Rent_

Positron. Fix zones Pl0x.

Hopefully DJ will get back to me tomorrow and we'll have the preliminary plans up

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You know what that is? I've been banned, unbanned, banned again, unbanned again, banned again, unbanned again and my permissions are so messed up that in some forums I can only reply is I click on the quote button, some I have to use the quick reply and some are just as normal.

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Excuses excuses.


Now mush!

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There wasn't I check every day every 2 hours or so, old habits die hard for me

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As per my above post.

That just means that there were no people unhidden in them

Fahie

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Exactly my point!

A lot of people use hide these days becuase of the PvP bug I discovered.

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So important that you had to post it twice!

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I've sent my idea's to GR to look over but i know he's a busy guy so it might be a few days till he can get back to me. As soon as he does however i'll post what i've come up with.

It's probably going to be a league rather than a ladder though if i'm honest as there simply won't be enough people for a ladder and it won't work well i don't think. Same concept though.

And it will more than likely be on test depending on server location of players who sign up.

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Just got your offliners mate, ill pm ya the details of a vent server im on, we can discuss there and get GR involved

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I did research into everything so those /tells are pointless now.

Seeing as this was your idea originally i'm PM'ing the same stuff that GR got to you now. Have a look and let me know what you think

Too late.

I've sent my idea's to GR to look over but i know he's a busy guy so it might be a few days till he can get back to me. As soon as he does however i'll post what i've come up with.

It's probably going to be a league rather than a ladder though if i'm honest as there simply won't be enough people for a ladder and it won't work well i don't think. Same concept though.

And it will more than likely be on test depending on server location of players who sign up.

So you never existed?

As far as i'm aware you have to buy a retail version of the game to upgrade the account. You'll get 30 days playing time with it so you won't need to buy the time card yet.

Two things were good from i13.... Multi builds and selectable arena maps. Only the maps are directly related to PvP changes and it doesn't affect how the game plays so i'm not counting them as a good PvP change either.


Zonal PvP was not dead on Union.... If your on Union and found that they were you weren't coming in RV and SC at the right times. 6pm+ was the times to be in.

The only reason imo why the devs changed the system is because Japanese owners love PvP in every game and they think they know better from half a year with this game than the players that have spent 5 years playing it. Wouldn't surprise me if their "vision" was CoH being only PvP.



Dunno how many people are reading this thread but how many PvP'ers are still around on all servers? I'm in the process of sorting out preliminary test ladder stuff.

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Union Legends.....


Well lets see.....


Spag Bol
Gamete/Loar
Rent
Narcosis
Shotta
Rooks


Think that about covers it.

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Dont think your supposed to put yourself down....

n00bc4k3

Think you missed:

Globey
Phil
Enervator
and
Reviver

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I agree with those tbh Nicky, would add them if i could and i didn't see any rule stopping self submission

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Firstly I wasn't flame baiting, I was agreeing with GR and saying that the changes are not all bad as people like you would like everyone to believe.

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The people throwing their toys out of their prams also resort to insults

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^ this is flame baiting.




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True, you are entitled to your view, but then so are other people, and you keep saying there is nothing positive in there at all is unhelpful as well as being untrue.

Certain ATs will find the changes better, certain ones worse, and imbalances will no doubt be looked at.

To say a blanket "there is nothing good about them" is actually barefaced lying.

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How can you say my opinion is a barefaced lie? To me there is nothing good, end of. If you want to disagree with me then feel free but do it by telling me why you think things are good, not just by dismissing my side of things.



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That all depends on what people class as good.
For me i have not found anything good about the changes and as such have hung up my pvp toons until more changes are done.

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Another person who agrees with me and another good active PvP'er being forced away from the aspect they love.


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But it makes no difference,lol it couldnt be worse than it was as nobody was PVPing anyway!!

Thats the whole point. You and others moaning about how you have hung up your pvp toons is aa mute point as you obviously werent before as PVP was dead before all of this.

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I haven't hung my cape up, i'm still here but i can fully empathise with those that have. Having the only thing that your currently interested in taken away from you or changed beyond recognition is disheartening.


I don't know Shockwave that well as he's on defiant and i'm on union but judging by his skill when i have played with him or watch him play it's clear he's an active PvP'er.

I was on every night doing some sort of PvP as was a fair few of my friends (Shotta, Falc, Gamete/Loar, Free Spirit, Narcosis, Prince and Dark Messiah. (Sure i've missed a few too.)) Who have now left. With Shockwave and crew on Defiant i have to ask.....

Where were you? There used to be loads more PvP than there is currently.

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That would be fantastic! Groups of lvl 50's chasing lvl 1's all over between their missions!

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OMG that sounds fun.

Union Legends.....


Well lets see.....


Spag Bol
Gamete/Loar
Rent
Narcosis
Shotta
Rooks


Think that about covers it.

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I agree wholeheartedly with what GR is saying.

There is a lot of rubbish being spouted about the PVP changes, some of which is not even true, for example if u were to read about the travel supression, you would think you are stood still all the time when this simply is not the case, it isnt actually that much different.

The people throwing their toys out of their prams also resort to insults when something positive is posted about it, like " Oh you obviously dont PVP that much or know what you are talking about".

I think the changes are for the better, and for all those people who seem to think it has killed PVP, it was hardly teeming before was it? if it was so good, where were all these people then?

Sure it isnt perfect, for example the diminished returns on the healing sucks if that is your main type of powers or your only defense, but I have faith that it will be looked at and improved.

A few folk had a go last night and a fun time was had by all, so hang in there and let the changes evolve.

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Thanks for the flame bait.

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Well that just proves my point that you cant post anything positive about the PVP changes......

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I would if there was anything good about them. Even arena acts funny and the changes are supposed to be for them.


12.5% defence to psi (from frozen armour for some reason) and a psi domi with 140% to-hit couldn't touch me. Even psi blasters struggle to hit me. Movement is terrible and damage is skew whiff.

That's my opinion on the matter and it's unfair to say the people un happy with the changes are throwing the toys out of the pram, just because it's nothing positive. Our opinions are just as valid as yours.

Flame baiting won't make anything better though will it?

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I agree wholeheartedly with what GR is saying.

There is a lot of rubbish being spouted about the PVP changes, some of which is not even true, for example if u were to read about the travel supression, you would think you are stood still all the time when this simply is not the case, it isnt actually that much different.

The people throwing their toys out of their prams also resort to insults when something positive is posted about it, like " Oh you obviously dont PVP that much or know what you are talking about".

I think the changes are for the better, and for all those people who seem to think it has killed PVP, it was hardly teeming before was it? if it was so good, where were all these people then?

Sure it isnt perfect, for example the diminished returns on the healing sucks if that is your main type of powers or your only defense, but I have faith that it will be looked at and improved.

A few folk had a go last night and a fun time was had by all, so hang in there and let the changes evolve.

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Thanks for the flame bait.

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The problem in, the Dev's have got an idea from nowhere that what players want to make pvp more accessable to the masses is to make it easier and dumbed down. That isn't the case. A bit of balance between the builds and AT's is what was needed - focusing on individual powers, rather than changing the format and core of pvp itself.


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Dual builds, Pain Domination and the -range from taunt would've fixed 90% of the problems. All the other stuff added was a total waste.

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Is it just me or did stalkers get megasmacked with the nerf bat?

<-- Wasnt killed on an un-accoladed blaster by AS then ET

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Stalkers overall are weaker due to the inherent resistance everyone gets now. No-one cares though because they pick spirit sharks and go on a "2 shotting 750 damage rampage" where there is no counter for it.

At least in pre i13 PvP there was movement as a counter

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If anyone deserves a statue for all to see in game it would be Mothers_Love.

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Rent deserves that statue more tbh.

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I think you've missed the most important part of what Ex Libris was saying in that post. The lack of testers was referring to early betas (one of which we did try including EU community in). For Issue 13 they brought in a significant number of PvP'ers: they knew they'd need them. What happened is that the feedback they received from the majority was effectively unusable and got in the way of being able to iterate changes.

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I got all of what Ex Libris was saying. She was blaming the US PvP'ers for not providing the data the dev's wanted.

My only point (which i tried to put tactfully rather than just "give us beta access") was that EU players should be included in beta's that make changes on this scale, especially if the US players aren't giving them what they want/need.

I know we have our own insult throwing machines but the majority would provide good feedback, just because it's a rare honour if nothing else. You will have a good idea of who and who not to invite regarding to the quality of feedback.


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The dev team want to communicate with the PvP community. Effective communication is a two way street, however: the PvP community needs to step up as well, and show that they're willing to communicate with the devs in a mature and reasonable manner. Throwing insults and responding to the dev team giving an option to play pre-Issue 13 PvP by making accusations like those in this thread does this community no good at all.

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Constructive feedback is always the best way to go, i agree 100% but this two way street will never happen whether we write 3 page detailed essays or a one line sarcastic comment as only you and Palladium read our forums.
I'm sure the dev's are too busy around beta time to be reading substantial emails from you when they can check the beta forum for any information they require.

I know that's an old age argument but that is definitely how it seems.

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I haven't noticed much difference, the zones still seem pretty empty, when there has been ppl in there they seem to be badging, when they did pvp i was accused of ganking even though I play a support toon, yet they felt killing a support toon in a one on one was completely fair, oh well, as more things change the more they stay the same I guess.

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No offence but if you haven't noticed much difference then you didn't zone PvP much before. It's totally different.

I agree..... Defence seems epic now. I couldn't hit an MM inside PFF with my ice blaster at all. Not even just once with streak breaker kicking in.


Can't imagine SR being any different.

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Build was confused with skill too much. I think most PvPers wouldn't entertain some characters in PvP although in team PvP there is potential for success of most builds from the result of what the rest of the team can do.


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I have to disagree with this. There's plenty of PvP'ers who use power sets that were deemed to be poor performers and still killed everything in sight.

TG's AR/Dev blaster comes to mind.

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It's because cry baby PvE'ers couldn't be bothered with practising at PvP and moaned for years that PvP was broken. Now the devs have given them it on a plate. The end.

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Hmmm. I can only imagine you have, and never had, any real interest in enticing PvE players to PvP with comments like that.

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I and all the other PvP'ers are always happy when someone new wants to get into PvP. We offer advice, knowledge and even tips and hints to these new players, not much more we can do. Except maybe let them kill us?

If players want to PvP then they will do and shouldn't need enticing. If they start to PvP and they're always getting killed so quit soon after, moaning that xyz is overpowered or saying they only lost because they haven't got IO's without contemplating it's because they aren't very good at PvP (even though they can solo an AV) and demanding things get changed so they can get a kill will result in negative posts from the guys who have worked hard to get where they are.

Whether it's the right build or skill that makes a good PvP'er in your eyes, both are easy to achieve with invested time. Something an MMO is all about.

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Of course this thing went live to get enough feedback.

There was no way it couldn't, even if every single PvP'er played around with it it's still too small of a group in my opinion.

Far more people'd have a look at it on Live than would on Test.

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Obviously live data is better than test data but Ex Libris said that the beta went poorly due to a lack of testers or because the people in the beta weren't testing what the dev's wanted them to.

My point was if they don't think they had enough people helping state side then there's plenty over here. Also telling the players about what they went testing would also help..... Something they'll do next time apparently


Here's the thread i've been reading if anyone wants a gander.



Linky