Archnemesis - creating more hero verses villian feel


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Posted

one of the big parts of superhero comic book's is the archnemesis. where would spiderman be without the greengoblin? Superman without lex Luthor? Hellboy without rasputin?

at the moment, city of heroes/villans doesn't really capture this feel. sure, you fight alot of different villans as a hero..but they're mostly the archnemesis of one of the other NPC heroes, or one off named villans you never see again. it sometimes feels like your just a background hero in someone elses comic book series.

one of the ideas i'd had about how to alleviate some of this feel is to allow players to designate their own "archnemesis"

this archnemesis would occasionally show up as a radio mission or newspaper mission, where you'd have the opportunity to travel to a spot in one of the zones and fight the archnemesis.

now, the way i see it, you can leverage City of Villans to create your Archnemesis.
basically:

1) an archnemesis is a hero or villan from your own account. so for example, my main character Tyr's Hand could be the archnemesis of my villan character Fenrir Lokison.

2) to qualify as an archnemesis canidate, both hero and villan would have to be over a specific level (not sure what would be best.)

3) for the missions to appear, both character must be within a certain level range of each other. (say, 3-5 levels apart). if the gap is more than this, the missions won't show up until the gap is narrowed.

4) a character can only be the archnemesis of one other character. (simplifies things)

on the "archnemesis missions", the computer runs your archnemesis, using the stats from that character slot as it would be if you were playing it. (same hit points, endurance amounts, powers, etc..)


this would allow players to create an archnemesis...and it would encourage more play redside, since to make an archnemesis you have to create a redside character..and to keep him available, you have to keep playing him.


once this kind of system is in place, many options open up. a "sinister 6" type task force for example, where the task force has to fight a group of their archnemesis's as one mission.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrome guardsman View Post
one of the big parts of superhero comic book's is the archnemesis. where would spiderman be without the greengoblin? Superman without lex Luthor? Hellboy without rasputin?

at the moment, city of heroes/villans doesn't really capture this feel. sure, you fight alot of different villans as a hero..but they're mostly the archnemesis of one of the other NPC heroes, or one off named villans you never see again. it sometimes feels like your just a background hero in someone elses comic book series.

one of the ideas i'd had about how to alleviate some of this feel is to allow players to designate their own "archnemesis"

this archnemesis would occasionally show up as a radio mission or newspaper mission, where you'd have the opportunity to travel to a spot in one of the zones and fight the archnemesis.

now, the way i see it, you can leverage City of Villans to create your Archnemesis.
basically:

1) an archnemesis is a hero or villan from your own account. so for example, my main character Tyr's Hand could be the archnemesis of my villan character Fenrir Lokison.

2) to qualify as an archnemesis canidate, both hero and villan would have to be over a specific level (not sure what would be best.)

3) for the missions to appear, both character must be within a certain level range of each other. (say, 3-5 levels apart). if the gap is more than this, the missions won't show up until the gap is narrowed.

4) a character can only be the archnemesis of one other character. (simplifies things)

on the "archnemesis missions", the computer runs your archnemesis, using the stats from that character slot as it would be if you were playing it. (same hit points, endurance amounts, powers, etc..)


this would allow players to create an archnemesis...and it would encourage more play redside, since to make an archnemesis you have to create a redside character..and to keep him available, you have to keep playing him.


once this kind of system is in place, many options open up. a "sinister 6" type task force for example, where the task force has to fight a group of their archnemesis's as one mission.
There is something like this in CO. I am just praying CoX can make a version of it and allow us to make our arch-nemesis. This game certainly lacks the super enemy feel and it is what I have been hoping to see for years.

As an added incentive, have it for VIP players only; this would create a stronger desire to subscribe.

I have made similar suggestions in the past so let's hope we can get to some of the devs and make this feel more like a supers game.


 

Posted

It's an interesting idea.

The main problem I see is that the game's AI is not bright enough to fully use all the powers of a higher-level character - so having the AI run the Archnemesis would not be a very challenging fight.


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Originally Posted by SpyralPegacyon

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Posted

Last I heard, the devs' position is that the Mission Architect currently fulfills this role in the game, which I think is a damn shame because it doesn't fulfill it very well.

The new phasing tech introduced in Going Rogue and further developed in I21/Freedom could be put to excellent use in conjunction with nemesis (lowercase n!) technology.

On a final note, because I can't help myself:

Quote:
where would spiderman be without the greengoblin?
Probably quite a bit happier.


"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkGob View Post
Probably quite a bit happier.
He wouldn't be(/have been) married to a redhead.


Main Hero: Chad Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1396 Badges
Main Villain: Evil Gulzow-Man (Victory) 50, 1193 Badges
Mission Architect arcs: Doctor Brainstorm's An Experiment Gone Awry, Arc ID 2093

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nethergoat View Post
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Posted

It's a concept certainly worth exploring. There would have to be more than just a handful of arch-nemesis to make it work, to prevent boredom from repetition with each new toon. Perhaps certain steps/actions/choices along the various mission arcs could be used to spin you off on differing paths. Players with 40+ toons across several accounts would only have to face the same nemesis a few times then.

I like that your arch-nemesis might even appear in Radio (Broke out of the Zig again!) or Paper (Vows revenge on player) missions, maybe even to replace, or as an alternate choice of, bank or mayhem missions, that's just cool. It would be helpful, and more fun, if your nemesis leveled up and progressed roughly with you.

I seriously have no clue would this would take code wise, but it's a fun idea and I would love to see it made to work. As Gob mentioned, the phasing technology would seem to be perfect for this with your arch-nemesis might randomly attacking when you are between missions, an ambush with some warning like NPC text or something. (There he is, Get him!). . .


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chad Gulzow-Man View Post
He wouldn't be(/have been) married to a redhead.
True, but even on the night before his wedding he was thinking of Gwen. MJ was kind of a consolation prize in that sense (a very awesome consolation prize, but still).


"You don't lose levels. You don't have equipment to wear out, repair, or lose, or that anyone can steal from you. About the only thing lighter than debt they could do is have an NPC walk by, point and laugh before you can go to the hospital or base." -Memphis_Bill
We will honor the past, and fight to the last, it will be a good way to die...

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Remaugen View Post
It's a concept certainly worth exploring. There would have to be more than just a handful of arch-nemesis to make it work, to prevent boredom from repetition with each new toon. Perhaps certain steps/actions/choices along the various mission arcs could be used to spin you off on differing paths. Players with 40+ toons across several accounts would only have to face the same nemesis a few times then.

I like that your arch-nemesis might even appear in Radio (Broke out of the Zig again!) or Paper (Vows revenge on player) missions, maybe even to replace, or as an alternate choice of, bank or mayhem missions, that's just cool. It would be helpful, and more fun, if your nemesis leveled up and progressed roughly with you.

I seriously have no clue would this would take code wise, but it's a fun idea and I would love to see it made to work. As Gob mentioned, the phasing technology would seem to be perfect for this with your arch-nemesis might randomly attacking when you are between missions, an ambush with some warning like NPC text or something. (There he is, Get him!). . .
It might be cool if your nemesis could be created after level 20 or so, once you're an established super and all that. Perhaps they could make a random slew of missions which feature a random nem from the team. Also have your nem randomly appear in a zone where he causes mayhem and anyone can whoop on him in that zone. Something like that, anyway