TheMESS

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It's kinda hard to express distaste on a forum without posting :3

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you could protest in silence some one would eventualy notice im sure.

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It's still not free!

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We'll nothings ever free

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Where's the "coming storm"?


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I'm sure one of the Devs said something about this being a long way off but then as we don't actually know what the coming storm is its entirely possible that were already seeing the beginnings of it but just don't know it yet.

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Where's CoP?


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Best guess its under the patio don't expect to be seeing it sooooon

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Where's City Vault?


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Last i herd it was pretty much dead due to technical reasons

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Where's the new forum?


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hardly game related so I'm not sure how it features when discussing content

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Why's there no Broadsword/shield brutes?


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because were getting claws this time perhaps?

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Where's maaah content, maah?


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no idea

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...and yeah! +1 to me!

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gratz dose that mean you've leveled then

Well going by posts Babs post US side here there's no new animations for Earth Assault so its safe to assume that any powers that make it up will be preexisting in some form or another

this is somthing i've wanted for a long time i rarly use capes on my alts they just dont suit them. but would love to add back spines or random bits of tech to them.

However i think the problem lies in where back items attach to the model if you've had the jump pack or raptor pack you'll notice that they frequently end up stuck within the back instead of on the back this is especially noticeable on huge models that have the body scale sliders maxed.

but still great idea would love it

/signed

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To me Desdemona looks like she's a backing dancer for Madonna in that black leotard thing.

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Actually, the delectable Desdemona has swiped her entire look from 50's glamour girl, Bettie Page (including boots!)

Try typing "Bettie Page" or "Betty Page" into a Google image search if you don't believe me (not if you're at work, though - I MEAN IT!)

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I can think of worse people to swipe your image from.

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No it wasn't, but some people hardly care about that as long as they get they're F'in +1!

I'm sick'n'tired of that F'in [censored]!

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And you felt it necessary to further derail the topic pots and kettles come to mind.

I believe it comes down to

Risk Vs Reward Vs Time spent

with standard farming the above applies the farmer (ignoring the door sitters for the moment) is at Risk (more so as he's facing mobs set for more than a single character) the problem arises from door sitters there not taking part so are at 0 risk and are probably off doing something else so are investing 0 time but are getting maximum reward the new system in i16 should hopefully reduce the door sitters while allowing the farmer to continue doing what he finds fun.

As to MA it was bad because it broke the formula (and still dose) because the risk to the farmer could be reduced to very low levels while the reward could be increased

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I bet it's because Cynic is bald and jealous of your long staticly flowing golden locks

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My waist length hair says no to your accusation

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I tried at least

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He never said it was waist length head hair

Dose it really matter who posted it?

I mentioned chamoions because you talked about a free power pick system being originaly intended for CoH but it was abandoned due to balance issues i used champions to show that even tho in the past that system was abandoned developers had found a way to impliment it in a upcoming game that was the only reason i raised champions and its freeform power selection. which if you read the bit of text that you quote should seem clear. I dont in anywhere in that text suggest implimentation of open power picking in CoH.

No it was retrofited into a existing system look at how villian patron/epic pools originaly worked they were effectivly the same 4 powers in 4 difrent flavours with little to no variation and they worked just fine within CoV however problems arose when you flung PvP to the mix heroes had the advantage with there superior epic pools so teh Devs modified the sets.

thats all they would be doing by adding powers to the AT power sets it would be the same proces but on a much larger scale.

Of course if you took it the stage further like i have suggested and incorporated the same either or tek that's used in the villain Epic ATs you could create more varied power sets giving variations on power types.

going back to blasters you could offer either the PBAOE nuke power as a tier 9 or a ranged single target high damage attack similar to that used by electrical blast.

both have advantages and play stile would way heavily on which one a player picked up.

If i remember corectly CoV came first and was compleatly stand alone for a time and then it was followed by "along came a spider" which combined the CoV and CoH with the PvP Zones

But I imagine GR will be different as its not standalone you must have CoH/CoV to play it so i would guess that well see a small semi issue/patch shortly before GRs release that puts in place tho not necessarily reveals in game any assets that are needed for CoH and GR to interact eg contacts etc.

Its a bit like a booster pack in a way some stuff will be there but just hidden from veiw until its time to reveal it.

I just deleated my stone/fire last night to make new alt space and now after reading this i want to go roll one again

Dam you

I'm guessing there aiming GR for just under a month after CO hits

My theory being people will pick CO up for at least the free month that will more than likely come with the box so if you want to grab them back you want to be releasing the new shininess just in time to grab them back before the months over but not anuff time that they can pic up GR play it for a bit and still return to CO within that free month.

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If unrestricted access to all powers (or a system like COs) was added you would pretty much have to start the game play aspects of this game from scratch, something that is orders of magnitude more complex than something that lets you change the colours of your powers. Adding something like that can be added simply (from our point of view) because it doesn't actually change anything other than the graphics/animations.

And no I don't think I have sidetracked the thread. I don't think that making the changes that you seem to want is either a good thing or a needed thing. It would be a huge change that would most likely lead to even more balance issues. And if everyone could make uber builds due to more choice of power picks then some would.

I for one have three or four power picks on my already stupidly easy to play fire/kin that I'd happily swap to something even more damaging or powerful. But that is the nature of balance by not wanting to have those picks I have to pick something else, something that in the end makes me more balanced and less OP.
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the elemental melee sets could game alternate versions of the weapon powers and vice versa no longer would you be forced to take the fire sword powers or loose good attacks in the same vain you would be able to create a all fire sword wielding character no punch attacks.

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Unless they do the same damage as the punches, you end up with issues of balance. And if they do do the same damage it is merely Power Customisation which is going in anyway.

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the only time I've talked about full on free power selection is in response I have never suggested that free form power selection should be implemented in this thread my only suggestion was that they could increase the number of powers available within a power set what those powers were would have to be decided by the Devs based on the balance the sets. I also suggested that it could be a means for the pigeon holing of some sets to be broken eg Fire need not be the only AoE king.

The changes i have suggested have already been partially implemented with the increasing of the number of powers in the villain Epics so clearly in cases the Devs feel it necessary all I'm suggesting is that it could be expanded it could be as little as a extra power in each set but again balance would need to be considered when adding them.

yes of course there would be issues of balance there's always issues of balance i never suggested there wouldn't be but just because there's a balance issue dose not mean that a idea is immediately pointless if that was the case we would get no new power sets at all. plus the Dev's have formulas for working out things such as balance they could take fire sword and remove some of its damage and there formula would indicate what stats would need increasing to balance the new power

Finally just to be clear

I AM NOT SUGGESTING OPEN POWER SELECTION

then let me explain

bye what you posted a unreleased system should not be used as a bases for adding a new system to CoH correct?

that being the case why should power customisation be added as by your argument its untested so should not be added?

back the blasters and melee fine add the melee powers to the secondary but i fail to see what difference that would make from adding melee powers to the primary. end result blasters have more melee.

but you've side tracked the entire point of the suggestion more powers could be added to the primaries and secondarys of ALL the ATs giving more choice in builds.

Now yes doing this would take a lot of time but its not impossible and some of the ATs / Powersets could see some real benefit from it.

AR could see a build up style ability added but maybe it could only be taken at the cost of loosing the snipe.

stone armour could see a alternate form of mez protection available but again you would be forced to choose between it and rooted.

the elemental melee sets could game alternate versions of the weapon powers and vice versa no longer would you be forced to take the fire sword powers or loose good attacks in the same vain you would be able to create a all fire sword wielding character no punch attacks.

I wonder if a Sothoth demon is one of the pets from the new mastermind set if so i wonder if there going to have Lovecraft / Old Ones kind of vibe.

ok now i know your just being argumentative for the sake of it

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As for CO using a different system. Tell me its good in five years time and I may well agree with you.

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you then say

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How would they see if it works if they don't implement it?

CO hasn't been released yet, saying a feature you want in this game will work based on a game that could well bomb after six months isn't really a good idea. It maybe that Cryptic have got it right this time, or maybe not. Until we can see one way or another sticking with a system that works is almost certainly a better idea.


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Also giving blasters melee attacks would be less of i divergence from there play stile than giving scrappers ranged would be

but if you so wish i imagine scrappers could be given the odd short range blast ability as claws and spines both already have such powers.

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I has a question. :3

I never did buy the Architect Edition, and paid full whack for the previous boosters. I want to get the Architect Edition and redeem the free booster that comes with it on the Super Science pack. It seems logical to me, anyway.

Is this possible, or does the architect edition only let you choose between boosters I and II?

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As I've discovered it only works on 1 and 2 making the purchase of the architect pointless as you cant even apply it to the account to get a months play

well managed to purchase it eventually but only after ending up with a mac edition that i don't want and have no idea how i got it (have emailed support)

and i also foolishly purchased the architect edition for my account that doesn't have it thinking i could then get the booster with it which you cant (and yes it dose tell you if you read it so that ones my own fault) but it also turns out you cant apply a architect edition to your account without claiming a booster but as i have both boosters i cant apply it grrrr.

but i did get SB3 for one of my accounts and have sent support a ticket on the other stuff so all is almost good.

I never said don't give scrappers more power picks i said

"blasters getting more melee dose not = scrappers getting ranged"

what bit of that sentence suggests that scrappers wouldn't gain new powers?

Ok so you change a fundamental aspect of the blaster by giving it access to more melee attacks is this a bad thing? I mean really dose it matter where the blaster deals its damage from and if the player of the blaster wants to risk his neck to get into melee let him.

Also i think the presence of the blapper suggests that there are players out there that would enjoy more melee attacks in there blaster.

yea never be in danger provided your out doors also again balancing the powers just because you can fire all your powers from snipe range it hardly makes you undefeatable many groups have extremely long range attacks take the likes of malt there titans can launch a barrage of missiles from across a map at you, gunslingers can TP to your location, sappers can fly.

Also you can hover and repeatedly snipe with current powers so having 9 snipe powers would just be giving the player variety.

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f they used that tech to limit the power picks what the hell are you suggesting? Lets add powers to sets so that we have more choice but then use tech to remove those choices to stop it being unbalanced? That makes almost good sense /signed.

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almost I'm suggesting that they use the tech to limit the choice end result being more choice NOT remove it.

Did i suggest it would be a small amount of work? i don't think i did if i did i retract that suggestion there's no doubt in my mind it would be a huge undertaking and take many many hours of development time but just because its time consuming dose not mean it should be done.

your trying to tell me that changing the variety of powers you can pick from wouldn't change game play after saying earlier that they would be fundamental changes?

going by the logic of waiting 5 years maybe the Devs should wait 5 years and see if power customisation is any good before implementing it?

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but a focus on the correct role could still be maintained while giving diversity to the powers. a blaster who's primary roll is damage will still be doing damage regardless of weather its from melee range or extream snipe range.

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And we'd better give scrappers ranged attacks too? Because if you have a choice between a AT that has low survivability due to lack of mitigation and an AT that has plenty what will people choose?


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why would scrappers need to be given ranged attacks simple answer they wouldn't just because a blaster can operate at melee doesn't mean a scrapper needs to be able to operate at range. scrappers could simple be given a wider variety of melee based attacks attacks that do low mag holds attacks that do KB or KD

blasters getting more melee dose not = scrappers getting ranged

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but the powers needn't even brake from the AT mould taking blasters again a more snipe attacks could be added to the set to allow the creation of a almost pure sniper style character (something i would love to do with my AR blaster) or more close ranged blast or AOE blasts could be added it would allow any blaster to specialise in a discipline (AOE,Snipe,mid range,short range) or to mix it up no longer would the fire blaster be the automatic king of AOE or the energy blaster be single target centric.

some one mentioned controllers fire/kins would become god like. why would you your assuming such a system would be implemented without any consideration for balance which seems a foolish thing to believe.

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Gotta point out that does seem to be what you're suggesting above. If you add a whole range of extra powers into any power pick, you will end up with balance issues. Okay so you pick 9 snipes, that's be OP in some situations. Having the system as it is creates balance by giving you powers that you may not need/like. Adding powers into the mix to give you more overall choice with one power set would remove that balance.


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blasters are the damage AT giving them different options in how they deliver that damage is not breaking from the mold of the AT you assume 9 snipes based on the current model for snipe which need not be the case again this is where balancing the powers would come in.

even if the 9 snipe powers were all based of the current snipes yes it would be OP in some situations but then such things are the case now some combinations work better in some situations the 9 snipe blaster would be at a real disadvantage in a cave map for example while his mid range a short range brethren would have the advantage.

The balance you talk about could be maintained as i said already similar tek to whats used with veats could be implemented meaning you would still have to choose between powers also there's still only so many powers you can take.

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As to every one gravitating to wards specific builds with specific power pics yes that mite happen

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I don't think its a case of 'might' though. The original idea for powers in the game was that you would be able to pick any power you wanted. And all that caused was a lot of tanks with AoE and ranged attacks. So they implemented what they have now.


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Its definitely a case of mite as even with the current set up there is variation in builds. Not every one has build up, or the snipe, or the nova, or the tier 9 god mode armour.

I don't think this would change if there was a few more options in the sets.

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Also lets face it you don't need a mega uber build in coh to play the game and sub optimal builds can normally do well.

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Which is why so few people bother with Fire/Kins?

Nothing forces people to create optimal builds, but if you make it easy to create super OP builds, you get to the point where you get teams that only take people who have specific power sets or picks. There was a time when as a defender you would have problems getting a team unless you were a 'healer'.

Adding more power choices as you suggest would only make the situation worse.

Adding more power sets that move away from the current traditional types would be good, adding more choice to the current sets wouldn't be IMO.

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not every one has fire/kins and not every one who has a fire kin has them because there the uber build I've had a fire kin for years kin was picked because at the time it worked best thematically with fire and if it wasn't for the fact it had taken me years to get him up to 32 i would re-roll him as a fire/thermal in a second.

Also i was here during the "need healer" days and that was largely caused by players coming from other MMOs where the healer was king but people did learn that healing wasn't the only way to stay alive.

and once again there would only be a problem of optimal builds if balance wasn't considered as long as balance was considered there would be no problem in fact more choice within sets could even help as there could be more than one way to achieve a good alt.

finally yes CoH in the beginning had open power picks and it was abandoned for fear of tank mages.

But that system as far as I'm aware never made it past alpha stage so it was never really tested by the players (hell some of the current devs weren't even there in those days) also considering champions has returned to a open power pick system and by all accounts its going to launch with it so it would seem it is workable.

So i fail to see how a bit more choice within the power sets would be a bad thing.

Is apparently a blind mythical beast

but a focus on the correct role could still be maintained while giving diversity to the powers. a blaster who's primary roll is damage will still be doing damage regardless of weather its from melee range or extream snipe range.

but the powers needn't even brake from the AT mould taking blasters again a more snipe attacks could be added to the set to allow the creation of a almost pure sniper style character (something i would love to do with my AR blaster) or more close ranged blast or AOE blasts could be added it would allow any blaster to specialise in a discipline (AOE,Snipe,mid range,short range) or to mix it up no longer would the fire blaster be the automatic king of AOE or the energy blaster be single target centric.

some one mentioned controllers fire/kins would become god like. why would you your assuming such a system would be implemented without any consideration for balance which seems a foolish thing to believe.

As to every one gravitating to wards specific builds with specific power pics yes that mite happen but again this is where balance comes in also the power selection tek from Veats could be used so if you take the power "snipe 2" you cant also pick up "melee ranged blast 2"

Also lets face it you don't need a mega uber build in coh to play the game and sub optimal builds can normally do well.

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A blaster with AR has great ranged damage. he takes some melee powers, they are a change and they suit his character but they are nowhere near as effective as a scrapper (no crit chance for one!)

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Speaking as sombody who has tried a lowbie archer/energy blaster, I can say that blaster melee damage is freakin' insane! They just dont last more than a few seconds in a melee situation.

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yea blasters have pretty high modifiers for both ranged and melee damage

Not that i think giving them the chance to pick up a few more melee powers would be entirely a bad thing after all there inherent squishiness would still set them at a disadvantage in comparison to a scrapper if anything they would be a very squishy stalker or maybe a dominator that had neglected its primary.

all in all it could lead to some intresting builds