Question...


Arcanaville

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarrate View Post
True, but you can slot Confront in many ways...
(Note: I've always done the brute force "stand in his face" approach, so I've never tried it the 'sneaky' way..)
Confront slotted for ED capped range puts you at a little over 105ft and one can now boost the range further if one really wanted via a Cardiac Core Boost.

I have seen a Fire/Shield scrapper kite (and I think using confront) the bajeebus out of him, basically jousting back and forth at the rear of the map while the team took on the towers, constantly encouraging LR to a game of chase the scrapper. There were a couple of mad scrambles when LR decided, briefly, the scrapper wasn't interesting enough but he was able to keep his attention and live long enough for the team to take out the towers without undue delay or stress.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doomguide View Post
Confront slotted for ED capped range puts you at a little over 105ft and one can now boost the range further if one really wanted via a Cardiac Core Boost.
Looks like ~109.2 ft (70 * 1.56). Of course, you don't have to stop at 3 slots, after all.
[edit: Oh, and that's with SOs, not generic IOs.]


 

Posted

Sorry for being late to this, i rarely frequent scrapper section but it was done before these forums were merged on eu servers in order to get the first all scrapper tf done. There were about 5 defeats across the whole stf. Method used would still work now and thats why i damn well think an all Scrapper team can Mo the STF yet. The sneaky way mentioned would be really quite unreliable now for an Mo.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by New Dawn View Post
Sorry for being late to this, i rarely frequent scrapper section but it was done before these forums were merged on eu servers in order to get the first all scrapper tf done. There were about 5 defeats across the whole stf. Method used would still work now and thats why i damn well think an all Scrapper team can Mo the STF yet. The sneaky way mentioned would be really quite unreliable now for an Mo.
I figured out how to do it (and I've done it for a MoSTF)...Hover + taunt.


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

Arcanaville iirc mentioned to me that the AI was fixed so that you couldn't just do that not without chasing any running, you could have immobs. If you were to try an all scrapper one anyway, different scrappers will have various threat levels that might overcome yours with the taunt as the range, the further away you are means less threat. So you might need the other scrappers not running their auras at all, perhaps not even using +dam powers.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by New Dawn View Post
Arcanaville iirc mentioned to me that the AI was fixed so that you couldn't just do that not without chasing any running, you could have immobs. If you were to try an all scrapper one anyway, different scrappers will have various threat levels that might overcome yours with the taunt as the range, the further away you are means less threat. So you might need the other scrappers not running their auras at all, perhaps not even using +dam powers.
Well, what I'd do is Hover above Recluse, then move straight down untill Confront activates, then hold the position.

As long as he doesn't resist the taunt 3 times in a row, he doesn't leave me, and basically runs around in a small circle trying to get at me.

Another is to stay high, but he runs up the pole then jumps as you, lands and repeats.

All tactics I've used so far to keep Recluse busy while others take down the towers.


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by New Dawn View Post
Arcanaville iirc mentioned to me that the AI was fixed so that you couldn't just do that not without chasing any running
I don't recall saying that specifically about Recluse. AI has been tweaked in a couple of ways within the last year or so, but I don't have information on the specific AI Recluse uses which might be different from the standard AI. In either case, I don't think anything that's changed recently would affect taunting directly, at least not that I'm aware of.

The main change to AI I'm aware of is that standard critters should no longer, or only rarely, stand around with loads of powers recharged while puzzled over which one would be the best one to use, and as a result use none of them or the same one over and over. You used to be able to run around in circles about a critter or group of critters and they would often just stare at you and not know what to do about it. They should now just shoot you in the face and figure it out later.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
Well, what I'd do is Hover above Recluse, then move straight down untill Confront activates, then hold the position.

As long as he doesn't resist the taunt 3 times in a row, he doesn't leave me, and basically runs around in a small circle trying to get at me.

Another is to stay high, but he runs up the pole then jumps as you, lands and repeats.

All tactics I've used so far to keep Recluse busy while others take down the towers.
That tactic has been in play in RV since RV has existed, just pull to an apex, except not on Scirroco as he flies without -fly and used by me once on a scrapper back in well before these US, EU forums merged, two years later someone blabbed in the tanky section about it but it's actually "not how most tankers like to tank" so easily got forgotten by people.

From what I thought Arcanaville said, I thought they would just run around like headless chickens now or go off. Long time since I'd needed to bother with it as I personally resort to trying to make what is there in the team useful I haven't used that method for a flipping long time.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
I don't recall saying that specifically about Recluse. AI has been tweaked in a couple of ways within the last year or so, but I don't have information on the specific AI Recluse uses which might be different from the standard AI. In either case, I don't think anything that's changed recently would affect taunting directly, at least not that I'm aware of.
Well i pretty sure your wording was slightly different. I am thinking that it was in a thread that had a completely different topic from the OP and it got locked because the OP asked for it to be as people (like us) were off topic. I tried looking for it, but it made me believe that the sneaky way was dodgy to use from then on, not that I needed it.

Since the beginning of CoV, all Tankers, all Scrappers with Taunt or Confront, could of tanked the STF/RV like cake. Back with SOs it took one more than 3 range slots, 114ft of range would do, meaning the rest could be taunt duration and allow them to comfortably tank LR, not one of the Arachnos AVs unlike the Praetorian AVs would exceed 110ft in range and all could be -flied (selftaught this way back then).

In them days when COV just came out there were tankers without taunt, who'd scoff at taunt, laugh at people who had it, let alone as much as 6 slotted it, the same tankers were struggling to tank an STF and were whining. I thought it was funny at the time, the very thing that would solve their problem, the thing that would give them the easiest solution to an obvious problem no matter what the team make up, they was saying was useless. Just because they couldn't find a good use of a power they thought nobody else could.

That sneaky way (extreme kiting I called it) is not for everyone idea as people like their heroes to look heroic when playing and do damage. Sometimes though one person has to sacrifice their damage in order for the majority to do more.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by New Dawn View Post
That tactic has been in play in RV since RV has existed, just pull to an apex, except not on Scirroco as he flies without -fly and used by me once on a scrapper back in well before these US, EU forums merged, two years later someone blabbed in the tanky section about it but it's actually "not how most tankers like to tank" so easily got forgotten by people.

From what I thought Arcanaville said, I thought they would just run around like headless chickens now or go off. Long time since I'd needed to bother with it as I personally resort to trying to make what is there in the team useful I haven't used that method for a flipping long time.
I'm sure it's not a tactic a lot of hardcore tankers like to use.

Personally, I prefere that tactic over "I need this and this and this to tank a STF"

When a tank says "I need an Empath to tank Recluse" I just stick out my tongue and giggle.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
I'm sure it's not a tactic a lot of hardcore tankers like to use.

Personally, I prefere that tactic over "I need this and this and this to tank a STF"

When a tank says "I need an Empath to tank Recluse" I just stick out my tongue and giggle.
Heh, I've never considered an Emp essential for anything other than the old school Hami raid. I just got off a STF with my SD/Fire tanker... I didn't have any issues and I was tag-teaming most of the TF with my buddie's Stone/Fire. I did let him take LR, but I could have done it with my SD if I'd needed. We had a team with few debuffs and lower than average damage so it took a bit longer than normal but it was a very smooth run with only 6 deaths.

I've tanked the STF with Invuln, Stone and SD personally and been on teams with Ice, Fire and Dark tanks. All of them are able to handle the job... admittedly some need more outside assistance than others but a good player with a good build can handle it regardless of primary. I've yet to have an Elec or WP on a STF but I can't imagine they couldn't do it given a competent build and player and some assistance from the team.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Call Me Awesome View Post
Heh, I've never considered an Emp essential for anything other than the old school Hami raid. I just got off a STF with my SD/Fire tanker... I didn't have any issues and I was tag-teaming most of the TF with my buddie's Stone/Fire. I did let him take LR, but I could have done it with my SD if I'd needed.
I think one of the main problems is his [lord recluse.channelgun]. Many tank primaries don't have the necessary resistance to this end/recovery sapping, and if you're doing it without outside buffs (or constant transference), tanks like SD are going to fall fairly quickly.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Iggy_Kamakaze View Post
I hate to be the bringer of bad news... but Willpower sucks!!! you're better off rolling a regen
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=260718
^Professional Katana/regen build thread

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandX View Post
I'm sure it's not a tactic a lot of hardcore tankers like to use.

Personally, I prefere that tactic over "I need this and this and this to tank a STF"

When a tank says "I need an Empath to tank Recluse" I just stick out my tongue and giggle.
I agree that if its the only option to get a team make up thru its a good option to be able to achieve. All my tanks fly, all my tanks 6 slot taunt, so I myself always have that option. This is why if I were to redesign the game I would wipe the whiteboard clean. I'd want different team make ups to only need to use different tactics, timing, positioning and lose the need for an extreme kiting does all as an option. That option works well for Trick Archery which is effective if it is seen just as much as a controller as a debuffer. We should be playing differently on account of what defender we've got anyway and this would especially show around AVs.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by New Dawn View Post
I agree that if its the only option to get a team make up thru its a good option to be able to achieve. All my tanks fly, all my tanks 6 slot taunt, so I myself always have that option. This is why if I were to redesign the game I would wipe the whiteboard clean. I'd want different team make ups to only need to use different tactics, timing, positioning and lose the need for an extreme kiting does all as an option. That option works well for Trick Archery which is effective if it is seen just as much as a controller as a debuffer. We should be playing differently on account of what defender we've got anyway and this would especially show around AVs.
I actually like the fly and taunt option, as it means the rest of the team is concentrating on the towers, and therefore, taking them down faster, rather than 1-3 members out (the tank and how many ever needs to support the tank) with less people on the towers.

More and more people however are making tanks that can stand up to Recluse on their own (or their own and just inspiration usage), but there's stil a lot out there who need the backup.


BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection

 

Posted

When I ran an All Scrapper STF it was indeed a Katana/Inv that tanked Recluse, although, I'm fairly certain he used Inspirations to do it.