BurningChick

So ...

I ran a three BAFs this afternoon, after the patch, on my Traps / Dark defender.

First run, I used my primary as little as possible without being a total jerk (FFG and leadership always on, full traps on the doors, did not debuff AVs) and spent my time punching AVs in the face. Common.

Second run, a more balanced approach of blasting and Trapping: Very Rare (only my second on the Trapper, and I've done enough raids to have T3 in all 4 new slots despite crappy drops and having to burn 100 threads for 1 piece of salvage twice).

Third run, same as the second with a side of me leading and, minimally, barking commands (setting the ground rules of pulling AVs, 3 to a door, don't bogart adds) and throwing out some hints to the newbies (target the AVs through health bars in UI): Rare.

Maybe the devs slipped something into the patch.

Or the RNG smiled on me.

I dunno which.

Here's another thread: http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=258115

The annecdotal evidence here is that sets that rely relatively little on directly affecting mobs are most likely to get the lower tier tables. Sets that DO directly affect mobs end up nosing toward the better tables.

I couldn't bring myself to do it on a couple BAFs I led this morning (note: if /I/ can lead a BAF, freakin' anyone can), but I have a theory ...

A MM spamming Brawl will score better than a MM spamming pets.

Directly debuffing a mob's HP seems to be better than using pets. I.e., my trapper can solo doors, mostly with T3 Lore and heavily-procced Caltrops, Poison Trap, and Acid Mortar. That is a solid amount of inf and drops, but it doesn't neatly correspond with a good table at the end.

Further ... my f/f/f dom (alpha-shifted) got the rare table five times in a row (and one time a very rare) the first 6 times she ran BAF. I.e., she was fighting +3s /and missing/. She was teamed with people hitting more often AND doing more damage, but they got the bottom 3 tables. I, however, was madly mashing buttons because f/f/f has some /very/ fast animations.

I think it's just a question of activating mob-affecting powers. I.e., a fire / fire tanker might be able to get a decent table door-sitting spamming PBAoEs. My guess would be common since the animation times for fire / fire are long-ish.

I have no conjectures about buffs 'cause I don't have the intestinal fortitude to Incarnate-out my 50 bubbler and kin.

A question: what would happen if a person were to do nothing but attack with Brawl (I can have a perma-Brawl chain on my dom) and spam PBAoE attacks during down time (waiting for spawns, waiting for AVs to be pulled during BAF)? 10 Threads? Common? Uncommon? Better?

My first toon through Lambda / BAF was a Traps / dark defender. She's up to T3 in all slots, meaning I've ground out many, many trials on her. The vast majority of her drops have been from the uncommon pool, with 1 very rare, 3 or 4 rares

My second toon through Lambda / BAF is a fire / fire / fire dom. So far, she's T3 in Lore, nothing else slotted. Either she's INCREDIBLY lucky, or the loot table can be gamed. She's only had 1 uncommon drop -- everything else has been rare. Even when she was a measly 50+1 in a league of mostly +2 and +3 toons. I have enough rares to craft T3 in all the remaining slots, with a some leftovers.

Some thoughts.

My traps / dark relies heavily on long animation powers with a lot of drops (FFG, Caltrops, Poison Trap, etc.).

My dom spams short animation powers (Cages, Fireball, Blaze, etc.).

If activity level does have a bearing on loot tables, we have a problem. My Trapper brings FAR more to the table than my dom (she can solo doors; my dom can't). But my dom, unless, again, she's been incredibly lucky with the RNG, gets the better rolls because she can OMGspam a handful of powers.

Just something to chew on.

FF has been getting marginalised almost since release.

The beta / release era devs seem to have envisioned the game as having a significant single target, tactical component. Keeping mobs detained / KBed / repelled fits into this play style. The players, by and large, saw the game as an AoE-fuelled zergfest where keeping mobs clumped and available for AoE carnage trumps the 25ish% pseudo damage debuff you can get from Force Bubble.

Right off the bat, most of FF was written off by the vast majority of players.

FF's niche became team-wide mez protection and team-wide def buffs. It was, until Issue 5, the only set that could provide mez protection and a whole lotta' def to an 8 person team.

With I5 came Sonic, and the niche was further pared down with Sonic Dispersion. Throw in the GDR ... and ... ugh.

I6 (IIRC, could be wrong on the issues, but timing's not crucial to my argument) brought us Traps and Cold ... and further watered down FF's niche.

And yet ... people still roll bubblers and other people invite them to teams.

At the end of the day, I think most players don't invite players to create the most massively efficient team possible -- they just invite who's available. Further, some people simply like the laidback playstyle of FF.

That said, I haven't played my bubbler, seriously, in a year or two. I think FF could do with a couple more team-friendly powers.

Hey Zwillinger,

I'm feeling lousy and haven't read through the thread so I'll keep this short ...

The LFG experience blows.

Point the first: LFG runs start with 8-12 people. But it's far easier to do these trials with a group of 24 set up in Pocket D. I'm not sure how it's going to work out in the long run, but right now LFG is actually a hindrance to enjoying the trials.

Point the second: LFG needs more options. I.e., someone sets up a trial run and sets some parameters: trial starts once 24 join. None of this heartache waiting to happen of 7 melee toons and a dom.

Not much to add

/em pokes Taser

I've seen you break your "don't boast" rule ... ummm ... frequently. If not constantly. And generally fatally

It always added to the fun, light-hearted mood you were going for to watch you consistently faceplant.

Good times!

I think the undertone of what you're saying boils down to, "It's a game. It's supposed to be fun. Don't take it, or yourself, too seriously. Sometimes, ensuring everyone has a good, non-stressful time means regrouping and talking things over."

Or making references to <shiver> The Pet Shop Boys.

So ...

I've been around a long time and have a baseline knowledge of most of the game's sets. That's a big help when putting together a team 'n' figuring a strategy if the team isn't steamrolling. First tip: roll a bunch of toons, and get a feel for different sets and ATs.

(De)buffers make the game more pleasant in every possible way. Invite as many (de)buffers as you can find (Defenders, Controllers, Corruptors, MMs, and, to a certain extent, VEATs). Pass over anyone advertising himself as a healer (no, seriously, you'll often end up with someone who thinks that auto-firing a heal is a serious contribution).

Second tip: If you've got a handful of (de)buffers, start inviting everyone else, regardless of AT (I have a soft spot for inviting stalkers). You'll be good to go for most of the game's content.

Third tip: once you have a better idea of how the game works and the various sets and ATs work together, then you start going for optimal teams. I.e., if all you can find is a bunch of blasters, look hard for any FF defender you can find over L22.

Hmmm ...

Personal choice: I'd skip Aid Other and the rez. In their place, I'd hit the stealth pool for Stealth and Invis. Stealth provides a wee bit of defense, and I find that stealthing is often rather useful. I also like Vengenace, and would prefer it over Recall Friend.

All three powers are good with the default slot, with the added bonus that you can also use them to mule LotGs once you have some a-merits banked and you feel the need for some recharge.

I find the number of choices in the CC so bewildering that I just hit random until I find something OK then change the colours to csomething that won't make my eyeballs bleed.

More choices in the CC?

<twitch>

Feh.

I'd rather the devs spend their time elsewhere.

Ahhh, thanks for reminding me of OpenDNS

I can now load the forums again.

If anyone's having problems, try manually setting your DNS server to 208.67.220.220.

The forums load faster on an iPhone + 3G than they do on a 6 core processor with a fast broadband connection.

I'm not enough of a nerd anymore to track down what the hangup is, but both ie and Firefox give similar connection reset errors to me. I'm guessing a routing or dns glitch that's only affecting some networks since my phone had similar problems seeing the forums over wifi.

So ...

I like Traps. No futzing with anchored debuffs. No calling for "hugs". And, importantly, no ST buffs. I've done enough levels of FF and kin to know that ST buffing is a PITA, and understand why people might not keep them up 24/7 ... but a goodly chunk of Cold's goodness comes from the buffs.

The distinctions I make between rad, cold, and traps aren't, FWIW, really performance-based; rather, they're style-based. I just prefer Traps' way of doing things.