Serio

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Isle of Wight Festival Woohoo!!! Jimmy where are you??

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still travelling i believe, after all, it was a long trip

unstoppable is ace, and with phase shift ( yes i know ), and a single blue insp, the crash kill can be easily avoided.

Unyeilding stance is the one true beauty of the invuln set in pvp imo though. Learn to love that power.

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Fine with me, 1 more to beat!

Btw, dont know if i missed it, but when is this to take place? So i can tell GF in time so she wont get [censored] when sit at pc all night

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ive already sorted the draws ( and no im not telling lol! )

The first round will be listed this friday, and from Monday 18th and you will have 5 days to complete your matches.

Anyone wishing to change their toons pm me your changed details BEFORE FRIDAY, please.

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if your still allowing entrances i would like to enter

Knight Stalker
Subconscious
Unforgotten

All @Knight Stalker

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Im happy to let KS in if there are no objections?

He makes it a nice even 18 entered!

Regigstration now CLOSED.

Thankyou all entrants.

Matches will be posted shortly.

ok, girls.
Been a bit mad this last few weeks, so havent had time to come on here and sort things out, and as such am extending the sign up deadline to tomorrow (Friday night) midnight. Thanks for all your entries, look forward to seeing who is The One.

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We did back alley brawler 6 times in a row

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There are some things that sound so wrong, no matter how many times you hear them.

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How do you think he got the soubriquet Back Alley Brawler dude?

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after spending a night out with KS...

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MM in bodyguard mode is nothing against a Kinetic Defender. Or is that just me?

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they dont like thunderous blast too much either lol

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I thought you were being sarcastic, as dwarfs do have inherent mezz protection.

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At the risk of going slightly off topic, is this really the case? I did ask a few of the guys about this the other day, and they said the dwarfs 'did'nt' have inherent mez protection!!

I am not doubting what you say is true, as I had originally thought this was always the case too. However it has been a while since i fought one in pvp ( last one was s4 praccy I think! ).

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I don't like WoW, but I have no idea why as I've never tried it

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Sorry, but, lol.

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yeah, got to agree with chump norris here on this one.

(see you werent on test tonight you big girls blouse)

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BTW, I take it Khelds are counted as squishies as they have no inherent mezz protection.

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My bad. I had always thought of Dwarf form as having mezz protection. However, after checking, i realise this is not the case, and therefore Khelds will NOT be included in the max of 2 melee charachters.

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in fact ill save you the trouble

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As for khelds - the dwarf is not an inherent power and nor is light form. If you class them as melee for being able to get mezz protection from their powers, then you have to class everyone as melee as its possible to get 1 from acro. You would certainly have to class bubble defs/conts and anyone with the psionic epic as melee...which is clearly wrong.

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Please go way back in the thread and read my repsonse to your earlier mention of this.

Has anyone mentioned the uber ranged nova you have too? One big melee hit and thunderous blast drops most sqishies.

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so is it pvp night tonight?

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Starting in 4 minutes or less.

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Hehe, cheers mate. I was only kidding btw, to get a response out of KS. Waiting for the update to patch then ill be over. What am i best bringing? ( fromn the 4 toons in my sig )

so is it pvp night tonight?

Finally, as you may have guessed, I am getting a little annoyed about the way certain people are deciding to voice their 'feedback'.

Ever since the first major tourney, S4, people have always argued their cases. In the recent 2 man team comp, that KS and LW won, I remember the outcry over the 'no travel powers' decision. Many argued that this would 'gimp' melee sets and give an advantage to those sets with holds/slows etc. To some extent they had a very valid point. I remember playing my scrapper in a practise match, being hideously slowed, and being predictably ganked. This didnt annoy me however, as I chose a different toon to enter with (and still got ganked in the event lol), however, despite the arguments many turned up and had a great time.

I understand questionning the rules is going to happen, and indeed, I have tried to encourage it in both the original 'feedback' thread and this one. What I am finding frustrating however is people voicing opinions without really explaining why.

- Yes, this tourney is restrictive regarding the number of toons and the level needed to enter. However, in the first thread (April) I had initially planned to have the bouts at 44, but it was from the feedback in the thread I decided to change this to 50.

-The max 2 melee rule, as I have stated, is not yet set in stone. This is primarily because it was not mentioned in the initial thread. KS and Stalks comments about it possibly limiting the numbers is a fair point, and is being considered. I do after all want as many people as possible to 'give it a go'!
Currently however, nobody has yet pm'ed me to say they wanted to enter 3 melee toons, could they enter etc, like I said for them to do, and yet some people seem set on highlighting any small potential flaw, followed by a further dismissal of the entire event in the thread.

I created the idea for this competition to try and revamp some pvp fun. Believe it or not lol! All I ask is, if you have an opinion, feel free to share it, but also try to offer a solution too ( an example being the 3melee vs 3melee stalemate )

Quote from KS:
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This competition isnt as Compettive as it sounds i know for one im not really bothered if i win im going to enjoy myself and see what talent and skill CoX has to give. Ill be watching all the fights and enjoying them and hopefully learning some new tatics from what i see.

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Quote Devilshot:
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Still don't mean you can't have fun though

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Sums it up nicely

Hammer, you have clearly stated your opinions on this tourney in both this thread and the original one started in April:
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- My worry was not having enough 50s in the first place.. let alone any toons good in pvp. . Thats what I meant by being exclusionary.

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In April:
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Sounds like a tourney for the grinders or PLers.. :/

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You currently have 6or7 level 30-35's ( from your sig ), I however have nowhere near that number. I have been playing the game for 2 years+ and have 4 level 50 toons. Hardly powerlevelling.

In May:
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This format is a nice idea overall but.. its just too restrictive in practise. Honestly my first thought was
that this was meant for the small ring of Union PLers only.

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Currently it's a 60:40 split in the sign up between Unionefiant. My real concern atm the moment is the French and German servers. I really could do with some help informing them.

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Also give some leeway to melee players like KS

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KS recently won the 2vs2 tourney using one of his trollers. KS has many 'squishy' toons, and plays them exceptionally well.

All in all, I get the fact you don't like the format. I have known about this since April.I understand you aren't going to enter, and I am sorry you are not eligable too. However, please may I request that you leave this thread to those players who are interested, who maybe would like rule clarification or are offering useful feedback on the event.

Thankyou

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this 2 melee only rule is still stupid, it really really is.. Please. May I say(again), there is little need for these types of comments if someone is brave enough to enter 3 melee class characters then I would applaud them as they ARE NOT anywhere near the top of the heap for duels. People are already entering what you class as 'weak builds'. Some of those that have entered these toons have said they have done so for the FUN aspect. Bravery? IMO people enter for the fun aspect

Whats a regen scrapper going to fo against a ice/rad/mace corr except fight bravely, whats a granite going to do against a rad troller? a rad/psi defender? a elec/kin defender (yes I know rooted has a level of end drain protection but certainly not eneough) and so on and so on. The examples you have chosen above are very specific examples, which could be argued either way depending on the melee AT you are talking about. For example the Kin/elec defender would stuggle against SR etc. For this reason, im not really considering such specific examples

Playing a squiahy sure is a different concept to melee but it doesnt change the fact that there may be pvpers who dont play squishies and as such cannoy enter and are excluded. Given that pvp is a rare commodity these days I would have presumed it was in the events best interests to be open to as many as possible. This is EXACTLY the feedback I am after. Indeed, it is my primary doubt about the current rule standings, and as such I agree it is definately worth taking this into account. Thankyou.

Right from the start you have made a bold claim that "Solo pvp skill includes being able to handle playing squishies too" Claim? I have been very careful to state that this is only my current feelings/opinion on the matter, and as such I am willing to listen to feedback , my question would be, why does it? I have stated my reasons in the threads above If a regen scrapper can take on a competant ice/rad, rad/psi, rad/sonic, ice/cold, ice/ice and win then they are worthy of being recognised for thier skills over an /EM blaster EM blasters undoubtedly are excellent in team pvp. However in duals, I can think of an awful lot of melee chars that would potentially have an upper hand or one of the myriad of rad builds.
Melee classes have built in survivability to an extent but this is more evident in high number pvp not duels.

IMO to say that squishies dont have "'room to manouevre'" in high level pvp is insanity, they can do everything a melee class can do but better really? please elaborate, without mentioning specific builds , what do they have over squishies? A few more HPs? A few? mez protection? Yes, certainly a bonus. Please don't forget damage resistance, defense, slows/stuns etc Squishies get all the BFs they can chomp along until they run out with the ability to smash a melee class to mush in half an attack chain Only very few exceptional circumstances of x squishy vs y melee is this the case. . Melee class is not an easy option, anything other than a SR or ice tank is going to be slowed and chain held to destruction and their damage mitigation is very easily took out of the picture. again stalk, I do feel this is a very arguable situation My Fire/Ta troller tormented ice/em tanks to the point of frustration on Union and even without the ability to slow the recharge of hibernate I could merrily kill them.

If you want to have only 2 melee builds accessable then you can only have 2 squishy builds available also, its only fair.

I applaud any attempt to increase pvp and I dont doubt that your only intention is to generate a good time by all but my feeling is that you are being exclusionary towards the brave souls who are willing to gimp themselves by entering 3 melee alts before the game has even begun. I can hear many pvpers who hear they drew the guy who entered 3 melee toons going "w00t!!!" and rubbing their hands with glee, using your example of Ice/EM tank, EM/elec brute, Ice/EM tank they would all fall at the hands of any well played rad, and one of the obligatory ice/rad trollers would hebitch man-slap all of them with hardly a sideways glance and even my incompetant fire/ta would make them cry.

*edit* oh and a mind/ff troller really would just stand there and laugh as they are tkd to helplessness and dominate bypasses their defences

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All in all stalk, you made a very fair point about getting the numbers up. However, I completely disagree about melee sets being gimped AT ALL! Yes, there are some builds that trump them, no doubt, but hardly a huge number. Bearing in mind, this comp lets you pick some of your fights, allowing you a degree of control over whether or not you have to face an opponents AT you know you may struggle against.

Stalk, some fair points, to which ill reply shortly.

Meanwhile another point i forgot to mention, was what happens then if two players, with 3 melee toons each meet?

How do you overcome the ensuing stalemate?

Sweet Chilli Wrote:

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katana/em stalker



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oooh, never seen one of these before. Sounds a little gimped though

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Its a bit weird how someone could play an...

ice/rad cont
rad/rad def
ice/rad corr

but not play....

elec/elec brute
katana/em stalker
spines/regen scrapper


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First of all mate, currently they CAN play all but one of the listed toons. Secondly, I do see where you are coming from. I agree, playing a brute, scrapper and stalker does require different play styles. However, I felt the need to stop combinations like:

Ice/EM tank
EM/elec brute
Ice/EM tank ( yes someone could have pled a second one! )

I wanted to prevent someone playing these from having the option of purposely drawing matches they think might be difficult, wating for the perfect match to attack and win. IMO, it is exceptionally difficult to beat a melee toon who just wants to draw and not to fight.

Now I am NOT saying this would definately happen. Indeed, i would be sad if anyone chose to do this. However, I guessed most peeps would be taking in at least one squishie, and as well as my previously stated opinions about the reason I wanted everyone to play at least one squishy, i was also trying to prevent this from happening.

However again, this was only my opinion, and I am willing to reconsider if needs be..

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This whole tournament is exclusionary to the point of being ridiculous but since im not participating Ill leave comments at this.

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Please guys, rather less of this..it is neither a constructive argument, or helpful.

First off, I assure you that I have given this a lot of thought, and I am still open to suggestions.

As stated above, my reason for the no more than 2 melee rule was decided upon because I believe playing a squishie is a whole different concept to playing a melee AT.

I myself have always enjoyed pvping with melee toons. It is only relatively recently I have really begun to play my squishies. Playing an AT with low hitpoints and most with no mez protection, requires good timing and leaves very little room for error.
Please don't get me wrong, played well, squishies can be/are devastating, however this comes at a price; Against any high damage melee toon, get it slightly wrong, and within a few hits, you're toast. In most cases, it is a case of not getting hit as much as possible whilst managing to debuff and 'wear down' the opponent, ie damage over time.

Melee on the other hand is a different challenge. In pvp, playing melee is all about trying to overcome the debuffs etc, and deilvering as much damage as possible, in the shortest amount of time. Playing melee against high level squishies can be very difficult. However, against most squishies, you get some 'room to manoeuvre'. With high hitpoints, resists etc, good self-heals, most of the time you can get away with making errors in a match. I just don't feel, in top-flight pvp, that squishies have this same 'room to manouevre'.

Please note, this is only MY opinion. I know there are always exceptions to the rule, but this will always be the case.

All this aside, I am still torn whether to allow 3 melee or not. I understand, and agree to some level, that players may feel discriminated against for this. Anyone definately wanting to play 3 melee please feel free to have your say, after all, I would like as many peeps entered as possible.

I would also appreciate feedback from the people already entered.

Thanks

Andy

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BTW, I take it Khelds are counted as squishies as they have no inherent mezz protection.

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My bad. I had always thought of Dwarf form as having mezz protection. However, after checking, i realise this is not the case, and therefore Khelds will NOT be included in the max of 2 melee charachters.

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if someone entered 2 stone tanks and a stone brute they are not going to be winning anything and will be destroyed by ill/rads and probably any other rad troller

if you can enter 3 trollers u should be able to enter 3 melee, its not right for one rule for one and not for the other.

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You are not the first to bring up this argument, and after consideration I will be changing the rules to: No more than 2 of the same AT allowed.

However,

The rule concerning the total number of melee toons allowed will remain at 2.

ooh robots/dark nasty...