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For those of you who are dissatisfied with the amount of hard numbers given to us by the devs about these powers, here are some of the numbers I've collected:
<font class="small">Code:[/color]<hr /><pre>
Power Scorpio Mace Web Poisono Mace Mace Web Disruptor
Shield Blast Cocoon Ray Beam Beam Envelop Blast
Volley
BaseAcc 1 1.05 1.05 1.05 1.25 1.05 1.05 1.05
Target single single single single single cone AoE AoE
MaxTrgt 0 0 0 0 0 0 10 16
Radius 0 0 0 0 0 50 15 15
Angle 0 0 0 0 0 35 0 0
Range 0 80 60 80 150 50 80 80
Activat 2 2 2 2 8 2 2 2
Recharg 4 9 32 24 24 32 20 32
s/Tick 0.5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
EndCost 0.1625 8.58 10.66 13 17.94 18.98 12.74 18.98
Interup 0 0 0 0 6 0 0 0
Enhance endredu endredu hold endredu interup endredu endredu endredu
recharg range slow range endredu range range range
defense recharg endredu recharg range recharg recharg recharg
knockbk range defdbuf recharg knockbk immobil knockbk
damage recharg accurac knockbk damage accurac damage
accurac accurac hitdbuf accurac accurac
damage
accurac

Power Summon Summon Summon Summon
Blaster Disrupt Tarantu Spiderlings

BaseAcc 1 1 1 1
Target Summon Summon Summon Summon
Range 60 60 60 60
Activat 3.03 3.03 3.03 3.03
Recharg 900 900 900 900
EndCost 26 26 26 26
Enhance endredu endmod slow endredu
range hold endredu range
knockbk endredu range defdbuf
immobil range defdbuf damage
damage immobil damage accurac
accurac damage accurac
accurac</pre><hr />
I'll soon be posting the numbers I have for each pet's individual powers.

NOTE: Before you ask--yes, what I've shown here states that recharge enhancements are NOT allowed in the 15 minute recharge pet powers.

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No recharge enhancements allowed? That is just insane. Thanks for the info, appreciate it.

Ok, so it is Mag3 then. I was thinking it was Mag2 since one of the posters above said it will be Mag2 and Castle said he was right.

Yes, I understand that it is nice if you have another hold to stack it with but my point is that holds are not a crossover skill for every AT. Giving a corruptor or a mastermind a Mag2 hold in their PPP's that recharges in 32 seconds would be like giving brutes a 2.5% smashing/lethal resistance passive in their PPP's.

I understand that these powers are not totally horrible in their current state but I do believe they could be buffed and made more appealing to the players without causing any balance issues. Introducing new powers in a slightly weakened state and then buffing them if possible at a later date is always better than giving us something too good then ripping apart but I doubt that is the developers intentions here.

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As far as magnitude goes, expect it to be exactly the same as Tanker APPs such as Block of Ice, Stone Prison, etc..

Those have a hold magnitude that is able to work on LTs but not Bosses, making it Mag2 I believe. Recharge will likely be 30+ seconds, and duration will be around 8-10 seconds.

Ranged holds are possibly the most nerfed APP crossover skill, and I think that it will be the same for PPPs.

If I'm wrong about mag and recharge/durtation then GW's hold will indeed be an amazing skill for stalkers. Otherwise, the holds are a bit of a let down.

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Sounds about right, actually.

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So a corruptor or mastermind who gets Mag3 holds in his primary or secondary will have access to an even worse hold in his patron pool? It's hardly a crossover skill for tthem.

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Ok...Why isn't the resistance portion of the Scorpion Shield enhanceable? I recently hit 42 on my Dominator and noticed this...Anyone know if this is intended?

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Please tell me you're joking.

It's quite obvious, at least to me, that the PPP's are not a top priority for the devs at the moment which is quite disappointing. The developers seem to be paying more attention and putting more effort into the PvP aspect of CoX than the PvE. The least they could do is make a post in one of the official PPP threads acknowledging our concerns.

They are gone after 4 minutes.

I was under the impression that the developers were going to give out hard numbers for the PPP's so that we can make informed decisions when picking these permanent powers. After checking the statues on test it appears this is no longer the case.

I'll make a short list of my problems with the descriptions for the corruptor here and hope a dev happens to take a look and respond:

Web Envelope- No duration numbers, magnitude, or description if it is a cone or AoE. It seems likely it will be mag 3 but the devs have been known to do some crazy things. Also, I had previously thought this was an aoe but now I'm not so sure.

Scorpion Shield- No description for the amount of defense it provides. Why the numbers for the most important aspect of this power are not given in the details is beyond me.

Web Cacoon- This is not really a problem with the description but having a single target hold that recharges in 32 seconds is on the verge of being useless outside of PvP unless you have another to stack it with. Forgot to add that the magnitude is not given. Again, Mag 3 seems most likely but who really knows.

Summon Disruptor-This power, in my opinion, needs a lot of detail in the decription. Mainly what I would like too see is the HP's of the pet, whether it uses resistance or defense, a list of the attacks it uses and if they are melee or ranged, and whether or not it uses any holds/buffs/debuffs.

Unless we get a level bump on test to actually, you know, test these powers there will most likely be a lot of angry and disappointed CoV players.

Chum spray friggin sucks!!! That's right, I said chum spray SUCKS! Burn for tanks is 100x better than chum spray could ever dream of being and that is saying a lot.

P.S. Trick Arrow&gt;Chum Spray

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All MMs were told they would receive a slight buff with i7, aimed at PVP but useful in PVE also. Does anyone on test know what this buff is?

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Actually, it's not aimed at PvP -- it's a general change. Useful equally everywhere.

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This sounds like a nerf to me. I hope I'm wrong, I really do, but a "general" change does not sound good at all. My guess, if it's not a nerf, is that our pets attacks will have the same affect as gauntlet like tanks have. Castle said gauntlet is going to work in PvP soon so the coding for that is already being taken care of. This way the devs get to solve 2 problems at once and tankers and MM's get a buff for PvP.

The only useful thing for my MM is the AoE immoblize and that is only because mine is bots/ and the burn patch causes fear and a lot of their attacks do knockback which I hate. The personal attacks are completely useless, MM's do .55 the damage of a blaster so it's not like we will be hurting anything too much not to mention the fact that you should be focusing on your secondary and/or pool powers to keep your pets alive.

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i know you cant respec patrol power away but can i respec a paticular power in PPP, lets say i didnt like gloom and i want to pick soul tentacles instead will i be able to do it in a respec?

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Yes

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In case anyone is wondering (aside from questions as to "why &lt;x&gt;!!", this was the most pressing question on my mind regarding the powers), the ever helpful _Castle_ confirmed to me that the PP pets function like controller pets - at least with regards to duration.

Again, to clarify, the pets last until you zone or die. That makes me very happy. I doubt they will be as buff as their NPC versions, but hey - free pets!

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Well that is definitely a good start considering my corruptor, I could always use a pet to tank for me and it will be nice tossing buffs onto it.

I hope the devs come up with some way for us to try the PPP's on test without actually having to level your character up.

I'm sure they will give numbers like they said but will that make a difference when powers are "balanced"? Will they tell the player which aoe immobilize stops knockback and which one doesn't? Will the lvl 49 pets have their hit points, resistances, status protection, etc listed? Will there be pictures of the powers to look at in the game so you're not stuck with something that looks so horrible/ridiculous you wish you never picked that patron? Will the descriptions even be accurate or in 2 months will a player test something, post about it, then receive a dev response along the lines of "ooops, we forgot to update that description. We nerfed that power before it even hit test, sorry".

These patron powers just keep getting worse and worse in my view.

I personally am very very disappointed in the patron powers. I am not excited one bit about getting my corruptor some gimpy armor that will get knocked off by sleeps/disorients/holds every fight nor will it be awesome when my mastermind is able to get access to more personal attacks.

With my MM I skipped my attacks for a reason, I do not need the aggro on me, I have to focus on my secondary to keep my pets alive in battle, and our attacks are set at .55 the damage of a blaster which is absolutely horrible.

The only good thing I can see for my corruptor is the aoe immobilize, this will allow me to use my rain more effectively. Everything else is garbage unless the devs actually give the stats on the pets so I can see which one has the most hp's/resists so he can tank for me. That is also assuming it can be made perma or close to it, I have no use for a pet every 1000 seconds.

It appears the only AT, or should I say build, that will get a great benefit from the patron powers is /fire brutes.......what I wouldn't do to get an aoe immobilize for my fire tanker. I know we still don't have all the info and that some people are perfectly happy with the patron pools but I for one am seriously disappointed in the lack of variety and usefulness of the PPP's as a whole.

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See how he says currently there is no way to allow us to respec out of them?

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Yes, and I also see 'truly permanent' and 'part of your character'.

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Yes but what is your point? My point is that they are just being lazy by not figuring out a way for us to respec out of these patron powers, I'm not arguing about the fact that they are permanent. Thinking up a new way of getting people their APP's is not lazy, adding unique story arcs tied to patrons is not lazy, causing these powers to be permanent just because the game isn't currently programmed to allow these powers to be changed is lazy.

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Unfoturnately, its far too late for things to go back to the drawing board. They've created the content, created the powers, and now we're going to be stuck with it. The odds of a change to something like this happening are very, very low based on past history.

They've been heavily promoting I7 the last few weeks, they aren't going to make fundamental design changes too it at this point. I'd love to be wrong, but I doubt I will be.

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I agree. Makes me wonder why they even put this stuff on test considering they will not change it no matter what kind of feedback they recieve. It really is a shame too, they get a bunch of new and old subscribers by introducing CoV then go and do something like this that will most likely cause those people that returned to leave again once they get frustrated over "balance" changes made to their powers that they have to keep forever.

Here and here. See how he says currently there is no way to allow us to respec out of them? That makes me believe they are not against it, only that it would be difficult for them to program a way of doing so in-game. That seems lazy to me.

Edit: screwed up my links

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I think it's lazy that they didn't/won't figure out a way for the patron powers to be respec'd out of.

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They made it that way on purpose.

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Really? Are you sure they didn't just tie the patron powers to content on purpose and by doing so incidentally locked the powers into your character once you've chosen them? From what I read that's how it sounded to me. I don't think they are very concerned with you having to keep the powers forever, it's just they have no way of preventing this with the way they are being implemented.

I think it's lazy that they didn't/won't figure out a way for the patron powers to be respec'd out of. It's also going to be lazy of them when this hits test, they find out the majority of people hate it, and they do not change it.

This thread is barely 24 hrs old and is already 34 pages long......you'd think this would send a message to the devs.

I'm probably just going to skip the patron powers now There's nothing I hate more than getting powers I am stuck with for forever and watching them get nerfed. The devs have already ruined my fire/fire tank and ar/dev blaster, I will not allow them to do the same thing to my fire/kin in CoV.

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It will be interesting to see how touch of fear works out on test, I'm thinking it will be an excellent setup for AS. Unless the person is /DA (is there anything else that resists fear?) or has a lot of BF's they are going to be in some serious trouble.

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You can go test it right now. Just get Intimidate from the Presence Pool and only use it in melee range. ToF should have a longer duration, though.

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Actually intimidate has a much lower base accuracy, takes about 3 times longer to recharge, takes up a power pool choice, forces you to take a power that is worthless to stalkers, and has no -accuracy debuff. Everyone knows how tight a stalker build can get so it's no wonder nobody really uses this but with DM it will be a different story.

It will be interesting to see how touch of fear works out on test, I'm thinking it will be an excellent setup for AS. Unless the person is /DA (is there anything else that resists fear?) or has a lot of BF's they are going to be in some serious trouble.