Dark/Dark def, -tohit slotting overkill?
By
Burning_Seraph_EU,
Posted on: 2008-06-28 19:41 in Defenders
Its not overkill. When you get to AVs they'd resist most of that and so you could need as much as you can get.
oh and think of -45% tohit as +45% def.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
IMO it is worth slotting Darkest Night, Fearsome Stare and Dark Servant for -ToHit but not the Dark Blast attacks.
Octavian Vanguard
@ohmsEU and @ohms 2
Badging character: Bimble on the Union server, Badgehunter.com and City Info Tracker.
Ah, good point, didn't think of AV's resists. I'll leave my -tohit set in DN and give Fluffy some -tohit as well. I'll think about slotting some in Fearsome as well, but my inner controller says to slot fear sets first.
And yes, I do think of -tohit as +def, that's why I mentioned my +def powers as well 
Icelock - Ice/Storm Controller
Command Bot 1 - Bot/Traps MM
I'd stick with -tohit in DN and Fluffy and not worry about it elsewhere. Aside from Nemesis I've never had problems with any other mob outdoing the debuff, including most AVs and GMs unless you plan on tanking them yourself =D
Fearsome stare also works wonderfully with the Glimpse of the Abyss set, and I think slotting -tohit there would be a waste.
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Fearsome stare also works wonderfully with the Glimpse of the Abyss set, and I think slotting -tohit there would be a waste.
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Why a waste? It has the same base -Tohit as Darkest Night. Going from (rather poor) memory I have FS slotted with 4 or 5 GoTA set and 1 or 2 Lysosome Exposure. I think I have Twilight Grasp slotted with 2 Lysosomes instead of accuracy IOs too. As well as being a heal, TG does -ToHit, -Dmg and -regen and the debuffs stack. It's a real AV killer 
Octavian Vanguard
@ohmsEU and @ohms 2
Badging character: Bimble on the Union server, Badgehunter.com and City Info Tracker.
I agree with Chisel.
The -tohit is a by product of Fear, if you slot for Fear you extend the duration of the power including the -tohit, by slotting for -tohit you increase the magnitude of the tohit but reduce the duration.
Pre-sets I would slot 2Acc, then in the other 4 slots a combination of recharge and Fear that fits your style of play. This will allow you to double stack FS and thus the -tohit as well or have it readily available for another mob.
I would also do the same for Tenebrous Tentacles, slot 2 Acc and then imob and recharge in the other 4 slots to stack all of the effects not just -tohit.
Just my opinion of course.
L50s: Tanks: Cryofission - Ice/EM - Dr Celsius - Fire/Ice - Saint George - SD/SS | Controllers: Psichosis - Ill/Kin - Major Chaos - Ill/Stm | Scrappers - Neutron Crusader - DM/SR
Currently Levelling: Angelic Blade - BS/WP Scrapper | Seeds of Destruction - Plant/Kin Controller
By rounding down or up to be excluding decimal places I got:
Darkest Night -29% (3 SOs worth)
Fearsome Stare -23% (5 Abyss 1 -tohit)
Dark Blast -11% (1 sec to cast, poo dam anyway, fast rechg, gloom is better duration though)
Totals 63% (which is also Blackstars base tohit debuff rounded up).
Then Fluffy.
With the Dark Blasts I only got 4 including Black Star...25ft rad Black Star - Blue - Dark Consumption.
He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.
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...if you slot for Fear you extend the duration of the power including the -tohit
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Actually, according to the ingame numbers, slotting +fear duration does not increase the duration of the -tohit. Which I suppose is logical if you think about it, the enhancements do state increase duration of fear, not the power in itself.
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This will allow you to double stack FS and thus the -tohit as well or have it readily available for another mob.
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Are you sure? As I recall, debuffs don't stack from the same power (from the same user). But slotting FS for recharge is a good idea anyways.
Icelock - Ice/Storm Controller
Command Bot 1 - Bot/Traps MM
OOOPS!!!
I think you're right, my bad 
Pretty annoyed with myself on this, I new this was the case ages ago but reading too many bad guides has obviously thrown me.
Oh well, I would still leave FS slotted for fear, might slot a -tohit in TT though.
L50s: Tanks: Cryofission - Ice/EM - Dr Celsius - Fire/Ice - Saint George - SD/SS | Controllers: Psichosis - Ill/Kin - Major Chaos - Ill/Stm | Scrappers - Neutron Crusader - DM/SR
Currently Levelling: Angelic Blade - BS/WP Scrapper | Seeds of Destruction - Plant/Kin Controller
Most of my knowledge comes from playing my Nec/Dark, but I have a Dark Def in mid 30s atm.
With the MM, I have slotted fluffy (fluffy does more base -tohit than MM anyway) with -tohit and darkest night with -tohit too, but do not slot Fearsome Stare, gloom, TG or MM pets for -tohit. Yesterday I went toe to toe with Countess Crey AV, conning +2 to me and didn't lose a pet taking her down.
My tactic for AVs, EBs etc is to make sure that I summon the Dark Servant right next to them, so that both the anchor and pbaoe debuff are in effect, giving me stacked Darkest Night and Chill of the Night. With the pets clustered round to get heals off the Dark Servant, I simply cycle TG and Howling to keep regen manageable and keep out of any AoE Mez. Of course, all Nec pets do -tohit attacks too, so this isn't a direct comp with D3, but you get the picture.
I kindof think slotting Fearsome for -tohit is a waste; fear duration is much more useful damage mitigation vs minions and lieuts, bosses should get the anchor as soon as possible (I don't bother on teams with good scraps) just throw out stare, tentacles, tar patch (DNight if worth it) then the cone attack and twighlight the boss to make sure it's not regenerating.
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Fearsome stare also works wonderfully with the Glimpse of the Abyss set, and I think slotting -tohit there would be a waste.
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Why a waste? It has the same base -Tohit as Darkest Night. Going from (rather poor) memory I have FS slotted with 4 or 5 GoTA set and 1 or 2 Lysosome Exposure. I think I have Twilight Grasp slotted with 2 Lysosomes instead of accuracy IOs too. As well as being a heal, TG does -ToHit, -Dmg and -regen and the debuffs stack. It's a real AV killer
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I'd say a waste because like the others have said you'll see much more benefit from keeping the entire mob perma feared, which will be a lot easier with longer duration fear. That and the 50-60% you get without adding any extra -tohit other than in DN and Fluffy will be more than enough for any mob or AV/GM unless you plan on tanking, and even then on my D3 unless I get held/stunned/etc. I can still stand toe to toe with most of them without too much trouble.
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...if you slot for Fear you extend the duration of the power including the -tohit
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Actually, according to the ingame numbers, slotting +fear duration does not increase the duration of the -tohit. Which I suppose is logical if you think about it, the enhancements do state increase duration of fear, not the power in itself.
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This will allow you to double stack FS and thus the -tohit as well or have it readily available for another mob.
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Are you sure? As I recall, debuffs don't stack from the same power (from the same user). But slotting FS for recharge is a good idea anyways.
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This is incorrect. Debuffs from the same power twice MAY stack a lot of the time, unless the power specifically says "does not stack from same caster". A lot of powers will indeed let you stack the debuff.
Fearsome Stares toHit debuff isn't marked "does not stack" according to Red Tomax, so if you have the recharge down less than 20 seconds you'll get some stacking on the ToHit debuff.
There's no way to increase the duration of ToHit debuffs as far as I know (Power Build-up boosts the amount debuffed, not the time it debuffs for)
Was looking at the slotting for my mid-30s D3 and started wondering if it's overkill to slot tohit debuff enhancements in my powers. Just using unslotted Darkest Night and Fearsome Stare would put mobs at -37.5% tohit. Add either of the cones from /Dark and they're at -45% or lower. Plus there's Fluffy with his debuffs, various single target attacks/debuffs and some defense from Shadow Fall and Maneuvers...
So can I more or less ignore slotting for -tohit, or at least slot for other effects first, or am I missing something? (There are of course special cases, like DE emanators and Nemesis vengeance where extra -tohit is nice to have)
Icelock - Ice/Storm Controller
Command Bot 1 - Bot/Traps MM