So confused, not even sure where/how to start

I've always stayed away from the Kheldians because they seemed overly complicated. Recently, for some reason, I've felt that I need to give them a try. I've spent the last 2 days bumping around the forums and reading the posts, but I'm still not sure how to approach making one.

To start with, other than power differences (one is dark, one is "light" of sorts) I can't figure out what the difference is between Peacebringers and Warshades. Looking at the powers, it seems like PBs might be blasterlike and WSs more controllerish?

The different forms. Are tri-form builds superior to two form or human only? Is one easier to play for a newbie like myself?

Basically, I'm just looking for a foothold to get started and figure these things out so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Plasma's guide in the Kheldian Guides sticky is a good place to start. Despite being written for I8 it stands up surprisingly well to give you a basic idea of how to get started. It is pretty much required reading for anyone new to Kheldians. Keep in mind though that Kheldians are way more awesome now than they were back then in many ways and some formerly human powers like Hasten and the inherents now apply to all the forms.

The main difference between Kheldians is that Peacebringers are better at soloing and in groups tend to make up for the weaknesses in a party thanks to the Cosmic Balance inherent while Warshades can do more damage but are slightly more dependant on being in groups for survivability and while in groups they play to the strengths of a party with the Dark Sustenance inherent.

Another way to look at is that PBs play like Off Tanks while Warshades are more like Brutes or Scrappers (pure damage dealers) except that both have ranged attacks of course.

I think you have that absolutely backwards. Perma eclipsed warshades can solo pretty much anything except AV's on +2/x8 or higher.

As a reference, just a week or so ago my Warshade ran a bunch of Borea missions on +4/x8 with a level 50, also IO'd Peacebringer (played by an experienced player.) To give you an idea of how that went.... When we were almost done with the first mission, he got really excited and said "I hit one!"

I'll give you a good place to start if you're willing to try a shapeshifting Warshade.

Read the guide in my sig.

Warshades have one driving purpose and that is to create more bodies. Bodies give you health, bodies give you endurance, bodies give you pets and bodies give you crashless mini-nukes.

Second only to creating more bodies is finding more live mobs, live mobs give you resistance, live mobs give you endurance, live mobs give you damage, live mobs give you tohit and, most importantly of all, live mobs give you more bodies.

A well built Warshade on a map swarming with mobs is probably the most fun you can have in this game.

Alls I can say is that the only ATs that I've regularly encountered which can outlast a Peacebringer in a firefight are Tanks. Maybe most people with Warshades just never come onto these forums to read the guides or just aren't suited for that kind of edge of your seat style of playing.

When I first unlocked the Kheldians, I made one of each, to see which one I liked better. (Both of them wearing very magicky outfits - my PB with the high-collared magic cape, the WS with the skull mask and baron jacket)

I had a terrible time with my Warshade. I died a half-dozen times on the first mission arc, against regular troops and Void Hunters. I never managed to complete it beforeI got completely fed up. My Peacebringer had no such problems. She tore through enemies like crazy, even the Void Hunters.

Aside from that, I like flying and hovering much better than teleporting, so the Peacebringer had that going for her, too.

I don't play her much, so the Peacebringer is still only in the high teens, but the Warshade was deleted long before he even hit level 5. He never even got to the point of learning Orbiting Death (and I don't think it would have helped me more than Essence Boost, since I was trying to stay at range with both classes).

Did I do something wrong? Possibly. At that level, the two classes are more similar than not, so it should have been equally easy with both of them. Do I want to remake him and try again? ... not really. The Warshade may have the numbers, but I just like the Peacebringer more.

My argument is only that Peacebringers are somewhat easier to play because we get 3 heals by level 22 while Warshades only get 2 and they require corpses or enemies to work and they can actually miss. Also the Eclipse power isn't available until 38 and presumably most players won't have the IOs to make it perma until some time after that. The numbers you refer to don't seem to take into account that the nature of the mitigation available to Warshades requires a little more work while Peacebringers just have to press buttons. I'm actually trying to give you guys a compliment by saying it requires more skill to do what you have done.

Yes I've played a Warshade but haven't gotten one all the way to 50 yet. One of these days!

The way I've always looked at it (and this is admittedly an old-school view) is:

1> All flavors of Kheld require more skill to play well than the basic ATs for several
reasons: The Forms are role-specific mini-ATs in themselves, and are situationally
optimised, so using them well at the right times is vital. Also, some powers work
in forms and some don't and you have to know that and act accordingly - again more
challenging than basic ATs. Khelds have more powers but the same slot count, so
building them is harder - you have to pay more attention to slot allocation.
Finally, Khelds are the *only* ATs that have kryptonite mobs - ie. mobs that are
specifically designed and optimised for killing inexperienced/unwary Khelds and they
show up everywhere you turn - again, more challenging than basic ATs.

2> PeaceBringers are more self-contained. They have no holes they cannot plug
themselves. They are steadier and more consistent in playstyle. That said, the
math is right - they're best at doing standard content at standard difficulty
levels - you don't read about PBs running +4/8 difficulty settings, because it
doesn't happen... Otoh, PBs can be good in PvP because they have all the basic
tools they need to do the job.

3> Warshades are more dependant on external factors, most notably corpses.
When they can generate/obtain what they need, they are capable of amazing
things. When they can't, they're toast. Not surprisingly a WS is generally free rep
in PvP. Typically, they have higher highs and lower lows than a PB. In theory,
those swings should average out with steady PB's from a balance perspective,
but we as players have a tendancy to remember highs (and lows) better
than we do averages...

I disagree with the term "better" wrt to WS vs PB, preferring "different". The
simple math doesn't tell the entire story (although I do feel that PBs specifically
and Khelds in general, could use some Dev attention).

WS to me are like my Rad/Elec defender. When things work, it is awesome and
even red/purple mobs are in trouble. When things go south, even blue mobs
can kill him.

My PB would virtually never die against a spawn of blue mobs, but would virtually
never win against a spawn of red/purples. Whites/Yellows are his bread and butter.

Personally, I like my PBs better than my Shades *because* they're more consistent.
Many folks like Shades better because they are chaotic, with a mix of Epic Victories,
and some Epic Defeats.

YMMV.


Regards,
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