SOs and SFs
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2011-04-01 24:29 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
Haven't personally seen someone rejected and subsequently ridiculed for not having enough set bonuses.
Maybe I'm just good at avoiding teams full of jacktards though, because I have no doubt there are people out there who would engage in such behavior.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Because power equals fun, and the more powerful a character is the more fun she is to play. Well-designed IO builds can take on greater challenges, run into frustrating situations much less frequently, are less reliant on teammates being competent, let you be a lot more flexible with team makeup, and are a way to keep investing and improving a character you love. Minmaxing can be fun all on its own; every build is a logic puzzle where you have to find a balance between budget, concept and performance that you can live with. Build design involves much more strategy than anything in the game itself, requiring good judgement, experience and even creativity (math, not so much - Mids' is there to do the math for you). |
Originally Posted by crayhal
If the game is playable with just SOs, how come people are spending billions on a build, and complaining about the price of purples and pvp IOs?
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IOs are very affordable, even without playing the market or farming. People complain about prices because people will complain about any price that is not completely trivial.
As for people only wanting to play with expensive builds, nothing in the EULA forbids that and they're free to play or not play with whoever they chose. You're free to not join their teams and to put them on ignore.
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Well put. I know i love being able to do any random pug of an LRSF/apex/tin and know if the **** hits the fan i can freakin carry the team on some of my toons. Running pug teams means i get to meet a ton of new people all the time too, rather than some people who say "i only team with people i know, we have been playing since beta." I always figured the point of an MMO is the team with as many people as possible, and there happen to be a lot of bad players out there. IOed builds just means even if you have a few bad apples you can still "win."
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Originally Posted by Laevateinn
Because power equals fun, and the more powerful a character is the more fun she is to play. Well-designed IO builds can take on greater challenges, run into frustrating situations much less frequently, are less reliant on teammates being competent, let you be a lot more flexible with team makeup, and are a way to keep investing and improving a character you love. Minmaxing can be fun all on its own; every build is a logic puzzle where you have to find a balance between budget, concept and performance that you can live with. Build design involves much more strategy than anything in the game itself, requiring good judgement, experience and even creativity (math, not so much - Mids' is there to do the math for you).
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I could name names if that were allowed. I've definitely seen this behavior and, in one particular case, someone that plays on Virtue that posts frequently on the forums these days. I never ever team with these people, but the "bonus elitist" is very real. I have a feeling it happens less on servers other than Freedom and Virtue. In my own experience, playing on 4 servers frequently, it's only those 2 where I find that sort of elitism.
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Originally Posted by DarkGob
I have never seen someone rejected for a TF/SF because they don't have sets. I'm convinced this is a myth propagated by people who don't understand how to use sets.
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Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
Hrm. While I've not seen anyone kicked or not invited for not having IO bonuses, I've seen plenty of equally stupid things so I don't disbelieve it 
While I personally check the global and info of everyone I team with, it's just out of curiosity. Having a lot of bonuses doesn't mean their build is good. You can tell if a build has say, LotG 7.5s or purples. You can't tell much more than that without really reading through it and even then it'll only give you a rough idea of what kind of bonuses they have a lot of.
Heavily IOd build does not necessarily = good build. Anyone who has spent some time looking at builds posted on the forums can tell you that much.
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I never insisted on sets for Mo's. One char I used on a Mo was using level 25 IOs. She was the best fit for the team and I wasn't going to waste time reslotting 50s. We got the Mo too. |
Originally Posted by ultrawatt
The only time I've ever seen any worry about sets is on Mo runs. Even then people generally just want someone they know is not full of suckage.
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The only time I'd look at sets is as a guide to whether an AT might need a bit more support. More so a melee char than a squishy; if they're going to be in the position of cuddling the AV, it's just a case of giving them a bit more oomf. Maybe they don't need it but I'd err on caution anyway. Any scrapper scares me more in general than a non-set build.
I've seen plenty of people setted out the wazoo go down when the more sensible un-setted stayed up because they weren't trying to solo the whole TF. Biggest killer is the "I've got sets" mentality which is currently migrating into "I'm an incarnate".
As for insisting on sets for an ITF ... that's just ...
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I don't care what gets added to this game, HOs, IOs, temp powers... The rules haven't changed before, and even the incarnate stuff won't change them now.
Any build, any budget, no exclusions.
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I don't bother with IO's set or common, until I get past lvl 40. The soonest I do it it lvl 37. The sheer cost of it is insanity sometimes. Particularly the bits you need.
Ive been refused access to TF's but mainly that was due to not having the right Archytype they needed. Not because I didn't have sets.
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Virtue is ok, so far as I have witnessed otherwise, and people like that are not so hard to avoid -- sadly it takes one time dealing with them to get on their /ignore for not being 1337 enough.|
Originally Posted by Deacon_NA
I could name names if that were allowed. I've definitely seen this behavior and, in one particular case, someone that plays on Virtue that posts frequently on the forums these days. I never ever team with these people, but the "bonus elitist" is very real. I have a feeling it happens less on servers other than Freedom and Virtue. In my own experience, playing on 4 servers frequently, it's only those 2 where I find that sort of elitism.
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I have not played on freedom, except maybe to get someone to lvl 5 back in i1/2 days. I assume however it is a good overall server as well.
Perhaps due to size, more so I think due to cross server chat systems, COH is much better knit and, I dont know, polite/mature/help-full then other mmo's I have played. The various elitisms the less gifted players cling to, like the above mentioned Jerk thinking set bonuses really meant something useful in terms of predicting a character/player's effectiveness, I have, gladly, always seen much less of here then with other games (well except maybe RP-snobs on Virtue and it has been some years since I have dealt with or witnessed that).
Maybe that is why those incidents of puerileness, like the OP's information, stick out more, we are not desensitized, numb, or jaded from hours and days of 'Barrens Chat.' Or has it migrated with the new world?
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Back in the dawn days, you know before the controller nerfs and ED, I would get some controller hate both mission teams and TF's. At the same time I got anti-hate with my PB. I was heavily sought as a team mate. Being a kheld meant you had a 50 and knew what was going on. |
Originally Posted by BigBoss Eyepatch
I don't bother with IO's set or common, until I get past lvl 40. The soonest I do it it lvl 37. The sheer cost of it is insanity sometimes. Particularly the bits you need.
Ive been refused access to TF's but mainly that was due to not having the right Archytype they needed. Not because I didn't have sets. |
Both controllers and defenders could have trouble finding teams if they were not Empathy, I still see bits and pieces of that here and around, for the most part it is gone, I hope that the "build police" will *not* rise like a zombie invasion. Fortunately there is no scoring system for set bonuses, AKA the Wow gear score many add ons will provide for you and anyone you click. I refused teams requests with gear minimums, usually being well above the req number.
When forming a team, I often open other characters' info windows and look at their set bonuses while I'm waiting for the team to assemble.
It's never occurred to me to do anything about what I see -- I'm doing it solely out of curiosity. The character description/bio is usually much more interesting...and interestingly enough, although I can't remember doing it, I am prepared to kick someone from the team based on their bio, if it was something horribly racist, for example.
So multiply the cost of a complete Oblit set by 100. And then multiply it again by the number of players on the team. Simple!
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