KidQwik

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If I concede for a moment that this power is theoretically unbalanced for PvP, can someone explain to me why that warrants a nerf that affects PvE?

I'm not trying to be snarky (at least not overly so), but PvP isn't the major thrust or the major draw for this game anyway. The majority of players are still primarily PvE players. The majority of Stormies are still primarily PvE players. And for a lot of people who picked the Storm set, at least from the Defender side, positioning-especially with Hurricane- was THE reason to take the set.

So their fun gets nerfed in the name of PvP balance? One of the primary reasons people reacted so strongly when PvP first entered the game was fear of PvE nerfs for PvP balance. And here we are, and it's not just a nerf of a power-it's a nerf of the reason people took the set.

I honestly think that the game over all is more healthy letting the PvP side game go somewhat unbalanced, rather than hurting the primary PvE game in an attempt to balance PvP. Just my opinion.

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I agree that there needs to be changes to the PvP version of a power, but not ALWAYS necessarily to the PvE version of a power. What would help the devs cause in making these changes would to be a little HONEST about why they are being made. We're talking powers that have been around for 2 years and NOW they're like they're too overpowered for PvE???? It's because of PvP and I've grown bored and tired of outright lies. Maybe if the devs thought about ways to make things more challenging then giving into people complaining mobs are too hard, nerfing them and then making powers overpowered because of nerfs to mobs, then the wouldn't have to nerf our powers too much. That said though, in PvP, Hurricane is/was overpowered..

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Actually Kid, I kind of agree with you on some of this (I know you're amazed). Look, I knew a hurricane nerf had to be coming at some point, I've been around MMO's too long not to see it. Its not that I felt it was needed but I saw it coming. I feel this may be a bit too strong,l but then again nerfs tend to be (like some of your multitude of regen nerfs).

My problem is dealing with storm defenders, where many people have problems with storm controllers (I have both so I feel I can speak knowingly about them). The Devs really made some problems for themselves with the storm set. Its not a heal set like empathy, and its not a strict debuff set like dark or rad. Its not simply defense through bubbles like FF. Storm is in many ways the jack of all trades master of none set. And a lot of the way it defends is through positioning and controlling the battlefield. Hence why storm controllers tend to be more effective the defenders. This is the fatal flaw of the set and one that players have long recognized.

I've already said I don't really PvP. I've tried it but its never been my thing. I just don't have the time to really get good and in with the good teams to be able to truly compete. But really the storm defender has a massive amount of tools at his disposal when facing an enemy. But Hurricane is the most noticeable. Storm was designed to keep squishies safe from melee. Its why tanks and scrappers have had issues with us since day one and blasters have learned to love us.

So now that this defense is being taken away, what is the role of a stormer? We have slows (snow storm), assuming you stay in range. We have freezing rain to debuff, but once again you have to stand in the effect, which PvE has never done let alone PvP. We have thunder clap and lightning storm to detoggle you. Thunder clap was never used much as its range was less then hurricane, expect to see it more often now (although with detoggle changes who knows). We have gale for positioning, but t has horrible base accuracy. We have O2 which has a reasonable distance heal and can help resist status effects and end drain, but its not enough to keep someone dieing alive (especially for the end cost). We can offer some resists and stealth, but in the age of perception steamy mist doesn't do much for anyone. And finally we have tornado. A wild uncontrollable power that can be very nice, but if the stormer doesn't know how to use it its likely to get them killed instead. So where's this leave us? We had one thing we were really good at, and hence that's what you saw us do. Now we can do a lot, but none of it as well as another defender set.

Wow, this post rambled much more then I intended, my apologies. I guess I'm just voicing some frustrations. As I've said, based on testing my stormers will be fine. I'll adapt and keep moving. I've made stormers since before the game was released. I've been kicked from teams for being a stormer before ever getting to a mission to show what I can do. If that age come back I'm fine with it. I'll be sad because a lot of people will miss out on a great set, but I'll keep rolling along.

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I've had some ideas about what to do with Hurricane, none of which would be acceptable to anyone who has the set. My first was make it a clickie with an end time and a recharge time similiar to other defense nerfs that put in effect. Yes, they suck(I have IH on my scrapper and it sucks.. I have a ton of powers that are now click to heal clicks... Repetitive much?? ) Instead of making it a click it could have also have been an extreme Endurance sapper which would mean you could turn it on, use it for a bit, but without a team that could buff your stamina you'd be drained pretty quick(I'm using this one because I keep being told by Stormies to get a team with this that and then other and then you could take out a Hurricane).

My most novel idea would be to make Hurricane into a power that you turn on, and makes you have very limited control of movement. Just like the hurricane pushes mobs mobs and PvP players away, have it sort of carry the Stormie away in a non controllable direction. This would mean that the Stormie would either have to turn it off to get his/her bearings again and allow the impenetrable Hurricane to most melee people to have a chance without a team(and then Stormies wouldn't need a team either to buff them because a massive drain endurance nerf, fair? ). This would also mean that anyone on a team with the Stormy using Hurricane would have to follow the Stormy and their uncontrollable Hurricane to stay behind the one power that is holding so many opponents at bay in the zone. This make it more fair for everyone to have a shot at the Stormy(because they'd have to turn it off to gain composure and not drift into a giant mob of NPCs mobs) and the others on the team would have to actually do more then hide behind someone with hurricane. They'd actually have to move and follow the Stormy which would allow for some of the stragglers to get picked off. I actually like this way the most because it would be fun to watch a Stormy on top of a building have to make the decision to turn off Hurricane to avoid falling off the buildings(meaning your whole team would have to either jump off with you to stay behind it or stay and fight) or turn it off and use other powers. I think this is the kind of "balance vision" the devs need to use with many powers instead of just black and white nerfs that make powers more or less click on and off. They need to make using the powers have more dynamic consequences along with possible positive results. People complain about Stalkers Hide. It's a power that is on, but as soon as it drops the Stalker has a giant bullseye on them and then can be torn apart. That's the way to make thing more interesting and fair for all the ATs in my opinion. Have an actual consequence for using powers in addition to the gains that can be made. I'm all for Uncontrollable Hurricane movement as a fair nerf. Then they can keep the power just the way it is strength wise.

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oh, we're talking ONLY IN SIREN'S CALL here...

so...no epics.

so...no storms with mez protection.

well then...

did you try using focused chi before launching your stun grenade?

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Once again.. MA/Regen Scrapper, Siren's Call. Siren's Call is heroes vs villains. Scrapper is a hero. Can't fight other heroes. My Stalker doesn't have Focus Chi. My Stalker has wasted tons of Inf on useless stun and web grenades. Hurricane alters the battlefield way too much. You shouldn't need a whole team to take out one power. No one power should be able to run continuously and make them almost untouchable(and I really do mean untouchable as in can't get near them to be able to hit them) because a toon doesn't have ranged attacks or super speed, etc. Even with tanks and scrappers there toggles can be more easily dropped by using Brawl. With hurricane, you can't get close enough to use Brawl.

I haven't gone on test to see how the effective the changes are but just because some people are complaining about them, doesn't mean they are good enough. When Tsoo Sorcerers use Hurricane you at LEAST have a chance to get close to them and hit them. Not with toons in PvP.

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please edit your quotes. Theres no need to quote several posts woth, just the last bit.

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We're trying to make the screen explode or make something than looks like an Easter egg.... ;-)

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In PvP, almost every other AT uses a lot their powers. Stormies? Most just click on Hurricane and use that and that alone. That right there says it's been overpowered. Instant Healing was overpowered for PvP.

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Can't remember when I've ever killed someone with hurricane. Granted I really never PvP, but last I checked it caused 0 damage, I actually have to use a few other powers if I hope to actually defeat someone. Thats like saying tanks rely on their shields in PvP. Of course they do! But they have to attack to kill stuff. Same with stormies.

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Instant Healing never killed anyone either directly. It helped keep me alive and make me unstoppable. Sort of the purpose Hurricane has. I have to attack to kill things. I don't have range so I have to run up and get in everyone's face. I have to use more then one power to take someone down which includes my actual attacks, Int, and Focus Chi. Hell, I even have to chase after everyone because I can't snipe them being melee.

Most stormies I see in PvP just use Hurricane... They proceed to be the bowling ball against a whole bunch of opponents that surround them but that's all they do is use one power. Thank God we have a blaster amongst us. Otherwise the 7 others on the team would have a problem even touching the Stormie because they're melee. See the problem? Everyone should be able to have a chance at each other in PvP. I know blasters who can take me down because I can't touch them because they're far away. If I get close, watch out. But I have to be able to get close and it's something that doesn't always happen. Why we have travel powers. Run away, chase, etc. But to sit there and watch someone with Hurricane use one power, not even their travel power is really being used, it says there's a problem.

Either give stormies more dmg to some powers or something. I had hoped for a Hurricane nerf for some time because in PvP it's overpowered for various reasons. People should have a chance to be able to get through and hit a stormie besides having to use MoG or try to jump on his/her head. No one should have to switch their travel power to SS just to be able to take on Hurricane. PvP will never be balanced unless all our ATs ended up doing the same things and having the same powers.

Do I think that PvE and PvP should allow for powers to work differently whether you're in PvE or PvP, YES. I'm tired of the nerfs I see with the devs trying to say "it's not because of PvP". Please. Spare me the making themselves look even worse lying excuses.. Some powers are overpowered. Sometimes when you nerf one, you make another overpowered. The whole thing is a mess to sort out that's ongoing. Does anyone like being nerfed with a toon they love, no. I feel your pain. In this situation I feel it WAS necessary though. Will I have people name call me and stuff, sure. Whatever. I did it when they rolled into the Scrapper forumn and were laughing at all our nerfs and said it needed to be done. Nerfs happen. And unfortunately, the powers that be can't seem to figure out how to do them without messing with all our favorities powers.

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once again, you're mistaken.

any stormer that ran into battle with only hurricane running wouldn't be very effective at all.

he'd be dead.

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How about against a team of 6 MA scrappers with Super Jump? The stormie would rule. Against 6.. With one power. Of course he wouldn't be attacking them with dmg really, but then what's the point of being in PvP? To serve as a dmgless bowling ball or try to up your rep or get bounty? Many choose the first.

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no, here's what would happen...

one of the scrappers would guy a stun grenade.

and it'd be all over.

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I have yet to buy a stun or web grenade that has worked. Spending 10K on them has always been a waste.

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ok, if you won't buy temp powers...how 'bout your epic set?

can one of your 6 ma/regens in this imaginary fight with a stormer have a ranged attack or mez?

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You can't use any of your epic powers in Siren's Call or Warburg. Too high. Also, I'm mostly in Siren's Call as my villain. I can't battle my MA/Regen against a stormie because we're both supposed to be good in SC.

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i do recall a red-name post in the "issues and concerns with storm summoning" thread (of long ago) informing the community that we shouldn't worry about how our set is performing...storm does very well in pvp (this was during pvp beta).

maybe it's time to ressurect that thread...

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I just went through my PMs read an exchange with Cuppa I had complaining about Hurricane and changing it. I had talked about turning it into a click or doing something to it and Cuppa said she didn't see any changes like that coming to it. Statesman must be having his period and all the toradoes happening around the country made him take his wrath out on stormies.

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kid, may i ask what you and your team did to try to overcome the unbalancing effects of hurricane in pvp before you complained to cuppa about it?

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The bazillion recommendations that were asking a bit too much:
1) Respec to SS (just to be able to run in try to hit and get propelled back to get a very slim chance to hit stormies). Not..
2) Buy web and stun grenades. (did, wasted Inf, missed every time, no refund was given)
3) Get a blaster on your team (making a team of 8 with one player that can touch the stormie from afar when the other 7 can't touch them fully demonstrates the problem) to attack one stormie
4) Can't use MoG is Siren's Call silly!

No one should have to do 10 things to have to deal with one power that runs continuously and isn't a click. For all those powers that were on all the time and running all the time that helped people stay alive like Phase Shift, Quantum Flight, Instant Healing, and MoG, they were all made clicks from toggles. You can either have Hurricane made a click or have it nerfed in others way. Trust me. You'd be even less happy with a click with a long recharge time.

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In PvP, almost every other AT uses a lot their powers. Stormies? Most just click on Hurricane and use that and that alone. That right there says it's been overpowered. Instant Healing was overpowered for PvP.

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Can't remember when I've ever killed someone with hurricane. Granted I really never PvP, but last I checked it caused 0 damage, I actually have to use a few other powers if I hope to actually defeat someone. Thats like saying tanks rely on their shields in PvP. Of course they do! But they have to attack to kill stuff. Same with stormies.

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Instant Healing never killed anyone either directly. It helped keep me alive and make me unstoppable. Sort of the purpose Hurricane has. I have to attack to kill things. I don't have range so I have to run up and get in everyone's face. I have to use more then one power to take someone down which includes my actual attacks, Int, and Focus Chi. Hell, I even have to chase after everyone because I can't snipe them being melee.

Most stormies I see in PvP just use Hurricane... They proceed to be the bowling ball against a whole bunch of opponents that surround them but that's all they do is use one power. Thank God we have a blaster amongst us. Otherwise the 7 others on the team would have a problem even touching the Stormie because they're melee. See the problem? Everyone should be able to have a chance at each other in PvP. I know blasters who can take me down because I can't touch them because they're far away. If I get close, watch out. But I have to be able to get close and it's something that doesn't always happen. Why we have travel powers. Run away, chase, etc. But to sit there and watch someone with Hurricane use one power, not even their travel power is really being used, it says there's a problem.

Either give stormies more dmg to some powers or something. I had hoped for a Hurricane nerf for some time because in PvP it's overpowered for various reasons. People should have a chance to be able to get through and hit a stormie besides having to use MoG or try to jump on his/her head. No one should have to switch their travel power to SS just to be able to take on Hurricane. PvP will never be balanced unless all our ATs ended up doing the same things and having the same powers.

Do I think that PvE and PvP should allow for powers to work differently whether you're in PvE or PvP, YES. I'm tired of the nerfs I see with the devs trying to say "it's not because of PvP". Please. Spare me the making themselves look even worse lying excuses.. Some powers are overpowered. Sometimes when you nerf one, you make another overpowered. The whole thing is a mess to sort out that's ongoing. Does anyone like being nerfed with a toon they love, no. I feel your pain. In this situation I feel it WAS necessary though. Will I have people name call me and stuff, sure. Whatever. I did it when they rolled into the Scrapper forumn and were laughing at all our nerfs and said it needed to be done. Nerfs happen. And unfortunately, the powers that be can't seem to figure out how to do them without messing with all our favorities powers.

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once again, you're mistaken.

any stormer that ran into battle with only hurricane running wouldn't be very effective at all.

he'd be dead.

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How about against a team of 6 MA scrappers with Super Jump? The stormie would rule. Against 6.. With one power. Of course he wouldn't be attacking them with dmg really, but then what's the point of being in PvP? To serve as a dmgless bowling ball or try to up your rep or get bounty? Many choose the first.

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no, here's what would happen...

one of the scrappers would guy a stun grenade.

and it'd be all over.

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I have yet to buy a stun or web grenade that has worked. Spending 10K on them has always been a waste.

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i do recall a red-name post in the "issues and concerns with storm summoning" thread (of long ago) informing the community that we shouldn't worry about how our set is performing...storm does very well in pvp (this was during pvp beta).

maybe it's time to ressurect that thread...

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I just went through my PMs read an exchange with Cuppa I had complaining about Hurricane and changing it. I had talked about turning it into a click or doing something to it and Cuppa said she didn't see any changes like that coming to it. Statesman must be having his period and all the toradoes happening around the country made him take his wrath out on stormies.

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How about against a team of 6 MA scrappers with Super Jump? The stormie would rule. Against 6.. With one power. Of course he wouldn't be attacking them with dmg really, but then what's the point of being in PvP? To serve as a dmgless bowling ball or try to up your rep or get bounty? Many choose the first.

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I've wondered this very thing since it came out.

I do recognize that my dilemma is not universal. Nor should PvP be so.

Edit: Supervillain
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I wasn't trying to misslead you with anything I've said, but give you what I thought, and why I thought it. I am sorry that it came out that way, it certainly wasn't my intention.

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I was referring to the patch notes in regards to misleading, not yourself. No worries.

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The devs "reasonings" are usually a buncha crap in my opinion. I saw they mentioned something about "stamina" in regards to nerfing Hurricane. They also said that by turning Instant Healing into a click it would help with a Regen's endurance issues... They HAD to be kidding. Regen can not only get Stamina, but Quick Recovery!!! I NEVER had an endurance problem! So... The devs have never really do a good, honest, non-foot-in the mouth, explanation about nerfs. It's like when people try to sell you a bridge or talk about WMDs. :-b

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In PvP, almost every other AT uses a lot their powers. Stormies? Most just click on Hurricane and use that and that alone. That right there says it's been overpowered. Instant Healing was overpowered for PvP.

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Can't remember when I've ever killed someone with hurricane. Granted I really never PvP, but last I checked it caused 0 damage, I actually have to use a few other powers if I hope to actually defeat someone. Thats like saying tanks rely on their shields in PvP. Of course they do! But they have to attack to kill stuff. Same with stormies.

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Instant Healing never killed anyone either directly. It helped keep me alive and make me unstoppable. Sort of the purpose Hurricane has. I have to attack to kill things. I don't have range so I have to run up and get in everyone's face. I have to use more then one power to take someone down which includes my actual attacks, Int, and Focus Chi. Hell, I even have to chase after everyone because I can't snipe them being melee.

Most stormies I see in PvP just use Hurricane... They proceed to be the bowling ball against a whole bunch of opponents that surround them but that's all they do is use one power. Thank God we have a blaster amongst us. Otherwise the 7 others on the team would have a problem even touching the Stormie because they're melee. See the problem? Everyone should be able to have a chance at each other in PvP. I know blasters who can take me down because I can't touch them because they're far away. If I get close, watch out. But I have to be able to get close and it's something that doesn't always happen. Why we have travel powers. Run away, chase, etc. But to sit there and watch someone with Hurricane use one power, not even their travel power is really being used, it says there's a problem.

Either give stormies more dmg to some powers or something. I had hoped for a Hurricane nerf for some time because in PvP it's overpowered for various reasons. People should have a chance to be able to get through and hit a stormie besides having to use MoG or try to jump on his/her head. No one should have to switch their travel power to SS just to be able to take on Hurricane. PvP will never be balanced unless all our ATs ended up doing the same things and having the same powers.

Do I think that PvE and PvP should allow for powers to work differently whether you're in PvE or PvP, YES. I'm tired of the nerfs I see with the devs trying to say "it's not because of PvP". Please. Spare me the making themselves look even worse lying excuses.. Some powers are overpowered. Sometimes when you nerf one, you make another overpowered. The whole thing is a mess to sort out that's ongoing. Does anyone like being nerfed with a toon they love, no. I feel your pain. In this situation I feel it WAS necessary though. Will I have people name call me and stuff, sure. Whatever. I did it when they rolled into the Scrapper forumn and were laughing at all our nerfs and said it needed to be done. Nerfs happen. And unfortunately, the powers that be can't seem to figure out how to do them without messing with all our favorities powers.

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once again, you're mistaken.

any stormer that ran into battle with only hurricane running wouldn't be very effective at all.

he'd be dead.

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How about against a team of 6 MA scrappers with Super Jump? The stormie would rule. Against 6.. With one power. Of course he wouldn't be attacking them with dmg really, but then what's the point of being in PvP? To serve as a dmgless bowling ball or try to up your rep or get bounty? Many choose the first.

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Stormies are complaing "A blaster can get me!" Yeah, well melee isn't range and having to take this or that power soley for trying to counter hurricane isn't balanced. Each AT has many powers to choose from. In PvP, almost every other AT uses a lot their powers. Stormies? Most just click on Hurricane and use that and that alone. That right there says it's been overpowered. Instant Healing was overpowered for PvP. Just as Hurricane is now. They do different things, yes, but they were/are overpowered for PvP. Now maybe stormies can pay attention to using their other powers.

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quoted for sheer ignorance.

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It'll be ok. Nerfs suck, yes. Sometimes though they're necessary to make the playing field a little more fair. I should know the suckage pretty well with my Regen. It's ok if u want to cry. I know I did too when I had MORE THAN ONE of my bread and butter powers nerfed issue after issue.

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yeah, maybe i'll cry to the devs.

see if i can get 'em to nerf the regen set.

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Where have you been? They've have nerfed regen so many times over and over from like Issue 3-5. The next nerf they could possibly do would turn yet another one of my powers into a click. Then I could respec and have the entire "Click To Heal Collection!" with Instant Healing, Reconstruction, Dull Pain, and then finally Integration. I think anyone on the forums knows how the axe has fallen on Regen. We're talking one of your powers. I'm talking 3 of my powers that were completely altered by turning into a click, an 8 minute recharge with 3 minute up time, adding heals to a non heal power, etc. I'm already an Selfempathy healer with all the click heals.

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In PvP, almost every other AT uses a lot their powers. Stormies? Most just click on Hurricane and use that and that alone. That right there says it's been overpowered. Instant Healing was overpowered for PvP.

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Can't remember when I've ever killed someone with hurricane. Granted I really never PvP, but last I checked it caused 0 damage, I actually have to use a few other powers if I hope to actually defeat someone. Thats like saying tanks rely on their shields in PvP. Of course they do! But they have to attack to kill stuff. Same with stormies.

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Instant Healing never killed anyone either directly. It helped keep me alive and make me unstoppable. Sort of the purpose Hurricane has. I have to attack to kill things. I don't have range so I have to run up and get in everyone's face. I have to use more then one power to take someone down which includes my actual attacks, Int, and Focus Chi. Hell, I even have to chase after everyone because I can't snipe them being melee.

Most stormies I see in PvP just use Hurricane... They proceed to be the bowling ball against a whole bunch of opponents that surround them but that's all they do is use one power. Thank God we have a blaster amongst us. Otherwise the 7 others on the team would have a problem even touching the Stormie because they're melee. See the problem? Everyone should be able to have a chance at each other in PvP. I know blasters who can take me down because I can't touch them because they're far away. If I get close, watch out. But I have to be able to get close and it's something that doesn't always happen. Why we have travel powers. Run away, chase, etc. But to sit there and watch someone with Hurricane use one power, not even their travel power is really being used, it says there's a problem.

Either give stormies more dmg to some powers or something. I had hoped for a Hurricane nerf for some time because in PvP it's overpowered for various reasons. People should have a chance to be able to get through and hit a stormie besides having to use MoG or try to jump on his/her head. No one should have to switch their travel power to SS just to be able to take on Hurricane. PvP will never be balanced unless all our ATs ended up doing the same things and having the same powers.

Do I think that PvE and PvP should allow for powers to work differently whether you're in PvE or PvP, YES. I'm tired of the nerfs I see with the devs trying to say "it's not because of PvP". Please. Spare me the making themselves look even worse lying excuses.. Some powers are overpowered. Sometimes when you nerf one, you make another overpowered. The whole thing is a mess to sort out that's ongoing. Does anyone like being nerfed with a toon they love, no. I feel your pain. In this situation I feel it WAS necessary though. Will I have people name call me and stuff, sure. Whatever. I did it when they rolled into the Scrapper forumn and were laughing at all our nerfs and said it needed to be done. Nerfs happen. And unfortunately, the powers that be can't seem to figure out how to do them without messing with all our favorities powers.

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Stormies are complaing "A blaster can get me!" Yeah, well melee isn't range and having to take this or that power soley for trying to counter hurricane isn't balanced. Each AT has many powers to choose from. In PvP, almost every other AT uses a lot their powers. Stormies? Most just click on Hurricane and use that and that alone. That right there says it's been overpowered. Instant Healing was overpowered for PvP. Just as Hurricane is now. They do different things, yes, but they were/are overpowered for PvP. Now maybe stormies can pay attention to using their other powers.

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quoted for sheer ignorance.

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It'll be ok. Nerfs suck, yes. Sometimes though they're necessary to make the playing field a little more fair. I should know the suckage pretty well with my Regen. It's ok if u want to cry. I know I did too when I had MORE THAN ONE of my bread and butter powers nerfed issue after issue.

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Hurricane was the new Instand Healing. A power that made you untouchable

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Thats hilarious. As someone who has used ih when it was a toggle and hurricane before yesterday...its not even close. Blasters can three-hit me. Em stalkers stun me, then AS me. Scrappers or tanks with fa hit through it plenty. Scrappers with ih also have mez protection, something with most stormies dont have (iw is around 60% of the time for those with it, so its not close to perma either), so a simple hold drops hurricane easy. Ih scrappers are infintely harder to kill.

Save the ridiculous claims.

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Every AT has a role and what the Devs have tried to do is homogenize those roles so that everyone has some way to beat each other in PvP. In PvP, every AT is supposed to have SOME sort of chance to defeat every other AT. That's why there were so many nerfs on Scrappers. I've always complained about nerfs that were done for PvP that effected the PvE game. "Balance Vision" has a long way to be balanced.

Stormies are complaing "A blaster can get me!" Yeah, well melee isn't range and having to take this or that power soley for trying to counter hurricane isn't balanced. Each AT has many powers to choose from. In PvP, almost every other AT uses a lot their powers. Stormies? Most just click on Hurricane and use that and that alone. That right there says it's been overpowered. Instant Healing was overpowered for PvP. Just as Hurricane is now. They do different things, yes, but they were/are overpowered for PvP. Now maybe stormies can pay attention to using their other powers.

I'm so happy about this nerf. Now melee has a chance to hit stormers. Hurricane was the new Instand Healing. A power that made you untouchable. Hopefully this nerfs works well, otherwise I hope they chop it some more. If anything it should have been made into a click like Instant Healing.

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Giving stalkers a snipe when they already have AS is just insane. So now the great keep moving strategy doesn't mean squat since you can get sniped. Way to go there.

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Can't wait! :-)

You could add more a chance to detoggle for Hurricane. Especially with the ineffective web and stun grenades and the EMP glove. Melee's can barely touch hurricane people and the jump and try to punch them to knock the toggle off is sort of ridiculous. Make Hurricane a click like you've done to Instant Healing, Phase Shift, and Quantum flight. I mean having someone just stand around with hurricane the whole time and do only that and not be touchable is a bit overpowered. Especially when you have like 10 people around them tryin got touch them and can't.

P.S. I'm not responding to any "NO! I don't want to be nerfed like so many other people because I like my overpowered power just the way it is!!!" My only post in here.

Is anyone else having problems with the 6.3 drivers? 6.2 seemed to do a world of good, but since I've installed the 6.3 drivers I'd had the game lock up on me a few time. Also, I've started to experience distorted contact pictures when I bring up the contact list and sometimes my costumes are also distorted when I go to switch costumer. I'll get half of my costume show up in the box it's supposed to be in while the other half will be a bunch of garbled artifacts. Same will happen with the contacts. It's similiar to the 3 in one pics people are having with costumes but instead of the two tiny pics of legs at the bottom of the main costume pic, I'll get black and the top will be my legs or all garbled stuff. Reading other threads I'm begining to think it's something Cryptic has done with the game because Nvidia people are getting it too.

When I had graphic issues about 6 months ago, support had recommended I always have Fast Write turned off. I didn't have really have any issues because of it, but had the issues everyone else was having with the sound loop crash. Since the 6.2 and 6.3 drivers I think I've left it on though. I'll try it with it turned off tonight to see how it goes. I'm begining to think their are issues with the 6.3 drivers. See my next post.

Bill, I have an x850XT PE AGP card. Like it MUCH better than the 9800XT I had before. I'm going to try some of the settings you have listed here but overall I get very nice gameplay except in obvious lag situations. One problem I've had since CoV was released that also shows up in CoH now is a zoning rubberband issue. One I switch from one zone and pop up in the other and start moving quick(SS, Fly, Jump) as I get rubberbanded back to the starting position intially. After the intial snapback I'm fine. Any idea if this is just me or happening to everyone?

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you can't leave we will not let you quick everybody gang
tackle

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My mind must be in the gutter(or not). I thought u said "quick everybody gang bang" at first glance. Ack!

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1. We're looking into the tweak to Endurance for mobs that's affected Endurance Drain abilities. Sorry about that!

2. We'll be putting in a check that prevents "one shotting"; if anything occurs within a fraction of second that brings a player from 100% Hit Points down to 0, we instead give the player 1% Hit Points.

That's all for now.

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Tweak says the Statesman??? Regen Scrappers know this really spells DOOOOOOOM. Please tell me you're not going to make Stamina a click or something...

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They should have one in central New Jersey.

Just saying.

But knowing my luck, the closest place they'd have one is in NYC. And NYC is a hellhole.

And you know how I feel about hellholes.

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Clearly the solution is to have it in Secaucus.

-5 bazillion hotels so everyone and their mom can stay closeby.
-hotels = conference rooms for cons.
-located within walking distance of me.
-close to NY.
-in NJ.
-less of a hellhole than NYC (not like thats saying much).
-doesn't smell too bad.
-near 3 airports.
-Secaucus + CoX jokes write themselves.

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I live in Wallington, NJ and work in NYC(oh do I hate the commute, NJ Transit buses, the subway and my job). Secaucus sounds good. Isn't there a Cyberjocks in NYC though? That may be good since they'd have all the computers setup, etc.

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Wrong.. Cause obviously you read things I posted and construe your own version of them which is nothing that I said. You don't want to be nerfed because you like having a power that is over powered and are happy playing it. As I've said before, MoG was overpowered, BUT had the ability to be beaten with a team, insperations, "the right powers", etc etc. Same things people have "suggested" to me about overcoming hurricane. Yesterday there were about 10 of us in SC in a circle around a Hurricane person trying to take them out. Eventually they fell, like what would happen with MoG if they "had the right team". 10 people shouldn't be needed to take out any one AT and especially ONE power. That's the problem. Call me what you want, I understand you like you're toon unnerfed, who doesn't. But Hurricane needs to be "fixed". Much love... Me.

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Wow. That had nothing to do with the post you quoted.


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Incidentally, your post really did, literally, have nothing to do with the post you quoted. Just pointing that out while you rail me for being irrational.

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You know, I think you're right. Thinking about it, people with hover have an unfair advantage, too. When they're using hover, my meleers can't get anywher near them. I mean, sure I could respec and take hover, or superjump, but hover sucks because I don't like it for some arbitrary reason! I shouldn't have to change my build to counter someone else's power!

Do you realize how absurd your arguments are? How weak your rationale is? Are you concious of this fact? Are you, in fact, lying and exaggerating to justify your continued argument? I begin to suspect you are. Because there is no acknowledgement of reality in your words.

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We'll see how weak my rationale is if the devs nerf hurricane. Then I guess it will be my fault that it happened.. Sure. Ok. Given the fact one of your own started this thread and was like "Nerf On the Horizon?" about Hurricane I think
that clearly shows there are more then me aware or complaining about it being overpowered and it may be next to be nerfed whether you like it or not. If it's nerfed, go scream at devs and use your rationale to them and see if they listen or not.

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If the devs see fit to nerf Hurricane, I'll see what their reason is and If it seems sound, I'll accept it. I can guarantee it won't be your fault, however, because I tend to doubt your arguments are sound enough to influence them. Especially since many of those arguments boil down to "I don't wanna!". Furthermore, I'm willing to bet that whatever changes come down the wire, they certainly won't be in the vein of turning the power into a MOG-style situational click.

Let's clarify something, however. The person who started this thread is not "One of my own". Believe it or not, my main is a regen scrapper. Had her since launch, still love playing her. I have one defender, and he's archery/trick arrow. I -team- with a stormie, but I am not especially loyal to the defender camp. I came here following the dev digest, and got involved because I dislike seeing people like you try to change history with your words.

Maybe you should wait until you know someone's motivations (or, and I know this can be challenging, but read their posts) before making ignorant leaps to erroneous conclusions.

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Make sure they lie first before you accuse them of lying like you're doing with me.

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You mean like you've been accusing them of doing about regen since I got involved in this thread?

You are, at best, carefully selecting "truths" that adhere to your limited perspective, and deliberately ignoring the larger picture to further your vendetta. That is, in my opinion, every bit as dishonest as a bald-faced lie. If you're not lying to us, you're lying to yourself. As far as you're concerned, You're already right, and while you will adopt -any- evidence you can find to support your perspective, you ignore -any- evidence that contradicts it. It's called confirmation bias, and any reasonably intelligent person can see it permeating your arguments. Even the people who agree that hurricane should be nerfed don't agree with your perspective or attitude.

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Given their track record, I'm sure they'll fumble up something they say in regards to a nerf like they've done in the past. I'll save my responses from now on to the whiners who don't like change, but at LEAST can respond maturely. Peash.

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Yes, and this little barb was certainly the epitome of rational debate.

Fact: No single AT is always going to be balanced against another single AT. This means some are going to be weak against melee, some are weak against ranged. This means that there are ALWAYS going to be situations where your build is going to be less then effective.

Your answer to this fact: None.

Fact: Changing Hurricane to a click, as a concept, while perhaps balancing in PVP, -severely- inhibits this power in Pv-E-, which is a significantly larger portion of the game. While the devs have conceded more then once that sometimes it's nessecary to change PvE aspects to balance PvP, it is not the -priority-, and thus odds are that one of the other suggestions in this thread would be a fairer balance between the conflicting ideals. Your other suggestion, having stormies float around uncontrollably while hurricane is on, would be so utterly damaging to the player's ability to control their character that I find it hard to believe that it wasn't said out of personal bitterness.

Your answer: But they nerfed IH and MOG for PvP reasons!

Which brings us to....

Fact: IH and MoG were not changed exclusively for PvP concerns. I'll concede that PvP may have played a role in some of the changes, but as I and others have pointed out, Regen scrappers were absurdly overpowered in PvE as well, which is -not- something you can say about Storm defenders.

Your answer: Stormies whined about us, so I should be able to whine about them!

And finally...

Fact: PvP and PvE are two significantly different styles of play. You cannot take a PvE build into a PvP zone and expect to compete against dedicated PvP teams. You must be willing to alter your tactics, team balance, and possibly even your build if you want to be seriously competetive. If you don't -care- about being seriously competetive, you should not be complaining about the fact that there are builds you can't topple, because you yourself are limiting your effectiveness -deliberately- in order to favor PvE play. If you want to bring down storm defenders, you can use a variety of powers (temp and pool) to create an opening. You can try to detoggle with brawl. Running hit. You can alter your team structure to try and compensate.

Your answer: I shouldn't have to change my build or strategy to be able to win!

This is what you're saying, man. Does any of this strike -you- as particularly reasonable? Am I really misrepresenting your arguments -so- thoroughly as to completely miss your fundamental arguments? Do I have to literally quote your words back at you?

This is coming form a fellow regen scrapper, man. I'm not a frequent player of the defender AT, I'm an outsider here, just like you are. But even with all that, I can tell, -easily- that you are being unreasonable, bitter, and trollish.

Sorry if that makes you -feel- bad, but it's my honest opinion. This isn't personal to me. I don't give a poot what you can or can't do in PvP. But when you come on these forums and exaggerate, twist truths, and try to misrepresent the past according to your own, plainly skewed, perspective, someone is -always- going to come in and tell you you're being useless. And that's what your behavior in this thread is. Useless. You want to be useful, check your back pocket and notice that the truth isn't in there, and start trying to think past your immature notions of what's fair and what isn't. Try to think of -other- ways to balance the power. Accept the fact that maybe some of your troubles with storm controllers and defenders are because you're not really -all- that serious about being a serious menace in PvP. Stop asking for an "I win" button and try to work out strategies and compromises.

Above all else, stop acting like an antigonistic perspective is inherently immature and meaningless. I disagree with you -strongly- on many points. That does not mean I'm being childish, it means I think you're fracking -wrong-.

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I skipped through most of what you wrote because the responses you gave were filled with a bunch of combative remarks about your insistence about what you THINK I meant by my posts and the facts of what "I" really meant by my posts and fully explained and you continue to accuse me of being bitter about Regen nerfs(DOOOOOM). You're so not my ex or something. :-) Nuff said.

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If Stormers are so overpowered why don't you play one instead of coming in here with your flamebait?

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Cause I really don't want to be overpowered. If I did, I would have taken the Tough/Weave route with my toon, suped up MoG, etc. I wanted to have some identity to my toon and not be a cookie cutter build.