Breog

*shrug* I can run my Claw/WP brute throw the Cyborg Fire farm with no worries.

Big key I find with any farm.... dont be afraid to use your Inspirations. Thiers lots of them and just 1 of you so go hog wild.

105% Disagree with this


We are talking about a power you cannot perma on SOs alone. Permaing Hoarfrost is its biggest use, other wise its jsut a really slow heal. Its very skippable in the lower levels because of its slow recharge time, and non-perma status. Taking it over a DEF boosting power is a step backwards.

In my view anyways *shrug*.

Good points about what to compare.

To be fair to Pain, we probley should compare to Controller Empathy vs Pain.
As Defender's Empathy is on a differnt scale all together. Defender Empathy vs Corruptor/MM Pain is kinda a no brainer due to the scale difference.

Fortitude Base of 11.25% vs 15% etc So more like 17-18% Def instead of 24% Def.

Your point however still stands... 18% Def generaly does much more for a Toon then 18% res.

Recharge on Fortitude is pretty crazy, I didn't realize it was that low and lasted 120s. Pain does have one big advantage here, its 1 click for World of Pain vs multi buffing for fortitude. Also because of World of Pains 35 ft radius and massive target taging capacity in a big group of 8 toons with pets World of Pain starts to look better then fortitude when you factor in just how many targets are being buffed by it. Granted you do need to tag everyone vs the single target tagging.

So depending on your group make up (and how large) each buff has its pros and cons.

* Damage/Tohit side, WoP is lower in both per target, but once you start multiplying how many are effected by WoP its over all To Hit boost/Damage Boost its giving across the board because pretty huge (10% base Tohit and 16% damage x tons of targets vs 6 targets with 15% and 25%).

AB vs PB

Thats a toss up at first glance.... Both have the same Recovery and Reg boost. Same Duration, same recharge, the only thing that is different.... +50 Damage boost vs 100% recharge.

I going to say AB wins this one. +100 Recharge is pretty massive for what it can do to a toon. +50% Damage boost is definitely nice, but I'm willing to beat in the long run that extra recharge will surpass the damage boost that PB gives.

But its close
*unless your buffing a pet with it.. then Pain Bringer wins

Regenerating Aura vs Suppress Pain/Sootheing Aura.

Thats a really tricky one.

500% reg base of RA vs 200% Base of Suppress.
Clicky with 500 sec recharge and 90s duration vs a toggle.

Sootheing Aura does a Heal Tick and its a toggle.

This one would take math to figure out , and I dont care enough about it to figure it out LOL. Think its going to come down more to style of play then anything else.

Over all I think they did a good job balanceing Pain as the villian version of Empathy.

So I still hold to my suggestion of Pain as a alternative to Empathy.

Barrier definitely could use some toneing down. At least with the moding of the color you can turn it its "loudness" down a bit.

I tryed Yellow to get that golden Incarnate power look. OMG I think I burned my eyes out when I hit the button with 30+ people around me with pets. It was like the Yellow Dawn all over again *shivers*.

Currently I have it set to a darker purple, very soft and easy on the eyes.

Oh *** ***** I did it twice LOL

Yes, thank you I ment Route. Thats what I get for typing without double checking what I wrote.

I took Diamagnetic on my Tanker. Being able to stackup to -20 to Hit Debuff is pretty impressive. Being a Electric Tanker, I didn't have prefect Def like Inv or Granite tankers. So being able to effectively buff up my Def that was weak in a few area's was very nice.

not to mention it helps midigate Defense Debuffs.

Between all my AoEs, and Damage Aura (and 100% Proc chance) it very quick and easy to have things hitting stack cap.

The Neg Reg? *shrug* being that it only stacks to a maxium of -60% and that anything I would really want that -60% reg on (AVs, GMs etc) have massive resistance to it. Yeah... kinda a dud. One place I did find it somewhat useful was stacked with my Warworks neg reg (can get up to -210% Reg if everything stacks up), and vs Longbow Wardens that are Reg base along with Paragon Protectors.

Closest to the Empathy Defender would be the Corruptor Root, taking /pain.

A bit clearer It was written late night/early morning half asleep.



As to the comment on the last page.. Pain healing more then Empathy.

hasn't been my experience with playing Pain and being grouped with a Pain Corruptor.
Pain brings a 18+% Permable Resistance boost across the board thats pretty impressive resistance boost for everyone (plus its damage and to hit boost). A 400%+ Reg Boost Toggle for those around you as well. The new Incarnate at its weakest (rebirth) is 200% reg. Granted with the toggle you do need to stay within 15ft of the /Pain toon. But its double the effectiveness when slotted.

Fortitude vs Pain Bringer

Kinda a hard call. Granted Fortitude is easyer to perma and can be kept on multi-targets were as Pain Bringer is really only going to be used on 1 person. (unless you some how manged to get its recharge down to 45s O_o )

Certainly not saying ether is better then the other (emp vs pain) just that Pain plays differently then Empathy while still doing a lot of what Empathy can do. Which is why I brought it up as a possible option.


As to the Team kicking conversation...

I would NEVER kick anyone jsut because of some precived view that they may have Poorly biuld thier toon, and/or didn't take "key" powers.

Thats what I like about CoX so much, you dont need KEY powers, or the prefect biuld to play this game. Have fun, mix and match things up a bit. I'd gladly take the Petless mastermind that was fun to play with and had a intersting character concept then yet another Forum Clone "Prefect: Robot/Traps" FOTM biuld.

Now kicking people for being A-Holes etc... is a different matter.

And I seriously almost kicked a Kin for constantly SBing me all the time even after me repeatly saying I DONT WANT SB, STOP SBing ME etc etc.

PS - I hate Speed Boost

Just a quick reply to this part...

10 Million influence is a small drop in the bucket when your looking at fully IOed out biulds.

My Main Tanker is literaly a 15 Billion Influence Biuld. I have 2 IOs that cost 2 Bil+ each.

My Advice is to take it slow with the biuld.
Fill the biuld out with what you can (SOs, Generic IOs etc). Use downgrade IO sets while you save up for the final sets. (Positrons blast in place of Ragnarok, Smashing Haymaker in place of Kinetic are great examples).
Everything you do to improve your toon, makes it that much easyer to gain rewards faster.

Even if you dont play the market (which I dont) you can biuld up some pretty impressive Influence totals just by selling what you get, and doing your Alightment missions, and TFs for Merits.


To many time I see and hear people scared off from the IO system due to sticker shock, never realizeing its really not that bad. if you start small and work your way up. (this coming from a causal player, with Atlitus).

PS - Avoid Purple sets... #1 mistake I see so many people do when planning out a Biuld for thier toon. Purples % wise arn't that much better then other sets, but cost 100 times more then the cheaper set. Purple sets really are only for squeezeing every last ounce out of a biuld when you have the cash to do it.

I always plan my biulds in 3 phase sets. Phase 1... the working biuld. Phase 2... after I have a working biuld thats solid, I see were I can refine it some more after playing around with Phase 1 for a bit. Phase 3 is were the Purples sets replace certain sets.... to date 99% of my toons never reach phase 3. Because of Cost vs effectiveness.

I ment just on S/L. But yeah the more resistance toggles you have the more and more bang you get out of it.

Case in point.. Elec Tanker. My Base Res Numbers are 35% (except for Neg Energy) add in Tough, and dont forget power surge (its very rare power but cardiac does efffect it).

Adds up to lots of things being boosted by the res.

Like 8% S/L and 5%ish to everything else (Neg, Cold, Fire, Psi).

Add on the +3% PVP IO then also Add the T4 Barrier effect

I normaly just run over to the Mother Ship and bash 2-4 groups of what ever rikiti I find spawned (pull 2 groups together at a time and bash them all).

But obviously thats not for every AT to do.

Definitely second useing Atlas Park, the zone is smal and very easy to navigate quickly.