The Ideal Team for Master Level Badges
Stone Tank/Brute
Force Fielder
Empath/Thermal
Sniper
Heavy debuffer like Rad/Cold/Sonic
If you have both a Thermal and a Sonic/Cold then you can even do without the bubbler.
Then anything else to make up the numbers (Though I would say you need a stalker on the MoRSF).
A team like that should see you through pretty much anything.
British by act of union, English by grace of God, Northern by pure good fortune!
For ITF I'd try and get a second melee type so that you can pull the healing Nictus away from Rommy. It's not required but it does make it easier. MoITF is probably the easiest of the Master badges by a long shot.
Now the interesting one would be Master of Dr Q TF. I think with that one the primary problem would be player fatigue.
I'd say:
Villains: 8 Corrupters
Heroes: 6 Defenders, 1 Blaster, 1 Scrapper (or 8 defenders, but it'll take longer..)
Combined: 8 Corrupters
If you're running MoRSF, swap in 1 permadom for one of the corrupters or defenders. They'll have to be able to permanently hold a 54 Statesman - for MoRSF even a /stone tank buffed by 7 corrupters is a liability because 2 hits can result in a kill.
Why? Well, assuming a moderate amount of player skill, minions and lieuts are trivial easy and bosses are an annoyance only in large numbers. The only question is how you're going to take down the AVs, and the KISS answer is massive debuffs combined with extreme firepower.
My dream team is 2 /colds, 2 /thermals, 2 /kins, 1 /rad and 1 /sonic. Primary doesn't matter in the least.
I don't think up dream teams. I basically think that if you can't devise a way of achieving anything with any team then you are still learning.
Then I think that team work is essential and if players can't get things right despite trying then, they may want to change their slots a bit better, or adapt the build to have the power they skipped, that allows for better flexibility, with other team dynamics.
You can get things done more than one way but some people simply stick to the one method like glue. Why I don't know.
I certainly don't like to value people over what they chose at the powerset selection screen.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
The ideal team is 8 people who know how to play and communicate.
I don't think up dream teams. I basically think that if you can't devise a way of achieving anything with any team then you are still learning.
Then I think that team work is essential and if players can't get things right despite trying then, they may want to change their slots a bit better, or adapt the build to have the power they skipped, that allows for better flexibility, with other team dynamics. You can get things done more than one way but some people simply stick to the one method like glue. Why I don't know. I certainly don't like to value people over what they chose at the powerset selection screen. |
I don't think up dream teams. I basically think that if you can't devise a way of achieving anything with any team then you are still learning.
Then I think that team work is essential and if players can't get things right despite trying then, they may want to change their slots a bit better, or adapt the build to have the power they skipped, that allows for better flexibility, with other team dynamics. You can get things done more than one way but some people simply stick to the one method like glue. Why I don't know. I certainly don't like to value people over what they chose at the powerset selection screen. |
So people figure out the path of least resistance, and if it means that they exclude others, as long as it doesn't exclude them they don't care. This is one of the reasons why there are an absurd number of stone tanks/brutes and kins around.
I find this even funnier that it happens so much in this game because of the amount of flexibility between classes and roles available.
Dark Armor is like that kid you knew in school that didn't know when to shut up, and no matter how bad he got beaten down, he got right back up again and kept on talking.
A tank of some kind. A debuffer of some kind. Some one with some sort of heal (doesn't have to be a "healer")
Personally I like the combination of a tank and a Thermal. Thermal covers buffer, debuffer, and healer all at once. Add a Rad/Sonic or something for help with AVs and fill the rest of the team with whatever.
For villainside, just replace tank with brute, and Rad/Sonic with Sonic/Rad (because it will be a corruptor instead of defender)
With enough debuffs and buffs you don't even need a tank or brute to hold agro, but it does make things a little smoother sometimes.
You can achieve the Master badges with any team makeup, the only reason people put together specific teams is it is a little easier and everyone knows their role from the start. Or because they're of the mistaken belief that that is the only team that can do it.
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
Me, Tark, Hobo and Rat.
You can achieve the Master badges with any team makeup, the only reason people put together specific teams is it is a little easier and everyone knows their role from the start. Or because they're of the mistaken belief that that is the only team that can do it.
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Master teams don't need to follow an exact cookie cutter format, but the team composition does need to be balanced a fair bit better than other content.
If you can finish something at all, you can finish it without deaths if you're careful enough and/or given enough attempts, unless the only way you won was with vengeance/fallout. That is (should be?) common sense.
The hardest part in a specific MSTF/MLRSF setup (i.e., all scrappers) is gathering enough players with the right AT, a good internet connexion and the ability to login during the same time period. It's already hard enough to organize a normal allscrapper or allblaster STF/RSF, claiming the lack of public proof that a blaster or scrapper MSTF/MLRSF has been done proves it isn't possible is ludicrous.
I don't think up dream teams. I basically think that if you can't devise a way of achieving anything with any team then you are still learning.
Then I think that team work is essential and if players can't get things right despite trying then, they may want to change their slots a bit better, or adapt the build to have the power they skipped, that allows for better flexibility, with other team dynamics. You can get things done more than one way but some people simply stick to the one method like glue. Why I don't know. I certainly don't like to value people over what they chose at the powerset selection screen. |
If you can finish something at all, you can finish it without deaths if you're careful enough and/or given enough attempts, unless the only way you won was with vengeance/fallout. That is (should be?) common sense.
The hardest part in a specific MSTF/MLRSF setup (i.e., all scrappers) is gathering enough players with the right AT, a good internet connexion and the ability to login during the same time period. It's already hard enough to organize a normal allscrapper or allblaster STF/RSF, claiming the lack of public proof that a blaster or scrapper MSTF/MLRSF has been done proves it isn't possible is ludicrous. |
And to respond more directly to your comment about what I allegedly 'claimed': Generally the burden of proof lies with the person who states something is true or possible, not the other way around. There would be no burden on me to prove something is impossible, even if I had originally made that statement.
However, seeing as how an all scrapper STF run on Test, made up of scrapper forum regulars, who would generally be regarded as among the most experienced and most knowledgeable scrapper players out there resulted in 121 deaths, when a Master run requires ZERO, I am going to remain skeptical that it is even possible.
I stand firmly by my assertion that the claim that a team of any makeup can successfully complete a Master TF run is false. It does not require a cookie cutter exact team build, but certain things must be taken into account and planned for. For example, on an STF, there must be some plan and tactic for dealing with Ghost Widow's Soul Storm and Dark Regeneration. There are various ways to approach this, but there still has to be a specific plan for it on a Master run.
Remember, I'm the kind of player that will take anything for any TF in the game. I have never said "we need a tank/healer/troller". I avoid teams like that. I have, in fact, quit teams with that attitude. When Issue 15 went live, I started a team to run the Kahn TF within 20 minutes of the servers going up and went with the first 7 players to respond. Some of the best times I have had on TF's were with teams that didn't fit the expected mold. All that flies out the window when talking about No Temp/No Death Master runs.
Generally the burden of proof lies with the person who states something is true or possible, not the other way around. There would be no burden on me to prove something is impossible, even if I had originally made that statement.
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Kudos if you know the band.
I agree, and technically, you can't ever irrefutably prove something is impossible. Even Einstein didn't prove that travel faster than the speed of light is impossible. There could be some unknowns or variables that we just don't know. This is why I believe that nothing truly is impossible. It's just a matter of time before someone figures it out.
Although, you have to accept that as soon as any one all blaster MSTF works, sufficient proof has been provided that it's not impossible.
Edit to add: There's something else I'd like to say. To irrefutably prove that any team could successfully complete a MSTF would be insurmountably time consuming. You would have to complete it with every permutation of every possible AT and every possible powerset to truly prove that statement. 8 Fire/rad controllers. 7 Fire/rad controllers, 1 fire/kin controller. 7 Fire/rad controllers, one illusion/kin controller... etc.
What might be an acceptable compromise is to devise a few "worst case" teams and see if you can get those to complete it.
Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
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don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
If you can provide me with 7 people who have loads of influence and blasters/scrappers they are willing to respec to my desire, I'll make it happen
The problem really is getting 7 people like that together. I know maybe 2 people in that situation.
Get psi damage. Both Cimerorians and Reichsman are more vulnerable to that than other damage types.
Other than that, make sure you get players who help keep the team safe and productive and you'll be golden.
-STEELE =)
Allied to all sides so that no matter what, I'll come out on top!
Oh, and Crimson demands you play this arc-> Twisted Knives (MA Arc #397769)
<QR>
Team full of people you know that play their characters effectively. Seriously, that's all you need. It might make a bit more difference on something like the STF where you need to be able to take down multiple AVs and then Recluse, but people I know have done sub-1-hour MoSTF runs while still leaving one or more of Recluse's towers up.
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
@Mazzo Grave
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Energy/Energy Blaster Guide
Please don't say I made a claim that I never did. |
Generally the burden of proof lies with the person who states something is true or possible, not the other way around. |
You could also use logic. Again, if you can finish something at all, then you can finish it without deaths given enough attempts, unless you used specific tricks requiring deaths. This being the Internet, people don't like logic though.
Then there's screenshot proof / video proof. Of course, it can be faked and some will say it is.
A dev could say it has been done ; but he could be a liar for whatever reason.
And so on. The burden of proof lies on people who care about popularity, or sharing their experience - but knowing something is true / possible is enough for some, regardless if others laugh at them when they say so.
To me, experience and numbers tend to show a scrapper MSTF is possible. I don't see any reason to believe it's impossible. I've done "PuGs" (1-3 friends, 4-6 folks from /search) all scrapper STFs on Freedom with 30-40 deaths, just from that experience I'm pretty sure it'd be possible with a team of friends, given enough attempts. If you're expecting me to spend hundreds of hours on an extremely tedious task just to prove a point, you're mistaking me for someone who cares much about it.
The maximum effort I'm willing to give on this was typing this long forum reply.
I'm going to weigh in on the "any combination of highly competent players can accomplish x"... I've been on teams that I thought had no prayer of completing an STF due to AT's and powersets and managed a MoSTF run. I've also been on dream teams with an ideal selection of AT's and powersets that couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag.
While I haven't run an all-blaster MoSTF I wouldn't be surprised to see someone manage it. I've run a couple of all-controller STF's; our best run had I believe 5 deaths total so I can easily see that being possible with practice and tighter coordination.
My only try at an all-scrapper STF was shortly after it went live; we had massive problems mainly due to the fact that everyone was playing a regen and spike damage was dropping us. All-scrapper with Shield scrappers? I don't see any reason why not, everyone should have well over 100% defense with all the grant cover's stacked and massive damage output.
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
the ideal team is 8 people who know how to play and communicate.
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I have 7 MoSTF badges and 3 MoRSF badges and I have ran successfull ones multiple times on toons that already had the badge on various times (so my friends can get the badge) and various team builds. There is no "I WIN" team make up, there is only good players with good communication that can get this stuff done. Its much easier that way and some practice is needed sometimes.
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Fight my brute
However, seeing as how an all scrapper STF run on Test, made up of scrapper forum regulars, who would generally be regarded as among the most experienced and most knowledgeable scrapper players out there resulted in 121 deaths, when a Master run requires ZERO, I am going to remain skeptical that it is even possible.
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I tanked every single AV on the STF without defeat with my scrapper. I do tanks mainly tho so I got an edge.
The other scrappers were brilliant and we must of had a deathcount of less than 10 easily, I was going to say 5 but its probably between 5 and 10 and they could of been omited as it was our first run.
We must be sizzling hot!
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
With the new Badges for Master TF/SFs coming out, I'm curious as to what your ideal 8 person team would look like for each of the new Badge TF/SFs.
Master of Reichsman Strike Force - 8 person Villian Team Master of Reichsman Task Force - 8 person Hero Team Master of Imperious Task Force - 8 person Combined Team |
if you need a set team point tank, back up tank, debuffer, debuffer, debuffer, buffer, buffer, buffer/healer
With the new Badges for Master TF/SFs coming out, I'm curious as to what your ideal 8 person team would look like for each of the new Badge TF/SFs.
Master of Reichsman Strike Force
- 8 person Villian Team
Master of Reichsman Task Force
- 8 person Hero Team
Master of Imperious Task Force
- 8 person Combined Team