Xaphiero

I suggest that "Grounded" be replaced by some sort of click heal. Also, the heal should be moved much earlier in the powerset than Grounded is currently positioned.

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FIRST IMPRESSIONS OF ENFORCERS:

1: The "hipshot" heavy Uzi burst doesn't seem to have any sounds.

2: Can we get heavier sounds for the Uzis? I'm not one for toilet humor, but it sounds like they're farting at people.

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The phrase you're looking for, to borrow it from Spider Robinson, is "asthmatic sewing machine." I'm told it's what a Uzi actually sounds like. But I could stand to have the volume turned up on it a little bit, too. But after running mercs to 40, trust me, eventually the sound of loud, clattering SMGs/assault rifles gets really old.

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Please no. The one thing the game does not need is more annoying and louder sounds (and super-bright visuals either).

Ok, I didn't think it was possible for MMs to be more annoying but success has been achieved. Have you been in a group of 8 yet with 4 Thug MMs and all call Gang War? In caves? Seriously. Not grouping with more than 2 MMs ever from this point on again. Too much of a pain in the patoot if you are a Brute or Stalker (or any other AT really).

Can pets be made non-solid or something? Or mission spaces much larger? Or MM AT just be dropped from the game?

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The way I actually see it is that the real issue is the combination of no immoblization protection, no knockback protection, and no ability to recover health.

There is one undeniable fact about this: No other Brute set needs to go into power pools like this.

Sure you can plan 1 of 2 ways for dealing with no knock back or immoblization.

But there one and only 1 option for health recovery avaiable. If that option is not taken, then the player becomes utterly dependant upon green inspriations, or teaming with only specific AT sets.

Otherwise, expect to have a higher rate of down time. More time down means less Fury building. Less Fury building is less SMASH time.

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It's really no KB prot or Heal, IMHO, is the issue. Also, I really really do not see how the so-called benefits touted previously in this thread outweigh the above shortcomings. End drain resist is situational, so resist to it is not so important. Especially when you have 2 end powers in the set.

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My only issue with this AT so far is it is sooooo end heavy.

I assume once I get my attacks SOed with end and get all the powers SOed it will be better.

But I already see fitness a must and leaping a must for immob protection and end recovery.


And has anyone else had the chance to build up a nice pile of MOBs with Staice field then hi thunder strike OOOOMMMMMGGGGG its so cool and if you get 10 mobs one hit with thunder strike gives you 50-75% rage Yummy

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All of the Brutes run into end problems. Just get Stamina like every other character. Oh, and you have end conservation and end drain powers. I don't get your point here.

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Well, I'm going to offer up what is probably going to be a completely wacky idea: change power sink to have the same effects as Energy Absorption from the Ice Armor line. This would give it pretty much the same qualities it has now but with the added bonus of +Def. It wouldn't be much, but might help in large battles so that you get hit a bit less.

Sure, it's no self-heal, but it could help.

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Sweet idea!

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Some people see a lack of a heal as a weakness, yet not one single person would claim that Energy Armor or Super Reflexes is underperforming and they don't have heals or dull pain either.

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I believe the "having no heal is a weakness" camp have specifically stated a number of times in this thread that it's "having no heal in a +Res set is a weakness." Super Reflexes and Energy Aura are both +Def sets.

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Correct, it is about a heal in a Res set. However, having no heal in +Def set is nasty. When you get hit you take it ALL baby! Hopefully the Def changes in I7 will help mitigate that to a degree.

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Some people see a lack of a heal as a weakness, yet not one single person would claim that Energy Armor or Super Reflexes is underperforming and they don't have heals or dull pain either. A heal is a perk, not a requirement at all. Knockback and immobilisation is the only weakness Electrical Armor suffers from and it can be fixed with a single powerpool if you choose to take it. Frankly though I've taken my fire tanker from 1 to 26 without any knockback protection and while it might be annoying when it happens its rarely killed me and its a limitation I choose to accept but will eventually plug with acrobatics anyway since SJ was always intended for the character. If people are concerned about knockback you can also consider getting hover which leads into the flight travelpower. So don't claim you're being pidgeon holed into SJ because for starters a character works fine without KB resistance and secondly you have at least two powerpools which over protection from it.

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A) A Tank is not a Brute. While a Tank can take getting KB some it bites into a Brute's Fury Building. Anyway, what fire tank doesn't have Acrobatics at 20 or 22? /bogglesTheMind KB may not kill you but will interfere with you keeping aggro, which means you aren't doing your job.

B) Um...I'll complain right here and now LOUDLY about SR not having a heal. Doggone inconvenient that. One Very Long recharge heal would have me in ecstasy. I'm sure the same is true with the EA folks.

C) And no...a Brute doesn't "work fine" without KB protection. It's a crappy situation to live with. That's why there's all of this discussion in this thread.

And I can't really see doing the strangeness that is Hover/TP. While it may work, it has to be clumsy.

Tal, you are still way off base in your arguments.

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Ever played a dark armor before? resist to every damage including Psi (59%!), fear, end drain, acc debuff, immob, has a self heal only at the cost of no knockback and practically no defense.

ELA is downright lackluster in flexibility right now, I'm still settled on dark armor and invuln... Why should I pick ELA?

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Cause ELA has
- auto +rech
- power sink (DA is heavy on end and a pain if you dont have DM)
- conserve power
...

I am not saying ELA is perfect and that the trade of no heal for end tools and other stuff is fair. But it is far from being gimp.

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Yes, DA protections come at the cost of some BRUTAL end usage. You need an End recovery power to counter it, like in DM.

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Are you familiar with what is like to play locked to the ground?

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As someone who constantly ran around Rooted with my Stone Tanker, I do. And while I'm not enamored of -jump, I'd have to say that I prefer being stuck standing on the ground, to being stuck with my [censored] on the ground.

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Woot! You KB'd me with that comment! Right on target.

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you could just get acro and not get the power that comes in your secondary, but for ppl who dont want superjump it would give them another option of travel while still being able to get KB resist

and it sometimes seems like the devs are on drugs. have you seen our patron powers? they do like twice the dmg of brawl at best

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<rant>
At the risk of getting wacked for off-topic, the PPPs are a blatant attempt at not thinking through from a player perspective, but reusing code to keep cost down to maximize profits. Don't worry, in the long run lack of vision and originality will come back to bite the company in the behind.

</rant>

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Your e-tough attitude is not impressive and it's not having the effect you desire. I don't think you're smart or tough. I, in fact, am rather sure you're niether.

The toggle provides an option. You can take that to protect you from KB, or you can do the hover/TP or Accro thing. Leaving it as is means to stand up you have to do one of those two.

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Pinkstar is right on. It's your bashing attitude that is not impressive. Attack the arguer, not the argument eh?

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My beef isn't with the lack of KB protection or the lack of a self heal. The only problem I have is that there is a lack of sources to gain such protection and from most of the complaints I've read this is the underlying reason a lot of others don't like Elec not having this kind of protection.

Manuevers is in need of a buff, maybe that's a place to start.

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I think the lack of KB or self-heal is EXACTLY the issue here. Put either one in the set and I'd be ecstatic. There's really no point to two End powers either.

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i really wish grounded was what someone suggested, a toggle with medium end cost that did -fly, -jump, and +regen and knockback protection

i'd play the set if it had this, otherwise i'll roll a elec/stone or /EA or something (would've picked /inv but its ugly black now)

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I don't get it. I honestly don't.

There's a Brute set with a Quickness clone power, and people want to change it to Fast Healing? Cause Brutes never need +recharge and +runspeed for Fury. Naah...

/e boggles. Am I missing something? No, that's not a rhetorical question.

Thanks,
-> Scott.

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/agreed

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I would figure nothing about the set will change except if there are bugs. Which means use a set that works or spend the extra 3 - 5 pool power selections and 5+ slots to plug the holes. Run the 6 - 7 toggles you need to run to work. At least you should be able to have 3 - 4 attacks and maybe with Stamina you will be able to fight.

I am planning on attempting the Combat Jumping, Acrobatics with Aid Self... no idea where I am going to get the slots for Aid Self

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That's easy. Forget about Taunt in your primary and either Conserve Energy or Power Sink in Elec Armor.

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OK I have to just speak up here about everyone moaning about Elec Armor needing this and that.

Lets look at this in the big picture rather than saying 'I want it to do THIS'. Each powerset needs to be induvidual to itself, it wouldn't be any fun to have 10 Energy Blasts which all behaved in the same way with maybe 1 or two signiture powers. Likewise armors have to be very induvidual as well. Additionally every powerset NEEDS to have a weakness and a strength. Without that there is no need to team as you have no limitations, armor in particular HAS to have holes within it.

Typically a powerset has a purpose, if a powerset breaks the purpose it takes penalties within to balance it out. A case example is Ice Blast. A primary for blasters is supposed to be about raw damage yet ice blast offers alot of control powers. As a penalty it suffers from mediocre AoE and heavy endurance costs. Fire armor is supposed to be a tanker primary intended for defence. Except it deals damage directly, as such it has weaknesses greater than normal because it breaks the purpose of what a primary tanker power is supposed to do.

Elec Armor is an interesting hybrid of abilities. Its more utility based than some sets plus it has direct damage potential. However alot of its powers are defensive in nature. You can see this balancing system in action. It has less damage potential than fire armor, so it offers higher protection than fire armor. However it offers more ultility than Invulnerability so it has less protection than invulnerability.

Now everyone compares alot of the armor sets to invul but I'll point out one simple fact. Invul is PURE PROTECTION with almost no utility. It only has one power which buffs something other than defence, health or resistance and that simply gives a moderate acc buff. So its amazing protection is because (a) it doesn't do anything beyond the purpose of the set and (b) it doesn't have utility powers or extra special protections.

I know knockback protection is something alot of people hate, but the fact is that in order to put it back in you'd need to lose something in return. Maybe alot in return, endurance drain protection seems most likely and perhaps teleport protection would have to go to since these are 'exotic' defences. Now some will say yes to stripping those out. But if you do then Elec Armor suddenly only has a few things to make it unique. The endurance reduction powers and a damage aura.

That might be enough, but lets be fair here. There is much defence against endurance drains so this set really stands out as special because of it, this will make enemies like MALTA, Carnies and Longbow a hell of alot easier. All things considered, I'd rather have a powerset with a hole I can fill with a powerpool than not have to take a powerpool but be completely unable to defend myself against endurance draining powers.

With the ability to fix the weaknesses in the set with just one powerpool I'd say its a fairly good trade to the number 1 killer of all brutes. A complete lack of endurance.

So lay off with wanting to turn the set into something less unique just because you don't like what its offering. If you want higher protection go make an invulnerability brute, its why the set exists. If you want to be a tanker go invul, if you want something different and more varied go elec.

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I think you are off base here. Folks are evaluating the new set and seeing how it stacks up against the others. Everyone wants a VIABLE powerset that players will actually USE. That's the main contention here. It has to have strengths and weaknesses. But too many glaring holes will just make folks go use some other set. Why would you use Elec if it is too cumbersome? I guess you could use it for a Roleplay point. But that will get old after getting beat down consistently, except for the heaviest RP'ers.

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The Hero that shows up to stop you is just too hard. Seriously, devs, rethink this... right now my only options are to drop the difficulty before every mayhem mission, and to solo only and not bring along teammates. I can't understand posts that read "Sure, I got pounded 10 times and reached my debt cap, but WHEE FUN!". Fun starts to drop off when you feel like you're hitting an insurpassable brick wall of frustration and futility.

The neverending waves of heavy ambushes loaded with a dozen debuffs are also too much. Why chuck 10 emp grenades when 1-2 are enough to completely drain me and take out my toggles? Why hammer me with so many glue arrows that I can't move faster than a snail? There's got to be a bug at play here... I hope.

Let's see, what else... I'm going to assume pets and villain helpers ignoring the enemy in favor of pounding on civvies is a bug and will be dealt with... and that the timer starting at less than 20 and bonus time being inconsistent is a bug... those things are minor. It's the overall difficulty that MUST be addressed before this goes live. It doesn't have to be insanely easy, but it should be doable by the casual gamers you're trying to reach out to.

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The hero is too tough? Well doh! Drop your rep level. I"m really tired of people who run with increased rep and then complain that their missions are "too hard". Really now, what do you expect, more XP for not very much elevated risk/challenge? C'mon now...

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The pool table is what I summoned during Propel. Did you know those summons actually STAY in the world now? And you can actually move them around? Sweet.

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So does everyone see a differerent object like they usually do with Propel?

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So....The hero at the end of the mission Spawns at hero level instead of Elite Boss if set on invincible? Ouch, not sure if i like that, that means I'll have to reset my difficulty lower for each mayhem mission.

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Wait, I hear the Waahmbulance coming...

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i LOVE the fact that i can hit pedestrians with my /kin powers. Huge fulcrum shifts, always a target to siphon speed.... Oh glorious day!

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Probably something that would help with the "immersion" factor is if you hit a civilian it is "teleported" out. That way you are defeating the civilians, but not really hurting them.

I do love seeing level 1s running around.

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Say what? Oh no no no! I've been pushed around by civvies for way too long. They deserve to die. We deserve to see blood and dismembered pieces. You know, sort of like any console game...

Kudos on the new animations! Still trying it out but I hope this makes the set faster, making up for the +5% acc boost we never got for drawing a weapon, though it is in the anims.

Now, you really really have to get rid of the root effect for SR/Practiced Brawler!

Agent Stiehl
34 Claws/SR Scrapper

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The first thing that came to my mind as I read the various powers is why is this set called Mace Mastery? None of the powers let you hit something as if you were using the thing like, well a mace. Where are the melee attacks for "Mace Mastery"?

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/agree

devs dropping acid again and designing shooty melee weapons?

I'm not sure what the point of the sleep effect is for melee attacks. YOu gotta be kidding. First of all, if I'm building fury, I'm going to unsleep the guy next hit. Also, the mob isn't trying to hit me, so not building Fury that way either. Didn't the Ice Brutes go away due to this consideration?

Some of the zero sleep effects I've run into in CoH have been nasty interrupts/toggle-droppers. It seem like this was put in for PvP only. Which is totally WRONG since PvE is the game's bread and butter and PvP just some "other thing to try out". I'm not sure what I'm getting out of this in PvE. It looks like nada since we cannot drop toggles of mobs (e.g. Longbow Warden Spines guys). And then, of course, we are paying end for the useless status effect and, as always when an attack has a status component, the attack does less damage due to the perceived benefit of the effect.

BOO on the sleep!

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I don't really expect too much out of the endurance transfer, but I can't even tell how much it does at all. If it weren't for the little healing-channel messages telling me so, I wouldn't even know I was getting anything at all. I've never actually noticed my stamina bar going up after a hit. So I'm guessing that the inrcease really is as low as two points, as the Negitive damage message would seem to indicate.

According to the battle logs, I get a successful drain about 1-4 times in a decent battle. At this rate, it wouldn't seem unreasonable to get back fiveish points per success. About as much as a tick, I think, and just enough to be noticeable. Or, maybe, let endmod enhancements beef up this part of the power a bit (at the cost of slots, of course).

Though I'd rather keep it as is than reduce damage or whatever to balance it out, though. I just get this feeling of "It dosn't *DO* anything at all" from it.


About Jacobs Ladder: I haven't ever seen it print the "has drained the foo-enemy's endurance" damage message, or visibly drain the target's blue bar; both of which the basic attacks do reliably. The endurance-related aspects of the power seem completly broken.

Also, I use the Ninja Blade and Scrapper Broadsword cone slice-type attacks all the time, and I find it WAY easier to hit at least two if not three enemies with those than with Jacob's. With average human enemies like hellions, they seem to have to be standing shoulder to shoulder with Jacob's, but I can get away with a third to maybe a half of their width between them with the sword attacks.


Last thing I'm wondering about the set so far, is, does thunder strike ever disorient the secondary targets? It dosn't do smashing damage to them, which is what got me wondering, but I haven't had enough time to see if it does yet.

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If the end drain from attacks isn't going to be significant or noticeable then why the hell did it get put in?

/puzzled

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Really, really need some variety on the sound effect for Charged Brawl! Hearing that CHIRPY-chirp sound over and over is very unpleasant.

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Definitely need to add some SMASH! sounds in there somewhere. I like the thunder rumbling/strike idea.