City of Heroes: Live Forum Archive

help with ill/kin build

DreamMaster

By DreamMaster,
Posted on: 2006-09-27 07:21 in Controllers

 

Posted

Hi Everyone,

I used to have a Grav/Kin controller, which I quite liked. I fancy something along the same lines but with some solo capability. For this I thought of rolling an Illusion/Kinetic controller.

I have had a first go at doing a build (see below). Can any of you nice peeps give me some advice on my build or possibly a build for an ill/kin please.

Thanks.

---------------------------------------------
Exported from Ver: 1.7.6.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder - (http://sherksilver.coldfront.net/index.php)
---------------------------------------------
Name: Name illkin
Level: 50
Archetype: Controller
Primary: Illusion Control
Secondary: Kinetics
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Spectral Wounds==> Acc(1) Dmg(3) Dmg(9) Dmg(11) Acc(43)
01) --> Transfusion==> Acc(1) Heal(3) Heal(5) Heal(5) Acc(34) Acc(43)
02) --> Deceive==> Acc(2) Acc(7) ConfDur(15) ConfDur(34) ConfDur(37) Range(40)
04) --> Siphon Power==> Acc(4) Acc(9) Acc(43) Rechg(48)
06) --> Flash==> Acc(6) Acc(7)
08) --> Swift==> Run(8)
10) --> Siphon Speed==> Acc(10) Acc(11) Acc(42)
12) --> Group Invisibility==> Rechg(12) Rechg(13) Rechg(13) EndRdx(17)
14) --> Air Superiority==> Acc(14) Acc(15)
16) --> Fly==> EndRdx(16) EndRdx(17)
18) --> Phantom Army==> Rechg(18) Rechg(19) Rechg(19)
20) --> Health==> Heal(20) Heal(21) Heal(21)
22) --> Stamina==> EndMod(22) EndMod(23) EndMod(23)
24) --> Speed Boost==> EndMod(24) EndMod(25) EndMod(25)
26) --> Spectral Terror==> Rechg(26) Rechg(27) Rechg(27)
28) --> Increase Density==> DmgRes(28) DmgRes(29) DmgRes(29)
30) --> Blind==> Acc(30) Acc(31) Hold(31) Hold(31) Hold(46)
32) --> Phantasm==> Rechg(32) Rechg(33) Rechg(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(34)
35) --> Transference==> Acc(35) EndMod(36) EndMod(36) EndMod(36) Acc(37) Rechg(37)
38) --> Fulcrum Shift==> Acc(38) Rechg(39) Rechg(39) Rechg(39) Acc(40) Acc(40)
41) --> Conserve Power==> EndRdx(41) Rechg(42) Rechg(42)
44) --> Temp Invulnerability==> DmgRes(44) DmgRes(45) DmgRes(45) EndRdx(45) EndRdx(46) EndRdx(46)
47) --> Power Boost==> Rechg(47) Rechg(48) Rechg(48)
49) --> Repel==> EndRdx(49) EndRdx(50) EndRdx(50) KB_Dist(50)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Empty(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Empty(1)
01) --> Containment==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Empty(2)
---------------------------------------------

 

Posted

Ok, here are some comments, working my way down through the build:

Transfusion is probably overslotted for accuracy. For PvE two accuracy is generally plenty unless you're facing ridiculously purple foes. I'd either slot it 2 acc/2 heal/2 recharge or 2 acc/3 heal/1 recharge.

Deceive is wayyyyy overslotted for general PvE use. Facing a group of 3 minions with just a couple of accuracies on it it'll last long enough for you to keep one enemy deceived while holding and spectral wounding the other two. It doesn't need the added range and it'll only need the added confuse duration if you want to stack it on multiple bosses. If you do want to keep it 6 slotted I'd probably go 2 acc/2 duration/2 recharge for quick stacking. It's probably ok-ish slotting for PvP but I still think the range isn't needed (my end target on my ill/ff is to have deceive slotted 2 acc/2 duration/2 recharge for PvP use).

Siphon Power is again over-slotted for PvE - 2 accuracy is enough and then as many recharge as you want.

Flash really isn't very effective until you can slot it with SO's so I usually push it out until somewhere in the 20's. Granted illusionists don't really bring a lot of control to the table at low levels so that may be why you want it that early.

Siphon Speed - again probably one too many accuracies. I loved this power for stacking the buffs on me and debuffing the bad guys so I 6 slotted it 2 acc/3 recharge/1 slow but it's a matter of taste really. I do like having some recharge in there in case it misses though - it can be a pain waiting for it to come back up. It's up to you to slot it depending on what you want to do with the power

Phantom Army - for a soloing illusionist it really pays to 6 slot this power. 1 acc/ 2 damage/3 recharge will give a good damage boost with affecting the power's availability.

Health - really does not need extra slots on a low hp character. These slots could be moved to Phantom Army as damage.

Spectral Terror - this power's recharge is the same as it's duration and you can only have one out at a time so it doesn't need to be slotted for recharge unless you want to have the flexibility to move it's location mid-fight. It's a fine power with just the base slot slotted with accuracy. Add a fear for flavour and maybe keep a recharge to give you that added flexibility.

Increase Density - this is one of those powers that really depends on what you want to use it for. It's too short a duration to keep the whole team buffed with it so lots of people just use it as a mez breaker with just the base slot. If you want to use it as a resistance buff then by all means 3 slot it - your team mates will benefit a lot against some enemy types.

Blind - this is a power that needs to be picked up as soon as possible. An illusionist without their single target hold until the 30's will not be bringing a whole lot to teams and will really struggle to solo as well. This should be moved up to where deceive is and either deceive or flash delayed until later (my money would be on delaying Flash but I'm a soloer so deceive benefits my illusionists more at low levels). Try to 6 slot this power 2 acc/2 hold/2 recharge.

Phantasm - this pet is perma unless it dies or you exit a mission or move to another zone so it really doesn't need the recharge. I slotted mine 2 acc/3 damage.

Fulcrum Shift - you could probably get away with dropping one of the accuracies - 2 acc/3 recharge is quite effective slotting.

Conserve Power - could probably change the end reduction to a third recharge so it's up more often (I don't think it costs all that much endurance to use).

Temp Invulnerability - you could probably drop one (or two) of the endurance reductions but it's up to you You'll know best by that level if you have endurance problems or not.


So those are my comments. A lot of your slotting choices depend on how you want to use a power. It's a fun combination to play - enjoy

Defiant 50�s: Generalissimo, Righteous Bob, Splortch, Brutus Cayuga
Union 50's: Chimera Obscura, Diet Anthracite, Grim Proctologist, Puny Little Minion, Raging Bitumen

In Soviet Russia, mission farm you!

 

Posted

Generalissimo already said a few of these things, but here goes...

Ill/Kin is always a tight build because there are so many good powers on both side, it's hard to leave things out. In terms of choices, I would try to fit in Hasten and if possible Assault/Tactics (so your kin powers don't miss much). I would leave out ID (although it's a nice buff) and probably respec out AS/Fly after 28 and take IR instead (just to fit in more powers). Flash is only worth it if you 6-slot it and don't bother taking it before SOs (some people even skip it, although it's your only tool for AoE containment, so I would keep it). I guess Siphon Power is droppable after Fulcrum, although it's nice to stack on AVs, so not sure what else to drop. Here are a few comments on slotting (assuming it's a PvE build):

- Transfusion: swap an Acc for a Rechg
- Deceive: a bit over-slotted imho. 1-2 acc 1 ConfDur is probably enough
- Siphon Speed: needs more Rechgs
- Group Invis: don't think it needs the EndRdx. If you take Hasten, I think it's perma with 2 Rechgs. Also, if you plan to solo a lot, I would take Superior Invis. It's an end hog, but as a toggle, you have control over when it's on (also I think there are some problems currently with GI suppressing -but not showing- when you click glowies)
- Fly: you need Flight speed, preferably 3
- ST: it's perma out of the box, so slot 1-2 Acc 1-2 Fear
- PA: their damage is not that bad, so slot 3 Dmg if possible
- Health: I would take Hurdle instead. It makes almost no difference and you have a great heal anyway. If you do take it, don't slot it
- Blind: you should take this at lvl 1 or 2. I prefer 2 Acc 2 Hold 2 Rechg so it can stack
- Phant: no need for Rechg, slot 1-2 Acc 3 Dmg
- You don't need Conserve Power with Stamina and Transference. Take the blast instead.
- Temp Invuln: only needs 1-2 EndRdx
- Don't take Repel.

If you do take Tactics, you can probably drop an Acc from some of the powers (e.g. Siphons, Fulcrum).

Hope some of this helps!

CoX 50s: <ill/rad> <ice/ice> <fire/kin> <grav/sonic> <ice/storm> <earth/kin> <kin/elec> <cold/psy> <thugs/dark> <fire/dark> <dark/elec> <night widow> <EM/ninj> <mind/icy>

 

Posted

Ok well hopefully this may help, this is one of the respec builds for my own Illus/Kin currently 45 on his way to 50 and possibly the most fun toon I have played. Things that I think I should comment on...

Deceive: Dont have it, it never suited my play style tbh so I specced it out but it is a good power if you use it well, just not my cup of tea.

This build was used as primarily a soloing toon and not on unyielding or invincy so some slottings are a little different one example is PA I dont bother with and Acc, never really seemed to need it.

Flash: I have since respecced it out, again its a playstyle thing tbh but I just didnt use it enough.

Epic: I took Fire as I wanted the Fireball Fulcram Shift combo for pure damage.

---------------------------------------------
Exported from Ver: 1.7.6.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder
---------------------------------------------
Name: White Phantasm RS
Level: 50
Archetype: Controller
Primary: Illusion Control
Secondary: Kinetics
---------------------------------------------
01) --&gt; Blind

  2. Recharge Reduction(1)
  3. Recharge Reduction(3)
  4. Hold Duration(5)
  5. Hold Duration(5)
  6. Accuracy(7)
  7. Accuracy(7)
01) --&gt; Transfusion
  2. Recharge Reduction(1)
  3. Healing(3)
  4. Healing(9)
  5. Healing(11)
  6. Accuracy(13)
  7. Accuracy(27)
02) --&gt; Spectral Wounds
  2. Damage(2)
  3. Damage(13)
  4. Damage(31)
  5. Accuracy(34)
  6. Accuracy(37)
  7. Recharge Reduction(40)
04) --&gt; Siphon Power
  2. Accuracy(4)
  3. Accuracy(15)
  4. Recharge Reduction(15)
  5. Recharge Reduction(29)
06) --&gt; Hasten
  2. Recharge Reduction(6)
  3. Recharge Reduction(31)
  4. Recharge Reduction(31)
08) --&gt; Superior Invisibility
  2. End Reduction(8)
  3. End Reduction(9)
10) --&gt; Siphon Speed
  2. Accuracy(10)
  3. Accuracy(11)
  4. Recharge Reduction(17)
  5. Recharge Reduction(17)
  6. Recharge Reduction(25)
12) --&gt; Swift
  2. Run Speed(12)
14) --&gt; Super Speed
  2. Run Speed(14)
16) --&gt; Health
  2. Healing(16)
18) --&gt; Phantom Army
  2. Recharge Reduction(18)
  3. Recharge Reduction(19)
  4. Recharge Reduction(19)
  5. Damage(23)
  6. Damage(23)
  7. Damage(25)
20) --&gt; Stamina
  2. Endurance Modification(20)
  3. Endurance Modification(21)
  4. Endurance Modification(21)
22) --&gt; Speed Boost
  2. Recharge Reduction(22)
  3. Endurance Modification(29)
24) --&gt; Recall Friend
  2. Range Increase(24)
26) --&gt; Spectral Terror
  2. Accuracy(26)
  3. Accuracy(27)
  4. Fear Duration(39)
  5. Recharge Reduction(46)
28) --&gt; Inertial Reduction
  2. Jump(28)
30) --&gt; Flash
  2. Accuracy(30)
  3. Accuracy(43)
  4. Hold Duration(43)
  5. Hold Duration(46)
  6. Recharge Reduction(50)
  7. Recharge Reduction(50)
32) --&gt; Phantasm
  2. Accuracy(32)
  3. Accuracy(33)
  4. Accuracy(33)
  5. Damage(33)
  6. Damage(34)
  7. Damage(34)
35) --&gt; Transference
  2. Recharge Reduction(35)
  3. Accuracy(36)
  4. Accuracy(36)
  5. Endurance Modification(36)
  6. Endurance Modification(37)
  7. Endurance Modification(37)
38) --&gt; Fulcrum Shift
  2. Accuracy(38)
  3. Accuracy(39)
  4. Recharge Reduction(39)
  5. Recharge Reduction(40)
  6. Recharge Reduction(40)
41) --&gt; Fire Ball
  2. Damage(41)
  3. Damage(42)
  4. Damage(42)
  5. Accuracy(42)
  6. Accuracy(43)
44) --&gt; Fire Shield
  2. End Reduction(44)
  3. End Reduction(45)
  4. Damage Resist(45)
  5. Damage Resist(45)
  6. Damage Resist(46)
47) --&gt; Fire Blast
  2. Accuracy(47)
  3. Accuracy(48)
  4. Damage(48)
  5. Damage(48)
  6. Damage(50)
49) --&gt; Group Invisibility
  2. Recharge Reduction(49)
---------------------------------------------
01) --&gt; Sprint
  2. Empty Enhancement(1)
01) --&gt; Brawl
  2. Empty Enhancement(1)
01) --&gt; Containment
  2. Empty Enhancement(1)
02) --&gt; Rest
  2. Empty Enhancement(2)
---------------------------------------------

Anyway hope its of use, any questions feel free to lob them up here or PM me.

Cheers,

White

 

Posted

Thank you for all the help everyone who has replied.

I think I will roll one of these tonight. I did try a grav/kin before but took ages to level as it didnt have no solo ability.

Would you lot say that an Ill/Kin is quite solo-able

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Thank you for all the help everyone who has replied.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your more than welcome

[ QUOTE ]
Would you lot say that an Ill/Kin is quite solo-able

[/ QUOTE ]

See my comments on my build above I pretty much totally soloed for a good chunk of my levels. My answer Much, much more that quite!!

If you are going to solo alot bit of advice: Blind-Siphon Power-Spec Wounds-Siphon Speed(later on) is your best friend till you hit PA get em and slot asap!

Enjoy the new toon and let us know how you get on

Cheers,

White

 

Posted

In my experience ill/kin is a very soloable build, depending on your power choices. Blind, Spectral Wounds and especially (in my opinion) Deceive are invaluable tools for a soloing illusionist. Add Transfusion for the self heal in melee and you're sorted for 99% of missions.
Back before containment was introduced and before the animation for Deceive was shortened (a great recent change) I soloed my ill/kin about 75% of the time from lvl 10 upwards (I duoed the start of the Hollows and got Frostfire out of the way and also teamed sparodically in Striga and then teamed a lot in PI). I've recently soloed an ill/ff up to 30 and am currently soloing a low level ill/rad on Union so I've had a lot of recent experience with illusion. If I'm facing a group of three minions I tend to deceive one, hold and spectral wound the second and hold or deceive the third, depending on which recharges first or which is more appropriate. Xp loss through Deceive is very slight compared to the safety and speed it adds to soloing.

Defiant 50�s: Generalissimo, Righteous Bob, Splortch, Brutus Cayuga
Union 50's: Chimera Obscura, Diet Anthracite, Grim Proctologist, Puny Little Minion, Raging Bitumen

In Soviet Russia, mission farm you!

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Flash: I have since respecced it out, again its a playstyle thing tbh but I just didnt use it enough.

Epic: I took Fire as I wanted the Fireball Fulcram Shift combo for pure damage.


[/ QUOTE ]

One small comment: if you've dropped Flash, you have to rely on other controllers for AoE containment to make the Fulcrum/Fire Ball combo really work.

CoX 50s: <ill/rad> <ice/ice> <fire/kin> <grav/sonic> <ice/storm> <earth/kin> <kin/elec> <cold/psy> <thugs/dark> <fire/dark> <dark/elec> <night widow> <EM/ninj> <mind/icy>

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Flash: I have since respecced it out, again its a playstyle thing tbh but I just didnt use it enough.

Epic: I took Fire as I wanted the Fireball Fulcram Shift combo for pure damage.


[/ QUOTE ]

One small comment: if you've dropped Flash, you have to rely on other controllers for AoE containment to make the Fulcrum/Fire Ball combo really work.

[/ QUOTE ]

That is a valid point and I did consider it as should the OP, but whilst playing around for a while with tactics I've pretty much found that after Dropping PA, moving in and hitting FS-Fireball the mobs were going down fast enough Adding Flash to set up containment would be nice though and I might well take it over Fire Blast overall I have found I do well enough atm buuut .... more damage is always good.

One of the joys of Illus imo is the different ways you can use it so much so that I might well roll another Illus troller soon

Cheers,

White

 

Posted

I rolled my Ill/Kin controller last night and played about with him a bit. I have to say that I am really enjoying the set atm.

Having rolled a /kin before I sort of knew what it will be like. Think this alt is going to be my "fun" alt as i still have to get my main (claw/regen) those last 6 levels to 50.

Think its going to be difficult to stay off my ill/kin to level my main though!

 

Posted

Hi,

I have had another look at my build, and have taken out flash. Reason for this is that I have tried it and I dont really like it. It gives me too much aggro, plus when PA etc. comes along I don't think I will have much use for it.

Can you take a look at my build and pick it to pieces if needed I really wanna get this build right

I am up to lvl 11 now, so will need to respec when first respec comes around.

01) --&gt; Spectral Wounds==&gt; Acc(1) Dmg(3) Acc(7) Dmg(15) Dmg(17)
01) --&gt; Transfusion==&gt; Acc(1) Heal(3) Heal(5) Heal(13) Acc(15) Rechg(17)
02) --&gt; Deceive==&gt; Acc(2) Rechg(5) Acc(7) Rechg(19) ConfDur(19) ConfDur(27)
04) --&gt; Siphon Power==&gt; Acc(4) Acc(9) Rechg(11)
06) --&gt; Blind==&gt; Acc(6) Hold(9) Hold(11)
08) --&gt; Swift==&gt; Run(8)
10) --&gt; Siphon Speed==&gt; Acc(10) Acc(13) Slow(43) Slow(45) Rechg(45)
12) --&gt; Superior Invisibility==&gt; EndRdx(12) EndRdx(21)
14) --&gt; Hover==&gt; EndRdx(14)
16) --&gt; Fly==&gt; EndRdx(16) Fly(23) Fly(34) Fly(36)
18) --&gt; Phantom Army==&gt; Acc(18) Rechg(21) Dmg(23) Dmg(25) Dmg(25) Rechg(31)
20) --&gt; Health==&gt; Heal(20) Heal(27) Heal(29)
22) --&gt; Stamina==&gt; EndMod(22) EndMod(27) EndMod(29)
24) --&gt; Speed Boost==&gt; EndMod(24) EndMod(31) EndMod(31)
26) --&gt; Spectral Terror==&gt; Acc(26) Fear(33) Fear(36) Fear(46)
28) --&gt; Increase Density==&gt; DmgRes(28) DmgRes(33) DmgRes(33)
30) --&gt; Group Invisibility==&gt; EndRdx(30) Rechg(34) Rechg(34)
32) --&gt; Phantasm==&gt; Acc(32) Acc(36) Dmg(37) Dmg(37) Dmg(37)
35) --&gt; Transference==&gt; Acc(35) Acc(39) EndMod(39) EndMod(39) EndMod(40) Rechg(40)
38) --&gt; Fulcrum Shift==&gt; Acc(38) Acc(40) Rechg(42) Rechg(42) Rechg(42)
41) --&gt; Conserve Power==&gt; Rechg(41) Rechg(43) Rechg(43)
44) --&gt; Temp Invulnerability==&gt; DmgRes(44) DmgRes(45) DmgRes(46) Rechg(46) Rechg(48) Rechg(48)
47) --&gt; Power Boost==&gt; Rechg(47) Rechg(48) Rechg(50)
49) --&gt; Repel==&gt; EndRdx(49) EndRdx(50) EndRdx(50)
---------------------------------------------
01) --&gt; Sprint==&gt; Run(1)
01) --&gt; Brawl==&gt; Dmg(1)
01) --&gt; Containment==&gt; Empty(1)
02) --&gt; Rest==&gt; Rechg(2)
---------------------------------------------

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Hi,

I have had another look at my build, and have taken out flash. Reason for this is that I have tried it and I dont really like it. It gives me too much aggro, plus when PA etc. comes along I don't think I will have much use for it.


[/ QUOTE ]

Flash is a pain until you get SO'd up but in my opinion it is vital.

As a controller you will be expected to bring some form of hard group control to teams and Phantoms will not be around every mob and can (will) run out when you are in the middle of a fight.

I would try to find room for it after stamina somewhere.

 

Posted

Ok some points, all imo of course...

Blind: You've heavily underslotted imo really should 6 slot for me 2 Acc 2 Hold and 2 Recharge does the job, you will need the recharge especially if like me you are not using Flash.

Siphon Speed: Really dont need the slows and I would strongly advise 3 recharge.

Health: Don't bother 3 slotting this unless you are a tank imo.

Phantom Army: Must have 3 recharge imo gotta cycle it as fast as possible its your main weapon, imo you dont need the Acc but if you must then 3 recharge 1 Acc and 2 Dam.

Group Invis: Not all that tbh imo lose it and get Hasten from the Speed pool to cycle your powers faster.

Epic: Matter of taste I guess but with Fulcram Shift really do suggest you consider Fire Mastery and Fireball for damage. I assume the Recharges in Temp Invun should be End reduxs and imo 1 or 2 of em is enough, better places for the slots.

Dream Masters point on Flash has merit I still dont really miss it as I reakon the best form of troll is a defeated mob and you can achive that pretty well on Ill Kin but as I said before its a play style choice.

All the above is of course imo but I really hope it helps

Cheers,

White