What to do?
Well with the red hair maybe a fire / fire tank would do it for you? They are quite easy to solo as their DoT is immense but if thats not for you then maybe just an inv/* tank?
Hmm - How about an Ice/fire? - herd up all those mobs for some AoE fun...
...The armour might get in the way of your toon's hair - but post 30 a fiery red head aura might add that extra stylish touch
Now if she's going to look stylish, then that might well be the one! I was looking at the various powersets earlier today, fiddling around. Stone and Ice seemed the most attractive primaries for a mainly-solo-but-still-wants-to-team tank, and either fire or ss for a secondary.
Apart from the usual slotting end recs and taking stamina, anybody out there got any advice for the endurance issues a solo tank seems to suffer in my somewhat limited experience pre-20? ie. which powers can be not bothered with until later, which toggles to run and not run based on fire/ice?
With fire as a secondary, is scorch enough to see me through the first ten levels or so solo while I build defences or will I be needing a fire sword and/or combusion?
With Ice, I am presuming that frozen armour, hoarfrost, chilling embrace and wet ice are all more or less compulsary to be an effective tank? Permafrost seems quite meh, icicles a bit love-or-hate.
"Pride is all well and good but a sausage is a sausage"
For Lent I gave up...
Hope
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With fire as a secondary, is scorch enough to see me through the first ten levels or so solo while I build defences or will I be needing a fire sword and/or combusion?
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Scorch is a bit rubbish but is one of the better 1st tier tanker attacks, I relied on it for my Inv/Fire for 10 levels however I would get Combustion at level 4 now that it is possible to. For solo tanking you will need to gather up enemies. Combustion is great in hazard zones too. You can survive on just Combustion and Scorch until the late 20s.
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With Ice, I am presuming that frozen armour, hoarfrost, chilling embrace and wet ice are all more or less compulsary to be an effective tank? Permafrost seems quite meh, icicles a bit love-or-hate.
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For a low level tank, I would get them in this order Frozen Armor, Chilling Embrace, Hoarfrost and then Wet Ice. Some people say Wet Ice should be taken ASAP, but I think that it is highly situational until you have DOs slotted so I would get it at level 8 or 10 rather than 6 when it becomes available.
I wouldn't take Permafrost. I wouldn't get Icicles until you have stamina and SOs if you are going to take it ( I did and I like it ).
The other powers are Glacial Armor, which you can leave until the early 20s, energy absorption which you should get at 26 and Hibernate, which I feel is underrated and you should get at 32.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
The attacks I was having great trouble planning, especially having specialised in scrappers and blasters these last 18 months, where getting another attack is vital!!! Must... hit... bad... guy... one... more... time... So thank you very much for the advice on that.
I am going to have to ask about wet ice though - with a magic origin I will be fighting CoT fairly early on. Wouldn't wet ice be better taken earlier rather than later? Though I suppose 8 isn't really all that late, thinking about it.
Level 1 - Frozen Armour + Scorch
Level 2 - Chilling Embrace? (I am at work - is this available at 2?)
Level 4 - Combustion
Level 6 - Hoarfrost
Level 8 - Wet Ice
Level 10 - Taunt
Level 12 - Air Superiority
Level 14 - Fly
How's that for a start? Slotting will focus primarily on defences, attacks getting an acc and a damage each, defences an end rec plus however many defence buffs I can fit in.
For everyone's information, she will be called Venery and will be starting on Union on the evening of 3rd May UK time. Any help very much appreciated should you run across her.
"Pride is all well and good but a sausage is a sausage"
For Lent I gave up...
Hope
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I am going to have to ask about wet ice though - with a magic origin I will be fighting CoT fairly early on. Wouldn't wet ice be better taken earlier rather than later? Though I suppose 8 isn't really all that late, thinking about it.
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The first heavy mezzer I encountered was Frostfire. Only CoT bosses mez AFAIK. I got Wet Ice at 6 and Hoarforst at 8 and I don't think I needed Wet Ice between 6 and 8.
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Level 1 - Frozen Armour + Scorch
Level 2 - Chilling Embrace? (I am at work - is this available at 2?)
Level 4 - Combustion
Level 6 - Hoarfrost
Level 8 - Wet Ice
Level 10 - Taunt
Level 12 - Air Superiority
Level 14 - Fly
How's that for a start? Slotting will focus primarily on defences, attacks getting an acc and a damage each, defences an end rec plus however many defence buffs I can fit in.
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Seems like a good power choice selection. It leaves 16, 18 and 20 to get the fitness pool.
You may want to swap Air Superiority and Taunt around depending if you feel you are needing Taunt or not. I did get it and 10 but I like corner pulling and for you Air Superiority seems a pretty useful power for making bosses less dangerous. You should have no problems keeping the majority of aggro in melee with just CE, taunt is for regaining any lost aggro or initiating combat.
Defence buffs TOs hardly make any difference.
I suggest the following slotting principle.
Levels 1-11 : Slot attacks with Acc and end red. Slot toggles with end red only.
Levels 12-21 : Slot attacks with Acc, Dam and End red. Slot toggles with 2xEnd and the rest defence.
In the low levels I had 4 slots in FA and 2 in WI and CE. In TOs these were all end reds. I had endurance problems until I switched them to DOs at level 12.
Attackwise, I suspect you are best off concentrating on Combustion, it is a wonderful aggro grabber and does significant damage if surrounded. Fire secondary is pretty poor single target damage until later on.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
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The first heavy mezzer I encountered was Frostfire. Only CoT bosses mez AFAIK. I got Wet Ice at 6 and Hoarforst at 8 and I don't think I needed Wet Ice between 6 and 8.
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A good point, I was thinking along the lines of the stolen jewel mission, which is a very early CoT cave mission with a named mage at the end - can't remember what type he was though. Also the Perez hunt 10 CoT thing. I wasn't really intending to go to the Hollows until after 10, prefering KR missions instead.
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Seems like a good power choice selection. It leaves 16, 18 and 20 to get the fitness pool.
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Doesn't Glacial armour slip in there at 18? If so, stamina may have to wait until 22.
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You may want to swap Air Superiority and Taunt around depending if you feel you are needing Taunt or not. I did get it and 10 but I like corner pulling and for you Air Superiority seems a pretty useful power for making bosses less dangerous. You should have no problems keeping the majority of aggro in melee with just CE, taunt is for regaining any lost aggro or initiating combat.
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Taunt is also for pulling in those pesky cave missions where groups stand too close to charge in without aggroing a second group and getting overwhelmed. This can be a problem especially if solo.
Air Superiority is a fantastic attack for the knockdown effect - it also recharges quite fast and with luck can keep a boss or lt on their backsides throughout a fight. My level 41 scrapper still has it as part of her attack chain, and with flying being my travel power of choice, it seems a logical choice for a tank too.
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Defence buffs TOs hardly make any difference.
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I tend to avoid actually buying TO's, preferring to save cash for DO's as soon as they are available. I slot what drops if it is immediately useful, and do tend to concentrate mainly on end reds and accuracy in preference to anything else.
Thank you for the advice, very much appreciated and I am hoping that with a bit of guidance this will actually be a succesful tank capable of team and solo play.
"Pride is all well and good but a sausage is a sausage"
For Lent I gave up...
Hope
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Seems like a good power choice selection. It leaves 16, 18 and 20 to get the fitness pool.
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Doesn't Glacial armour slip in there at 18? If so, stamina may have to wait until 22.
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Yes but you don't really have the endurance to use it at 18. I got it at 24, which was a little late as the Council galaxies were becoming a pain. 22 should be fine for Glacial Armour.
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... taunt is for regaining any lost aggro or initiating combat.
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Taunt is also for pulling in those pesky cave missions where groups stand too close to charge in without aggroing a second group and getting overwhelmed. This can be a problem especially if solo.
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Pullling = initiating combat. Taunt is good for pulling whole spawns, especially round corners to group them. It depends on your playstyle, I felt I needed it at 10 for the reason you describe. I would leave the decision until level 10 and decide then. As an Ice/Fire you need to keep everyone in chilling embrace to get it's benefits, anyone in Chilloing Embrace should also get hit by Combustion so you are sorted.
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Defence buffs TOs hardly make any difference.
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I tend to avoid actually buying TO's, preferring to save cash for DO's as soon as they are available. I slot what drops if it is immediately useful, and do tend to concentrate mainly on end reds and accuracy in preference to anything else.
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I do the same.
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Thank you for the advice, very much appreciated and I am hoping that with a bit of guidance this will actually be a succesful tank capable of team and solo play.
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Both /Fire and Ice/ are good team players, the combination is probably the best aggro grabbing and retaining tank build you can have. The main problem you will have is dealing with bosses solo, they will take ages until you start your ST attack chain later on ( the 30s for my Inv/Fire ).
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
Glad to see my idea taken up
Sounds all good to me..
I'm... starting..to feel... the altituss...coming on
ARGH!...MUST MAKE NEW TOON
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The first heavy mezzer I encountered was Frostfire. Only CoT bosses mez AFAIK. I got Wet Ice at 6 and Hoarforst at 8 and I don't think I needed Wet Ice between 6 and 8.
[/ QUOTE ]Lost are fairly heavy mezzers as well, and council do knockback.
Well, Venery has been duly created and has had two sessions so far, both fairly short due to limited time whilst working nights.
She is level 6 (and a bit) and has the following powers...
Level 1 - Frozen Armour + Scorch
Level 2 - Chilling Embrace
Level 4 - Combustion
Level 6 - Hoarfrost
I played in a PUG from levels 4 to 6 and had problems with a /energy blapper who insisted he had to run in and use that damn punchy/push thingy on the tank's targets (two tanks in the team, me and an invul). I decided the best tactic when this sort of attack was preferred was to switch targets myself and concentrate on holding aggro from the remaining bad guys. Let the blapper have fun with the guy he just pushed out of my Chilling Embrace, no longer my problem til taunt comes around. I did ask him to stop, more than once.
Combustion is a funny old attack for someone used to scrapping. OK, I like its AoE, quite large for a low-level attack, probably wider than CE. Therefore, using punchvoke, it holds aggro reasonably well. BUT... it's a slow recharge, way too slow to rely as a main attack without recharge being heavily enhanced. It is also quite light on damage 7 + 1/tick for about 6 ticks vs white mobs. Obviously this will change once DO's kick in, but I see my self struggling solo.
Therefore, perhaps a slight change to my build plan would be in order. I was thinking of taking Air Superiority at 8, Wet Ice at 10, Taunt at 12, to give one more attacking option for solo play in the earlier levels. Thoughts?
"Pride is all well and good but a sausage is a sausage"
For Lent I gave up...
Hope
And while I think about it - Am I right in saying that Chilling Embrace only holds the attention of mobs for a limited time before they scatter? There have been a few times now whilst playing with CE to see how it works that the bad guys have all turned and run simultaneously, despite any damage my attacks may have done to them in the mean time.
"Pride is all well and good but a sausage is a sausage"
For Lent I gave up...
Hope
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Am I right in saying that Chilling Embrace only holds the attention of mobs for a limited time before they scatter?
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That hasn't been my experience. It seems to do a very brief but pretty effective taunt, so things that are in melee range or thereabouts tend to focus on you, but they might lose interest fairly quickly if you move away.
I've never encountered any sort of "mass desertion" effect, where it was holding aggro and then suddenly stops.
But...just because a mob wants to fight YOU, doesn't seem to mean he wants to fight. I've had instances where a mob was wanting to run rather than attack, and no amount of Taunting seemed to be able to change his mind. At least Chilling Embrace does a solid slow!
That's just what I've observed; could be entirely wrong.
OK, I have tried tanks, over and over. I actually played one all the way to level 14 once, but have always always ended up deleting them.
Why? Because of time differences and a real life, I have irregular playing hours and often end up playing solo and my tanks have never seemed to suit my mainly solo style. Instead I have gone along the route of scrappers and blasters - easily the best solo classes IMHO.
But....
I am still determined to conquer the Tank AT, at least until the thirties. Most other AT's I have managed to a lesser or greater extent. My target for my Tank is level 34 before possible deletion! (highest level deletion so far is 27 and that was a dark/dark scrapper after I4 or 5, ages ago anyway, due to some long forgotten nerf that meant I needed to change the whole build from the ground)
So what Tank powersets to take? All the guides here and on the US forums are pretty good, every power set very attractive, and all the powersets seem to have good and bad points, but which combination of powers do you tanky-types think would suit an often-solo-but-likes-to-team player?
Looking for something that is fun to play, able to easily solo, fits reasonably easily into a team and looks damn good. It's always important when heroing, looking good - otherwise the citizens don't take enough time to admire the good work you are doing.
Any advice is more than welcome.
Cheers folks.
PS - the Tank will be a female toon,about 5' tall and a red head (it's a theme, all my toons fit this description) and stone armour really plays havoc with hair-styles, so if you suggest stone as a primary, then please also suggest the most suitable hair-styles. Thank you.
"Pride is all well and good but a sausage is a sausage"
For Lent I gave up...
Hope