Petition system broken? Lag, GMs, layoffs
By
Cass_,
Posted on: 2009-02-17 13:16 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
Well said.
We did a LGTF night before last and it was appalling. It was almost kill one, mappie, kill one , mappie, kill one.....u get the idea and no I am not overstating, it really was that bad.
Last night we did another and for the first couple of missions it was fine, then it all started again. Add to that the disconnects, people not being able to log in etc and it is really poorly playing at the moment.
I didn't bug report as I have gotten totally fed up with the generic response, taking your time up by running endless tests and all so that they can blame it on your ISP, who incidentally say it is NC.
And of course not one iota of a response from anyone about it. Yes I know there are things going on, but that's not our problem , that is NCs.
Zhaan, Chakyra, Fiorina 161, Aeryn, Polly Nation, Dee Pression, Shazanne, Night Jester and too many more to mention.
Network Hell 47640
Valley of the Harpies 74519
Green and Pleasant Land 75966
Well, the truth to the problem lies in two places:
1. There's a problem BETWEEN the players and NC. Not much NC can do about it, but to locate it (through traceroutes etc, need our help for that) and make sure the pwoers-that-be are aware of the problem.
2. Five year old, unoptimized netcode in the game not capable of handling problems like #1. You can't really expect NC to make such a drastic code change to an old declining game.
BUT, you SHOULD be able to expect a descent, proper response, that they treat customers with at least a shred of respect. The fact they don't is part NC's fault, but since there obviously are GMs that give a (cencored) the people working at "customer support" (what a joke) can't just blame "current policies and routines/doctrines".
Yes, they probably have a book telling them what to do and they've been told to follow it (I truly hated that part, never used the book myself when I was in tech support) but they do have a brain, that's why there's PEOPLE working support, not just a bot sending out generic responses. They actually do have a responsibility to think for themselves too.
...and I'm still hoping NC will change their policy and start informing customers about problems instead of denying them until overwhealmingly, repeatedly humlilated by proof we supply the community with. (The Londoner US/EU customer difference incident being the big honkah honkah imho).
Ok, so it's a korean company(?), but it's not friggin' China. When there's a problem, I wanna know about it and then I accept it as "they're obviously working on it at least" and do something else for a while. Pretending it's not there... well, did it work with Chernobyl?
Don't blame the current economic crisis, NC, you're creating your own problems. Oh man, I so whish I wasn't still hooked on this (cencored) game.
edit: STILL trying to update the petition ticket. Guess the system is "overloaded" by the 10 petitions sent in from players the last 20 days or so...
Edit II: Ok, tried a whole friggin day to get on playNC and update my ticket, and it's impossible. Go (cencor) yourself folks! NC has already left Europe for the new world! Good night, was a good fight!
Um, you do know there are lot of major issue with the back bone in Europe at the moment? If you didn't, well then, there are major issue with the back bone in Europe at the moment. Causing problems for lots of MMo's. i would imagine that it is exasperating the already connection intensive maps in the ITF/LRSF.
I thought my post made it rather clear that I DO know it's not NCs fault (this time), but I guess you cared as much as the totally useless GMs? 
Honestly, thanks for the info that NC could've put on their front page or even in the updater window to alleviate the amount of aggravation they'll recieve. I just don't understand why they avoid making their lives easier and seem to go out of their way to make the customers angry.
Once again, I don't give a (cencored) about the lag, dc's etc, what makes me annoyed is the way the so called customer support is working. It's a Stalinized relic from the early cold wars, a chinese democracy (yup, that was a crappy joka about a crappy album), plain and simple... a joke!
...but it's a joke that's costing "OUR" game valuable players. I've had so many in-game friends leave and even more friends trying the game out, asking me how the h.ll I can stand it since they typically hit major snags even during the installation procedure (the US/EU bug).
I'm starting to think there might not be any GMs at all. The information published said there was job axing in lots of areas, and that could include GMs. I know it's unlikely, but it's possible.
But back on topic...
Yes, I have been getting bad lag for a while now and some very annoying DCs. I don't bother to petition because I gave up on support a long time ago. I think in over 2 years of playing I have petitioned about 5 or 6 times. Only one of my problems was dealt with, out of all of those. Everything else was the standard bot reply and they never contacted me about the problem again. They couldn't anyway, I wasn't allowed to respond to the e-mail. For a bug it would be "we are aware of this problem we're trying to fix it blah blah blah" and then I waited. Bug didn't get fixed until months/years later, and some bugs I petitioned about were never fixed at all.
I really do feel sorry for all those who lost their jobs, but NC really do need to make their support better. It's frankly not worth trying to petition now as all I'll get it some bot reply.
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I'm starting to think there might not be any GMs at all. The information published said there was job axing in lots of areas, and that could include GMs. I know it's unlikely, but it's possible.
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Instead of attempting to spread FUD (Fear, uncertainty, doubt), why don't you actually try reading some of GhostRaptor's posts from time to time?
Like this one, posted last Tuesday.
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Pretty sure I've said it already in this thread, but seems it bears mentioning again: there have been no redundancies in the CS team this time around. They are continuing with the same number of staff they had at the end of last year.
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Source
Emphasis mine.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Erhm...
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They are continuing with the same number of staff they had at the end of last year.
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Never said how many there is, might actually be none/bot! 
And I stand by my point, apart from a few good GMs that contact you ingame, move stuck enemies/hostages etc, the general response is so utterly pointless and useless they might as well use a friggin bot. Although that's mostly the fault of the company policy/handbook, I refuse to accept the employees are mindless drones that are hell bent on driving us all mad (that's the dev's job for cryin' out loud!). They're just creating more job for themselves alternatively making themselves redundant by insisting on using these rediculous generic responses and holding us in the dark whenever there's a problem.
...it's plain'n'simple stupid!
also, FFM, unlike you, the rest of us have lives and don't have time to read every thread every day, especially when people (like you btw) insist on making pointless one-liner remarks just to up' their post count, usually also ruining perfectly good threads. There's no bloody way I'd read a 10+ pages thread with total nonsense. So get off those friggin high horses of yours will ya?
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Pretty sure I've said it already in this thread, but seems it bears mentioning again: there have been no redundancies in the CS team this time around. They are continuing with the same number of staff they had at the end of last year.
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.. which makes poor support even more inexcusable. Or is that just me?
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So get off those friggin high horses of yours will ya?
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I actually laughed out loud at this. Probably shouldn't have, but hey ho.
@SteelRat; @SteelRat2
"Angelina my love, I'm a genius!"
"Of course you are darling, that's why I married you. Physically, you're rather unattractive"
http://faces.cohtitan.com/profile/SteelRat
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also, FFM, unlike you, the rest of us have lives and don't have time to read every thread every day, especially when people (like you btw) insist on making pointless one-liner remarks just to up' their post count, usually also ruining perfectly good threads. There's no bloody way I'd read a 10+ pages thread with total nonsense. So get off those friggin high horses of yours will ya?
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Pfff. It doesn't require following every thread, just the dev digest.
And what high horse? The only one I can see getting stroppy here is you, boyo. If you hate the service in this game so fricking much, then why the hell are you still here? I can't honestly think of anyone who'd stay with a company that's as bad as you claim NC are, especially if they experiences as many problems as you claim you do.
Personally, I think you make up most of the problems you claim you have, just so that you can whine.
Oh, and it wasn't a one liner comment, and I've never bothered much about powerlevelling my postcount, I don't need to. You can tell that because I generally don't take part in idiot weekend threads.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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Personally, I think you make up most of the problems you claim you have, just so that you can whine.
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lolumad?
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Never said how many there is, might actually be none/bot!
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There is a dedicated support team still with us.
With regards your specific complaint about always being asked to go through the same process, there is a very good reason for this. All professionally run support teams will have extensive records of past support queries, and the eventual resolution of those queries. From that data you can build a system that results in the majority of queries being resolved on the first response, and the majority of those remaining on the second response. This is why you get formula responses, and why those formula responses are the same each time you submit a new query on the same topic area.
Further, our support and tech teams need as much information as possible to help them ascertain the root causes and severity of an issue. If an entire team of 8 is all experiencing the problem, but only one person reports it, we are missing 87.5% of the possible information. We can't just take your word for it: unless all 8 players file a report (or a significant number of them, say 6+) we do not have verified information for the support and tech teams to follow up on.
With the above said, this thread is closed:
* The specific issue raised in the opening post is already covered in a pre-existing thread, and thus a duplicate.
* The original post is effectively just a rant post.
* The quality of discussion and language being used is quite low.
For future reference, if you wish to discuss the quality of service please take the time to address your comments constructively and without use of questionable language.
Ok, due to the lag, I sent a petition yesterday when eight of us where doing the ITF and everyone, EVERYONE got DCd at the same time over and over again. It IS getting totally unbearable, but I can take that if it's a problem outside of NCs domains. I know the game was coded badly for the internet infrastructure and it's not worth recoding that major part for a declining game.
It is the way we're treated that once again makes me sad and angry, mostly because once again people are leaving the game due to poor public relations.
The response I got was of course the generic send in info about your system, connection, run the net tool and attach the file etc. I've been told that sort of generic info is actually a private mail and I'm not allowed to post it on the forum, so you'll have to imagine the content. You all probably know the type A-formula response by now anyway.
Problem was, of course, that it's totally useless and I decided to respond to it. I've kept trying to respond for the last 20 hours because the cheap web system isn't working properly, I just can't get in. Becaue of that, I have decided to post my response.
As usual I'm using the big sledge hammer, so some of you might get offended due to the current situation at NC Europe. I have the utmost respect for the people getting fired, but can't help but wonder if the situation today could've been totally different with a professional customer oriented team. If you still feel like hating me, fine, I really don't give a you-know-what!
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I was thinking long and hard before I decided to respond to the usual generic answer, especially since I am aware of the current situation for the employees and I have worked tech support myself once, but...
If you read my initial report there is one keyword there:
EVERYONE DCing at the same time. We where a multinational task force from all over Europa and EVERYONE DCd repeatedly at the very same time.
Where does that lead us? A few possible scenarios:
1. The game is bugged after last patch. Response: None, NC never tells us anything about stuff like that and I guess we have to live with it.
2. Something is wrong with the servers. Pretty much same response expected.
3. Something is wrong pretty close to the servers, but may very well be far beyong the company's responsibility (e.g. problem with the internet infrastructure in general, not too uncommon). NC cannot really do much about it.
In the case of 1 & 2, the response I got will only aggravate customers - A LOT - since it is insulting (at best). There is a reason a lot of people leave the game. Frankly, no response whatsoever is better.
In case we have a #2 or #3 situation, asking me to run the netinfotool (and supplying you with the info from ALL EIGHT players, yeah, that is MY job, right) might actually help the techs to find the problem, but it is only useful if I actually run the tool while the problem is ocurring. Leading us back to support again: Sending an email is totally pointless in this situation.
As far as I know, you people can actually contact us in-game. I guess that is way too much trouble? In that case, you might as well all get fired actually, because a robotic answer is equally useful. Good riddance! Of course you can very well blame the company and its policies, but the company is in the end made up by the people that work for it as well. It is the responsibility of both the employer and the employee to create a good atmosphere and treat each other and the customers with respect.
Now, a few good GMs actually do bother to contact people, to read the question/petition and not just send off that generic by-the-book response. Even if they cannot do anything about the situation, most customers will accept that because they have shown them some respect. Paying the bill next month will not feel like such a (cencored for your conveniece) then.
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