Because the devs are special kids.
For some reason, they decided that completely detaching the PvP game from the PvE game would make it friendlier and more attractive to people wanting to learn PvP.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
Bah, Esh summed it up nicely
DR = Failed third grade math reject = Devs
In other words, there is no reason?
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In other words, there is no reason?
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Special children can come up with all kinds of reasons, unfortunetly none of them are logical nor understandable. They didn't really even state their goals with the changes, bring more pve'rs to pvp? lolfail
Sooo...who wants Devs to make PvP like PvE? Think they will ever do that?
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In other words, there is no reason?
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Badly designed/projected idea.
Good News: They try to come up with ideas to fix it with each new expansion.
Bad News: Failed big time so far.
- Dual Blades Stalker Guide
- Mastermind guide to Pain Domination
Biggest reasons behind the changes were:
1. Address various imbalances. Some of these were addressed but even more were created.
2. Eliminate FotMs. This succeeded - in a way. It managed to choke off some of the old FotMs but all it did was replace them with new ones.
3. Remove entry barrier. Nope, skill factor is still there.
4. Get more people involved. Maybe - there are some people around that weren't before. But there are a lot less overall because the changes drove away a lot of the really good players.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
What was *wrong* with it in the first place? Maybe they could reduce mez duration a little or perhaps limit it, DR was a good idea for IO bonuses...I dont remember it being that bad
I wish Tanks didn't do more damage than my scrapper...so dumb.
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What was *wrong* with it in the first place? Maybe they could reduce mez duration a little or perhaps limit it, DR was a good idea for IO bonuses...I dont remember it being that bad
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What was wrong with PvP? People complained about it without bothering to figure out how the system worked. The devs listened.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
They just need to change it back. Keep DR for IO set bonuses to stay in check, keep supression. All good?
Honestly, this entire issue's pvp "Fixes" should go in the trash IMO of course
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They just need to change it back. Keep DR for IO set bonuses to stay in check, keep supression. All good?
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Suppression needs to go
Why Diminish IO's? if some1 has the time and patience to io a toon, they should get the entire benefit?
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They just need to change it back. Keep DR for IO set bonuses to stay in check, keep supression. All good?
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[censored] no. Get rid of it entirely.
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Honestly, this entire issue's pvp "Fixes" should go in the trash IMO of course
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Yep.
Because IO bonuses is what makes it fair for newbies? Hey I'm ALL FOR non DR but I thought they made that to encourage new pvp'rs. Suppression I dont like, but I dont mind it too bad.
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Because IO bonuses is what makes it fair for newbies? Hey I'm ALL FOR non DR but I thought they made that to encourage new pvp'rs. Suppression I dont like, but I dont mind it too bad.
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Ummm, ok its fair for newbies, what happens when that newbie happens to be on a purpled out dom built for pvp walks in and suddenly his io bonus's go *poof*
Honestly, it all needs to go, if the newbies wanna be newbies, they can go to arena, to suffer from a minority within a minority sounds kinda wierd
I just said that cause Dev's wanted it I thought. I want DR gone too....
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Biggest reasons behind the changes were:
1. Address various imbalances. Some of these were addressed but even more were created.
2. Eliminate FotMs. This succeeded - in a way. It managed to choke off some of the old FotMs but all it did was replace them with new ones.
3. Remove entry barrier. Nope, skill factor is still there.
4. Get more people involved. Maybe - there are some people around that weren't before. But there are a lot less overall because the changes drove away a lot of the really good players.
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Can I get a recap of the details behind your assertions? What new imbalances were created? What are the new FotMs and why?
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What new imbalances were created?
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1. There's almost no need for buffers anymore thanks to DR and travel suppression.
2. Tankers are doing as much damage as Brutes (this is a general example, though this sort of issue exists on many levels across many ATs).
3. Controllers can no longer leverage Containment effectively thanks to the change to how mez works.
4. Some defense-based powersets became brokenly good with no consistent effective counter.
5. I could go on, I'm sure others could list more. I'm just pulling things off the top of my head right now.
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What are the new FotMs and why?
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I could make a really long and really detailed post on exactly why a given set is FotM, but that would take a long time and I'm tired. I'll leave it with this - as long as a set outperforms another one in a given situation, even by a small margin, people will choose it. The only way to eliminate this problem is to make everything exactly the same, and that makes everything dull and boring.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
[ QUOTE ]
The only way to eliminate this problem is to make everything exactly the same, and [u]that makes everything dull and boring[u].
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Rendering a few sets great and almost everything else garbage does not?
With the big variety of powers in this game, it's complicated to see that powers are balanced, standarized and made equivalent. But the way things are (for years now) isnt like anyone is even trying too hard.
- Dual Blades Stalker Guide
- Mastermind guide to Pain Domination
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The only way to eliminate this problem is to make everything exactly the same, and [u]that makes everything dull and boring[u].
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Rendering a few sets great and almost everything else garbage does not?
With the big variety of powers in this game, it's complicated to see that powers are balanced, standarized and made equivalent. But the way things are (for years now) isnt like anyone is even trying too hard.
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The same thing can be said for PvE. I'm not sure why everyone continues to apply this to PvP. When you want an AoE Blaster for a TF, you bring a Fire Blaster, not an Ice Blaster. Does this mean Ice needs a buff? Hardly. It's probably one of the best PvE single-target sets. The very nature of PvP ensures that some sets will always be better than others. There's nothing you can do to bring, say, AR up to par with Sonic, other than massively increasing its PvP damage.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
AR doesn't have a tier 3 is all. Why does Shout do more then Dreadful Wail? Stupid max target/cast time damage calculater....
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AR doesn't have a tier 3 is all. Why does Shout do more then Dreadful Wail? Stupid max target/cast time damage calculater....
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Because the devs decided that AoEs needed a damage nerf in a single-target spike environment.
@macskull, @Not Mac | XBL: macskull | Steam: macskull | Skype: macskull
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
"One day we all may see each other elsewhere. In Tyria, in Azeroth. We may pass each other and never know it. And that's sad. But if nothing else, we'll still have Rhode Island."
As of right now (I13 and I14), PvP and PvE areas are completely different, and seem as if they are from two completely different games. The goal of recent PvP changes was to give balence, when we had balance (excluding IO's) all along in PvE.
PvE has the perfect balence to build PvP off of. Very simple indeed. The basic style is "The Higher the Damage, the Lower the Survivability". This basic idea is obscured by a few things.
IO Bonuses
Bonuses from Invention Origin Enhancements can grant too much survivability to AT's that should not have it. However, DR has taken care of this problem.
Ancillary/Patron Pools
This is something that concerns me, and what makes level 50 PvP so wrong... Powers from APP/PPP should not be as strong as the TRUE version of the power. Powers from APP/PPP should not be one of the most important powers for anyone.
Force Field-er's focus on buffing others to help them survive. Because they do not do high damage, they have a power to help them survive, Personal Force Field. Blasters and Dominaters should NOT have this power because they get the power of high damage and high damage/mez, so they have LOWER survivability.
Ice Tankers have Hibernate to get them out of sticky situations when they have angried too many foes. Blasters and Stalkers should NOT have this power because it gives them too much survivability for the amount of damage they can dish out.
Also: Blasts and Mezzes should have a lower base damage and base duration than the TRUE version of the power. This will prevent Tankers, scrappers, brutes, and stalkers from avoiding their draw back of melee. Melee toons trade off range for survivability.
Damage Numbers
Powers should do the same damage in PvP as they do in PvE. This is pretty much a given. PvP should not involve studying every power to see what it will do once you enter a pvp zone. It should do the same thing no matter WHERE you are, PvP or PvE.
Mez Durations
So, recent PvP changes are to draw new PvP'rs to PvP zones? What happens when a player enters a PvP zone and happens to be on his controller? He tries to lock down his foe with all the mez's he has, but to no avail. Mezzes should actually work to full extent, but they should NOT do upwards of 115 base damage. Mez Protection should be put back to normal so that the squishy toons are vulnerable, melee toons are more survivable, and buffers are more useful.
Archetypes have basic roles in PvE that should be the same in PvP.
Tankers do LOW damage while taunting players to help teammates.
Scrappers do HIGH damage but must be in melee.
Blasters do HIGH damage from range, with low survivability.
Controllers do LOW damage, but control enemies and buff/debuff to help team.
Defenders do LOW damage, but buff/debuff to help the team.
*Note: Damage should be ranked as follows:
Blaster
Scrapper
Khedians?
Tank/Defender
Controller
I am posting this because it bugs me as to WHY PvP and PvE have been THIS ALIENATED from eachother...
Why are they so different when it's so unneeded?