Question about Build Up procs.

Okay, I know from experience that the Theft of Essence Chance for +End proc can fire multiple times on one activation of a power (in Dark Regeneration from the Dark Armor powerset) I have actually had endurance gain from firing it off before (it procced on 4 of the 8 targets and gained me 40 endurance, while only using 21)

My plan is to slot Scirocco's Dervish into my DM/SR brute's Soul Drain for the AoE defense. I only need 5 slots to get the defense bonus.

My question is: If I slot the Gaussian's Synchronized Fire-Control: Chance for Build Up into the 6th slot of Soul Drain, will it function the same way as the Theft of Essence proc? Or will it just check once when I activate the power?

In other words, is it possible to have a potential +1000% damage boost if it procs on all 10 possible targets? (ludicrously unlikely, but it would be cool to see)

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I don't see why it wouldn't check against each target hit.

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Be well, people of CoH.

I'm betting that it would check on each mob hit. However, remember that there are damage caps for each AT, so you'd never see a +1000% scenario. For the Brute, you'd cap out at 800%.

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Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson

"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus

psst: 850 total, 750 as per the combat monitor

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Be well, people of CoH.

Really? Hmmm...I thought it was 800. Oh well, my bad. Still, it'll be lower than 1000%.

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Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson

"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus

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I'm betting that it would check on each mob hit. However, remember that there are damage caps for each AT, so you'd never see a +1000% scenario. For the Brute, you'd cap out at 800%.

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Yeah, I know about the caps. I was looking at the effect of the power before the cap was taken into consideration.

If you pop Dull Pain while you are 400 HP away from the cap, it still gives you the full amount, it just doesn't do anything past the cap.

Thanks for answering the question though. We'll never really know until someone tries it and sees it proc more than once, but I have my slotting figured out now.

Also, I have my build planned out to not need the full set of Gaussian's to soft-cap, so that isn't a concern.

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That's actually quite an interesting idea, one that I'm surprised I didn't think of. I guess I know what proc I'll be buying for my Defender when I log on later today. Then I can really make many of those Blasters wet their pants! ...sometimes...

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It doesn't work per target but per click. While Foot Stomp, Lightning Rod, Shield Charge and other great skills can run a Force Feedback check on each target hit, Gaussians does not work this way with Soul Drain.

(Or, at least it didn't when I tested it upon the release of toHit buff sets.)

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It doesn't work per target but per click. While Foot Stomp, Lightning Rod, Shield Charge and other great skills can run a Force Feedback check on each target hit, Gaussians does not work this way with Soul Drain.

(Or, at least it didn't when I tested it upon the release of toHit buff sets.)

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They fixed the Force Feedback proc a while ago so that it only checks once per power. That's why it used to be worth a lot and can now be gotten for reasonably cheap.

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[ QUOTE ]
They fixed the Force Feedback proc a while ago so that it only checks once per power. That's why it used to be worth a lot and can now be gotten for reasonably cheap.

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Actually, that's not correct, last I read up on it. It is better to slot it in an AoE than a single target attack, exactly because it does check once per target.

That said, it cannot self stack, so it only gives you its normal, one-target benefit even if it triggers on multiple targets. However, multiple targets in an AoE gives a better chance of it triggering due to multiple activation checks.

It also suppresses even in click powers. There is ongoing debate about how exactly this suppression functions, but the evidence seems to lean towards it being benefit suppression instead of activation suppression. This means it is possible for it to activate while suppressed, the suppression to end, and then for you to get a reduced duration benefit with a delay after the intitial activation.

The reason it used to be worth a lot was that it had a 100% chance of activation. The only thing that kept it even remotely grounded in sanity was its suppression.

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Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

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They fixed the Force Feedback proc a while ago so that it only checks once per power. That's why it used to be worth a lot and can now be gotten for reasonably cheap.

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That's not what happened. Force Feedback used to work 100% of the time, but had a cool down period of 20 seconds. This meant that any skill with the proc would give 100% recharge for 10 seconds any time a a knock back power was used, but there was a cool down period that prevented it from being activated again. It also couldn't stack.

It was expensive because it was broken and offered, basically, 50% global recharge to any set that had a least one knock back power.

It now checks like a normal proc, doesn't stack, and can check multiple times. This is why it's great in Foot Stomp, Shield Charge, and Lightning Rod.

Gaussians was limited to check once per click of a skill, so it's a waste in Soul Drain.

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
They fixed the Force Feedback proc a while ago so that it only checks once per power. That's why it used to be worth a lot and can now be gotten for reasonably cheap.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, that's not correct, last I read up on it. It is better to slot it in an AoE than a single target attack, exactly because it does check once per target.

That said, it cannot self stack, so it only gives you its normal, one-target benefit even if it triggers on multiple targets. However, multiple targets in an AoE gives a better chance of it triggering due to multiple activation checks.

It also suppresses even in click powers. There is ongoing debate about how exactly this suppression functions, but the evidence seems to lean towards it being benefit suppression instead of activation suppression. This means it is possible for it to activate while suppressed, the suppression to end, and then for you to get a reduced duration benefit with a delay after the intitial activation.

The reason it used to be worth a lot was that it had a 100% chance of activation. The only thing that kept it even remotely grounded in sanity was its suppression.

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Yeah, that sounds right now that I think about it. I never slotted it, considering I never had a character that found much use for it, but I do recall that the change the devs implemented decreased chance and increased the effect while removing stackability. I still don't believe that Soul Drain actually checks on each target though because, unless the devs also changed the stackability whenever they made the Gauss proc unique, it's still supposed to be stackable (if you can break all of the other rules).

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I still don't believe that Soul Drain actually checks on each target though because, unless the devs also changed the stackability whenever they made the Gauss proc unique, it's still supposed to be stackable (if you can break all of the other rules).

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I believe you're right, but that may have to do with the fact that there's only one target for the toHit buff portion of the power, where as FFB affects the Knockback component of slotted powers, which affects opponents.

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Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

Another way to look at it is this: Gaussians checks upon the click of a skill-- which only happens once for obvious reasons. Build Up, Aim, and even Soul Drain can all grant the ability to run a procedure even if no targets are in range, unlike other procs that check against a MOB that has been attacked.

It's basically how they got the proc to work with skills like BU and Aim, but in turn made it largely uselss in Soul Drain.

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It doesn't work per target but per click. While Foot Stomp, Lightning Rod, Shield Charge and other great skills can run a Force Feedback check on each target hit, Gaussians does not work this way with Soul Drain.

(Or, at least it didn't when I tested it upon the release of toHit buff sets.)

[/ QUOTE ]

They fixed the Force Feedback proc a while ago so that it only checks once per power. That's why it used to be worth a lot and can now be gotten for reasonably cheap.

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not quite.

what they did was fix it's chance to fire.

The way it worked was that it would fire, last for 5 seconds (non stacking) and then there was a 5 second period which it wouldn't fire, if you used the power after that 5 seconds, it would proc 100% of the time.

It still does not stack with itself, but now it lasts for 5 seconds, has a 5 second period which it won't fire, then has the correct chance to proc after that, which is apparently what it was supposed to do.

so, you have a better chance of it firing in an AoE than a ST attack, but it just won't proc more than once per fire.

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No

Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo

I think you underestimate our fools, sir.

Why /duel is a bad idea

Nice but confusing info.

Glad I kept it in followup.

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Be well, people of CoH.

Yeah- that's the only skill where Gaussian's proc can make a solid contribution. Well, that and Blinding Feint I should say.

Ironically, the proc is better in a Toggle than in most click skills.

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Yeah- that's the only skill where Gaussian's proc can make a solid contribution. Well, that and Blinding Feint I should say.

Ironically, the proc is better in a Toggle than in most click skills.

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A lot of people claim it is better in a toggle - and I agree that unless you use a click power more often then once every 10 seconds you will have more checks for it to fire off in toggle however with the short duration of the buildup I have always felt that the odds of it both firing off AND affecting attacks was a lot less likely in a toggle as it checks every 10 seconds whether or not you are actually in combat, about to attack, etc - so if it fires off when a mob has a sliver of health left, or when running between combats it won't do you any good.

At least with buildup/aim you are always going to follow up with attacks immediately afterwords so you will get maximum benefit from the build up effect if it does fire off. Obviously, follow up/blinding feint is going to be the best choice as with a reasonable amount of recharge you can use that more than every 10 seconds but I had a gaussian's chance for build up in my archery/devices blasters targetting drone and I don't recall EVER noticing the build up effect being of use. That doesn't mean it wasn't but I certainly didn't notice it.

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Globals: @Midnight Mystique/@Magik13

I PMed Castle about this. If and when he answers me I'll let you all know definitely one way or the other.

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