deejaye_6

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And Pax, truth be told, just because someone is on a forum with someone and is a friend of theirs, it doesn't make them a "meat puppet" when they decide to come here to defend that friend. It makes them a good friend.

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The definition of "meat puppet" as an internet colloquialism (at least, in my experience) is "Bob is in an argument online; Bob goes to his friends Mary, Joe, Bill, Susan, and Mike to ask for help ... even though none of them are part of the cummunity where said argument is happening; those five friends join said community and leap into said argument."

You call it "being a good friend", I call it "being a meat puppet": their presence has been requested solely to bolster the perceived popularity of Bob's position in an argument, and that is what a Meat Puppet is.

...

Aha, found a reference for you: Wikipedia's article on internet sock puppetry.

[/ QUOTE ] Okay, and if he did ask them to come here and help, then you might be right. But then again, he might have simply said, "Man, what a jerk! Dude on the forums called me a spoiled brat for asking for some base love in I12!" and his friends (without being asked to) said, "What?!" and went on their own to see what had been said. To me, they are acting on their own, under their own willpower, and are not "puppets" in any way, shape, combination, or form. (If I'm right, that is...)

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What I noticed first was the tiny post counts of several individuals who suddenly appeared out of nowhere to chime in on JZ’s side… Coupled, of course, with JZ jumping in immediately and saying “HA! You see! Other people agree with me! So there!” It didn’t pass the smell test. In fact, this is the very first time I’ve ever questioned the reality of another poster on these forums. I think that in this case I had good reason.

The one person I knew to be real, PlasmaStream, received a thoughtful response.

And as a matter of fact, I’ve not seen any evidence that any of these posters is not an alt account. The one registered two days ago is particularly suspicious. But I’m willing to concede that they are (mostly, anyway) real people, since like you pointed out a meat puppet is not any better than a sock puppet.

[/ QUOTE ] Why not do a search on my name in the forums? You'll notice that I've been posting on this kind of thing here and there for a long time now. And most of those posts are about the same thing: base love. I laid into you and Radiant Beam simply because this is the first time I've seen *anyone* else asking for what I've asked for, and the two of you treated him like crap. And there was NO excuse for it. You said a few pages ago what you *meant* by the Veruca Salt comment. If you can keep your posts on topic like that from now on, you may very well avoid being jumped by a bunch of folks.

And regardless of your attempts to change the argument from "We'd like to see something for the bases" to "We demand EVERYTHING for the bases" (which none of us have, in fact, asked for), what we have asked for is now coming to fruition. So, you may say what you like on this thread. I'm done. But if the SG logo bug isn't fixed in I13, you'll most likely see me there, too.

Peace.

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They’re not alt accounts? Not even the one that was registered yesterday? Heh. So instead he ran off to another internet community crying for his friends to come save him from the big, bad CoX Forum Bully. Yeah, that’s much better than just whining for his Oompa Loompa. I guess he sure showed me!

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You don't have a single friend, do you? I know for my own part that if one of my friends had told me that he had posted here and someone had compared him to Veruca Salt, I would immediately come here to see what was said.

The fact of the matter is, you acted like a freaking jerk and instead of making a point, you insulted someone. Someone with friends. And then some of them take you to task for it and what? You're surprised? *shakes head*

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(And I’m still waiting to hear how, exactly, the newly hired developers could be reasonably expected to complete tens of thousands of programming hours of work between December 07 and the announcement of the planned content of i12.)

[/ QUOTE ]Oh, geez... Are you *still* on this??? THE DEVS ARE NOT ALL NEW! For crying out loud, they have already said that they are fixing one of the oldest base bugs with Issue 12! Clearly, they must be more capable than you'd give them credit for. I dare say if they were only capable of what *you* seem to think they are, we'd still be waiting for even a *rumor* of Ish 12...

Maybe if you'd read what I posted previously in this thread, you might have had a clue about that.

I just love that I argued every point Zub has made on this point (including how Plasma, the guy he acknowledges is real, already TOLD him that we're real) and he's not said a thing about it. And yet, he still won't shut up, once more claiming that JZ whined.

And Pax, truth be told, just because someone is on a forum with someone and is a friend of theirs, it doesn't make them a "meat puppet" when they decide to come here to defend that friend. It makes them a good friend.

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Since Mr. Zubenelomgugottabekiddingmegenubi thought it appropriate to sling mud and call names for paying customers.... [snip]

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"This alt account ALSO agrees with me!!! AND since nobody knows who it really is, I can make up lies about what Zube has actually said (because of course nobody can go back and read his posts and see for themselves that he didn't do that)!! It's a foolproof plan!"

[/ QUOTE ]Well, Zube. I do believe that your reply on page 49 in which you quoted Veruca Salt was your way of calling JZ a spoiled brat. I cannot see how you can even think that saying it the way you did could be taken *any* other way. And that, sir, is (in effect) calling someone a name. So, no, you do not get to play the innocence card in this. An apology card to JZ might be nice, though...

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Call me a brown noser if you want

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NEVER. You have never been anything but polite and factual in your posts here (as far as I can see) and I see no reason to be anything other than that with you.

You make some very valid points here. All JZ and the rest of us want is some sign from the devs that the bases aren't being pushed off the back burner and into the mulch bin, which is what it's seemed like for some time now. The scuttlebutt has been that the team who put the bases in has left, and no one there wants anything to do with them now. True? Almost certainly not! But it's still being said by many, and with quite a bit of hopelessness in their words when they say it.

As I've already said, the notice that one of the longest (and most annoying to me) lived bugs in the game is now going to be fixed in I12 is all I need to hear to let me know that the devs still care. Though it really would be nice to see some more stuff for the bases... But I'll take what I can get.

Thanks for a well-spoken post, Grazel! It's a pleasure to chat with you here.

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This one I will make a real reply to, as I know PlasmaStream is a real person.

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Yeah. A real person who has already told you that each of us is also a real person. Look! No strings!

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Posi promised, when the NCSoft buyout was announced (or very shortly thereafter), that bases would be worked on. This was one of the things that the new staff members would be assigned to. So the promise of major base love dates to that time. And, like I already said in this thread (and which was ignored, of course), tens of thousands of programming hours cannot be accomplished in a few weeks.

[/ QUOTE ]And you couldn't have spoken this eloquently in your first reply to JZ?

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Yes, bases have had outstanding problems for a long time. Of course they have.

[/ QUOTE ]Oh, thank you! Thank you for acknowledging that! It must be really true now that you've agreed!

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So do many other aspects of this game. But developer resources, in terms of time if nothing else, have been limited. And I should point out that the Devs rarely comment in advance about bug fixes, whether they’re working on them or not. So it’s not as if bases have been singled out for neglect.

[/ QUOTE ]Perhaps not singled out for neglect, but I defy you to point out any other aspect of the game that has gone with as few additions since its inception. Doubt me? Go to the Patch archives and do a search for "Bases." (Watch out for the occasional incorrect tag on things like "Vanguard bases" and the like.) We've seen very little done to the bases, and almost nothing over the last year and a half. The Pillar of Ice and Flame was about it.

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Nevertheless, there have been major improvements to bases. Improvements that came directly as a result of customer feedback.

[/ QUOTE ]Not recently...

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Drastically reduced rent.

[/ QUOTE ] That was an SG thing. It didn't actually affect the bases.
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Storage items.

[/ QUOTE ]??? That was in issue *7*!! As in, one issue after we got bases! We're now in ish 11, in case you forgot...
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The final fix of the infamous Base Kick Bug.

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Which was a server issue. Not really a base fix... And how long ago was that?
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Low-cost rooms and items for starter bases.

[/ QUOTE ] Okay, you got one there.
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And let us not forget Merry Basemas (in which some SG’s and VG’s actually received 6 MILLION BONUS PRESTIGE. (Yes, you acknowledged all this above of course. And thank you.)

[/ QUOTE ] Again, that is an SG thing, NOT a base thing. They *are* separate.

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AND far from neglecting bases or base builders… There are highly encouraging signs that the devs are reading the base construction boards and paying close attention to what we discuss over there.

[/ QUOTE ]Only after the I12 announcement (which JZ was talking about) came out.

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My whole point in posting the Veruka Salt comment was simply to say that we’ve been promised future overhauling of bases, now that the developer staff has increased in size. But this has just happened recently, and it’s ridiculous to have ever expected that i12 would include major base changes.

[/ QUOTE ] Then perhaps you should have said that, instead of childishly insulting him. And it is obviously NOT "ridiculous to have ever expected that i12 would include major base changes." I do believe that their fixing the Robo Surgery and allowing them to once again attach to the rez circles is quite a major base change. Well, a fix, at any rate. And it's a long-awaited sign that they really aren't ignoring us. Which, honestly, is all we've been asking for all along.

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(…and I did it WITHOUT name-calling, or telling anyone they’re not allowed to post, or any of the other absurd things I’ve been accused of.)

[/ QUOTE ]Gee, whiz. How incredible of you. Now if only you could have done this from the start, we could have had this entire conversation be civil...

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Wow, what an incredibly jerk thing to say in reply... Who are you? Mike Teevee?


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And who are you?

No, seriously, what other name do you post under on these boards? (I can guessss... ) All of a sudden a slew of new postings magically appear which all agree with a certain other poster, and they all have incredibly low post counts.

"Well, you see there Zube... all my alt accounts agree with me!!

[/ QUOTE ]Wow. Arrogant, much? You see several other people take you to task over a clearly antagonizing reply to a legitimate request for some attention to the bases, and all of a sudden, we don't exist? LOL! "Uh-oh. Others have agreed with him against me! ... This can't be happening. This can't be happening. This can't be happening! ... *I* know! They must be that same guy! There's *no* other explanation!" /sarcasm You replied insultingly to someone who posted what many others in this game agree with. Expect to be called to task for it, pal. You called him Veruca Salt in a jerk manner, I say that sounds like Mike Teevee.

Zen, everything you have said in your replies recently does nothing to change the fact that the bases still have bugs that have been there for *four* freaking issues. It is not too much for us to ask that the devs do something about the *bases*! (And I notice how you completely dodged my point about how the dev team is *not* "all-new" as you had erroneously claimed.) We are not talking about what the devs have done for the SGs and Prestige levels. We're talking about the *bases*.

We who are so concerned about this spend a *lot* of our gameplay time in the base editor, trying to improve our respective bases, and are getting so very tired of waiting issue after issue for the devs to help us as they said they would. And said they would. And said they would...

Now, from what I understand, someone with a red name (don't know who) apparently let it slip that they actually *are* fixing one of the worst bugs in ish 12. You know what, Zemimabully? That means that they acknowledge that some work needed to be done! And they actually DID some of that work! Why-- does that mean that (perhaps) they (just maybe) have some dev time to devote to this issue?? Does that mean (perchance) that JZ was well within his rights to be demanding what he did?

If the devs had included the notes about fixing the base bug that they are fixing in the I12 update notice, you would not have seen quite the note from JZ that you did. Instead, you probably would have seen the hundreds of base editors out here all cheering at once for the long-overdue attention. (And asking for more, no doubt.)

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2) They are working on bases. If you saw th recent announcement it shows they are up to it as they're doing another sweep to clear out hte last remaining IOPs from bases on the servers. This shows that bases are being worked on since there'd be no real reason to clean up clutter and remnants of a broken system after this long if they weren't getting ready to implement changes and a revamped system.

[/ QUOTE ]"Working on them?" And your evidence for this is them removing an item that maybe nobody is supposed to actually have? We're talking about *real* work. Fixing the medical aux items. Fixing the SG logos. Giving us some actual *control* over how we put things in the base. Adding more items to put in the base. Adding more walls, floors, and ceilings. You know, giving some actual "love" to the bases, which some folks love just as much as some of you love PvP...

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What about the BASES!
<SNIP>

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"But DAAAAAAAAAAADYYYY..... I want an Oompa-Loompa NOOOOOOOOOWWWWW!!!"
- Veruka Salt

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Two things.

1) Heh, Willy Wonka. Pwned.

2) Bases are actually some of the most FIXED things. Sure they are buggy, but look at WHAT YOU ARE DOING! You are making a completely original, customized piece of real estate inside a server based MMO internet universe. That easily is more advanced than any other aspect of the CoX game... Bases are great, and with a flare of ingenuity, you can pretty much build anything you want (almost).

Base love is great, but its not a PRIORITY over new/diversified powersets, zone revamping, VEATs, and new content. Sorry. Bases are a luxury; an expected luxury, but a luxury nonetheless.

Also, the Whamasylum called. They are missing a Whiner.

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What is with the folks on these forums? A person makes a legitimate post about wanting the devs to back up what they have been promising for YEARS, and you bust on him for it? Holy crap, you guys really missed the boat on community spirit, didn't you? What more do you want? He said that I12 has a lot of good things, and that they are badly needed. Where the heck do you get off calling him names for asking for what he thinks the game needs? 'Cause (by the way) he AIN'T ALONE.

To say that bases are a luxury and not a priority would be to say the exact same thing about PvP, and I see a LOT more loving going that way. PvP and bases were both made possible by the dawning of CoV. (Yes, I know the hero side had arenas. Look at my join date. I didn't just buy this game... Arenas are just not quite the same thing...)

This game has sides to it that appeal to lots of different folks.

Missions
Street Hunting
Badge Hunting
Task Forces
Consignments
Farming
PvP
Bases

None of that should be higher or lower than anything else. And frankly, when I see everything else on that list getting updates and fixes, and bases not? Then something is WRONG. Whether you agree with it or not.

And on that topic, where do you get off poo-poohing someone's legitimate beef with the game? ... Ohhhh... *I* get it now! You're a Dev kiss-up! I just did a search on your name in the forums, and boy howdy did I come up with two gems!

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Anyone who doesnt respect and love the Dev team is a hopeless whiner-baby.

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Go back to sleep in the passenger seat. The Devs are driving.

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So, what? Are the devs paying you to quell the cries for some base justice? Shill...

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What about the BASES!!!!!!!! Omg Issue after issue, the base builders get the promise... "Its not forgotten.... We'll fix the bugs.... We'll add more content...."

Ok Issue 12, I call Bull! You broke your promise. Yes all this new stuff is great and very much so needed. I bought CoV for the Super Bases and for 6 whole issues, roughly 50% of the updates and 100% of the life of the base... they have been forgotten.

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"But DAAAAAAAAAAADYYYY..... I want an Oompa-Loompa NOOOOOOOOOWWWWW!!!"
- Veruka Salt

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Wow, what an incredibly jerk thing to say in reply... Who are you? Mike Teevee?

The fact is, I12 has a LOT of great stuff, and I'm *so* looking forward to the levelgasms they're promising (among everything else!). But the bases *need* work! I agree with JZ on this. And I, too, bought CoV for the bases.

Fix the dang bases, devs! You broke the Robo Surgery/Spirit Signals back in Ish 8. Fix this! A bunch of the SG logos do not appear in the SG logo items in the base. Fix this! You haven't added *any* content to the bases since you created them! *FIX THIS!*

I don't think it's too much to ask for the devs to finally back up their words with deeds.

HELP! Please! I'm trying to edit my base for the second time (we have a huge, wonderful base, but some of the rooms are a little cramped, so I'm just upgrading to the Large Complex (20 x 20)), and I cannot move my entrance room. The last time I upgraded my base, I was able to move the entrance from the lower right to the bottom middle, but now I cannot.

The entrance itself has been cleared of ALL decorations and items, and the rooms I'm trying to move it next to are brand new rooms with similarly nothing in them. Their floors are at the same level as well. I have also set the new rooms in such a way as to allow the entrance to go in the bottom middle or the bottom right, but all it tells me is "Room cannot be placed because it may not be reachable from the entrance."

Please, someone, help me!

Sweet merciful heaven... FIX THE BASES!!! Jeez-louise!

Make the rez circles accept attachable items again.

Make the SG-Logo-Display items accept *all* the logos.

Let us place the computer terminals and other goodies that are in the missions and/or the tech/science stores.

Give us pool tables, dart boards, pinball machines, and the jukebox like the Cryptic Lounge in Faultline has.

Give us the toolboxes and ammo boxes like we see in our salvage bins.

Pleeease!!

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There are SG bases?

[/ QUOTE ] Cute. Truthfully, there are many, many reasons to go to a base like my SG's when you die. 1. Once you appear at 25% health, /bug the rez circle/reclamator. 2. Refill your insps at the bins or at the Autodoc/Tree of Wonders. 3. Go to the Empowerment Station and take a few powers to help you win that battle you just lost.

There are also reasons to use the base besides as a rez point. We have porters to every zone. We have a Pillar of Ice and Flame in the base. (It's a Control item, so look for it there.) We have an Invention Room with 2 worktables and a vault. We have a lot of Halloween salvage to let new toons get their 2nd costume slot immediately. It's a safe place to park your toon when you are going AFK for dinner so you don't auto-log.

I just want it to work the way it's supposed to! (Robo-surgery should attach to the Reclamator, and our SG Logo (and a few others) should appear on the banners, floorplates, podiums, etc.)

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It seems as this post has alot of I wish this and thats. My suggestion as someone who works with software (non gaming) and hardware is to be specific in your requests/rants/feedback as much as possible. When you give specifics, then it is easier for a programmer to go in and look at the issue.

Matt Miracle

[/ QUOTE ]I hear what you're saying Matt, and I agree wholeheartedly. ... Except I've been being very specific about wanting those issues with the base fixed for over a year now and still there has been absolutely, positively NO indication from the devs that they have any intention of fixing those problems. Then again, they haven't said that they won't fix them. But since they haven't fixed them, they didn't have to say that.

Sounds great!

...

Now FIX THE DANG BASES!!! It's been long enough that certain SG logos don't display on the SG logo items, and the dang Rez Circle/Reclaimator (BTW, the word is "Reclamator") STILL won't allow attachments! PLEASE fix this! We worked our fingers off to get that Healing badge to increase the rez circle's ability. To have the Robo-Surgery not attach is basically a broken promise.

I'm just ever so grateful that they rooted that tree in Cap Au Diable instead of fixing the problem with the base Aux Medical items not attaching to the rez circles. Whew!

And it's *so* nice that we can create an SG with a name starting with "The." That's *much* better than being able to display (for example) the "Diamond 1" SG logo on the base items made for displaying logos...

Good job, guys. Yeah...

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A "serverless" environment has been talked about. Perhaps you could put all 132 character slots (11 servers x 12 slots per server) in one "bank" then when you make a character you simply choose an empty slot and then choose which server that character will live on. The only thing I've ever used the 120 slots that are not on my home server for is testing builds and attending special events...

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The problem with that is who gets to keep the name? I have "Avatar of Horus" on Pinnacle. Imagine my joy when I found that the same name has been taken on both Freedom and Victory (where my friends play). So, let's say the devs do collapse the servers. Who gets the name? Or SG names? And just imagine logging into the RWZ and instead of seeing RWZ 1-3, you see RWZ 1-40! Just not a very good idea while the game is still popular.

*EDIT* I just realized that you were talking about a bank for your account, and not about making the game serverless. Sorry! That actually sounds like a good idea!

Jeez-Louise! You know, it's great and all that you keep adding things to the game, but for crying out loud, could you please FIX some of the things you broke???

The medical auxiliary items have not been connecting to the rez circles (tech or magic) since at *least* issue 8, and the "Diamond 1" SG logo has not been appearing on base SG logo items since at *least* issue 5!!! Come on, Devs! New stuff is all well and good, but stuff that *works* would be nice, too!

I, for one, will not miss it at all. The annoyance factor

WARNING: Rikti forces spotted heading towards Atlas Park

... Ahem. As I was saying, the annoyance factor of see--

DANGER: Rikti Invasion forces have been spotted in Atlas Park! Non-Combat personnel are advised to get under cover!

... Grrr...

Can we get the Admin messages taken out of our chat wind--

ALERT CANCELED: Rikti forces are retreating from Atlas Park.

GYAHHH!!! I give up!