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Who seriously has 2 billion inf from regular, non farming play? wow... no reason anything should be over 2 billion.
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Originally Posted by CoX_Junkie
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Im the random PeeveePee guy quoted there. The point is valid no matter the forum. The reason you are seeing more and more "Market sucks" threads is because several people are trying to reestablish a PvP community and are coming back to the game WAY before the influence explosion started. I don't think i've ever had 500mil to my name and now single IOs are going for almost 6 times that.
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Originally Posted by CoX_Junkie
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sorry wasn't taking a stab at you with the name was just to lazy to go back and get it. And yes the point is valid, which is why I posted it here.
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Originally Posted by EmpireForgotten
Im the random PeeveePee guy quoted there. The point is valid no matter the forum. The reason you are seeing more and more "Market sucks" threads is because several people are trying to reestablish a PvP community and are coming back to the game WAY before the influence explosion started. I don't think i've ever had 500mil to my name and now single IOs are going for almost 6 times that.
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I've got over 10B inf on hand across multiple characters, and I basically never farm.|
Originally Posted by The_Coming_Storm
Who seriously has 2 billion inf from regular, non farming play? wow... no reason anything should be over 2 billion.
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It's not that hard. If you both play at 50 a couple ours a day and sell stuff on the market, you're going to earn 50-100M inf a week, easy, and that's assuming no big-ticket drops. It doesn't take long to hit 2B at that rate. Hell, you can hit 10M/hour just running missions on an 8-man team.
If you use the market to earn inf, you're concentrating the billions of inf/hour that people are churning out into yourself (by selling them stuff). You can concentrate a lot of other people's money on yourself a lot faster than you can earn it yourself.
The cap isn't very high compared to our earning rates.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Add to the fact the billions(trilions?) that were in the game prior to the Markets and the fact that influence never goes away(in any meaning full way)...just trades hands for the most part
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Well, it does go away on the market, 10% per transaction. Certainly a lot of people currently think that's not enough ways to get rid of it. And off-market trades like happen with these IOs literally just shuffle the money around - nothing is lost/destroyed.
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Originally Posted by CoX_Junkie
Add to the fact the billions(trilions?) that were in the game prior to the Markets and the fact that influence never goes away(in any meaning full way)...just trades hands for the most part
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Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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I do, and I've never farmed.|
Originally Posted by The_Coming_Storm
Who seriously has 2 billion inf from regular, non farming play? wow... no reason anything should be over 2 billion.
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I just played the game "casually" for six years.
There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.
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Yes we have the 10% fee but, IMO, that is a drop in the bucket with the amount of combined wealth that exists.|
Originally Posted by UberGuy
Well, it does go away on the market, 10% per transaction. Certainly a lot of people currently think that's not enough ways to get rid of it. And off-market trades like happen with these IOs literally just shuffle the money around - nothing is lost/destroyed.
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I have no horse in the "is it to little or not race", as far as the market being out of control and uninviting to the new or casual player whom I love to gouge.
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The new and/or casual player is the best situated person in the whole mix. They stand to make a fortune on the markets, and common and uncommon recipes are dirt cheap. The hardcore nutjobs (like us) are the ones that drive high demand for rare and ultra-rare recipes, that result in increasing values.
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Originally Posted by CoX_Junkie
I have no horse in the "is it to little or not race", as far as the market being out of control and uninviting to the new or casual player whom I love to gouge.
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There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.
@MrDump
Yeah I know, was just being smarmy and providing fodder for those that "just. don't. get-it."
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No argument form me. I think the prices of purples are ok but the prices for PvPIOs are ridiculous. I don't PvP (and don't care to) but since the PvPIOs are presumably intended to appeal to PvPers they really need to be more readily available.
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Originally Posted by EmpireForgotten
Im the random PeeveePee guy quoted there. The point is valid no matter the forum. The reason you are seeing more and more "Market sucks" threads is because several people are trying to reestablish a PvP community and are coming back to the game WAY before the influence explosion started. I don't think i've ever had 500mil to my name and now single IOs are going for almost 6 times that.
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Making that much is a slow week for me.|
Originally Posted by EmpireForgotten
Im the random PeeveePee guy quoted there. The point is valid no matter the forum. The reason you are seeing more and more "Market sucks" threads is because several people are trying to reestablish a PvP community and are coming back to the game WAY before the influence explosion started. I don't think i've ever had 500mil to my name and now single IOs are going for almost 6 times that.
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Seriously I am developing market constipation where my toons have their slots jammed with transactions I can't complete without destroying inf.
The Market Sux divide is mostly because the people that don't like the market are unwilling to articulate the fact that it isn't the game they came to play and they don't like dealing with it, and those that enjoy the market don't want to hear it and have elaborate rationales why their mode of play is appropriate.
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I don't deny that this particular divide exists, but I think it's much too exclusive of other complaints people have. There are plenty of people who don't mention anything about disliking the market mini-game as such who hate the prices and irrationally blame all "high" prices on flippers. It's much more than possible for such people to hate marketeers without directly disliking that there's a market in the game at all.|
Originally Posted by Another_Fan
The Market Sux divide is mostly because the people that don't like the market are unwilling to articulate the fact that it isn't the game they came to play and they don't like dealing with it, and those that enjoy the market don't want to hear it and have elaborate rationales why their mode of play is appropriate.
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After all, if I remember correctly, you don't like the market mini-game's presence in this overall game, but you understand it pretty well and don't make a habit of blaming its users irrationally for every perceived ill of the "casual" player's market woes.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Too bad Castle doesn't seem to see it is the drop rate that is broken.
total kick to the gut
This is like having Ra's Al Ghul show up at your birthday party.
We can argue all we want about what we think of the market. And we do. And it's not that interesting. But this is the first time in a very long time that I've seen a dev comment on the market and frankly it's boggling my mind more than a little. I can't even decide if he's being sarcastic. When is the last time a dev described something as "horribly broken"? And what did they do to it afterwards???
Avatar: "Cheeky Jack O Lantern" by dimarie
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Originally Posted by UberGuy
I don't deny that this particular divide exists, but I think it's much too exclusive of other complaints people have. There are plenty of people who don't mention anything about disliking the market mini-game as such who hate the prices and irrationally blame all "high" prices on flippers. It's much more than possible for such people to hate marketeers without directly disliking that there's a market in the game at all.
After all, if I remember correctly, you don't like the market mini-game's presence in this overall game, but you understand it pretty well and don't make a habit of blaming its users irrationally for every perceived ill of the "casual" player's market woes. |
No, I like market games in general. I just understand that my preference isn't shared by everyone. I don't blame the market per se for the casual players woes, I do feel that speed with which you can do things with the market forces people into using it whether they want to or not.
Now while I don't dislike the market, I positively love deflating blowhards that take a tone of moral superiority over their actions in a video game.
If anything I would like a better more challenging market game, but I realize that is just me with a hammer viewing the world as a nail.
Edit: and the funny thing isi play several better market oriented games. Really wouldnt be appropriate in this games context.
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Well the drop rate is not his responsibility so I suspect it was more him not wanting to step on anyone's toes by saying whether the drop rate was borked or not.
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Originally Posted by SwellGuy
Too bad Castle doesn't seem to see it is the drop rate that is broken.
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I got a billion influence on a single character over the course of just over a month, some time ago. I play regularly and run many TFs but don't "farm" in the conventional sense. I don't engage in flipping or other market manipulation at all. The inf was gotten by crafting and selling the less needed drops and random rolls acquired by a roster of characters. This included two or three purples, and a stealth IO I did not need at that level at the time. Had I sold everything rather than just the bottom of the barrel / stuff I do not use much, it would not have taken as much time either.|
Originally Posted by The_Coming_Storm
Who seriously has 2 billion inf from regular, non farming play? wow... no reason anything should be over 2 billion.
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I did it just to see if I could, and promptly fecked much of it away; I just wanted to do it so I could tell myself I had done it.
If I can do it, it can't be that hard.
<《 New Colchis / Guides / Mission Architect 》>
"At what point do we say, 'You're mucking with our myths'?" - Harlan Ellison
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That was my reaction to it as well. Granted not sure what power Castle wields when it comes to the Markets.
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Originally Posted by peterpeter
We can argue all we want about what we think of the market. And we do. And it's not that interesting. But this is the first time in a very long time that I've seen a dev comment on the market and frankly it's boggling my mind more than a little. I can't even decide if he's being sarcastic. When is the last time a dev described something as "horribly broken"? And what did they do to it afterwards???
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Originally Posted by peterpeter
We can argue all we want about what we think of the market. And we do. And it's not that interesting. But this is the first time in a very long time that I've seen a dev comment on the market and frankly it's boggling my mind more than a little. I can't even decide if he's being sarcastic. When is the last time a dev described something as "horribly broken"? And what did they do to it afterwards???
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Praetorian Rands ? Emperor Cole Dollars ? Rogue Rubles ?
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Synapse is in charge of rewards, but I don't remember any dev being flagged as having responsibility for the market. I'm not sure any dev "owns" it, which means the opinion of someone like Castle is going to carry a lot of weight. If he thinks the market is horribly broken, them I'm suddenly afraid that it's going to be horribly fixed.|
Originally Posted by CoX_Junkie
That was my reaction to it as well. Granted not sure what power Castle wields when it comes to the Markets.
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When he talks about rampant inflation, does he just mean PvP recipes? Because a lot of salvage prices are about the same as they were a month after I9 launched. The big ticket stuff is mostly cheaper now, and only the low level salvage has really gone up. And I'm pretty sure that's a direct result of changes they made to shorten the time people spend in the low levels.
Some recipe prices are very high, but a ton of recipes are free for the taking. If they want the prices of Numinas and Zephyrs and the like to go down, then the devs can easily lower the price in AE tickets or Merits. If the devs are going to set a high price, then they can hardly blame the players for doing the same.
I looked at an old spreadsheet I had of Armageddon prices, and they look to be 6-10 times higher now. That's a big difference. Does Castle dislike that? If they didn't want purple prices to go up, why did they introduce the AE and then block anyone from getting purples if they use it?
I just don't know what to make of it.
Avatar: "Cheeky Jack O Lantern" by dimarie
Nice. I'm going to be very interested in seeing what measures he takes to lower prices and how much I can profit from this.
Have a seat over here, Castle, and let's discuss how the Evil Marketers got together and secretly decided to lower the prices of costume recipes. 
There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.
Without getting into the semantics too much, it looks to me like Castle is specifically referring to the price of PvP recipes being greater than the theoretical inf cap, not saying that the market itself is "horribly broken". The fix could be as simple as increasing the drop rate of PvP recipes.
If it helps, Mod8 has a dissenting opinion:
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Originally Posted by Moderator_08
For the record, as one of those people who has bids at 2bill (not many, since once I get that number it's after I've reached 50 and fully IO'd out the character I tend to just retire the character from active play) if we were to change it so those bids "went away" (something I'd highly oppose as it would harm the community of market users and put an undue workload on the CS department) I'd have to move that inf into a different storage medium (there are a number of other potential ways to store inf).
I'd probably take the lazy way out and just store it in recipes/enhancements. That would mean my personal bases would fill up with valuable commodities which would be essentially removed from the market. I'm guessing most of the other dedicated market users would store their resources the same way, leading to a great buy up. That would be a short term inflationary event unprecedented in this game. I personally wouldn't like to see how the redside market would respond to a several hundred billion inf buying spree. |
Castles thoughts on the the Markets
Responding to someone in the PvP boards of all places