Rial_Vestro

I've seen that same broadcast. And oddly enough for making such a requirement they don't even check to make sure people actually fit into it. I got invited to that trial when I didn't meet any of their requirements and oddly enough we had actually finished the trial without meeting their so called requirements, what a shocker. I'm sure I wasn't the only one. I did have a moment of "If you're requiring t3 rebirth or a healer what the heck am I doing here?" Plus only being level 50+1 if that. (The level 53 should actually say 50+3 because there are no level 53's it's just a level shift that makes you fight as if you were 53 not that you actually are level 53.)

I guess with that trial they got tired of trying to find people to fit the requirements and just went "screw it we'll take anyone, grab that guy who's been broadcasting for the last 10 min." which would be me.

Perhaps I should clarify something here. Usually when ever someone asks a dark "not to attack and just heal" that excludes the use of Twilight Grasp as it requires attacking an enemy in order to use it. This means while there is a heal power available I can't just stop attacking and heal as attacking is a requirement for a dark to be able to heal. No attacks = no heal.

This is not the same for an Empathy Defender who can heal allies without ever attacking a single enemy.

It's a catch 22 so to speak. Your only heal power on a Dark requires an enemy to use it but your team orders you not to attack. You can't heal without attacking so they get mad at you for not healing. You try to start healing but then they just get mad at you for attacking again. And trying to explain this to anyone that doesn't understand how Twilight Grasp works in nearly impossible.

DeBuffs require attacking and that's what I was ordered not to do. I could of tried grabbing power cells to charge terminals with be he had given orders not to do that either.

I have another character who can't attack in the Keyes trial but only when Anti-Matter is around because he's almost entirely AoEs so I don't attack at all to avoid hitting him. But he's usually still able to go threw and grab temp powers or basically act as a buff pet so as not to be completely useless.

This guy just really left me with no choice but to do nothing, the only power I was even capable of using as a Buff was the Force Field Generator and even that was ordered to be dismissed. As if a non-combat pet was going to screw up the entire trial.

Yeah actually I do because I don't feel like having yet another topic of mine be derailed by pointless arguments.

Actually the reason I think that anyone can rename them is because someone told me that they can be renamed and I looked on my Defender to confirm this. The rename option is there but I haven't used it because I can't think of a name to give them.

The coding is on the pet itself not the Archetype. This is why MMs can't name their Dark Servants, Force Field Generators, or Seeker Drones. No one else can name them either so MMs don't even get to do it. The only pets MMs can name are the ones specific to them not pets other Archetypes have access to. Pets like the Dark Servant don't even obey the same commands as a normal MM pet. My MM Dark Servant still works in exactly the same way as the one on my Defender.

That being said Lore Pets work exactly the same way for every Archetype. The UI window that pops up when you summon them is exactly the same UI that Masterminds have been using for 6 years. It even has the Mastermind pet commands on the UI window like a normal Mastermind has. If you right click on a lore pet just like you can do with a Mastermind pet you get all the same command functions. Attack, follow, stay, ect. it's all there as well as the rename option.

I've even tested the MM commands on my Defender and they all work. When I first got my IDF I left Pocket D to sell Enhancements and went to the Magic store in Talos to do this. Before logging off because someone told me that day that Lore pets work the same way as MM pets so I stood outside the magic store, found a target, and hit the attack command to which he responded and ran off without me to attack some freaks across the street. When he came back, that's when I looked to see if I could rename him and stared at the rename window for a couple minutes trying to think of something to call him. I eventually hit the cancel button on the rename window and logged off.

Now if only Masterminds can do this, how did I do all that with a Defender? Maybe it was changed at some point I don't know I just thought it had always been that way because that was my first experience with having a lore pet.

Patron pets don't use the same interface as MM pets so you won't be able to name them. Non-MM Lore Pets do use the same interface though so you can name them.

I'll post some screen shots of the Lore Pet on my Arachnos Soldier on Friday just to prove a point. :P

Just thought I should note, the only thing I can't get the Lore pets to do is use Emotes but even my Masterminds can't get them to emote so it's nothing to do with the Archetype. I've actually got a few MM pets emotes on key binds for some character but the Lore pets won't respond to them.

BTW it's people like this guy here that I created this topic for. Thanks for chiming in.

Have you ever seen anything saying that advancing your character past level 1 is mandatory or somehow required to play the game?

Your entire argument is based on a contradiction. If you're not advancing in the game then what are you doing in the game? Nothing, you're not even playing it. Advancement in a game is a natural part of playing the game.

I've read this like 5 times now and I still can't figure out what you're talking about. It doesn't make any sense. I assume the one story arc you're referring to is the story arc to unlock the Alpha Slot which has nothing to do with the other 4 incarnate slots. And the two things you originally started to talk about turned into that one story arc some how. I seriously don't have a clue what you're trying to say here. Are the two things you originally mentioned different than the story arc you mentioned at the end, is this just a typing error, what's going on here.

This entire statement is contradicting and confusing.

Advancing my characters is a natural part of playing the game. Playing any game in fact. You play to get better at the game and win the rewards the game offers. Rewards are needed to play the game because they add to the game play. Badges are not needed to play the game because they don't add anything to your character. You're not going to advance your character by having more badges than any other character. But you are going to advance your character by having more incarnate abilities and higher tier abilities than other characters. Saying that it's not needed to play the game is like saying you don't need to level up past level 1 to play the game. It's a part of playing the game, you can't do one without the other.

And this the confusing part. A significant number of things I'd be locked out of if I don't have all 5 incarnate slots? That doesn't make any sense. The 5 incarnate slot are the significant number of things I'd be locked out of if I don't have them. What the heck kinda backwards talk is this? I don't need $10,000 because it's not going to buy me $10,000 if I have it? Why would I need to buy $10,000 if I already had it. You're not making any sense.

Seriously I have no idea what you're saying the entire post is full of contradicting sentences. A paragraph that starts off talking about one thing and never finishes it's point then goes off on something completely different. And the last paragraph is a time paradox apparently. I don't know, how does not unlocking incarnate powers not unlock incarnate powers. I don't understand a word of it.

Yes please.

I'm not quite sure what you're getting at here. I know farming takes many forms that's why I compared trials with farming in the first place. You made it sound like it was just about PLing but I hate all forms of farming because it's repeatative. I have been in a few farms like you describe in your quote here to get defeat badges but I don't run them into the ground. I did a few yesterday in fact but typically I will run the farm mission ONCE run off to work on other badges, come back to the farm, and repeat until I have all the badges I'm trying to get that day. Maybe I won't even get them that day depends on how much progress I have on them already but the point is I don't continue to work on the same badge for the entire time I'm online, I only work on progress. Do it enough to put a dent in the progress and move onto the next one.

More detailed description of what I'm talking about. I had a Shivan farm. I went into the mission, killed a few Shivans till I saw the boss and left as if to reset. Most people when they run a farm will reset the mission and go right back into it. I went to sharkhead and started hunting Scrapyarders and Hellfrosts. Then I went to St. Matrial and killed some Family Bosses. Then I went to Cap to kill some Grimlins. Then I did some TV missions trying to get the Couch Potato Badge. This was all to earn progress on different badges, I didn't unlock any of them the first time I ran threw that list. After I got the Couch Potato badge I went back to hunting this time going threw that list backwards. Also I got lucky and found others working on the same badges the second time I went threw them otherwise I wouldn't of unlocked any of them yesterday, would of just got more progress and logged off for the night.

Anyway this all gave me more to do than just farming shivans till I got the badge because I was working on 6 badges all at the same time. Actually because of one of the teams I joined I also unlocked a 7th badge I needed that I wasn't even working on myself.

Typically badge farms are only repeatative because players choose to make them that way. I don't. There's nothing forcing me to work on one badge over another badge so there's no reason I can't work on them all at the same time to keep it from being repeatative.

To make the badge comparison again sense I'm already on that rant. Before the incarnate system existed the only reward giving content for level 50s was badge hunting and Hami raids or the Statesman and Lord Recluse TFs. Or I should say MAJOR reward giving content, as in Accolade powers and Hamidon Enhancements. And that's what I did with 50's before the incarnate trials and even now... sort of... All my main characters have all their accolades unlocked already so nothing more I can do with them in that respect. As far as Hamis are concerned my Defender is already fully slotted with them. He is 7 years old after all and I was doing Hami raids at least once a week back when MySpace Brian was leading raids. My main villains however... are all Masterminds... I don't know if you've ever tried to get on a Lord Recluse SF with a Mastermind... but it's nearly impossible. I had to form teams myself just to get the badge for defeating the future Freedom Phalanx and the only way I got anyone to join a team with a MM is by telling them we were only doing the badge mission. No one was even willing to try to complete the SF, that's as far as I could get them to go. This is back when the Lord Recluse SF first came out by the way.

As for the villain Hami raid... I was really excited when the devs first announced it but no one ever goes in there! We've had the villain hami raids for at least 5 years now (can't remember exactly when it first came out.) but what good is having the content available if no one is going to use it. First month it came out I went in there expecting to find allot of level 50 villains geared up for the Hami raid... but no... I was the only one there... and I can't solo Hami.

Hero Hami raids are even rare now sense the Statesman TF alternative was introduced. I think the main reason for that is because people who can't handle the graphics of the Hami raids prefer to do the TF and that seems to be the majority of players. Can't say I blame them myself I would of done Statesman and avoided the Hive if I had that option available at the time. I only did Hami raids because the Statesman TF didn't exist yet.

Anyway... with all that content available there was no rewards limiting me to doing any one thing. I could work on one set of rewards one min. and other set the next. I didn't have to do Hami raid after Hami raid, there was enough content that left room for me to do other things like badge hunting. And as previously stated I never focused on one badge at a time. I work on it till I get bored and then work on a different badge. Even with all the badges I don't have to do hami raids all the time. I mean I get the Hami-o after 1 run so I don't need to run it again, I already got the reward. I can get multiple Hami-o's but I'm not trying to fully equip on them in a day.

Incarnate trials work by rewarding you with limited IXP, threads, and components so you only get PROGRESS to a reward, you don't unlock anything new with each trial run. I can't unlock and slot Interface just by 1 run of each trial like I can slot a HO with 1 hami raid. It's like leveling up your character. You can't gain an entire level in only 3 missions. Thus it becomes repeatative because you can't do anything else to get the rewards so you have to run them again regardless of what you actually want to do.

You think the problem is with me. You keep telling me to do something else as if that will solve the problem. But you're not listening to what the problem actually is. As stated multiple times threw out this topic I am doing other things besides these trials. It's only your false assumptions that I'm not doing other things. But I'm also trying to get the rewards for these trials at the same time and even with breaks I'm still required to run trials more than I care to in order to unlock anything.

If it were my choice I'd only run ONE of each trial a day, preferably not even that because I'd like there to be enough trials that I don't have to run the same ones multiple days in a row. However it is not my choice because of programming I have to run these freaking things till I'm bored of them just to unlock one power. That's like the equivalent of running the Hami-raid 8 times just to get one HO. Hami raids don't work that way, you get the HO the first time you run it, not 8 raids later.

I'm doing Trials over and over regardless of weather or not I actually want to because I have to run them or I don't get anything for doing them. That's allot of work for nothing. Though you get progress towards something which would be fine if there were more to do.

You can tell me to do something else all you want but that isn't going to fix the issue. Which the issue is something else is not going to unlock my Incarnate powers. I'm not having issues finding something else to do like you seem to think. I'm having issues finding something else to do AND STILL BE ABLE TO GET INCARNATE POWERS.

You seem to be having issues telling the difference between a complaint about the lack of over all content in the game and what my actual complaint is in this topic, the lack of INCARNATE content in the game.

I keep talking about the incarnate rewards till I'm blue in the face and no one seems to understand what the heck I'm talking about. I'm not speaking another language here am I? The problem is the game not me. It's not my fault that there isn't any other content.

What's really great is you guys talk like it's my fault when you all want the same thing. Look at your quote here.

This is exactly the type of comment this topic was made for. In this one line of dialog you have agreed with everything I said in my first post and contributed something new to discussion. Why can't your entire post be like this instead of focusing on people's assumptions of things I never even said.

I went over this in the first post. Threatening someone in order to get them to do something they don't want to do is not the only way to force it onto them. Rewarding someone for doing something they don't want to do works in the same way. That's why people continue to work jobs they hate day after day, because it pays the bills. It's still a type of force.

This is how force works. Threatening force works by "If you do this thing, this other thing won't happen that you won't like." And what you choose to do in this situation is entirely based on which is the lesser of two evils for you in that situation. Technically speaking even if a gun is pointed to your head you still have a choice not to listen to the person holding the gun if you don't mind dieing or if being dead seems like a better option than what you're being forced to do. Rewarding force works on the same principal. "If you do this thing, you get this other thing that you really want." What you do in this case is entirely dependent on weather you think the task handed to you is worth the reward given. And in this case sense the reward given is a requirement for advance in the game then yes it's worth it.

It's the same as working a job you hate doing. As long as you're being paid enough for a job to take care of your bills and keep you from being homeless you'll do anything your boss tells you to do. If offered a good enough reward you'd clean all the bathrooms at your work with a toothbrush not because you really want to clean bathrooms but because you're being paid to do it.

Now by your logic if no one's pointing a gun to your head telling you to clean the bathroom with a toothbrush then you're not being forced to do it at all. You're doing it because you want to and I'm sure it has nothing to do with the pay check you're getting when you're done.

The difference there is that is that you're not doing multiple defeat boss, glowy, hostage, ect. in a row without taking a break to do something else with the same rewards you've been getting for all the defeat boss, glowy, hostage, ect. missions.

There are multiple maps, goals, NPC groups, that are never completely identical to each other unless you choose to run them that way and they all give the same rewards so there's nothing preventing you from running a different mission but you.

Incarnate trials are the same map, the same goals, the same NPCs every time you do them. There's no alternatives for getting the same rewards without doing them so you're stuck running the same identical mission over and over again. That's what makes it so repeatative. The rewards are tied to repeating the same content over and over again.

Yes you can name Lore Pets, always have been able to as far as I know. They use all the same commands as MM pets even if you're not a MM it'll even give you a temporary pet UI while the Lore pets are active.

And I can see why, I can't think of another phrase you could use to name your lore pets. Perhaps someone else will have something for you. I actually could think of a couple things but they don't begin with "the whole" so it wouldn't exactly fit your theme there.

Again you're assuming things that were never said. That's not the problem as I don't think that way at all. In fact it's the total opposite of what I've actually said just like all your other assumptions.

I had stated in the beginning that if we were going to be limited to do incarnate trials to get threads than they should of launched it with more than 2 trials to begin with. That doesn't mean they can't still make more trials later on. They've already done that with the Keyes trial. What that means it they should of held off on launching the trials till they had more content to give us and worked on other things till that could be finished. The way they did it was basically giving us unfinished content that wasn't really ready for the live servers. And I mean that in more ways than one but the other stuff is a little off topic for this thread.

I know what farming is. Someone early on in the topic had accused me of wanting rewards without working for it which is why I had mentioned farming. But the trials do work like a farm as you stated yourself and actually repeated from me for some reason while saying I didn't know what I was talking about. "Doing the same mission(s) over for a reward is farming." And that's what you do with incarnate trials because there's nothing else to do for the same rewards so you have to farm them, that's what this entire topic is complaining about but yet someone still thinks I want to farm. :P

I will tell you the same thing I tell the others. It is NOT my decision to keep doing the same thing over and over again. There's nothing else to do to get the rewards I need to advance my characters. As for taking a break so I don't keep getting frustrated, I'm already doing that. I had reduced the amount of time I spend in game a week before I even started this topic. It's not helping because the problem isn't me it's the game. I'm playing less because the game wants me to do content that I've already done and I'm getting bored of it but I'm still doing that same content when I do play because I'm still trying to get the rewards. The frustration isn't from my playing or not playing the content it's the lack of content provided.

I actually started playing more again when Keyes first came out and actually managed to complete the trial 3 times out of like 30 failed attempts. (Not that the other two trials were any better when they first came out though the majority of people seem to think so.) Now that everyone has done Lamb and BAF hundreds of times they rarely ever fail and that's the only reason why people seem stuck to them. The only people who seem to want to do Keyes are the ones who are bored like me. Anyway, now it's starting to be just another trial and I'm going back to playing less again. I ran each trial once today and then logged off rather than staying online for the whole day like I use to do repeating them till I'm bored to death. Hint there, if there was more content I'd still be on the game right now instead of making this post.

I rarely ever use the forums unless I see an aspect of the game that needs improving. I'll be very active on the forums for a while till a change is made and the topic isn't needed anymore or I just get tired of all the negative posters who seem to have more issues with me personally than anything I've actually posted. When the game is good I go months, maybe even an entire YEAR without posting a single thing because I'm busy actually playing the game. I don't know why so many people have issues with me, you people don't even know me. If you don't like my ideas I can deal with that, but talk about why you don't like my ideas. Don't just attack me like I'm the root of all evil. My idea, as it stands are simply, there needs to be more incarnate content than there is and some how people are having issues with that like the content is fine the way it is. If you don't want more incarnate content that's your problem, you don't have to do it if you don't want to, you can just stick to running BAF and Lamb over and over but I want more to do.

Stopping right there and putting it in bold because I think you just answered your own question.

I've posted allot of bitter, unhappy, angst-ridden threads on the forums over the years myself and it's not because I hate the game. Overall I love this game because it offers so much more that other games, I don't understand how they can even compare.
Every player on CoH has his or her own unique character and build, there might be a few similarities here and there but no two characters is ever exactly alike. Then the other complaint I kept hearing was CoH getting too repeatative which with the Incarnate Trials I actually agree with. There's only one thing to do in that game and you do it the entire time you play.

Like CoH first started the zone revamps like the new Faultline where they took was was originally a broken trial zone and turned it into a livable city again.


Going back to everything great about CoH. I can customize nearly everything. I have a few nit picks that I don't like but can be easily improved on in later updates and they always do get worked on some times it takes longer than others but it gets done because the developers actually listen to the player base. I've taken a few breaks from CoH to try other MMOs but non of them has offered any of the features that made me love this game. Mainly all other MMOs seem to be designed more like WoW, no direction, no customization, nothing to do.

I was hooked on this game before I even finished my first tutorial and the fact that no one else in the tutorial looked anything like me helped allot too. What other game would ever hold a costume contest? None of them they don't have costumes everyone looks the same. Sure allot of games have alternate clothing you pick up in the game but it all has defense and resistance value so you know players are always going to go for the items with the highest value so my only hope of not looking like a clone is to intentionally build a weak character. No thank you. I'd rather play CoH were I can be an individual without making my character completely useless. (or try to at least)

This is entirely optional but I love doing it. All my characters even have their own descriptions describing who that character is. Other games don't have that, just a name, you're stuck with whatever origin the game tells you that you have. What if I died in the fire. Nope didn't happen you're a zombie because you died in battle. A battle in fire. No there was no fire. Why not? Because I said so. Screw you, I'm going to CoH so I can die in a fire if I want to. I don't have to die the way they tell me to.

So yeah, over all, CoH is the best game of all time because it's the only game with choices. It's the only game that puts choice in the player's hands. Now if they'll just fix the Incarnate system to do that again.

How did you get that out of that quote? I said the total opposite of that.

Look it's simple, the problem is with the game because it should be designed so if you're repeating content it's because you want to repeat that content not because it's the only way to advance in the game. That's how games work is you advance by playing threw ALL the content not just repeating the same thing till you're bored of it. The incarnate system is a form of advancement that requires repeating content to access it. Up till 50 you can advance in the game by doing anything you want and if you repeat any content between 1 and 50 that's your own damn fault for farming when you didn't need to farm. The Incarnate trials are actually designed to be farms as there's nothing else to do to advance in the game without farming them.

So here it is... you seem to have this totally backwards idea that the problem is with me not the game and this totally backwards idea that I want rewards without working for them. But that's not it at all, that's exactly the kind of thing I'm complaining about. That's not how I want the incarnate trials to be that's how they already are. I hate farms, I hate them because I don't like repeating content and because they promote noobs to level 50 who don't know how to play the game.

At no point in here am I asking for faster rewards, only more content giving the same rewards so it's less like a farm and more like a normal part of the game. The problem is with the game.

I never said that not getting threads would put you in a homeless shelter. It was a comparison of two different topics not that one would lead to the other.

You say that I don't need rewards to survive in the game.

Money is nothing more than rewards that you get in real life so I was using the real life example to explain how the game life operates not to say that the game will have any real effect on a person's real life.

Same thing with the example comparison of the value of in game Shards and Threads and the value of real life money. Of course you're not going to buy a house with a fictional form of currency but it's just a comparison of something real that you can more easily relate to, nothing more.

What they said.

Here's the math for you in case you don't know.

It takes 4 Shards to make one common Incarnate Component for the Alpha Slot. (12 shards to create a T1 ability)

It takes 20 Threads to make one common Incarnate Component for any of the 5 slots. (60 Threads to create a T1 ability)

Obviously Threads drop more often to compensate for the fact that it takes more of them to create anything but they only drop during trials. Now given the drop ratio of each in order for the Shards to Threads conversion to be worth while you should be able to covert 1 Shard into 5 Threads. But no that's not how it works at all. I'm logging on right now so I can get the numbers for this...

Upgrade 10 incarnate Shards into 10 Incarnate Threads ONCE EVERY 20 HOURS.

Upgrade 10 incarnate Shards into 5 Incarnate Threads as many times as you want.

Break Down Notice of the Well into 40 incarnate threads. And if you're not doing the WST the Notice of the Well cost 64 Shards for 4 common Incarnate components, Another 32 Shards to upgrade them into Uncommon Components, and another 40 Shards to upgrade all of them into 1 Notice of the Well. That's a total of 176 Shards to make only 40 Threads.

Break down Favor of the Well into 100 Incarnate Threads. Again if you're not WST the Favor of the Well costs 2 Notice of the Well and 32 Incarnate Shards adding up to a total of 384 Shards for only 100 Threads.

Quick recap

Upgrade Value
10 Shards = 10 Threads
Actual Value
2 Shards = 10 Threads
10 Shards = 50 Threads
Amount you're being ripped off
8 Shards Paid for 40 Threads not received

Upgrade Value
10 Shards = 5 Threads
Actual Value
1 Shard = 5 Threads
10 Shards = 50 Threads
Amount you're being ripped off
9 Shards paid for 45 Threads not received

Upgrade Value
176 Shards = 40 Threads
Actual Value
8 Shards = 40 Threads
176 Shards = 880 Threads
Amount you're being ripped off
168 Shards paid for 840 Threads not received

Upgrade Value
384 Shards = 100 Threads
Actual Value
20 Shards = 100 Threads
384 Shards = 1,920 Threads
Amount you're being ripped off
364 Shards paid for 1,820 Threads not received

Would you be willing go into a bank to exchange real life money at this exchange rate? It would be equivalent of giving a bank $10,000 in exchange for only $1 in return. You just gave up buying a house for a pack of gum!

Well you didn't understand but given your explanation here that seems to be more my fault. I'll try to clear things up here. And BTW thank you for actually explaining my mistakes in clarity rather than just insulting me like some in here have done. :P

The reason I brought up shard drops is because Shards can used for the Alpha Slot, and the Alpha Slot ONLY. I like to use them for my Alpha Slot because it gives me some extra content I can do provided I can find enough other people who are also interested in Shards. More specifically I want to run the WST for the Notice of the Well as I do other things for shards as well provided I have time to do anything else. Typically though it's been such that I have very little time to do anything else because I waist my whole day with trials and standing around for hours trying to get a TF together. Though more recently it seems to be more dependent on just what the TF of the week is as to weather or not people actually want to do it. Lord Recluse seemed to be very active last week which was good because two of my characters last week were also in need of the Marshal Accolade. But the week before getting a Barracuda together was a major pain.

Anyway, that being said, Threads can be used for ALL 5 incarnate slots making it as such that if one choose to one could slot all 5 incarnate slots without earning a single Shard. The more people realize this the less people there are to get shards. And people's reasoning for doing threads instead of shards is "because threads are easier to get" but I don't want to do threads when I don't have to. I'm only doing Trials for the 4 slots to which they were required and still trying to shard for the Alpha.

People have been coming to the unfounded assumption that I want easy rewards but if that were the case why would I be complaining about the trials directly after talking about Shards? Threads are already easy to get and yet I'm trying to avoid them as much as possible.

Yeah I know my spelling sucks and believe it or not it could of been allot worse. That was done with a spell check program which we all know doesn't work all that well for words that are spelled correctly but aren't the correct word to be used in that sentence. (Not knowing the difference between there and their for example) At least I'm trying to correct my spelling mistakes.

No, there isn't something else to do. The only thing forcing me to do the trials is the fact that I can't get threads anywhere else in the game. There's plenty of other content I could do which I've already stated DOES NOT REWARD THREADS. Oh look, here it is in my own words, at the start of the paragraph that ended with me stating there is nothing else to do TO GET THREADS.

Problem is definitely in game. Threads are forcing me and requiring me to do the trials. And your examples are invalid because the rewards you mentioned are not required to advance in the game. Being forced to do specific content to get threads would be like being forced to do specific content to earn XP all the way from 1 to 50. The only thing you're really forced to do at level one is the tutorial and that's only if you've never done it before after that you have the option to skip it. Now imagine that at level 1 you had all of two missions that gave XP and everything else in the game didn't give rewards at all. That's what incarnate trials are. That's what I am complaining about. Incarnate trials are in fact, by design, limiting the amount of content I have access to in order to get the rewards needed to advance in the game.

Shards I can already get anywhere in the game, I have a choice of what I want to do in order to obtain my shards. This is how Threads should work but they don't, they limit me to doing these trials weather or not I actually want to do them.

HO's as much as I love having a few HO's myself, they don't add anything new to my character, there's no advancement. Threads actually help to unlock new powers and abilities that I didn't already have. They even add level shifts to my character. This is much more than just a simple enhancement of something I already have, it's something entirely new.

Again, the rewards have not been to advance in the game. They have been for badges and things that you don't need to advance in the game. Again, imagine being a level 1 and only being able to get XP for two missions and having to repeat the same two missions over and over again.

The game design has always been about CHOICE. The choice to make whatever character you want, the choice to make your own missions, the choice to do whatever content you choose to do without limiting how you advance in the game. This can even be seen with Incarnate Shards. You are not required to the WST to get shards, that is your own choice, Shards will drop regardless of whatever content you are doing. I can whatever I want and still be able to upgrade my Alpha Slot but ONLY my Alpha Slot.

With Threads there is no choice. You can't use Shards to upgrade Interface, Destiny, Judgment, or Lore, you have to have Threads. You can't get threads unless you do Trials. This removes the choice from the player. If I could get Threads in other content or had any other choice to unlock and slot the other 4 slots I wouldn't be here complaining about the lack of content to do that. There is no choice because there is not other content to get Threads. I'm forced to do these two trials.

And besides I wouldn't mind being limited to trials if there were more of them. But I also understand that some people CAN'T do them because of the lag and continued crashing. Even on my computer this is annoying, I could imagine some people may not be able to load into the trials at all and there for wouldn't be able to participate in that content even if they wanted to. There has to be alternative content so that everyone has access to the same rewards. This is why we got Statesman and Lord Recluse as an alternative to the Hamidon raids because some people can't do Hamidon raids. They simply crash the moment they enter the zone. Statesman TF gives an alternative to people that can't handle the Hive.

Trials have no alternative. You have to do trials. There is no choice. There should be a choice because not everyone can do them and not everyone wants to do them, but everyone wants the rewards. I'm not asking for the rewards to be given easily, just that there be options to get them. I'm asking for a choice which currently does NOT exist.

If the problem were in chair and not in game that would mean there was already ways to get threads without doing repeated content. That would mean I only wanted Threads to drop faster without doing Trials. But they can't drop faster because they don't drop at all. Double of nothing is still nothing.

There is nothing selfish about wanting alternative content for EVERYONE, that includes YOU. If YOU don't care about advancing in the game and getting threads then YOU don't have to use them. But that doesn't mean that everyone else in the game that wants them has to suffer threw limited game content just because YOU don't care.

And YES, this does belong in this forum section. It doesn't belong in player help because I'm not asking for player help. It belongs here because it has everything to do with improving the quality of life in game play for everyone not just me. I have a friend in the game who CAN'T EVEN DO THE TRIALS because her computer CAN'T HANDLE THE GRAPHICS. She can barely handle being on a team of 8 players let alone being in a league with 16 or more. She wants to get threads so that she can advance further in the game but she can't even participate in the existing content. And you're calling me selfish? Again this was already explained in my original post.

This friend I speak of has unlocked and slotted her Alpha Slot using the alternative content available to get Shards, no TFs. She had that option open from the beginning. All I'm asking is that the same option be given to the other 4 slots. I doubt that she's the only one in the game like that, she's just the only one I play with regularly.

Weather you want to admit it or not THIS IS A LEGITIMATE COMPLAINT made not only by myself but others as well for different reasons. This would in fact improve the quality of life for everyone in the game not just me.

Why do people even continue to argue with me on this stuff. This has being going on for 7 years and every time I suggested a change be made to the game I get these hate messages and every time the changes have been made to the game. Going Rouge is a perfect example, if you look back you'll see a topic where I had first suggested the idea nearly a year, possibly 2 years before it was ever announced and that topic is just full of people insulting me, complaining about "balance issues" and claiming it would never happen but here we are. Another of my ideas that's in the game right now is power customization. People claimed it was impossible to do but in fact it was just very complicated and took a long time to implement. Doppelgangers, again, I made that suggestion years before it made it into the game and got lots of negative feedback on the forums from it. I was right and they were all wrong.

How many times do I have to post a suggestion to improve the game play and have it be implemented before people stop trying to argue with me and actually hold a civilized conversation? Seriously like 90% of every suggestion I've ever made on the forums has actually been implemented in the game and 100% of the comments on every one of them has been negative.

Oh I might also add that the only suggestions I've made that haven't been implemented in game are Praetorian Arachnos with the exception of Ghost Widow. A way to completely get rid of the Arachnos Uniform on the VEATs. And color names on the costume editor for the color blind.

The only reason I bring any of this up is to help you understand something. The reason my ideas have been implemented so often is because I speak for the majority of the player base not just myself. The forums do not even make up the majority of the player base as most players never even get involved on the forums. I speak to them in game before I even bother posting this stuff and they have civilized conversations with me telling me what they like and don't like about the game and that helps to influence my ideas before I even come and post it here.

I'm doing no such thing. You stated that ADHD wasn't a legitimate disability and if you've dealt with someone who has it as you claim you should know it is. Also you're right that actually having ADHD isn't an insult but you were obviously accused me of being ADHD as a means of insulting me which is not only offensive to me but to any person who actually is ADHD. I'm not going to sit here and argue this with you any further.

The first sentence is "Incarnate Threads only drop in Incarnate Trials" The second sentence is "No other content will ever drop threads" that's not a contradiction in any way shape or form.

I'm not talking about Inf, recipes, experience, or badges, I'm talking about THREADS. I don't even use recipes, I just sell them. Experience? Why would you even bring that up? You know I'm talking about incarnate trials, sure you must realize that you need to be level 50 to do them. Nothing gives experience for me anymore, I'm already level 50! But wait there's Incarnate XP that unlocks the Interface, Judgement, Destiny, and Lore slots, maybe you were talking about that but oh wait you can only get that in the incarnate trials. Badges? Aside from Accolades I don't care about the stupid badges.

Again you assume things about me that are totally WRONG. It was stated in the first post that people can get SHARDS threw normal content without doing TFs, it takes longer but at least it's POSSIBLE. THREADS on the other hand YOU CAN ONLY GET IN THE TRIALS! It is NOT possible to get incarnate THREADS if you do not do trials! Why is this so hard to understand? I don't want threads simply handed to me I want an alternative means to get them without having to repeat content I've already done hundreds of times. Why don't you try actually reading the original post instead of assuming you know anything about a random stranger you met on the internet?

Now that's what a contradiction looks like.

For one thing, I play about 15 different characters, again this was stated in my original post, try reading it. For another I am working up to new rewards over time not just in a couple of days. And finally I don't think it's even possible to work up to new rewards in a couple of days.

Anyway my post was never even about the speed at which rewards are earned, there isn't a single comment about how fast rewards drop anywhere in my original post, YOU are the one who brought it up. My post was only as the title states about "REPEAT GAME PLAY" I don't care how fast the rewards drop, I think they drop just fine as it is. My complaint is that there isn't enough content dropping the rewards to unlock anything without doing it over and over again.

You seem to be constantly missing the point of this topic that it's not about getting rewards faster, it's about getting more content with rewards. You have a choice of the content you want to do for Shards, the same can not be said for Threads, and THAT is what I want to change.

What choose? Lets put it this way. Why do you have jobs? Because you get paid with money. But you don't have to have jobs you "choose" to work? But if I don't work I can't afford food, or shelter, or playing this game. But you don't need money to survive, there are plenty of homeless shelters you can go to, money just help you afford the luxuries that you're use to.

Simply put they're dangling a carrot in front of me and you're expecting me not to eat it. People go where the rewards are, it's that simple. Literally every level 50 in the game right now is entirely focused on the two trials because there are no other ways to get Threads.

Put the threads in the normal game, make them harder to get like the shards are but just put them in the normal game. That's all I'm asking, I can't make this any simpler than that.

ADHD is in fact a disability, one of which I do not have but my older brother does. This means that one can not sit still or pay attention to things for any longer than 2 min. Your comment is both inaccurate and offensive.

Did you even read my original post or the information about the rewards in trials for that matter? I'm not complaining about Shard drops.

It looks like you've at least schemed threw it but you missed the point of the topic by a mile. Incarnate Threads only drop regularly during incarnate Trials. You can get 2 Threads, but ONLY two threads at the end of both Tin Mage and Apex TFs which is a major rip off sense they're allot more work for less of a reward. No other content in the entire game will ever drop Threads so you are REQUIRED to do the Trials REPEATEDLY.

This is not a simple "I don't like this and so I don't want to do it" in fact I actually like the trials, when I'm not constantly crashing from them. And I've repeated them countless times over the course of 2 weeks before I finally went "I really wish I could do something else right now." but I can't do something else because there's nothing else to do.

I actually admitted in my first post that yes there is other content I could do but if I want rewards I have to do trials. There's no other options for reward but repeating trials. It's a choice between repeat content with needed rewards or new content with no rewards at all. Thus problem not in chair, problem in game.

This is actually in the games design, it has nothing to do with me and everything to do with the game only being programed to give me threads if I do Trials.

Please please PLEASE try to ACTUALLY read what the problem ACTUALLY is before you ASSUME something TOTALLY the opposite.

The forum section says "Discuss gameplay / technical issues or bugs here!" This is not a "Player Suggestion" and General Discussion is basically anything that doesn't fit anywhere else. The entire post is dedicated to problems with repeat gameplay which I feel is an issue for the developers to look at and thus it belongs here.

Actually "Ketchup" is how it was originally entered in the English vocabulary and it's not arguable at all, there's multiple sources confirming this. I was even taught in school that Catsup was wrong not to mention the spell check keeps marking it that way while Ketchup is showing to be correct.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Ketchup

I can't seem to find anything about where Catsup came from, at least not from any reliable sources but I believe it's just a really bad marketing idea. This not really the only time this has happened but probably the first where in an effort to create a brand name for a product all they did was change the spelling on it's proper name. It would be like if I were to start a bottled Water company and use whattr as the brand name. (Whattr obviously just being Water spelled wrong.)

Catsup because technically it's spelled wrong.

Two things about that.

1. Flexo was not Bender's evil double from another universe.

2. That was not a Goatee it was a soul patch. A Goatee is basically anything where the sides of your face are shaved but not your chin and not your mustache. A soul patch is an almost completely shaved face with the exception of a triangular patch of beard left on your chin. You could technically have a soul patch as part of a goatee but in order for it to be a goatee a mustache is required. And evil Goatees are always in the style that Spock had.

On the comment of Evil Spock not being evil. I guess being good or evil requires some emotional reasoning one way or the other however one could also be good or evil by association. Shockwave is logical like a Vulcan but he is still a Decepticon and therefore evil. Ironically Lenard Nimoy actually voiced Galvatron and he was a crazy nut job. (Though he didn't really go crazy till Frank Welker took over again in the series. Nimoy only did the voice for the movie.)

Now if you'll excuse me I have to go hide in the corner after showing off what a gigantic nerd I am...