I have seen over-bids at times, but nothing lately. Then tonight I logged in to a character who has had one IO listed at 2.1M for weeks without moving. That last 5 were all between 3.0 and 3.6M. He finally sold his tonight for 5M. I'm not complaining, but......
/em boggle
RagManX
"if the market were religion Fulmens would be Moses and you'd be L. Ron Hubbard. " --Nethergoat to eryq2
The economy is not broken. The players are
Quote:
1) Yes, I read all of it.|
Originally Posted by Kane1
Did you not read the rest of my post?
Do I have to type "(j/k)" after every statement that can be taken poorly out of context? |
2) Given that there are no facial expressions or other cues for written text, and given that this was not part of a long discourse from you where we would have been able to pick up the 'tone' of your message; yeah, you need to be pretty blatant on the internet.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
Quote:
Too long, sometimes.|
Originally Posted by UberGuy
I guess its worth asking how much time you think bid creeping takes.
|
More than once, I've been buying recipes and I'll evaluate what levels are bargains and possibly put in low bids at several levels and wait a few days and end up quite pleased that I got a recipe for 8 million when most of the recent prices are 50 - 100% higher.
Then I'll start buying the salvage, see that an item has a range of 2,000 to 7,000 and start bid creeping - until I slap myself and regain a sense of proportion and stop wasting time over a matter of a few thousand infl.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
Quote:
How long does it really take? Lets say you are bidding on a 7 figure item. That is seven keystrokes per bid. Then lets say you try for the item within 5 levels of what you want. Lets say you bid creep in 100k increments. Lets all assume the cheapest one you find is 1.5 million and you start at 1 million.|
Originally Posted by UberGuy
I guess its worth asking how much time you think bid creeping takes. I might spend 20 seconds throwing out 4-5 bids on something low price - usually if it's a cheap item I only try a maximum of like 2 bids before I just offer the "last five" price for it. For something in the 10s of millions, I'll spend more time searching around other levels for it.
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I think that is 175 keystrokes.
Lets say salvage is anywhere between 3 and 4 key strokes per bid for a non rare salvage. Need 3 pieces of that. 3 bids before you get it?
36 ish keystrokes.
Do this for 1 set and you are already looking at over 1200 keystrokes.
Lets say you buy it now for 2 million, buy each piece of salvage for 10 K.
You pay 3.3 million ish million more, but do it in 114 keystrokes.
Granted that is just for a 1 million influence item, you'd end up losing more for something done at 5, 10, 50, 100 million if you just bid high, but how much time difference? 114 vs 1266. For one IO set of six enhancements.
What if you start to do that for entire builds. Rare sets which have an extra piece of salvage. What if you get to IO'ing 1, 3, 5... 10 full builds?
(For the record I'd have never typed all this out if I had access to the game this weekend.
)
Although I'm working on getting to the 2 bill mark, I still have my NAO moments. I say, if you got it to spend, more power to you.
You know what I just realized would help eliminate the need for bid creeping? Price caps. Set them low enough, and everyone can just bid the max and know that they'll never get it but keep hoping that they will. It eliminates complaints from people who say prices are too high on the market. It makes it easier for me to get richer. It can't be that hard to implement on the dev side. Everybody wins.
RagManX
"if the market were religion Fulmens would be Moses and you'd be L. Ron Hubbard. " --Nethergoat to eryq2
The economy is not broken. The players are
Quote:
There are certainly times when it doesn't make sense to bid creep. I never offer less than 2x vendor price for salvage, and if the salvage is less than 1% of my total IO cost than I'm not going to blink at paying 10x or 100x vendor price.|
Originally Posted by MrLiberty
How long does it really take? Lets say you are bidding on a 7 figure item. That is seven keystrokes per bid. Then lets say you try for the item within 5 levels of what you want. Lets say you bid creep in 100k increments. Lets all assume the cheapest one you find is 1.5 million and you start at 1 million.
I think that is 175 keystrokes. Lets say salvage is anywhere between 3 and 4 key strokes per bid for a non rare salvage. Need 3 pieces of that. 3 bids before you get it? 36 ish keystrokes. Do this for 1 set and you are already looking at over 1200 keystrokes. Lets say you buy it now for 2 million, buy each piece of salvage for 10 K. You pay 3.3 million ish million more, but do it in 114 keystrokes. Granted that is just for a 1 million influence item, you'd end up losing more for something done at 5, 10, 50, 100 million if you just bid high, but how much time difference? 114 vs 1266. For one IO set of six enhancements. What if you start to do that for entire builds. Rare sets which have an extra piece of salvage. What if you get to IO'ing 1, 3, 5... 10 full builds? (For the record I'd have never typed all this out if I had access to the game this weekend. ) |
But imagine an item has prices in the last five ranging between 70m and 75m. The item only exists at level 50, there are items available for sale, you want to buy it NAO:
You could pay 75m and get it instantly.
Or you could pay 70m and get it instantly.
You could pay 65m and get it instantly.
You could pay 60m, not get it, then bid creep up to 61m and get the item.
And what I'm seeing people do, consistently, is choose option 1 or 2. They could save ten million inf with just a few seconds of effort. That's something like 1,000,000 inf/second they are throwing away. You'd need to earn 3.6 BILLION inf per hour for that to be an economical use of your time.
If you really love playing the game and earning money, and you really hate using the market and spending money, then I can't fault you for spending more time doing what you love and less time doing what you hate. But I keep seeing more and more people complain about high prices, and yet overpaying seems more common than ever.
I'm shaking my head in disbelief all the way to the bank.
Avatar: "Cheeky Jack O Lantern" by dimarie
Quote:
LOL! Price caps are the solution to all problems. Sorry, no, price caps are a bad idea and would hurt most players.|
Originally Posted by RagManX
You know what I just realized would help eliminate the need for bid creeping? Price caps. Set them low enough, and everyone can just bid the max and know that they'll never get it but keep hoping that they will. It eliminates complaints from people who say prices are too high on the market. It makes it easier for me to get richer. It can't be that hard to implement on the dev side. Everybody wins.
|
Well, perhaps not 'most' since many don't use the market at all. Price caps would only negatively impact those who do use the market.
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
Quote:
Anything with a 7 figure price I will carefully bid creep for in something like 1-5M increments, and I really don't care how long it takes. It can mean I can can get anywhere between 10 and 50% purchasing efficiency, and I always consider that worth my time.|
Originally Posted by MrLiberty
How long does it really take? Lets say you are bidding on a 7 figure item. That is seven keystrokes per bid. Then lets say you try for the item within 5 levels of what you want. Lets say you bid creep in 100k increments. Lets all assume the cheapest one you find is 1.5 million and you start at 1 million.
|
My 2-3 bid creep example was for dirt cheap junk, like uncommon salvage.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
Here's how I bid on stuff.
common salvage: 5k minimum
uncommon: 11k minimum
this keeps me from having to re-type anything most of the time.
rares: undercut 'last 5' if I'm not in a hurry, go a bit over 'last 5' if I'm in a hurry.
recipes:
For anything over a few hundred k I always throw out one ridiculously, insultingly low bid....which fills often enough to keep me doing it. =P
After that, I'll bid what I think it's worth.
If that doesn't win it, I leave the bid to sit for a while. Most of the time I have what I want pretty quick, very occasionally I get impatient and increase it.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
To save typing, I have many common, large numbers in my clipboard history program (Ditto). If I'm typing bids with a bunch of zeros, I just pull it up the clip with the proper amount of zeros, type the first number or two into the auction house and paste in the zeros. Cuts down on the number of accidents.
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