of hurricane and NONE OF THE RANGED ATTACKS.

a fully slotted hasten now has approx. 35 seconds down time between cycles.

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Sigh.

Moving both Damage and Recharge to Schedule "B" does everything that the Devs want ED to do, and doesn't do many of the things Players don't like about ED. (Travel powers not able to be 6-slotted, etc)

But I suppose Dev solutions aren't allowed to make sense...

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holy crap!

you just nailed it.

not only does it make sense but...

it's...

so...

damned...

simple.

my feelings on i5 are best summarized on the first page of this thread:

http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showf...o=&fpart=1

i would also hope the devs continue to look into balancing the arena.

thanks.

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For those of you who were in Beta, you know I always do my best to listen to the community, as does the rest of the Cryptic team. As always, we are all listening and watching. Nothing is permanent in an MMP. New features will be added, and things will change. Not every change will make your Hero more powerful, but it is our goal to make it more fun. Those are not always the same things. It is not fun if it is not challenging (that is, easy is not always fun).

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what's fun about movement suppression?

i've got my tornado 6-slotted for pvp.

it does about 20-22 per tick.

is nice when your opponant is trapped in a corner.

and it really helps vs AVs.

hiya.

that hurricane bug is a known issue.

it usually occurs when someone other than the user of hurricane has held or immobilized a mob and then hurricane is applied.

for some reason (bug, i'm sure) the game considers the caster of the hold/immob as the source of the repel of the hurricane and not the operator of the hurricane as the source of the repeal.

the result is, well, a mess for the storm summoner.

this has been a problem since i2 i think.

still waiting fo the devs to address it.

holy crap that was funny.

thanks guys!