New Dawn

Sacrificing aggro control is not a pay off for survivability really is it not like Stone Armours rooted which affects the player. You could say losing aggro to a defender and having the defender die and thus the player and the whole damn team at level 15 is an ideal pay off but I just don't see it that way. Ofc losing aggro can mean less regen but you don't need it because you have one less hitting you.

Knowing that the gauntlet duration is of 13.5 secs is meaningless, you either have aggro or you don't, you either see turners or stickers, taunt duration is not going to have the same effect on every npc and gauntlets can miss.

It maybe a case of Tankers letting Brutes have initial aggro to ensure that those Brutes get a good fury bar. There was a lil tiff about a Brute wanting to take an alpha instead of a Tanker on the ITF ages ago and I think a Dev agreed it would be good to let the Brute go first. Brutes need to lead in DPS.

I don't see a hard rule, you've got to weigh up whether its suicidal for the Brute or not. Just as a Tanker don't be too long behind unless some team mates still need help.

I have seen Brutes hide behind my Dominator. I get dissappointed in this because I expect Brutes to do one thing properly and that's be insanely fearless.

If a) is not a guide then whoever puts the guides in the guide section must have a broad idea on what a guide should be. I'd look at the build for anything that might take my fancy.

If people are cool with it is as it is then there is no need to change it. Some people remarked on it in the past in other sections and have not remarked on it here. Yet and may not do so there is no point in asking for a change.

I' m not arguing for it, more so I am looking to see how much there is in differences of opinion on it.

I'll keep saying "gauntlet more".

Throw out the word need. Replace it with thinking about fun. Some people are obviously avoiding WP because of the lack of aggro control. Lacking aggro control wouldn't be fun.

Losing aggro to someone else for some tankers is not on. Not on at all. It's chicken.

Some past pugs might of otherwise stayed together had a WP tanker been able to establish good aggro control, because the tanker hadn't they disbanded. WP tankers aggro control ability is susceptible to -travel speed, -tohit, -rechg, mobs resisting taunt duration to name but four, because on top of them what other players do, to put mobs out at a distance for even a minimal bit of timecan lead to problems. Now other tankers have the same problems to certain extents just not so much with the mobs being put out at a distance for a minimal bit of time.

Someone could hit a npc, I could taunt aura them then move 9ft away for another reason, as time is off the essence, that npc could then go straight back to thinking about who hit them. It don't leave much time for recoveries when you consider that npc*15. What's the point in playing a tanker if at any second or two you might as well not even been trying to do your job as the very thing your trying to prevent happens anyway?

Sure there are ways around anything and players should learn to team together but not everybody complies to doing that. The kick button maybe there for the leader but not the Tanker. Games should be fun, not about being made completely redundant by others in no time.

I used to pick up taunt at 4 but now its 10. So problems for me are way less, problems for others that post here are also less but that don't mean there isn't a prob to look at because elsewhere on the forums remarks about it are getting made. That's why I brought it up.

What used to annoy me is when some energy blaster would KB mobs, spreading them from being collected within other peoples cones all for a pitiful bit of damage. If your gonna kb aoe then atleast make sure it is going to finish off rather than take a smidgeon. Cones are different, they can go to walls, corners, used to help bunch what have you.

Another thing knocking other peoples targets off of edges to fight them later is also bad.

I actually did the testing with and without my mates AAO on and deemed the aura problematic and potentially fun killing for people who may see aggro control as what a tanker should be bringing to the team, leveling up and with a style of play that is not conducive to forumite min/maxers. There is no argument with anyone as I can be found stating in the past that I have kept aggro with a Willpower Scrapper before but there is a reason why people lose aggro at times. For some people these times due pugs they play in may happen more often with them than most.

With or without a scrapper with an aura aggro can be most definitely taken. The moment npcs slip out of the aura the tanker is forgotten about. In a group of 17 which you may gather like other tankers can, your aura can hit 10 last pointlessly short, your taunt will say hit 5 and your gauntlet maybe hits 10 with none of those 5 included. Keeping aggro is abit touch and go because you have to rely on mobs remaining in aura, once they're out potentially it could be that they've forgotten about you. Taunt is great but you hit 5 rechg say 5 secs or more then hit another 5 that takes time potentially some team mate does not have. Gauntlets can miss, the duration that you read may not be the duration you will see existing in game.

Willpower is in away lacking some flexibility, the flexibility to move mobs within a fight for the protection of others and to do what its supposed to ensure it does in teams.

I am taunter, I do rely on it but how much reliance on it should willpower have?

If people find it okay because they can play around it great. I was interested in those that don't who shouldn't be shy about saying they don't. I did the tests. The aura is poo.

Edit: Why PuG type team mates should pay for a Willpower's other strengths that much I don't know.

The lack of taunt duration mightn't help with a Willpowers regen at times or help with teams survivability. I doubt the tohit debuff would be offloaded for greater taunt duration in RttC but maybe it don't need to be. An increase from 1.25s to 5s or 13.5s might still render Willpower roughly lacking in equal terms to what other tankers lack because it's not a precise science. I can imagine people inable to tank on their terms at times not feeling like they have much of a tanker when to them tankers are about aggro control.

Is it fair that WP relies on Taunt more than other tankers in order to keep other team mates as safe?

I have said in the past, and I may of come across a little bit anti change with something similar to this myself "WP should have better gauntlet ability with QR being accessible and so not much need for the aura duration". Taunt is something I would recommend to an Icetank, Shield and Invuln tank let alone anything else that would in my opinion need to rely on taunt more. So seeing WPs pick up taunt to help with the tanking versus tohit debuffs especially perhaps is a good thing.

I did the testing. It is alot like when Invulns were looking at the wrong table. Speculating then, in a high speed pug; movement wise; not steamroll "where did they just go?" wise because we could be talking hard mobs; I might be getting a bit irate when trying to make the splash zones small, my way, mobs tight so debuffs affect all....Only to have someone else, one person, undo that attempt and bring the splash to the team who won't appreciate it, have them whatever and then have to be abit scrappy myself in trying to do a recovery but with only taunt actually working. Recoveries aren't fun for everyone, having to make a recovery is a sign of inefficient play as well usually.

I could tell people how to play, which people hate, just so I can do my job, the reason I think I am there or carry on but feel deep down that there is no point me playing a tanker if I can't redirect damage and keep it redirected the right way.

I'm thinking Mag 4 it, all tankers should be Mag 4, no scrapper should make a tanker redundant. Then up the duration enough to atleast if needed move mobs somewhere advantageous from the team, offering them range whatever. If for whatever reason RTTC should not be as high a duration as 13.5 secs to encourage gauntlet then it should atleast allow getting mobs to the nearest vantage point, say 5 or 6 secs.

I can't see a change unless this is something people do have issues with. Off and on I have seen points being brought up.

Do people really feel like their getting their ATs worth with RTTC? Is everyone consistently feeling adequate and does it suit peoples idea of fun.

I don't like losing aggro at all and generally don't because I use taunt alot anyway but for other people it maybe too weak for their playstyle.

Fingers crossed I'll make it, I would of thought it would of been easier to get 3 teams of a mix of Corrupters, Controllers, MMs and Defenders and still do.

In Uzzi's team.

http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=112230

Just scroll down for the TA/A guides.

Never look in just one place.

I've seen a lot of posts recently seemingly negatively remark about RTTC lacking a good taunt aura and others in the team stealing aggro - making the point of the tanker being in the team pretty redundant really. It's currently alot like when Invulns aura had been reading the wrong table. I hated having a weak taunt aura on my Invuln and it, combined with how people like to play, killed my fun dead quite often as I took my aggro control quite seriously.

I wouldn't mind seeing the debuff go on that aura as it's unmissable (unless someone tells me it's irresistable - something I'd be shocked to find out) so take that away to balance any boost in taunt magnitude and duration if possible or better still just make the tohit debuff irresistable, up the taunt magnitude and duration.

So I think it would be a good idea to see if anyone would be against such changes being asked for? If we all feel badly about the lack of a good aura then we can prolly see it changed.

PvP mode does change things but I've found a few probs with Mids. However they come about I don't know but to pick on one thing I had a res set only accepting dam and kb enhancements somewhere. I just change my own and don't update.

As you level better IOs will come so that where you have 3*lvl 30 IOs you might want to swap to 2*lvl40s and change a rechg for an end for as I do understand that the build is looking to keep a constant flow of debuffs without much chance of trying to stack when they won't. You have to be careful not to over use powers unnecessarily as they will cost end, end that you have to spend sensibly.

Where you have say 3 Dam you might when feasible swap a Dam for a Dam/End bringing the end cost of powers down.

For now I think you spent too much slots in FA and Tactics. Leaderships count against end rec if anything. You lose one attack to the end bar if you were to attack dummies in RWZ till your end run out with leaderships but I would of 2 end slotted them. Tactics, nice extra tohit but perhaps with Snapshot having the highest EPS a second end in the attack would help endurance. Endurance slots wherever the end cost is pretty high.

Right now EMP is a power you wouldn't want to use unless you really have to. I pretty much left it as a panic button until I had conserve. Hastened conserve helps even more these days than when I leveled mine up as cast times were longer meaning the end cost of powers were recovered a bit during them. Nowadays you can fire two powers in the time of one almost I actually leveled up staminaless but now I have a staminaless team support heavy build and a soloable/teamable with other supports with Stamina kind of build.

For leveling up I assume you mean solo? Team builds concentrate on making others look good to me as that is what I think defenders do. Other people do more damage, build on it, make sure they keep doing it etc. Whereas a solo build is a build that works in teams and so for yourself with the bare minimum requirement for doing the job. I really wouldn't be without Entangling Arrow for either, especially if you fly, range in attacks some range that knocks ya attacks above the base 80 is also good. EA I would spam 2 or 3 times to get the initial needed effect then know my attack chain times so as to use it again when needed before the target moves because it is high eps, you don't want to over use EA. Range EA too, this and range in attacks is to outrange some of what EBs do etc.

For me it'll be a shame to do you a build or show you mine because looking at what you've done so far I think ya got the noggins to work it out yaself and finish up with something truly personalised.

My tray has all my powers in an order so that I don't over use them in a group. I don't hit things with powers because the powers are available. Some rechg quicker than others but I must be careful not to use them when they won't stack and so I use the rechg of say glue arrow to help me know when to use another power again say.

Most people use the defender guides as its very similar. I did make my first 50 on villains a Sonic/Sonic, built worrying about endurance management as well as the usual stuff. Best thing to do is get an idea of your slotting rather than power picks.