Memphis_Bill

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<Somewhat QR>

The only good villain epic powers were gloom, Soul drain, and Lightning Cages, Arguably the pets (Dom/Corr)


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I'd say you're wrong.

The regular, ranged blast is very useful on my Stalker and Brute (for runners, or - yes - a pull.)
The AOE immobs are very welcome to my Brute.
The shields are useful to the squishies.
My stalker isn't going to argue with the ST Hold, either.
My Dom gets use out of both the ST and Targeted AOE blasts, though perhaps they could do a bit more damage.
My MM's looking forward to the AOE immobs.

*Bad* Villain epics are a shorter list - Stalker snipes (mostly for 8 second animation,) *possibly* Stalker pets (which will cause things to aggro on you even if you're in hide because of how aggro works,) both make the short list. If the Brute pet survives, at least in Coral you can get an immob out of it - though it's not something to count on.

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BTW: I wonder how many people took EMP on blasters considering the 800 second recharge? Or Bonfire? Or Sleep Gernade/Flash Freeze (I considered it as the only useful thing to stack with Frozen Aura)? Or the 360-second recharge Consume for Controllers. I wonder if the the balancing includes this, or is just a massive Focused Accuracy/Power Boost change?

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I took E.M.P. on my Blaster, but only because I couldn't get a power that allows a Blaster to shoot Death Rays out of his eyes. (Regardless, E.M.P. IS a very good power, but I don't have the slots to give to it )

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What we need is sharks with freakin laser beams. Lets replace Focus Accuracy with that!

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This.

/hancocked

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As with other prosauropods, it has been proposed that Massospondylus had cheeks.

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BTW: I wonder how many people took EMP on blasters considering the 800 second recharge? Or Bonfire? Or Sleep Gernade/Flash Freeze (I considered it as the only useful thing to stack with Frozen Aura)? Or the 360-second recharge Consume for Controllers. I wonder if the the balancing includes this, or is just a massive Focused Accuracy/Power Boost change?

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I took bonfire. That blaster hit 50 before the Elec APP existed.

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Nimby! NIMBY!!! NIMmmmmmmBY!!!


Now, what the frick does that mean and why am I yelling it??

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It's Swahili for "Hey! Chesticles!"

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I don't need to wait till beta to know that outright replacement of chosen powers is bad design.

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It makes sense, if you're replacing powers because they're too powerful, grandfathering them in means older characters have a greater advantage than newer characters.

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But i doubt its the good powers that will be replaced. Devs are looking to change the "sucky" ones. So then i see no problem grandfathering players that like their sucky powers? Youd call that an advantage? I call that justice.

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-shrug- For the people whose character concepts are being ruined, they're losing their advantage. I'm just trying to argue reasons for this change. And doing a very poor job of it, it seems.

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"Advantage?" Re-read the above. Someone's "ninja" scrapper (with caltrops, shuriken, exploding shuriken) hardly has an advantage - whereas someone using Focused Accuracy has a huge buff.
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tangent: And you know controller fireball will be removed...

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I highly doubt it, since damage was toned down and they're removing "unpopular" powers.

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Calmly, rationally, reasonably, yes?

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Where's the fun in that?

Rant with us, or the duck gets it! I don't know what "it" is, but it will be gotten by the duck! (Though I have a suspicion it's a pizza.)

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Thing is that the players that are sent in Beta dont seem to be the players that dont care about numbers, efficiency and stuff like that. So devs never get in Beta a real portrait of what players think overall. The elite min/maxer and hardcore testers are lightyears away of many other players when it comes about concept and fun. They are the players who invent speed KHTF and stupid stuff like that...

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Not entirely true. I'm not a numbers guy (I've even said flat out "I don't play a spreadsheet,") and I know of others that have been in closed betas with me that most certainly aren't math majors and powergamers.

Are those in there too? Of cousre. But there *is* good representation, generally, of the "Is it fun?" crowd.

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Before going completely over the edge on this issue, everyone, why don't we just wait for the beta to start so we can see exactly what's being changed, determine the effects of those changes and present validated, justified concerns to Castle. I'm no more excited about losing some of my favorite APP/EPP powers than anyone else, but until I actually know which powers are being removed, and what the replacements are, there's no point getting upset over it.

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I'd argue that, even though we don't know details, the very fact that powers are being replaced wholesale does, indeed, deserve the hue and cry now being raised.

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We don't even know that, actually. What we know is that the developers have discussed it, and are considering it, but until the beta actually starts, it's just talk.

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I'll have to re-listen to Castle's interview when I get home, but it certainly sounded like more than "just talk" to me. "Just talk," to me, is what Castle said about Domination changes some time back ("I'm looking at various things, like maybe this or that, but it's a good ways off if anything changes.") The WOOT comment was - again, to my ears - closer to definitive. IE, "Shields are coming as a new powerset, and APPs will have powers replaced as soon as a user logs in."

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If we log into the beta and find that, yes, they really are yanking powers out of APP/EPPs, we still don't know for certain that those changes will survive the beta. It darn sure wouldn't be the first time that good, solid player feedback, based on testing, real data and calm discussion changed the developers' minds about something. Our developers aren't jerks, they don't make changes simply for the sake of pissing us off, and they've definitely proven that they care about us with all of the positive changes they've made over the years, so why not give them the benefit of doubt?

Positive, constructive feedback will give them the answers they need and help them determine whether or not some or all of the potential replacements need to be left alone. Screaming in their ears... that's not going to get us anywhere.

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The thing is, it's not just "What's getting changed for what?" that has people worried - and honestly, yes, some of my faith in the devs *has* been shaken. (new QFly, comments that Stalkers will never have anything like Quick Recovery even in shared sets.) It seems, frankly, like when some decisions are made, no matter what you bring to the table, they're made, end of story, regardless of the strength of your position. Yes, they do listen in other instances - but this sort of change, of *altering our characters* (not just the strength of powers, but wholesale removal and replacement,) has people justifiably worried. Pre-closed beta, while there's still more time available, is a fully appropriate time to let these very valid concerns be known - even if it just shows the devs that they need to clarify what will be happening.

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Before going completely over the edge on this issue, everyone, why don't we just wait for the beta to start so we can see exactly what's being changed, determine the effects of those changes and present validated, justified concerns to Castle. I'm no more excited about losing some of my favorite APP/EPP powers than anyone else, but until I actually know which powers are being removed, and what the replacements are, there's no point getting upset over it.

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I'd argue that, even though we don't know details, the very fact that powers are being replaced wholesale does, indeed, deserve the hue and cry now being raised.

No, we don't know the details on what's happening to what - but there are a lot of concerns (for instance, a Stalker may have no use for their pet... but what if they'd spent several tens of million on the Soulbound Alliegance set for the Regen, Recov, and damage bonuses? What if they LIKE the pet? What if it's tied into their concept - say, a symbol of usurping Scirocco's power or some such, and it's being replaced with, oh, an AOE sleep for example?)

The biggest "WTF" about this, though, is that players will have powers automatically replaced. They are not given a choice. And we, on the forums, are only - what, 5%? 10%? of the playerbase.

While not on the same scale (as this is 'just' some epics,) NCNC should look over at SWG's recent history after a certain change...

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LOL- where are my facts wrong? Serioulsy- people asking for powers they don't have access too- yeah- big shocker there- I KNOW people want powers they don't have access to, mainly, PATRONS v. EPICS. I never said people didn't. Here are your facts.

A). Patrons SUCK compared to hero epics- it's FACT.

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You need to put qualifiers in there. My Fire/ tank, for instance, would LOVE an AOE immob like my Brute has access to. I'd have actually kept Burn.

Patron pets? Some (Aggro-generating despite hide Stalker pets) suck. Some (with heals - corruptor pets, IIRC) are somewhat useful.

In general, they do the same thing - fill holes. The problem is that Some PPPs are underpowered or have powers that really need work (8 second snipe? C'mon, really?) and Some hero Epics are overpowered. (Focused Acc, FoN - but can you really tell me my Earth controller's Earth epic, with some armor, Hurl, a HP boost and Fissure, is overpowered? How about a Blaster's /Fire APP?

Main point I'm trying to make is that just saying "Redside's PPPs suck, blueside's APPs are overpowered" is a grossly inaccurate blanket statement. True in some specific cases, not true in many - and one of the disparities (the inability to respec PPPs) is going away.


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B). Villians want the hero Epics. And Vice versa- It's FACT.


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I'd say they want the same *concept,* just to be nitpicky - since that's what I do. And yeah, some want the actual powers (usually the overpowered, expect-a-nerf ones, like FA.)

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C). NO ONE wants powers taken away to be given powers they did not want. Serioulsy. Hundreds of complaints about Patrons v. Epics- no one said that they wanted powers actually taken away from them after the fact they choose them- they just want to be given more to choose from. Again, It's FACT.

D). From the info posted it seems like we are going to lose un-popular powers that players choose and be given powers that they could have choosen but did not. This flies in the face of past Dev explinations of datamining and "tweaking" (NERFING) popular powers. (ET, EMel). Now, they'll give the players the popular powers (FA) even if they could have taken them in the first place but didn't. I'm hoping to be wrong on this one but I have no faith in the Dev team and their actions of the last year. This all seems like it's going to be done to the characters even if the player do not want it to be done to their characters.

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Kind of turned the same thing into two points... but I think the gist is *worth* the repetition. Having powers you chose taken away for a power you *didn't* choose, with no input (outside of beta, if you're in early enough) is going to have ten sorts of hell raised about it.

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E). Why the hell are they even looking at the hero epics for power-swapping or whatever the devs are gonna call this massive cluster [censored] to begin with? Why is weapon mastery getting FA? Serioulsy WHY? What is it going to lose to get it? And all this is ignoring the fact that if the scrapper wanted to get FA all they had to do is pick the body mastery pool!! Is the weapon mastery going to lose anything to get FA?

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Weapon mastery will. What it will lose, we don't know. We've been told flat out it's a replacement.
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And why the do you keep bringing up Power Boost? If I don't CARE about Power Boost in PvE I'm sure as hell not going to give one [censored] about in PvP or the MINORITY opinion of the crybaby PvP'ers.

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Whether you like it or not, PVP is part of the game. And yes, the opinions of the people who are involved are JUST as valid for the part of the game they're involved in as those who badge, or play just for the market, or run nothing but task forces.
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Hopefully today there will some more expalining and this will all be a mis-understanding and they are actually going to give some Epic Pools a 5th power option. Hopefully in the end the villians get Epics. I know they are not going to be given over to villains in their entirety, which alone is cause for concern.

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No 5th power. Replacement is how it sounds now.

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Man I hope you guys are prepared for the coming storm of people complaining about the outright removal of powers.

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Seconding this. Very strongly.

Let's fix a few things here.

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Plus on top of all this is the fact that no one wanted or asked for powers to be swapped around to begin with

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Somewhat true. The big issue here is that powers, according to castle, will be swapped when you log in, whether you'd have chosen them or not. Stalker snipe in your concept? Well, very few people use it. It's now Caltrops of Mu. Enjoy!

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SOME- Villians want patronless Epics as a choice besides patrons.

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... since not everyone's character would tie their destiny to one of the four Patrons, or Project DESTINY.

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It's just that freaking simple.

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Less so than you make out, but...

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Some heroes want Patrons (LMAO).

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"LMAO" if you want. It's an arc and a concept that fits some hero concepts JUST as much as NOT having one fits ssome villain concepts. It's a choice that's not available (respectively) either side right now. Just because YOU don't get that doesn't make it "LMAO." Having similar choices (Patron and patronless) would make everyone happy.

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Not this mish-mash of crap with swapping a power out that the player picked to be given a power they did not choose in the first place. If I wanted FA on my scrapper I have that option- I do not because I did not want it. Now, it looks like the devs will be makiing the decision for us. What line of thinking propeled this decision? Serioulsy.

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And that to me, even more than powers getting replaced to begin with, is what really bugs me. I really, REALLY expect Stalker PPPs to be changed drastically. How many take (and use) the snipe, with its eight second animation? How many take the "OK, you guys can ignore my hide now because you saw him way over there" pet? How many Brutes take (and keep) the pet?

Yet I want the people who DID choose them and want/like them, or whatever else is being changed, to have the choice to keep them.

OK, this one's been (partially) in my head for a while, and for the life of me I can't find it.

Player wanting new powers. Goes to the various stores (and gets offered "magic herbs" from the magic store,) finally ends up showing off his new Kronos titan to Simon and Garfunkel's "Kodachrome."

Who did this and what was it called?

Camalot - with apologies to Monty Python, Tram a lot. Video on the PTA.

(And on first read, seeing "Cimerora," I immediately thought "Syllables-wise, that'd be a fit for Anatevka from Fiddler on the Roof.")

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[u]Topic: PvE Power Changes.[u]


[u]Patron Pools and APP[u]

1. They all got looked at by Posi, Castle, and minion. Datamined which ones were taken and which were ignored. Buffs, nerfs, and power replacements!

2. If powers are replaced, when you log in, you'll have the new power. No grandfathering.

3. About 20% of the A/EPPs were replaced.

4. As one example of the Epic/Patron changes, Castle mentions that Weapon Mastery for Scrappers will now include Focused Accuracy. If his memory is correct.



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Hmmm. No 'grandfathering'? I remember hearing that term, but I'll need a quick refresher course.

I wonder if this'll mean that if we don't like the replacements, we'll have to 'respec' them. Would be nice if this means we'll get a free 'spec with this update.

[/ QUOTE ]This means they are getting rid of caltrops and possibly conserver power just so they can sanitize ninjutsu and energy aura before being ported to scrappers.

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I see people being *pissed* in some instances. Looks like I'm going to be making sure to copy all my 50s as they sit *now* over to look at this specifically. (Well, except the Khelds - no APPs, obviously.)

I don't see things like Char (Pyre/Fire epic for blasters or tanks) going away, but I wonder what *is.* Stalker Snipes, I think I'd put money down on (though what if you have the set in it?)

Hope they're ready for some screaming.

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Respecing PPPs is well and good, but APPs are still light years ahead of them in power, and in completing/complimenting character concepts.

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I'll agree with the second (concepts,) the first... it depends. There are some powers in the APP that are frankly overpowered, and the devs know about them. Honestly, when's the last time you heard anyone complaining about a Controller having Hurl, or a Blaster having Rise of the Phoenix? It's alwys Focused Accuracy or PFF, and Castle knows this full well. (And most of those complaints come from PVP.)

As far as the PPPs? Having them respeccable is a good start, but other things need to be looked at. I don't know of any Brute that will complain about having AOE immobilizes or a ranged attack to pick off that runer. A Stalker with a hold and a quick ranged attack? Sign me up. Sheilds for squishies? Yes, please - and that, at least, is common between the two as far as filling in gaps.

Other things, though, need to be looked at, such as the pets (some are useful, some not - especially for stalkers, and are they worth a power pick or should they be an inherent "gimme?" I'm for the second, honestly, though it means no pet set slotting.) Stalkers get an eight second snipe - which even in PVE is ridiculously long. Bring it down to be equal with other snipes.

So, "More powerful" can be taken a few different ways. Making some of the powers more *useful* would, in a way, make them "more powerful."

I do agree, FWIW, that Redside should get Patron-less APPs, for those who want to round out a character without tying thnem to Arachnos (or for whom, say, Eleental powers fit better, or more weapons, or whatnot.) And I'd like to see something similar to PPPs introduced heroside, for those who'd really *like* to have States, Synapse, Posi or Psyche as a mentor.

Not particularly. Though I tend to like histories and backstory.

Can I just say....



WOOHOO!

>.>

This is certainly overdue - the purges and other forum "stuff" has led to suggestions like this for some time now. Glad to see it finally happening.

... so, freed up names... I'm assuming redname posts are still sacred (so we won't search on some of the departed devs and come up empty,) correct?

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Very nice. Working on a fanfic for my PB, and this helps. I have questions to which answers may not yet exist, but am too tired to remember them. Do have the question of whether an I11-related update is in the works. After all, Kheldian related beings do play a signifigant part in some of the new content.

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Not yet.

Mostly because trying to figure out where time travel and such is going to affect this makes my head hurt. Of course, given we don't have an "alternate now," it's somewhat safe (temporarily) to say it didn't have a huge effect... but we'll see. I'd say I15 is probably going to be where I'd actually have to give it some consideration. (That and fitting Twilight Son in... somewhere. "Traitor or not" to begin with.)

Crimcon Seas, cursed (and ill tempered, undead-ish) terror of the Isles.

Had that character a few years now. One of these days I'll actually play on that server a bit more...

(Slightly less pure-piratey, but I can't forget Piracat.)

The latest news on Issue 13 is that they have no new news on Issue 13.

Take your time, Posi. (So when's beta?) If the mission creator's going to live up to what we know so far... yeah, keep hammering away at it.

At least I got the name right when asking for the commission...

Irresistible Force by John Becaro, my Earth/FF/Earth 'troller.

/em thumbsup

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I was just wondering what was the rudest tell any of you have gotten and if this is common on other servers. I was on champion.

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That'd be the guy that saw my "I don't bridge" search comment and said, "lol I didnt know anyone was stupid enough to pass up free xp."

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I've gotten that one too. Odd.

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If you happen to have roughly forty million influence on the toon at the time and want to start working with sets early, then I wont say you can’t do something like that. I’m looking at the average player who, if they’re lucky only is working with anywhere from 500k to 2mill in funds; [u]20mill if they managed to find and sell a wings recipe[u], at that point they have a little more freedom to splurge on stuff at 30-35.

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I loled

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Look at the post date. Accurate for then.