Quote:
I, for one, wouldn't burn a respect just to take Salt Crystals. The difference between Salt Crystals and Stalagmites is only 4 levels so it's not like it's a long, brutal haul. I would only consider SC for a solo build or a mule for purples.|
Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
So, I made a new Troller on Pinnacle name Molten Moira. She is Stone Control/Thermal Radiation, and a real lowbie (only 10 at the time Im writing this). I've played Scrappers, Blasters, and Defenders for years, but Im relatively new to playing controllers, and was wondering if anyone had any specific advice for a troller with this power set (any advice on powers, general gameplay, etc). So far my plan is to get all Stone powers besides Quicksand and Stone Prison (I chose Salt Crystals. I know AoE sleep isnt great, but I wanted it for some crowd control at a low lvl, and I'm respeccing out when I have stalagmites and earthquake), and get all thermal powers except melt armor, as stone control does decent defence Debuff unless I'm mistaken, and heat exhaustion. I'm unfamiliar with controller epic pools, so if someone could list all the stone and fire mastery powers for trollers, I'd apprectiate that as well. If you see any flaws in that plan, or have any advice whatsoever, please reply. Thanks!
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Also, Quicksand is a massive 25% defense debuff and -runspeed. It's definitely worth taking, but requires a bit of thought in early levels. Drop it at a corner and pull the enemy around. Then everyone with Sands of Mu has a nice tightly bunched group with lowered defense to smash in the face.
Heat Exhaustion is a good power for AV and GM fights and is generally useful even for bosses. Bear in mind that in addition to a -regen debuff on par with Lingering Radition, it also debuffs damage by 50% (though this is resisted at times). Also, Melt Armor is more than just a defense debuff. It also debuffs resistance, which you could consider as a damage buff for the whole team. It's also the only place outside of earthquake that you would be able to slot the very good Achilles' Heel: -resistance proc outside of Earthquake.
As for epics, here's a quick rundown of the two you were thinking off.
Stone Mastery
+ High smashing/lethal defense-based armor.Fire Mastery
+ Good AoE attack with chance to stun.
+ Self-heal in Earth's Embrace.
+ Very strong melee attack that is also a mag 4 hold.
- Rock Armor is ugly and blocks your costume.
- Hurl Boulder is very slow.
+ Fireball!I generally like Stone Mastery with Earth Control for the chance to stack stuns and it does some decent damage. The armor also helps a lot with survivability. Fire Mastery offers a bit better AoE damage with Fireball. Being able to self-rez and rez others will help to keep everyone on their feet. Consume is nice, considering Earth Contol's heavy endurance costs. Both are pretty good choices.
+ Fireblast is a good single target blast.
+ Consume helps with endurance management.
+ Rise of the Phoenix.
- Resistance base armor.
Goodness, don't skip melt armor or heat exhaustion. With inspiration combining nowadays the rezz can be skipped or saved for 49 as it's really not that useful except for late game raids and/or TFs.
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
Quote:
I suggest you take a look at my Earth/Rad guide for a lot of advice on the Earth Control (not Stone) powerset. It includes a fair amount of strategy suggestions, too.|
Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
So, I made a new Troller on Pinnacle name Molten Moira. She is Stone Control/Thermal Radiation, and a real lowbie (only 10 at the time Im writing this). I've played Scrappers, Blasters, and Defenders for years, but Im relatively new to playing controllers, and was wondering if anyone had any specific advice for a troller with this power set (any advice on powers, general gameplay, etc). So far my plan is to get all Stone powers besides Quicksand and Stone Prison (I chose Salt Crystals. I know AoE sleep isnt great, but I wanted it for some crowd control at a low lvl, and I'm respeccing out when I have stalagmites and earthquake), and get all thermal powers except melt armor, as stone control does decent defence Debuff unless I'm mistaken, and heat exhaustion. I'm unfamiliar with controller epic pools, so if someone could list all the stone and fire mastery powers for trollers, I'd apprectiate that as well. If you see any flaws in that plan, or have any advice whatsoever, please reply. Thanks!
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Personally, I feel that Quicksand in one of the lesser understood great powers in the Earth Control powerset. It is a location-targetted AoE slow with a HUGE defense debuff of 25%. It has many strategic uses -- lay it on the ground at a corner, then have a teammate pull; as the foes come running, they bunch up at the edge of Quicksand, are grouped nicely as sitting ducks with that large defense debuff, ready to be slaughtered by AoE damage from your teammates. And if the foes are strung out a bit, it stays there still working as each new foe shows up.
I use Quicksand constantly -- for each of the three AoE controls in the Earth set (Stalagmites+Stone Cages, Earthquake, Volcanic Gasses), I throw Quicksand underneath each one, both to debuff defense and catch any foes who might escape the AoE. I would say that Quicksand has far, far more great uses than Salt Crystals.
Salt Crystals looks great, but it is PB AoE when every other control in Earth Control is ranged. It is a one-shot, so any foes not in range or missed will not be affected. Compare this to Quicksand, Earthquake and Volcanic Gasses, which keep working for a while. Salt Crystals is a sleep, where all your teammates will waste your efforts by waking up the foes. Compare that to Quicksand, where the foes will still be caught in the Slow and Debuff after they have been attacked.
Stone Prison is skippable unless you plan to solo your Earth Controller, which is generally not a great idea. I would suggest planning to skip Stone Prison and Salt Crystals from Earth, and the rez from Thermal.
As for the APP sets, Earth is really melee oriented -- if you plan to play from range, Earth may not be the best choice. Fissure is very short ranged, and Seismic Smash is a great melee attack. Fire is good ranged damage, and has the only self-rez available to Controllers. Ice, Psi and Primal all have their good points, too.
LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
Ill be referring to just about everything you all said, so I wont bother with quoting.
As far as the concern about burning a respec on Salt Crystals, I dont have much of an issue with respecs. I have a few from my veteran rewards (51 months), and I always do the respec trials whether I need one or not.
And about slotting the Achilles Heel Enhancement, I never bother with IO sets and bonuses. They are FAR too expensive for me, and in my opinion, make a boring Uber Character if too many are used.
Thanks guys, I didnt really look at quicksand too closely, didnt realize it had the debuff to more than speed. I still plan to take the rez, however, due to it's power as an AoE damage attack and the untouchable bonus. That, and I like the idea of being able to self rez with fire mastery and rez the tank or other buffer who has a rez if S**t hits the fan and the entire team goes down. So now I think Im taking Fire Mastery (not completely for effects, I love the sound of both sets, but fire suits the toon better) and I'm getting the self-rez and Consume (All of my toons have above average endurance issues for some reason, so consume would help a great deal). I'm not sure about the heat exhaustion (It's a long time away, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it), but I'm definitely taking Melt Armor.
Lastly, Local_Man, I had planned to skip stone prison and respec out of salt crystals (though I dont regret choosing it so far, its been moderately useful at these really low levels, but I know its quite useless at higher levels). And as for your comment on APPs, Im choosing fire for sure, because if I have the melee power of stone, I WILL overuse it (as Ive mentioned, Ive played scrappers and melee based blasters for years, Im stuck in that play style) and I WILL get killed. Im also aware that Psi, Ice, and Primal have great powers, but they dont come close to suiting this character.
Thanks for the advice, all of you.
Quote:
But it's so much fun to corpse-bomb with it! >.> |
Originally Posted by MentalMaden
Goodness, don't skip melt armor or heat exhaustion. With inspiration combining nowadays the rezz can be skipped or saved for 49 as it's really not that useful except for late game raids and/or TFs.
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Though I would make one other point - consider using your dual builds. When teaming, grab your build with the shields, rez, etc. When you're solo, use those slots that would go for "team powers" for stuff to help *your* survivability (or that fit your concept better) - Leadership, Stealth, Presence, whatever you want. Thermal can free up quite a bit in a solo build. (Or at least put them off, since as earth/therm, you'll probably decide to buff Rocky at some point. Still, he doesn't need a rez.)
I have a Earth/Therm, and this is the path he took (showing only power picks, no slotting). I left the level 30 power open as a free pick for you (I took Super Speed with it, but Recall Friend works well here too).
The powers I skipped are the single target immob, Salt Crystals, and the ally-version of Rise of the Phoenix. I also skipped the epic armor and favor of the self rezz power. Believe it or not, for teaming, I actually find I play better without the armor sapping at my endurance. Objectively speaking the armor only guards me against one or two extra hits, and then only if they happen to be smash/lethal attacks. I find that if someone can't save me in time it's actually far better, as the healer-ish character, to die and dump aggro, then pop back up when it's safe to do so. Your mileage may vary with this technique.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 48 Magic Controller
Primary Power Set: Earth Control
Secondary Power Set: Thermal Radiation
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Speed
Ancillary Pool: Fire Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Fossilize -- (A)
Level 1: Warmth -- (A)
Level 2: Stone Cages -- (A)
Level 4: Thermal Shield -- (A)
Level 6: Quicksand -- (A)
Level 8: Cauterize -- (A)
Level 10: Plasma Shield -- (A)
Level 12: Stalagmites -- (A)
Level 14: Hurdle -- (A)
Level 16: Health -- (A)
Level 18: Earthquake -- (A)
Level 20: Stamina -- (A)
Level 22: Hasten -- (A)
Level 24: Thaw -- (A)
Level 26: Volcanic Gasses -- (A)
Level 28: Forge -- (A)
Level 30: [Empty]
Level 32: Animate Stone -- (A)
Level 35: Heat Exhaustion -- (A)
Level 38: Melt Armor -- (A)
Level 41: Fire Ball -- (A)
Level 44: Fire Blast -- (A)
Level 47: Consume -- (A)
Level 49: Rise of the Phoenix -- (A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- (A)
Level 1: Sprint -- (A)
Level 2: Rest -- (A)
Level 1: Containment
Quote:
For the record, I did take it at 49 on my Ill/Therm. But I wouldn't go so far as to say, having it makes a build "team friendly".....maybe "friendlier". |
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
But it's so much fun to corpse-bomb with it! >.>
Though I would make one other point - consider using your dual builds. When teaming, grab your build with the shields, rez, etc. When you're solo, use those slots that would go for "team powers" for stuff to help *your* survivability (or that fit your concept better) - Leadership, Stealth, Presence, whatever you want. Thermal can free up quite a bit in a solo build. (Or at least put them off, since as earth/therm, you'll probably decide to buff Rocky at some point. Still, he doesn't need a rez.) |
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
Quote:
What other pools (non epic) are you taking, just curious. With what you are saying you should be able to comfortably fit everything in, but you seem to be fighting taking certain powers. In other words, what are you going to take instead of.....[blank].
|
Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
Ill be referring to just about everything you all said, so I wont bother with quoting.
As far as the concern about burning a respec on Salt Crystals, I dont have much of an issue with respecs. I have a few from my veteran rewards (51 months), and I always do the respec trials whether I need one or not. And about slotting the Achilles Heel Enhancement, I never bother with IO sets and bonuses. They are FAR too expensive for me, and in my opinion, make a boring Uber Character if too many are used. Thanks guys, I didnt really look at quicksand too closely, didnt realize it had the debuff to more than speed. I still plan to take the rez, however, due to it's power as an AoE damage attack and the untouchable bonus. That, and I like the idea of being able to self rez with fire mastery and rez the tank or other buffer who has a rez if S**t hits the fan and the entire team goes down. So now I think Im taking Fire Mastery (not completely for effects, I love the sound of both sets, but fire suits the toon better) and I'm getting the self-rez and Consume (All of my toons have above average endurance issues for some reason, so consume would help a great deal). I'm not sure about the heat exhaustion (It's a long time away, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it), but I'm definitely taking Melt Armor. Lastly, Local_Man, I had planned to skip stone prison and respec out of salt crystals (though I dont regret choosing it so far, its been moderately useful at these really low levels, but I know its quite useless at higher levels). And as for your comment on APPs, Im choosing fire for sure, because if I have the melee power of stone, I WILL overuse it (as Ive mentioned, Ive played scrappers and melee based blasters for years, Im stuck in that play style) and I WILL get killed. Im also aware that Psi, Ice, and Primal have great powers, but they dont come close to suiting this character. Thanks for the advice, all of you. |
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
I'm not sure what advice I have that hasn't already been covered. I just wanted to share my build because I like making builds and they are fun. My Earth/Thermal is only level 37 currently. This is the build I'm following (tho I won't have this slotting until level 50, if I get there). I strictly team with him, so that may not be your cup of tea.
Lewis
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.601
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Earth Magic: Level 50 Magic Controller
Primary Power Set: Earth Control
Secondary Power Set: Thermal Radiation
Power Pool: Speed
Power Pool: Fitness
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Fire Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Fossilize -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(3), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(3), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(17), EoCur-Acc/Hold/Rchg(17), Lock-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(21)
Level 1: Warmth -- Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(A), Dct'dW-EndRdx/Rchg(7), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(7), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Dct'dW-Heal(40)
Level 2: Thermal Shield -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(9), ResDam-I(9)
Level 4: Stone Cages -- Enf'dOp-Acc/Rchg(A), Enf'dOp-EndRdx/Immob(5), Enf'dOp-Acc/EndRdx(5), Enf'dOp-Immob/Rng(46), Enf'dOp-Acc/Immob/Rchg(50)
Level 6: Quicksand -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Hasten -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(37), RechRdx-I(37)
Level 10: Plasma Shield -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(11), ResDam-I(11)
Level 12: Stalagmites -- Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(A), Stpfy-EndRdx/Stun(13), Stpfy-Acc/EndRdx(13), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(15), Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(15), Rope-Acc/Stun/Rchg(21)
Level 14: Super Speed -- QckFt-EndRdx/RunSpd(A)
Level 16: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 18: Earthquake -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(19), RechRdx-I(19)
Level 20: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A)
Level 22: Stamina -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(23), EndMod-I(23)
Level 24: Cauterize -- Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(A), Dct'dW-EndRdx/Rchg(25), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(25), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Dct'dW-Heal(40)
Level 26: Volcanic Gasses -- BasGaze-Acc/Hold(A), BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(27), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(27), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(29), EoCur-Acc/Hold/Rchg(29), Lock-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(31)
Level 28: Forge -- AdjTgt-ToHit(A), AdjTgt-ToHit/Rchg(31), AdjTgt-ToHit/EndRdx/Rchg(31), AdjTgt-Rchg(50), AdjTgt-EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 30: Thaw -- S'fstPrt-ResKB(A)
Level 32: Animate Stone -- ExRmnt-Acc/Rchg(A), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg(33), ExRmnt-Dmg/EndRdx(33), ExRmnt-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(33), BldM'dt-Acc/Dmg(34)
Level 35: Heat Exhaustion -- Acc-I(A), Acc-I(36), RechRdx-I(36), RechRdx-I(36), EndRdx-I(37)
Level 38: Melt Armor -- AnWeak-DefDeb(A), AnWeak-Acc/DefDeb(39), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg(39), AnWeak-DefDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(39), AnWeak-Acc/Rchg/EndRdx(40), UndDef-DefDeb/Rchg(43)
Level 41: Fire Ball -- Posi-Acc/Dmg(A), Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(42), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(42), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(42), Posi-Dam%(43), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 44: Fire Blast -- Decim-Acc/Dmg(A), Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(45), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(45), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(45), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(46), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 47: Fire Shield -- ImpArm-ResDam/EndRdx(A), ImpArm-ResDam(48), TtmC'tng-ResDam/EndRdx(48), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx(48)
Level 49: Recall Friend -- RechRdx-I(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Acc-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- ULeap-Stlth(A)
Level 2: Rest -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 1: Containment
Code:
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Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
Quote:
Well lets see. I get to choose 24 powers over my career, unless Im mistaken. I want to get a travel power (thats two pools powers, probobly combat jumping and super jump) obviously 3 from fitness (swift, health, stamina), and 4 from fire mastery (rise of the phoenix, fire blast, fire ball, consume). That leaves 15 powers. there are 18 main powes, so I need to skip 3 of them. I plan to skip crystals, stone prison, and one thermal power. I'm unsure of which one though, and if I cant decide, I'll drop fire ball. Sound good?
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Originally Posted by MentalMaden
What other pools (non epic) are you taking, just curious. With what you are saying you should be able to comfortably fit everything in, but you seem to be fighting taking certain powers. In other words, what are you going to take instead of.....[blank].
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Quote:
Drop Fire Blast before you consider dropping Fireball. A hardy single target blast if your focused on solo'ing, but since this is obviously a team build take advantage of the damage you can contribute with Fireball.
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Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
Well lets see. I get to choose 24 powers over my career, unless Im mistaken. I want to get a travel power (thats two pools powers, probobly combat jumping and super jump) obviously 3 from fitness (swift, health, stamina), and 4 from fire mastery (rise of the phoenix, fire blast, fire ball, consume). That leaves 15 powers. there are 18 main powes, so I need to skip 3 of them. I plan to skip crystals, stone prison, and one thermal power. I'm unsure of which one though, and if I cant decide, I'll drop fire ball. Sound good?
|
Hmmm... if you like being in Melee, then The Stone APP was made for you. The thing is that Earth has so much control that being in melee isn't all that dangerous. Both of the Stone APP powers you get in close with have either a stun or a hold attached so when you nail the already controlled bad guys they are doubly screwed, as well as hurt badly. I like it for exactly this reason, it makes it easy to stack holds and stuns on bosses at the same time you're actually doing some damage to them. After 40 levels of really low damage potential it's really invigorating 
I would only go fire if you actually enjoy being at range. If you like getting up in their face, Stone APP all the way.
My Earth/TA went with Fire because she's all ranged. My Earth/Storm went Stone and has no issues being in close and laying it out. Either flavor works fine.
Edit:
Ack, just read your last post: Do not drop Fireball. Drop the rez or rise of the phoenix. I'd probably drop rise of the phoenix, you'll use the rez on occasion, but by the time you are in your 40s you will almost never die yourself. Also if you are team oriented I would look at Fire Shield instead of Fireblast. You've got two staff powers for ranged damage, and they'll nearly always hit because of the def debuffs in Quicksand and Earthquake. You probably don't need Fireblast.
Now that I think about it, you don't have Hasten. I'd take Hasten over any of the APP powers but Fire Ball. Having your Earth controls and your Thermal debuffs up more often is MUCH handier than anything but the Fireball.
Quote:
Consume will not be the power you hope it will, rise of the phoenix is way too situational and something that 3 insp can do without a power pick. If it were me I'd take blast, ball and shield. Also you may want to think of dropping another power for hasten, I try in most of my troller builds to have hasten. Given you don't use IOs you have no other non enhancment method of increasing recharge it's a thought. If you're set in stone (no pun intended) on taking the rez then I'd drop the single target fireblast since you'll have plenty of aoe containment for fireball.|
Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
Well lets see. I get to choose 24 powers over my career, unless Im mistaken. I want to get a travel power (thats two pools powers, probobly combat jumping and super jump) obviously 3 from fitness (swift, health, stamina), and 4 from fire mastery (rise of the phoenix, fire blast, fire ball, consume). That leaves 15 powers. there are 18 main powes, so I need to skip 3 of them. I plan to skip crystals, stone prison, and one thermal power. I'm unsure of which one though, and if I cant decide, I'll drop fire ball. Sound good?
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Edit- LOL just read Sweetmeats post on hasten.....I agree!
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
Quote:
I agree with this advice. If you want to fit in Hasten without giving up anything, consider using Hasten/Super Speed for travel. The benefits of Combat Jumping are fairly minor compared to Hasten. Add in a Stealth IO to Super Speed or a sprint power (you can use the jump ones in a sprint power), and you get full invisibility without having to use a power pick. With all the options for vertical travel now (Ninja Run, Raptor Pack, Zero-G Pack, GvE Jump Jet), Super Speed has far fewer problems than it used to have. Make sure you take Hurdle over Swift -- it really helps.
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Originally Posted by MentalMaden
Consume will not be the power you hope it will, rise of the phoenix is way too situational and something that 3 insp can do without a power pick. If it were me I'd take blast, ball and shield. Also you may want to think of dropping another power for hasten, I try in most of my troller builds to have hasten. Given you don't use IOs you have no other non enhancment method of increasing recharge it's a thought. If you're set in stone (no pun intended) on taking the rez then I'd drop the single target fireblast since you'll have plenty of aoe containment for fireball.
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LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
Well I'd rather not take the shield, as I have enough endurance issues as it is, without having that sucking it away. I didnt want fireball because I dont plan to use my attacks much. Fireball would draw too much aggro for my taste. And I wont take hasten/speed idea because I can NOT stand super speed. I'll considor dropping a power for hasten, but I've played this game for years, and I've never chosen hasten without respeccing out. I really dont like it much at all, I think its overrated, but I will considor it, having little experience with trollers. And what you people all seem to be missing is that in my experience, to use a wakie during combat effectively, you need a break and a blue, probobly a respite or two if there's no healer. The rez and self rez are much more covienient, and if I'm in a zone with no hospital, the load times going to the hospital, then zoning at least once, and loading the mish again are crippling (Im a disturbingly slow loader). We all have our own styles of play, and mine includes taking a rez, self or otherwise, whenever possible. Done it for years, no regrets. You get it? I'm not dropping either rez And for the record, I'm passing stone mastery because it has the melee. If I chose it, I would end up at dangerous range (I dont like melee fighting with squisheys, I just end up doing it out of habit). If I have fire mastery's ranged offense, I'll be less tempted to get in close. And as I mentioned, both APP sets sound great, but fire suits her better
I think you may be missing the fact that we too, understand the mechanics of using a wakey and as controller types still say......meh. Now I have it on my Ill/Therm as I've stated before but as a 49 power as the only time I see a need for "rez nao!" is late game AVs, TFs or raids. Also we are saying is that in the controller world hasten has a premium over other ATs because your value is controlling a situation and your safety is in control as opposed to a scrappers damage or a tanks hit points. Having your most valuable (and typically slow recharging powers) up often is much more important than making sure your friend is rezzed in the middle of a typical fight that your team can finish off without them. Rarely in this game do fights take very long and waiting for a spawn to be finished or tp to safety really isn't a priority for a controller. Your mileage may very of course, playstyles and all, but you did come here asking the controller experts for advice and well: we're advising. Take it for what its worth.
Edit- And regarding wakies and thermals. You have many tools to help a person using a wakey. They rez with wakey....you thaw....cauterize to heal the hps and shield them in case of incoming fire until they can retoggle (if they have toggles). All they need to do is wait for their end to recover and it's off to the battle.
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
I used to hate Hasten too. No longer.
Slot it with 3 Recharges, turn it on auto, and forget about it. Even without perma-hasten you will see a large reduction in recharge times. And with Earth/Thermal you have a lot of powers you want popping up faster.
Quote:
In addition to what Mental Maden said (we tend to agree on most things), A good controller's effective use of his/her controls does a lot more to prevent deaths. For example, I have Mutation and Fallout on my Earth/Rad . . . and I rarely use them. The AoE control of Earth with the debuffing of Rad means that my team tends to wipe out the foes quite quickly with little damage. I don't even use the AoE heal much unless it is one of those PuGs where the silly scrappers and Blasters like to run ahead of their protection and get their foolish selves killed. If the team stays together, they kill stuff fast and safely.|
Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
Well I'd rather not take the shield, as I have enough endurance issues as it is, without having that sucking it away. I didnt want fireball because I dont plan to use my attacks much. Fireball would draw too much aggro for my taste. And I wont take hasten/speed idea because I can NOT stand super speed. I'll considor dropping a power for hasten, but I've played this game for years, and I've never chosen hasten without respeccing out. I really dont like it much at all, I think its overrated, but I will considor it, having little experience with trollers. And what you people all seem to be missing is that in my experience, to use a wakie during combat effectively, you need a break and a blue, probobly a respite or two if there's no healer. The rez and self rez are much more covienient, and if I'm in a zone with no hospital, the load times going to the hospital, then zoning at least once, and loading the mish again are crippling (Im a disturbingly slow loader). We all have our own styles of play, and mine includes taking a rez, self or otherwise, whenever possible. Done it for years, no regrets. You get it? I'm not dropping either rez
And for the record, I'm passing stone mastery because it has the melee. If I chose it, I would end up at dangerous range (I dont like melee fighting with squisheys, I just end up doing it out of habit). If I have fire mastery's ranged offense, I'll be less tempted to get in close. And as I mentioned, both APP sets sound great, but fire suits her better |
On Super Speed -- It took me a while to get used to it. Like many things, SS gets better with practice. But Local Man is a Dark Miasma/Elec Defender, and I knew that Shadowfall+Super Speed = full invisibility long before IOs were available. Super Speed is like two powers in one -- I didn't want to have to use the Stealth pool, so I got used to Super Speed.
Now I hate to be without it -- SS lets me zip around the battlefield, going wherever I need to be to place my controls or to lead my pet into the fight without being seen. I can zip through caves and hallways much faster than my teammates who are limited by Fly, SJ or Teleport, and I have learned to how to speed through the maps pretty well. And Stealthing missions is easy on a Speedster. You know those "Find X" missions on large maps? Fly and Super Speed are the best for those. I have a lot of */Storm controllers, and all but one use SS with Steamy Mist for full invis. (The last one uses Fly, but has a Stealth IO+Steamy for invis.)
If I have a tight build where I need Hasten, I'm happy to take Super Speed. On my Illusion/Trick Arrow, I needed an extra power slot to fit in all the powers I wanted, but Hasten is essential to help Phantom Army recharge faster. Even though he didn't need the Stealth since he had Superior Invis, I took Super Speed for travel.
LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
Quote:
A few things...|
Originally Posted by Crawls on Dungeon Floor
Well I'd rather not take the shield, as I have enough endurance issues as it is, without having that sucking it away. I didnt want fireball because I dont plan to use my attacks much. Fireball would draw too much aggro for my taste. And I wont take hasten/speed idea because I can NOT stand super speed. I'll considor dropping a power for hasten, but I've played this game for years, and I've never chosen hasten without respeccing out. I really dont like it much at all, I think its overrated, but I will considor it, having little experience with trollers. And what you people all seem to be missing is that in my experience, to use a wakie during combat effectively, you need a break and a blue, probobly a respite or two if there's no healer. The rez and self rez are much more covienient, and if I'm in a zone with no hospital, the load times going to the hospital, then zoning at least once, and loading the mish again are crippling (Im a disturbingly slow loader). We all have our own styles of play, and mine includes taking a rez, self or otherwise, whenever possible. Done it for years, no regrets. You get it? I'm not dropping either rez
And for the record, I'm passing stone mastery because it has the melee. If I chose it, I would end up at dangerous range (I dont like melee fighting with squisheys, I just end up doing it out of habit). If I have fire mastery's ranged offense, I'll be less tempted to get in close. And as I mentioned, both APP sets sound great, but fire suits her better |
Fireball won't generate near the amount of aggro that you're probably expecting. Really, it's just another drop in the pail. You may find a surprising amount of aggro coming from Stone Cages with its debuff and DoT. In any case, a controller should be locking things down enough to survive a little additional aggro.
I can understand your hesitation towards Hasten coming from other AT's. If you can build a solid attack chain without Hasten then you're fine there, but that's not the case with controllers. There are powers that you want up ASAP. Take Volcanic Gases as an example. It's base recharge is 240 seconds, reduced to 130 seconds with two level 50 generic IO's. With Hasten, you drop that down to 94 seconds while Hasten is active. More recharge means more control means more survivability. Even having the single target up a second early can mean the difference between locking down a boss or eating their 500 hp heavy hitter. There's just no denying how important recharge is to controllers.
So, I made a new Troller on Pinnacle name Molten Moira. She is Stone Control/Thermal Radiation, and a real lowbie (only 10 at the time Im writing this). I've played Scrappers, Blasters, and Defenders for years, but Im relatively new to playing controllers, and was wondering if anyone had any specific advice for a troller with this power set (any advice on powers, general gameplay, etc). So far my plan is to get all Stone powers besides Quicksand and Stone Prison (I chose Salt Crystals. I know AoE sleep isnt great, but I wanted it for some crowd control at a low lvl, and I'm respeccing out when I have stalagmites and earthquake), and get all thermal powers except melt armor, as stone control does decent defence Debuff unless I'm mistaken, and heat exhaustion. I'm unfamiliar with controller epic pools, so if someone could list all the stone and fire mastery powers for trollers, I'd apprectiate that as well. If you see any flaws in that plan, or have any advice whatsoever, please reply. Thanks!