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If you are soft capped on defense, debuffing their toHit isn't another layer of mitigation. It does nothing. Tohit is just the opposite side of defense. The combination of defense and -tohit cannot exceed 45% and be of use (Other than all the exceptions already listed by others in this thread).
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Originally Posted by Tamorand
Wouldn't the -to hit incarnate proc be more beneficial than the fire dot?
Or is the assumption that if I'm using my insp correctly along with all of my accolades and incarnates filled in where they should be, I should't need another level of mitigation? |
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So long as you're at the DEF softcap and the mobs you're fighting don't have additional +ToHit from buffs, then the -ToHit from Diamagnetic Interface isn't necessary.
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Originally Posted by Tamorand
Wouldn't the -to hit incarnate proc be more beneficial than the fire dot?
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Winteriel Ice/Fire/Soul Tanker | @TBoxer Global | City of Heroes R.I.P. (2004-2012)
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Originally Posted by Giant2005
If you are soft capped on defense, debuffing their toHit isn't another layer of mitigation. It does nothing. Tohit is just the opposite side of defense. The combination of defense and -tohit cannot exceed 45% and be of use (Other than all the exceptions already listed by others in this thread).
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Originally Posted by TBoxer
So long as you're at the DEF softcap and the mobs you're fighting don't have additional +ToHit from buffs, then the -ToHit from Diamagnetic Interface isn't necessary.
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Well there goes that brilliant idea - (not so brilliant
)
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While not identical they are very similar and closely related, you are almost correct ... the fine print is going to get you | I think this was the concept I was missing - +def doesn't equate to -to hit and I was viewing them as synonymous, which apparantly isn't the case. |
. With no debuff resistances in the equation equal amounts of -To Hit is the same as +Defense. The "no debuff resistances" is the problem in that statement. That's never the case vs +4's as one is always going to get hit by the Purple Patch scaling at the very least (http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Purple_Patch) and the spawns themselves may also have their own To Hit Debuff resistance as well meaning you'll always need more -To Hit to get the same mitigation as provided by +defense while fighting anything above +0 in relative level to you.Edit: To get technical on myself the purple patch isn't really a proper resistance ... but it always in the equation and is always going to effect to hit debuffs when fighting up level foes.
You should get more use from a small purple, that should be plentiful, than from diamagnetic.
This should be even more true in a farm where you can't possibly debuff all the mobs, and candy is even more plentiful.
Diamagnetic is a 75% chance for a 5% debuff vs +0, vs +4s that will be a 2.5% debuff. Max Stacks X for Duration Y. I don't actually know the stacking limit or duration limit atm, but it should be safe to assume 4 stacks of no more than 10 seconds. Even with a massive AoE build, it's every unlikely that you'd have 4 large area AoE attacks in less than 10 seconds. It's more likely that you'd have only 1 or 2 AoEs in that duration, meaning the max debuff value would be 5% total, and only applied to the targets you hit in a very target rich environment, where those targets also happen to be dead in that same 10 seconds or less. 5% vs 16 mobs for 10 seconds, or 12.5% vs 100 mobs for 60 seocnds. You should be better served by killing the mobs faster and generating candy faster.
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I can do +4x8 missions pretty casually on my Katana/Dark, and I could before any incarnate abilities as well. I DO cherry-pick when I'm playing that way to avoid defense debuffing mobs like Arachnos and Cimerorans. I have a hard core survivability build, though, and merely soft-capping is not a hard core survivability build.|
Originally Posted by Tamorand
Ahh I think that I have gotten the misconception from reading the forums - I always see posters make the statement "Ya I do 4/8 all the time with [fill with random AT]" the casual manner in which I have observed this subject made it seem like with the proper build 4/8 was readily doable.
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So in a sense, yes, with the proper build, even without incarnate powers, +4x8 is readily doable. Your build is not a proper build for such stunts because you have very little healing/regeneration. Fortunately, that's easily addressed by adding Rebirth.
I have a Fire/Shield with stats that are probably in the same ballpark as yours - soft cap, passable resist, no heal. I farm Council at +3x8 on him, but that's really like +2x8 because I have the level shift, and Council are known pushovers. He's capable of +4x8 on that (=+3x8), but it takes more concentration. A real ambush farm would surely tear him apart on +4x8.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
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Usually they're Brutes, Fury really makes the difference on those.|
Originally Posted by Tamorand
Ahh I think that I have gotten the misconception from reading the forums - I always see posters make the statement "Ya I do 4/8 all the time with [fill with random AT]" the casual manner in which I have observed this subject made it seem like with the proper build 4/8 was readily doable.
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My SS/Fire started at +3/x8 w/bosses with no set bonuses, I just used 4 purps to be at 45% def all the time. Since your Fury is so high all the time, plus it boosts the damage aura, inspirations rains. Now my broot is incarnated with loads of recharge (Spiritual and 90% from IOs) and has 30% fire def on his secondary build, only AoEs well slotted and all I do is use a macro to convert every insp to reds.
Same on lowbie farms, after I got the hang of it I got a claws/elec and a claws/fire to 33 in about 4 hours I think. It was a s/l farm that caps at level 3 so I used follow up and Spin on auto (since you get your powers till level 8 in a farm capped at 3) - after each Spin I was filled with insps so I just pressed f1-f5 like mad and that did the trick, that at 0/x8/bosses, entering the farm having used 4 purples and having another 4 when to use again, the farm was over by then and tickets were capped too. The main difference is that on my ss/fire I get more infl since I'm at +4/x8, in the level 3 farm it's more relaxing for me even since there are fewer buttons to press and I can keep Spin on Auto (I click hasten right before entering), on the SS/Fire I have to click Rage, FE, Footstomp, Ball Lightning, E. Fences, etc, on the lowbie farms I just click follow up and keep f1-f5'ing, there are so many insps dropping it doesn't matter, I always end up still capped on def plus some resistance and damage bonuses.
Out of curiosity, I tested the same farm on my 35 db/elec scrapper I leveled normally, used oranges and lucks before entering (I don't bother with oranges on the Brutes even tho their resists are low when exemped to level 3 since slotting doesn't matter in this range), and I just couldn't kill fast enough to get my insp refill so I got shredded. I suspect the fury-boosted damage aura and AoE is kind of a big deal especially in the low level ones where you one-shot everyone with a Spin or Typhoon's. In normal gameplay scraps may outdamage Brutes most of the time, but in those farms Brutes are extremely high on Fury all the time.
I saw some Tankers do 50 farms at +4/x8 and they survive, but they are much slower than Brutes. I think your scrapper, with liberal use of inspirations (oranges to get to 75% res, reds to boost damage) may be able to do it at say, +3 or +2/x8. I'm going to test my Brute at +2 and +3 instead of +4 because at +4 the tickets are capped before the first ambush is over so maybe it'll be faster at a lower setting. I'd also suggest you take a look at non ambush farms, they're slower but there mitigation from your KD attacks will help you much more than ambush ones.
I use :
3 macros to combine reds
1 to eat greens and trashcan reses.
2 to combine purples (for those odd unlucky streaks when no purples at all drop, or if someone else is in-misssion with me)
Wouldn't the -to hit incarnate proc be more beneficial than the fire dot?
Or is the assumption that if I'm using my insp correctly along with all of my accolades and incarnates filled in where they should be, I should't need another level of mitigation?