Grav/FF/Primal - returning old player

Nerhesi123 · 10-13-2011 11:14 AM

A few questions from someone who stopped playing over 1560 days ago (Thats what it said :P)

1) Personal Force Field - slotted up with defence (I guess something 2-3 Defence IOs) - am I still almost unhittable? What is the %defence you need to have to be mostly unhittable nowadays?

2) detoggles.. are they still around? Other than draining endurance, what can detoggle my shields?

3) Holds - do I still need to put like 4-5 holds to actually hold someone now? What is the duration on holds when I finally land them?

4) Are people still dying in under 6 seconds?

7) What else should I need to know about Grav/FF/Primal.. is powerboost not worth it now? Should I switch to something else psi or cold as the epic pool? thanks

hemmingway3 · 10-13-2011 11:25 AM

Defense sucks (for squishies).. Diminishing Returns makes sure of that. Holds are irresistible. After a player is mezzed, he is immune to mez for several seconds. A decent spike will kill someone in < .5 seconds.

Nerhesi123 · 10-13-2011 11:26 AM

Wait - what? Really? Defence sucks? I'm confused as to diminishing returns.

So you can't even get a few seconds of a breather using PFF as a controller anymore?

hemmingway3 · 10-13-2011 11:41 AM

Not really, no. Diminishing Returns is a system implemented with i13. For Controllers or other squishy classes (Corr, Defender, Blaster, MM) it is not mathematically possible (according to the DR curve for that attribute) to get defense much higher than 20%. This much defense is easily erased by a foe's to-hit and accuracy buffs. Versus a poorly built enemy without a to-hit buff, you may see their to-hit rolls drop to as low as 30%, but that would be an exceptionally luck situation for a PFF user.

Typically, you will just die through PFF if your foes are determined.

Fiery-Enforcer · 10-13-2011 11:52 AM

You have to consider elusivity also, which is the main reason PFF is viable to use.

[U][URL="http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=251594"][/URL][/U]

Nerhesi123 · 10-13-2011 12:05 PM

Anywhere I can read up on this stuff and figure out which powers give elusivity and which do not? Because it doesnt appear on mid's CoH Character builder or so

hemmingway3 · 10-13-2011 12:24 PM

A Guide to Diminishing Returns

Understanding DR takes a lot of effort/time. That is on top of understanding the mechanics of this game in the first place.

Nerhesi123 · 10-13-2011 03:19 PM

Thank you - excellent read but I'm having a hard time applying it.

So here I am, as Grav/FF.. and I can stack a whole slew of defenses via dispersion bubble, maneuvers, hover, combat jumping...

So I get the part that according to A and B value, if I have something that is modding my defence by around 0.32 I'm actually only receiving 0.16 out of that due to DR.

Thats per power... so before I start enjoying the ability to circumvent DR by having a whole slew of +defence powers then, I realise DR is then applied on the whole stat as well.. so while I may think that I have several abilities contributing some X% to my defence, those are all actually heavily Diminished as well...

Ok - now where can I find info on elusivity?

DaveMebs · 10-13-2011 03:34 PM

Unless youre on a tank, or maaaybe a widow or something like that, you want to build for +HP. It's the only way of increasing survivability, without getting hit by DR. (Even on tanks, you still want as much HP as possible, but some tanks, like Shield Defense can be really tough to hit when built well.)

On a grav/FF I would definitely take PFF. It isn't amazing and you can still be hit through it, particularly if they use Aim or an equivalent power, but it definitely reduces incoming damage. This is especially the case in RV where people don't run optimal builds.

Nerhesi123 · 10-14-2011 08:31 AM

Thanks - any help on the elusivity business?