Ultimus
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Posts
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Joined
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I am still not seeing the patch that said it was fixed hmm
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Quote:Ok because I petitioned a GM saying it was fixed but I still couldn't access it. The response I got back was its being fixed in an upcoming patch.Originally Posted by Aggelakis
It was supposedly fixed but I still can't access it in the costume creator even after logging in a character that has it on her person.
Do you by chance know where the patch notes were that says it was fixed? -
I cannot seem to find this, is the Wisp Aura still broken or was it fixed in a patch? If it was fixed in a patch, does someone have a link the patch notes?
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Quote:Well yes before proliferation the Scrapper sets ranged in brawl index from 2.778 to 6.333 at the max. The only exception was BS HS at 7.333.Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Different would be better than just numerically tweaked better.
For a long time I was an opponent of powerset proliferation, not because I thought the sets shouldn't be converted from one archetype to the other but because the sets were just being transferred from one archetype to the other without regard for the fact different archetypes have different requirements. Before Brutes came along Tankers did have markedly different offensive sets from Scrappers in having far more soft control in general. That soft control was a form of extra mitigation over and above defensive numbers and it made them play substantially different. Brutes and powerset proliferation blurred that distinction somewhat in a counter-productive way.
PBAoE soft control should have been the primary forte of Tankers over Scrappers and even Brutes, but Brutes basically made that impossible to do directly. But given the mechanics of gauntlet, the devs should see an obvious way to do it indirectly.
Tanker sets BI were 4.5556-9.8889 with ET being 12.6666.
Now Scrappers are getting sets with BI's of 9+ -
Quote:You have pretty flawed logic, why balance the game around early levels then since a character's lifespan is spent very shortly in the early levels.Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
What about the VIPs who don't care about IOs or Incarnates? Or don't they count either?
My point being, the basic 1-50 game is available to every player, regardless of their account status.
You should NOT make changes that affect that basic game because of something that only occurs at level 50 that only some players even have access to.
Scrappers and brutes reaching survivability levels comparable to a tank, at level 50, with Incarnate powers, is a really crappy reason to make changes that affect the 1-49 game.
Just because they're playing free doesn't mean it's fair to force them to play an unbalanced game. Especially since a lot of them are still spending money, they just haven't subscribed in order to get the things you want to base these changes on.
The game has to be balanced at all levels. -
Quote:Thats great but I am talking about top end performance. This game now has an end game that has to be balanced just like the beginning game.Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
But the rest of the game and ATs ARE balanced around SOs, so if they suddenly start balancing one AT around IOs then you have to redo EVERY AT as well. And, unlike most of the forumites, not everyone who is a VIP goes hog wild with IO builds.
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Quote:Right I didn't quote what he said because its against the forum rules I believe. However, he did reply that he would have a meeting regarding them.Originally Posted by Johnny_Butane
You may want to point out what part of the quoted text in your post is from Synapse, because it looks you just quoted what you sent him?
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Quote:No offense to premium or frees but the developers have stated themselves the majority of their income is from VIP players. You shouldn't balance a game around the players that contribute the least to the game.Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
I saw it.
I'll be surprised if their conclusions differ greatly from mine.
I'll be even MORE surprised if they decide scrappers and brutes reaching comparable survivability with extensive use of IOs justifies tanks getting a buff to damage potential that is effective with just SOs.
If they DO decide that it pretty firmly puts a nail in the coffin of the notion of the game being balanced around SOs.
I'd hate to be the guy who gets to tell the free and premium players they have to become VIPs before they get to play a balanced game.
On top of that, an IO license is only 2 or dollars a month. Not to mention Frees and Premium are already inferior once they hit 50 since Incarnates come into play. -
Not sure you guys missed it but I said Synapse said they are going to have a meeting regarding Tankers.
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Did someone flip the market or is it always like this? I noticed a lot of the low level salvage is currently EXTREMELY high:
Clockwinders -- 250,00 per
Spell Scrolls -- 55,000 - 250k
Ancient Artifacts -- 1.1 million...
The amount of items on AH for these is also very low like less then 10...
Edit: Winders are going for over 2 million.. -
Ok guys I had sent this to Synapse and I got a response back.
They are going to sit down and have a discussion about TANKERS
Quote:- The Tanker's defense stats can be matched by a properly slotted Scrapper or Brute - but the Tanker can not approach the Scrapper or Brute in damage. -- The Tanker's resistance stat can be matched by a buffed Brute a buffed Tanker cannot match a Brute's damage.
This is a problem because in end game content, IO's are prevalent. This allows Scrappers and Brutes to match Tanker's defense (45%) with smart IO slotting. On top of this, in end game Incarnate content or teams with lots of buffers, nearly ALL classes hit these defensive stats. Brutes hit the Tanker's resistance stats through powers like Incarnate Barrier, T9's, and or buffs from Controllers, Defenders, MM, Corruptors. A League team will have many buffers.
There are two possible solutions to this:
1) Buff Tanker's defensive/resistance caps. Personally, I think its too late in the game's lifespan for this. The game is balanced around having a minimum to-hit of 5% and increasing the resistance cap beyond 90% would not help a Tanker shine more due to unresistable damage (More on this in a bit).
2) Increase Tanker's maximum damage potential. Bruising helps but I think its not enough. The other possibilities would be increasing their damage mod, raising the damage think, and or introducing a new mechanic.
I think raising the damage cap would be the best option because it gives them potential that can only be reached via inspirations or teams.
- Adding another Tanker to the team is not beneficial.
In the early to mid levels, a group will not be fighting more enemies at a time (Unless its a really bad pull) then the Tanker can take control of before hitting the aggro cap. In the end game, once again rarely do we see a situation where multiple Tanks are needed. (Such as so many enemies that more Tankers are required to tank them or multiple AV's.)
Regarding the end game, this is also a problem because once again everyone in a League is buffed and a Brute will be matching Tanker defensive levels and resistance levels with other ATs reaching the same defensive levels.
Another problem is Bruising does not stack between Tankers.
Ultimately, the problem is why add a Tanker when you could add another of any other class? The other melees bring more damage, the range bring more damage, and other classes bring more debuffs and buffs that stack.
The Solution:
Allow bruising to stack between Tankers.
Increase Tankers damage caps allowing them to deal more damage.
- The Tanker is too specialized in its role
The problem here could be illustrated like this:
Imagine if two AT's both were designed for damage. One of the AT's did 25% more damage (Like a Tanker's 25% more resistance) then the other. However, when capped they both have the exact same damage potential. However, the AT that does 25% less damage has nearly 2.5 times the defensive capability.
Another problem to being too specialized is there isn't a need for it:
1) The Tanker has an aggro cap. There is nothing at aggro cap that a Tanker can tank that an equally built Brute (And possibly Scrapper) couldn't tank.
2) A lot of the damage dealt end game is unresistable, by HP percentage, or auto-hit. The problem here is that despite having 25% more defense/resistance the Tanker doesn't really shine. Even having more hitpoitns does not help when an ability deals damage for a percentage not a numerical value.
Possible Solutions:
1) Raise Tanker's aggro cap. By raising the Tanker's aggro cap, he could take advantage of his extra hitpoints, defense, and resistance by maintaining more control of enemies.
2) Allow the tanker to resist unresistable damage.
3) Or as I suggested above allow them to have the potential to deal more damage.
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Anyways, I hope this isn't too long and outlines some of the problems.
I also came up with a possible mechanical idea for improving damage as well:
Quote:Regarding damage, an idea popped into my head that could make Tankers be different then the other melee ATs, have higher damage, and give some interesting mechanics.
I thought about when you build a Brute or a Scrapper defensively, you always try and take as many defensive (The actual defense, not resist) powers as possible (CJ, Hover, Maneuvers, etc). You also build your IO's around this method.
What if Tankers got an ability that really makes them out to be the "powerful" comic book heroes they are suppose to be? I mean their initial attack hits so hard it causes the target to bruise.
Here is how it would work:
Every attack power the Tanker uses invokes a cooldown to that specific power. When its not on cooldown, that power hits for (Tossing out a number, this could change) *TWICE* the *BASE* damage.
Upon hitting for that, that power gets a cooldown in addition to its normal cooldown time. If the power is used again, it hits for .8 (Tanker modifier) damage until the bonus damage is off of cooldown.
Since each individual power has its own cooldown, this encourages the Tanker to take lots of attacks and potentially slot them. Thus, on one hand, a tanker could come up with some interesting builds that could sacrifice some defensive abilities for damage by taking more attacks.
Here's some examples of how it could work (I am using numbers to illustrate the point but these aren't set in stone)
A Super Strength Tanker has 4 attacks:
Jab, Punch, Haymaker, KO Blow. -- For simplicity lets say they do, 25, 50, 75, and 100 damage unslotted.
The Tanker Jabs the target for 25+25 bonus damage, Jab has a 4 second cooldown lets say. The bonus damage goes on cooldown for 15 seconds.
He punches the target doing 50 + 50, it has a 8 second cooldown plus 20 second cooldown bonus damage.
He jabs the target again for 25 damage (No bonus) still 10 seconds left on bonus damage cooldown for this power.
He KO Blows the target, 100 + 100 bonus damage, 25 second cooldown, and a 35 second bonus damage.
The Tanker then gets 100% damage buff, and Haymakers a target for 75 + 75 Bonus damage + 150 from the damage buff, Haymaker goes on a 12 second cooldown with a 18 second bonus damage cooldown.
The bonus damage cooldowns are uneffected by recharge modifiers hence it encourages to take a lot of different attacks. - The Tanker's defense stats can be matched by a properly slotted Scrapper or Brute - but the Tanker can not approach the Scrapper or Brute in damage. -- The Tanker's resistance stat can be matched by a buffed Brute a buffed Tanker cannot match a Brute's damage.
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Ok then, go run an Underground Trial with an entire team using only SO's.
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Quote:End game the game is not balanced around SO's. Also Stalkers do fine when compared to other ATs with SO's its with IO's they start to lose a ton....Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Also, another thing that gets glossed over by a lot of people, Johnny in particular:
You cannot adjust the base performance of an AT because of what another AT can do with extensive use of IOs and Incarnate powers. Base damage and damage caps are part of an AT's base performance.
The game is STILL balanced around SOs. And it's more important than ever before to keep it that way. A good number of new and returning players are playing through the game with no access to the things that Johnny is justifying a tanker buff with. On SOs alone, tankers survive better than anything else in the game, by a wide margin. They are the only AT that can reach the defense softcap by themselves, with no IO use at all. With no IOs, tanker's HP is much higher than brutes, because their base HP is 400 points higher. On SOs alone, there is really no comparison when you're talking about survival.
If you can prove that scrappers and brutes are reaching tanker levels of survivability on SOs alone, maybe your argument will hold some weight, but you can't justify an increase to tanker damage levels simply because a scrapper or brute can reach comparable levels of survivability when IOed up the wazoo and using Incarnate powers. You just can't.
Base it on how the ATs compare using nothing but SOs to see if a buff is justified, because SOs are the baseline performance iof the game, and are available to Free, Premium, and VIP players 100% equally.
Making changes based on performance differences using things that are not equally available to ALL players is just unfair.
And they are being buffed. The game being balanced around SO's is ancient history, we got a new developer team now. -
Regarding damage, an idea popped into my head that could make Tankers be different then the other melee ATs, have higher damage, and give some interesting mechanics.
I thought about when you build a Brute or a Scrapper defensively, you always try and take as many defensive (The actual defense, not resist) powers as possible (CJ, Hover, Maneuvers, etc). You also build your IO's around this method.
What if Tankers got an ability that really makes them out to be the "powerful" comic book heroes they are suppose to be? I mean their initial attack hits so hard it causes the target to bruise.
Here is how it would work:
Every attack power the Tanker uses invokes a cooldown to that specific power. When its not on cooldown, that power hits for (Tossing out a number, this could change) *TWICE* the *BASE* damage.
Upon hitting for that, that power gets a cooldown in addition to its normal cooldown time. If the power is used again, it hits for .8 (Tanker modifier) damage until the bonus damage is off of cooldown.
Since each individual power has its own cooldown, this encourages the Tanker to take lots of attacks and potentially slot them. Thus, on one hand, a tanker could come up with some interesting builds that could sacrifice some defensive abilities for damage by taking more attacks.
Here's some examples of how it could work (I am using numbers to illustrate the point but these aren't set in stone)
A Super Strength Tanker has 4 attacks:
Jab, Punch, Haymaker, KO Blow. -- For simplicity lets say they do, 25, 50, 75, and 100 damage unslotted.
The Tanker Jabs the target for 25+25 bonus damage, Jab has a 4 second cooldown lets say. The bonus damage goes on cooldown for 15 seconds.
He punches the target doing 50 + 50, it has a 8 second cooldown plus 20 second cooldown bonus damage.
He jabs the target again for 25 damage (No bonus) still 10 seconds left on bonus damage cooldown for this power.
He KO Blows the target, 100 + 100 bonus damage, 25 second cooldown, and a 35 second bonus damage.
The Tanker then gets 100% damage buff, and Haymakers a target for 75 + 75 Bonus damage + 150 from the damage buff, Haymaker goes on a 12 second cooldown with a 18 second bonus damage cooldown.
The bonus damage cooldowns are uneffected by recharge modifiers hence it encourages to take a lot of different attacks. -
Also it should be noted the developers define Brutes as a Tank when you are creating a character. However, they also define them as a melee DPS.
I personally think its melee damage flexibility that Tankers lack. A Brute can be built to be a tank or a DPS machine, a Tanker can really be built only to Tank. -
Quote:Actually I disagree to some extent, store bought IO's cannot be enhanced by the booster. That 25% extra enhancement value is pretty nice. An example is slotting a melee power with 6 slots, 4 kinetic combat boosted and then 2 procs.Originally Posted by Selina_H
I have two concerns.
First, the store-bought IOs are *better* than IOs from in-game drops. With normal IOs, there's a tradeoff: Builds with maximum enhancement at 50 tend not to exemp down as well. SBEs remove those restrictions, making those builds effective for both level 50+ and exemplared content. For people who tend to play one or the other type, it's not such a big deal. Those who play a wide variety of content at different levels will appreciate the additional benefit of SBEs - but they have to be willing to pay for them.
My main concern that if the devs move too far, too fast in making enhancements available in the Paragon Market, there's a possibility that consignment house transactions could fall below the critical mass necessary to sustain robust market activity. We saw this happen redside before the markets were merged, and that time period was marked by hoarding, skyrocketing prices and endless waits for product. At that point real-money purchases from the Paragon Market would be a necessity, rather than a convenience, for anyone wishing to complete their build. -
Quote:Wait I have AV's set and he was never an AV? Was he nerfed to EB?Originally Posted by King_Moloch
trapdoor was an AV that was necessary to defeat in order to unlock the first slot of the Incarnate progression,the Alpha slot. It's part of Mender Ramiel's arc. Trapdoor was balanced against IOs (though they claimed otherwise) and was unkillable to a large number of toons. Therefore, a great deal of frustration and nerdfury rightfully found it's way to these forums. What good was incarnate progression if you couldn't even DO it? What's comical about that almost is that they went ahead with the raid thing anyway, even though it was built on the same philosophy.
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Quote:Isn't this a myth?Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
While I've hesitated to jump into this very old argument that's been rehashed, oh so many times, I'd like to throw out a few ideas.
3.) Stop Gauntlet from affecting to hit rolls! Any time we miss because of gauntlet injecting it's self into the hit rolls, it lowers tank dps.
That's pretty much it. (Although I do like the idea of tanks having a way to resist the un-resistable damage in the itrials, even if it's not by a large amount.) -
Actually, I'd love to know this too, what is the point of the two optional missions?
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Nah I meant at all levels, but thank you guys. I purchased the store bought LOTGs for 113 each.
Worth the deal because I was using LOTGs of different levels and I never enhancement boost LOTGs either.
Combing it with a LOTG drop set does still give the set bonus too. -
Actually one other question, can store bought IOs be mixed with regular dropped IO's of the same set to gain the bonuses?
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So then the store bought LOTG works at all levels? Hmm that may be a nice investment.
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1) Does a level 50 LOTG 7.5% only give the bonus down to 47?
2) Does it give the bonus when the power is greyed out from exemplar? -
Also I notice the cost of the Windfall and EXP boosters end in a 3. No other items on the market end in a 3... or rather any number that isn't 0.
With that being said, to break even you'd have to buy 10 of these to get back your Paragon Points ending in a 0.
If it was a 2 it would be 5 buys, 5 would be 2 buys, 6 would be 5, 7 would also be 10.
So clever marketing ploy? -
Ok let me add another question then, lets say the Developers are happy with Brute's performance.
If this is the case, do Tanker's need a buffing? If so, refer back to the questions in post 1.