Just what you needed, another Radiation Melee set idea....
By
AlienMafia,
Posted on: 2011-03-13 24:36 in Suggestions and Ideas
Don't have time this morning to do a full post/response to the conversation, but I do want to throw this out. Would the Tier 7:"Tear Down" power I proposed in my Goofy Melee idea thread be a creative enough idea to replace build up?
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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I've taken a bit of what's been said so far and incorporated a few things. With that in mind I came up with this variation.
- Tier 1; Melee, Minor DMG(Lethal), DoT(Energy), Foe -DEF
- Tier 2; Contaminated Strike - Melee, Moderate DMG (Energy/Smash, Foe Knockdown) Foe -Defense
- Tier 3; Irradiate - PBAoE, Moderate DMG(Lethal), DoT(Energy), Foe -DEF
- Tier 4; Taunt - Ranged, Foe Taunt, -Range
- Tier 5; Radioactive Smash - High Dmg(Melee, Energy/Smash, Foe Knockdown) Foe Disorient, -Defense, -Fly
- Tier 6; Build Up - Self +DMG, +To-Hit
- Tier 7; Electron Haze - Close (Cone), Moderate DMG(Lethal), DoT(Energy), Foe - DEF
- Tier 8; Neutron Cloud - Location PBAoE, Moderate DoT(Energy), Foe -DEF [Up front dmg like Burn, but -Def cloud left behind. Variation on Burn Mechanic, without the DoT]
- Tier 9; Cosmic Pulse - Close Chain AoE(Like Jolting Chain) , MInor (Energy), A cloud of radiation effects the foe next to them. First target receives moderate -res, each proceeding jump the -res gets weaker till it's dissipated.
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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I think it would fit the theme. If it would be well received or balanced, though, I dunno.
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Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
Don't have time this morning to do a full post/response to the conversation, but I do want to throw this out. Would the Tier 7:"Tear Down" power I proposed in my Goofy Melee idea thread be a creative enough idea to replace build up?
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Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
I've taken a bit of what's been said so far and incorporated a few things. With that in mind I came up with this variation.
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Not sure I like the idea of the Tier 9 power to be a chain attack, with a chance to fail after the first hit.
I would suggest reordering things this way.
Tier 1: Melee. minor
Tier 2: Contaminated Strike
Tier 3: Radioactive Smash
Tier 4: Taunt
Tier 5: Atomic Charge; new type of buildup
Tier 6: Solar Wind: Electron Haze graphic, but faster animation: need to remember the kb for the lovely Force Feedback proc
Tier 7: EMP; Handclap type, irradiates aoe high -def, low acc
Tier 8: Atomic Blast; Neurton Bomb animation, but single target This sets Hurl
Tier 9: Pulsar, Irradiate graphic, Footstomp range, possible knockdown
The main thing this set lacks is a overpowered single target attack.
Atomic Charge: not sure how to do this. But I would like to see it be a Rage clone, but with a twist, that while active, the damage swaps from energy/lethal, to all toxic. No real damage buff, but seeing how most of the game has little toxic resistance, that might be the better deal. A similar rage crash could be explained that your atomic structure needs time to readjust after its use, before being able to expell "normal" energy.
Even if it worked like buildup and lasts 10 seconds, with a recharge of around 30 after enhancements, that would be ok as well.
210 50s and still counting!
Speaking of chain attacks, there appears to be some kind of problem with passing on an effect off a dead target, which affects more than just Chain Induction, and indeed affects Assassin's Strike, as well. Personally, I'd push for a solution to that problem (why not through a pseudo-pet, instead of an enemy-granted power?) first before abandoning the concept of a T9 chain power.
More interestingly, though, I've always entertained the notion of a sort of "spreading disease" power, which goes as far back as Star Craft's Terran Science Vessel, which had a radiation infection power which hopped from unit to unit.
I'm not sure such a power would be appropriate for a melee set (unless its effect allowed the character to score criticals or some such), but a power put on an enemy which deals no damage, but has some other negative effect and is able to summon clones of itself to any enemy in AoE range, thereby spreading through a large mass of enemies of potentially unlimited number over potentially unlimited distance, seems like a cool thing to have, at least if said spread weren't too fast.
Just something I thought was interesting to bring up.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Can't believe you actually typed that and *didn't* instantly start thinking up concepts for a 'Chain mini-Fallout' type of mechanic that basically multiplies off of dead foes. It's in Radiation Emissions to a degree...
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Speaking of chain attacks, there appears to be some kind of problem with passing on an effect off a dead target, ...
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See now that sounds more like a job for an Illusion Melee idea, in the same way that the Phantasm pet summons clones of itself.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I'm not sure such a power would be appropriate for a melee set (unless its effect allowed the character to score criticals or some such), but a power put on an enemy which deals no damage, but has some other negative effect and is able to summon clones of itself to any enemy in AoE range, thereby spreading through a large mass of enemies of potentially unlimited number over potentially unlimited distance, seems like a cool thing to have, at least if said spread weren't too fast. |
Looking at the OP, I quite like the thematic idea of an energy melee set that has a -def component. I'm also with the notion that a bit of Build Up does no harm, and that too many gimmicks are annoying.
I'd rather have substance over style any day, which is why I have steered clear of Kinetic Melee (although find myself, inexplicably, with a Dual Pistols Corruptor) because in beta it felt lame and I have far more interesting sets to play with only to realise I don't like them.
Also I saw a point being made about melee sets with blast powers - Fire and Ice melee have ranged attacks, so it's not unheard of at all. Okay so the cone is not as good as the blast set, but then why would it be? It's a melee set.
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When I first started thinking about this Radiation Melee set I'd planned on incorporating the "Tear Down" as the inverse build up. I decided it fit the other melee set well enough that I used it there, and didn't want to recycle it here.
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Originally Posted by Leo_G
I think it would fit the theme. If it would be well received or balanced, though, I dunno.
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Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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I wouldn't include "a chance to fail" on the chaining, but would include a marker so that any foe couldn't be hit with the -res again. Once the -res got low enough it would stop chaining/propagating.
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Originally Posted by Charnage
Not sure I like the idea of the Tier 9 power to be a chain attack, with a chance to fail after the first hit.
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Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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I haven't played Radiation Emission to high enough levels to know what Fallout does, on account of it not existing for Masterminds |
Originally Posted by Leo_G
Can't believe you actually typed that and *didn't* instantly start thinking up concepts for a 'Chain mini-Fallout' type of mechanic that basically multiplies off of dead foes. It's in Radiation Emissions to a degree...
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But, sure, I have no reason to argue against this.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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The "chance to fail" doesn't refer to a hit roll percentage, it refers to the problem wherein if the target of the attack dies, the attack doesn't "jump." This is because powers like Chain Induction actually grant a passive power to the character affected, which the character immediately fires on the nearest enemy, deals damage and grants that following character the power which represents the next step in the chain. If one step in the chain dies, then its passive power doesn't fire.
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Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
I wouldn't include "a chance to fail" on the chaining, but would include a marker so that any foe couldn't be hit with the -res again. Once the -res got low enough it would stop chaining/propagating.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I haven't played Radiation Emission to high enough levels to know what Fallout does, on account of it not existing for Masterminds
But, sure, I have no reason to argue against this. |
Fallout
Post-Defeat: PBAoE, Extreme DMG(Energy), Debuff
After an ally falls in battle, you can activate this power to extract the energy from their body to deal a massive amount of Energy damage to any nearby foes. All affected foes are extremely weakened by the Fallout, and their chance to hit, Defense, Damage and Damage Resistance is severely reduced. Damage: Extreme, Recharge: Very Long
[Defender = 222 Energy dmg, ToHit -30%, Def -30%, Dmg -30%, Res -50%; requires fallen teammate]
Granted, that's a *HUGE* effect (it does more damage than their nukes) but requires a dead *teammate*. Switching it around to requiring a dead foe would require toning down the effect greatly, especially if the effect 'stacked' with each dead foe. So 2 thoughts I had in mind:
-OP's 'jumping' power could simply have a progressively less chance to jump to a dead foe with at most 10 times. So hit a foe and you could see upwards of 10 pulses of [insert balanced effect] to those in range of the dead foes (to help balance, you could make the range of this short like 8ft).
-Another variation using the Carrion Creeper type mechanic. Using the attack simply spawns a 'pet' that will cast [insert effect] off of dead enemies until the pet expires. To balance this, I'd probably limit the effect to a debuff of some kind rather than damage.
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I wasn't responding to you Samuel but to Charnage's comment about "chance to hit" in a tier 9 chain since, if I recall correctly, there's still an acc check on each progressive chain. |
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
The "chance to fail" doesn't refer to a hit roll percentage, it refers to the problem wherein if the target of the attack dies, the attack doesn't "jump." This is because powers like Chain Induction actually grant a passive power to the character affected, which the character immediately fires on the nearest enemy, deals damage and grants that following character the power which represents the next step in the chain. If one step in the chain dies, then its passive power doesn't fire.
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If instead of using a chain mechanic, the -res portion could be a location AoE set of pets. Each progressive pet summoned another pet that did a larger AoE with less -res and tagged to not stack with each other. The last of the set had the largest circumference, but did the weakest -res and didn't summon another pet.
For example; the first pet could do a 8 sec. -20% resist 8' AoE. Two seconds later it summoned one that did a 6 sec. -15% 12' AoE. Two seconds after that the new pet did a 4 sec. -10% 16' AoE, etc. The animation would be a rolling cloud of some sort.
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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Using pseudo-pets to implement chain attacks is something I've been suggesting for some time, so I agree. I'm not sure what the practical applications of that would be, however, as Standard Code Rant applies. But I do agree nevertheless.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Ok. Now that I've had time to get back to this I'll throw out one last version. Well, at least my last version in this thread. 
I understand the arguments against using lethal dmg, but I still think it can apply to this set. Sorry if it's too "outside the box", but I still would like it in. For me Radiation could be Energy, Lethal and/or Toxic and still fit thematically.
As I admitted in one of my other posts here, I'd originally planned on having the "Tear Down" power in this set but had used it elsewhere. I'm throwing it back in as it still fits thematically. I would imagine it being a PBAoE version of Bruising. It would stack with bruising, but not stack with other "Tear Down".
I've also changed my mind about the Tier 8 power. I would want the new version to be a 5 step PBAoE, with the steps being fairly quick. Each step would be a DoT PBAoE that would progressively get wider. The DMG would stack so that the closer Foes would be damaged more. I'm imagining it looking like a spreading cloud of damage, not a quick burst like Shield Charge. I'm not sure how it could be done mechanically within the game. Anyway, here you go. Hope you like it.
Radiation Melee Set 3-22-11
- Tier 1; Melee, Minor DMG (Lethal), DoT (Energy), Foe -DEF
- Tier 2; Contaminated Strike - Melee, Moderate DMG (Energy/Smash, Foe Knockdown) Foe -Defense
- Tier 3; Irradiate - PBAoE, Moderate DMG (Lethal), DoT (Energy), Foe -DEF
- Tier 4; Taunt - Ranged, Foe Taunt, -Range
- Tier 5; Radioactive Smash - Melee, High DMG (Energy/Smash, Foe Knockdown), Foe Disorient, -Defense, -Fly
- Tier 6; "Tear down", PBAoE -DEF all, -Resist All. Minor DMG(Energy)
- Tier 7; Electron Haze - Close (Cone), Moderate DMG (Lethal), DoT (Energy), Foe - DEF
- Tier 8; Cloud Bloom -PBAoE, Superior DoT (Energy), Foe -DEF *(see explanation above)
- Tier 9; Cosmic Burst - Close(Single Target) , High DoT (Energy), Foe -DEF
Thanks again everyone for the conversation and feedback.
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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Looks good, let's play it!!
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To be honest I've never really paid too much attention to the effects powers have, but in my opinion radiation sets should weaken opponents as well as damage them. |
Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
Ok. Now that I've had time to get back to this I'll throw out one last version. Well, at least my last version in this thread.
I understand the arguments against using lethal dmg, but I still think it can apply to this set. Sorry if it's too "outside the box", but I still would like it in. For me Radiation could be Energy, Lethal and/or Toxic and still fit thematically. As I admitted in one of my other posts here, I'd originally planned on having the "Tear Down" power in this set but had used it elsewhere. I'm throwing it back in as it still fits thematically. I would imagine it being a PBAoE version of Bruising. It would stack with bruising, but not stack with other "Tear Down". I've also changed my mind about the Tier 8 power. I would want the new version to be a 5 step PBAoE, with the steps being fairly quick. Each step would be a DoT PBAoE that would progressively get wider. The DMG would stack so that the closer Foes would be damaged more. I'm imagining it looking like a spreading cloud of damage, not a quick burst like Shield Charge. I'm not sure how it could be done mechanically within the game. Anyway, here you go. Hope you like it. Radiation Melee Set 3-22-11
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Maybe Health and Stamina could get a minor debuff which gets cumulatively larger with each successful attack/exposure. This could simulate prolonged exposure to radiation having a progressively negative impact.
But feel free to ignore my rambling.
Im currently working on a Radiation Melee/armor myself. Im going to make a thematic set and it will pull powers from multiple sets throughout the game. Im really loving my ideas atm and they just keep spewing out. I will post when i have it all said and done. With descriptions and everything.
Im getting goosebumps thinking about it and i cant wait till i get home to work on it.
Also its just a rangle plot...dont listen to anything he says cause its part of his master plan. Rangle i would like to get in contact with u to put this power set together and send it to the Devs as a final piece. They will love it.
The melee will work off of the armor when combined. Im plnning on a type of Rage power for the "Build Up" but it wont work the same way as the actual Rage. I will work along side the "Radiation" idea.
Trust me everyone. So far i cant stop thinking about it. And cant wait till i set up and entire thread on my idea. When i post it i would like some feedback.
Thorns - Spines/Willpower Scrapper (1366 Badges)
I did also suggest a very basic, no-frills hammer set in the past. In my head, I kind of combined the two concepts and came up with what I thought was a completely fictional concept. I apologise if it sounded like I was mocking you. I really wasn't.
That is, unless we're talking about a very long-duration buff, but at that point we're running into the problem of emulating Rage, itself.
I can say this, though - large but diminishing buff does not sound like a bad idea.