Pax__

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They're visiting, not using it as a base. At any given time, there are only 2 heroes using the Batcave as their base of operations.

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What's really going on with all the Batman-related characters is: there's two or more TINY supergroups, who all have a COALITION together, and have set base entry permissions to allow coalition members to stop by.

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Batman, Robin, Nightwing, Batgirl, Oracle, Azrial, Huntress (not full time), Spoiler (now deceased). Sounds like a supergroup to me.

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No. They're not a group - they don't all get unlimited access to the Batcave.

Indeed, Azrial is LOCKED OUT, most or all of the time. Nightwing IS Robin ... grown up. (One can consider "beign robin" to be "being trained to be a costumed vigilante"; indeed, I'm waiting for Batman to pick a Robin that actually has some sort of superpower ...!) Batgirl isn't part of the Dynamic Duo, she's just an ally with a similar theme. Likewise for Huntress. Oracle I don't know, but I doubt he's any more "on the in" than Batgirl is.

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> The zones say [Hero only or Villain only] make the hospital doors that way.

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Villain hospitals tend not to have actual DOORS, is the problem. No lobby, either. They're relatively open-air affairs, with just door-HOLES to go through. In BB and SC, anyway.

Heck, the BB villain hospitql used to be LITERALLY "open air" - no walls, no roof, clear view of the sky (filled with hovering heroes) all around.

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well admittedly after a stalker jumped into the hero base and ganked my blaster, simply my sg taught the villians a lesson. Tread on our ground we tread on yours. This occured in sirens call by the way. So after this incursion myself and a sg mate went in and camped the hospital on the villian side.

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Two wrongs do not make a right.

The actions of that one, single villain did NOT entitle you to be a$$holes to EVERY villain in the zone.

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Now mind you if we killed you once we offered you free passage out of the hospital if you so chose to take it. Because though we were sending a message, we are also heros and not completely without honor.

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You wer in the hospital - thus, you were UTTERLY without honor.

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Lets face it some people just come in to take a peek.

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Thos people,however, don't ATTACK while they are looking. If they do attack, they weren't there JUST to take a look around.

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The situation of why we were there was politely explained and in the end all present seem to understand the point we were trying to make except for one particularily whiny fellow who in fact dispite his cries and whines we did not even kill him once. Mainly due to the fact we didn't want his pouting to get any worse then it already was.

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I'd've /petitioned any so-called "heroes" involved, on principle alone. There is NO excuse for invading a hospital. NONE.

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They will fix it. Give them a break.
And by the way, the pendulum swings both ways, the heroes get nailed just as much. At least on Guardian.

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That's as may be, and I condemn ANYone on EITHER side who behaves in such contemptible ways.

However, MY villains don' camp the enemy hospital. I simply won't come that close to the spawn sites. In BB, my characters HAVE fouht their way through the NPC threats, to enter the otuermost perimeter of the base. But as soon as I get near the areas covered by police drones? I stop advancing. That area is protected in that manner for a reason, and I don't care to ignore that reason.

Similarly, I don't have a problem with heroes attackin the turrets and Wolf Spiders (etc) in the area, penetrating the outer perimeter of the base - it's when they are fully INSIDE the gates, in range to attack people at the spawn points, that it's a problem.

In SC, I've never even SEEN the hero base. The villain base, though - if you're in a position to attack someone in the hospital, or directly in the small space between there and the helicopter, youre in a place you should not be attacking from. Wanna sit and watch? Fine, go for it. If you attack, though, you're spawn camping.

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But as for all the rest of you Im standing by my statement that a 5 man TEAM is not a full GROUP

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The game code would seem to think otherwise.

And my currently TWENTY-person villain group definitely feels the pinch of "excessive costs". We're a SMALL group, but were not a "5-person team".

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Small SGs cant possibly be self reliant.

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Before I can blow this one out of the water, you will have to define "self reliant".

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Larger SGs are the only ones with the manpower and managment skills to efficiantly operate truly memorable pvp events, like a decent guild war.

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This presupposes that a small SG which wants functioning workshops and an infirmary has ANY desire to go PvP.

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AND FOR THE LOVE OF ALL MMOs STOP MAKING COMPARISONS TO BATMAN AND THE LIKE. This is NOT a comic book, its a Super Hero/Villain THEMED MMO! It will NOT behave like a commic book but RATHER more LIKE an MMO.

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Go back to EQ or WoW where guilds work the way you like, then. *I* wasn't the one that said "no comic-booksupergroup ever had less than seventy-odd members".

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which is PvP and the size of super groups.

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Again with the insistance that PvP has anythign to do with it, except in a tangential fashion.

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The PvE content of SG bases is not only underpowered, but definatly overvalued.

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No, it' snot overvalued. It's just overPRICED.

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Since IoPs are still currently not live maybe you guys should start complaining about them.. because thats what you really want.

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No, they're not. I don't give a flying f**k about IoPs; I just want my group's workshop to be fully-functional, and to have a working infirmary. Maybe to be able to afford some purely-decorative areas for some RPing, as well. But not IoPs.

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And let's see, comics examples of less-than-seventy-odd-member Super Groups:
[*] Teen Titans (5 members)[*] The Fantastic Four (well, gee ...)[*] The New Warriors (6 members)[*] The New Mutants (9 core members, IIRC)

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Titans have had over 60 members over the years...

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Not at once. Not at PRESENT, especially.

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the Fantastic "Four" - has included everyone from Spiderman to the their Mailman as 'official' members

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I don't count "crossovers" as "being a full-fledged member". SGs team with non-SG heroes all the time, in comics and in COH/V.


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The New Warriors ... dunno it's not a classic title so not one I read - New Mutants have had an entire schools worth.

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Check that site out; there were something over 150 issues in total when the series ran in the 90's ... and there are STILL fans.

While we're at it, let's add Gen13 to the list of under-bazillion--members SGs.

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We can emulate all we want but we are NONE of these and I suggest if you want a large SG you get them out of your head and concentrate on pleasing your members through being there for them and teaming.

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That presupposes that I *WANT* a large SG. I don't. 10-20 members is just FINE by me.

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If you only want a small SG - then keep in mind that Batman, although a singular hero - is both insanely wealthy and has had years to build that ultra cool base. In the early days the batcave was nothing more than an underground garage.

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Batman (even the Dynamic Duo together), I don't count as an SG.

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Supermans Fortress of Solitude - has similarly had years to build up - and is owned by the most powerful being on the planet with people owing him favors going back over 70 years. Of course it's going to be packed.

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Superman is not an SG unto himself.

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The Fantastic Four - have Government and corporate sponsors.

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Heroes: Paragon City and Hero Corps.

Villains: Arachnos.

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Spiderman ... has a closet. Keep it in perspective.

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For the old TV series, "Spiderman and his Mazing Friends", the trio of Spiderman, Iceman, and Firestar had a pretty well-equipped apartment, actually. SG Mission Computer in the living room, at the very least.

I dunno, 36M is a bit much, IMO.

A starting amount of, say ... 500K? And up the per-member bonus for the first fifteen members to 50K or 100K each? That would certainly help, a LOT. In the short run. But I'd prefer a long-run solution to a short-term bandaid.

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Anyone who's played PvP here in any serious capacity can suggest dozens of ways to restructure the spawn points to virtually eliminate camping. That's the solution, not constant GM supervision.

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Oh, I agree. My suggestions:
[*] Re-institute Drone-given Debt.[*] Put a Teleport lock-out on all Hospitals in PvP zones, including lobbies thereto.[*] Put a 100-yard-radius Teleport Lockout centered on the zone exit(s).[*] Place clearly-labelled paths betweenthe hospital and the corresponding exit, which is itself subject to a Teleport exclusion.[*] Place a 100-yard-radius autohit supermax-distance Repulsion field, magnitude 10 (to heck withthis silly 1, 2, & 3 crap), centered on the zone exit.[*] Place similar repulsion fields along the path from exit to hospital, and over all entrances to the hospital.[*] Give all drones an un-beatable perception for their own selves, so that stealthing past them is simply IMPOSSIBLE. Use them to create a broad enough "no-go zone" around the Hospital, Exit, and path between, that noone can use Snipe, nor knockback effects, against anyone in the teleport-exclusion areas.[*] Give double bounty for defeating an enemy inside your own base.[*] Change where you go, if you're nailed by a Police/Arbiter drone. Instead of going back to your OWN hospital, you get stuck in a prison which you have to break out of, and which is an absolute CAST IRON P-I-T-A to escape from (think "an ocean of purple" ...). Die in there, get thrown back into your cell; do not pass go, do not collect $100.

Poof. Problem mostly solved.

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You small groups should stop whining... a three man group isnt an SG its a TEAM!!

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And what of grops like the Shadow Coalition (we have our own Forum, too!) ...? We're some 15 members strong, discounting multiple alts in the group. Far mroe than a team, far FAR short of the membership cap.

And let's see, comics examples of less-than-seventy-odd-member Super Groups:
[*] Teen Titans (5 members)[*] The Fantastic Four (well, gee ...)[*] The New Warriors (6 members)[*] The New Mutants (9 core members, IIRC)

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Small groups should not benefit as much as large groups, not even for the PvE effects because honestly they havn't worked for it like our larger SG has.

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You haven't put ANY more work into your SG's base, than *I* have put into *my* SG's base. You just had more people putting work IN, at all.

Merely entering the opposing hospital (under your own power) should forcibly log you out, AND lock you out of logging back onto that account for at least 15 minutes.

No, not entering the hospital ... make that, just getting wihtin 100 yards of it (under your own power, still) ...!

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I said this would happen.

Once they removed drone debt, there was no longer any reason for anyone to fear camping the enemy spawn. Used to be only level 50s would consistantly risk hospital camping but now everyone does it.

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True, but when you had both hero and villain TP foeing each other in front of drones for an easy/greify kill..... I think if they put it back there'd be hell to pay. I remeber my warshade getting max debt because of this tactic. The stalker i was fighting couldn't take me out so just said...run away...port hahahah dead lobster

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The easy solution for "TP-Drone debt" was, and should still be, STAY THE BLOODY HELL AWAY FROM THE ENEMY BASE!!! If you're not CLOSE enough to get teleported to a drone, you won't get teleported to a drone!

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The siren's call bounty will never get this, because dying means you are invalidated as a bounty target. The bases remain raidable from the perspective of people who are hunting for such a target, and yet - most importantly - someone who does want to leave the zone can just stroll out past the campers, probably with time to wave, and get to the helicopter without any problems.

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Without problems?

Think again. This morning / last night (in the wee hours), I got one-shotted, despite having PFF up, while standing by the Warzone Operative (actualy, while actually TALKING to him). In a direct line between the Hospital, and the Helicopter. Precisely 75 feet FROM said helicopter, along said direct line.

Camper's name was "Simian Smart", if it matters. On Infinity.

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2) Sell salvage for prestige.

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This doesn't help small groups, it makes large groups get prestige faster. It would, if anything, exacerbate the gulf between the haves and have-nots.

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3) Fix the Prestige scaling. Higher level heroes should earn more Prestige; after all, they're more prestigious.

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Then again, they'r ealso "old news". After you hear about Captain Unbelievable kicking in the teeth of some random bunchof ganger punks for the fifty-thousandth time ... is it REALLY going to impress you more than the rising star of the relatively unknown hero ...? No. It won't.

And OOC, I *like* the fact that my low-level alts can still make a meaningful contribution to the SG as a whole, by way of prestige income.

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6) Crafted item: Map to the Perez Maze (placed in Control room; it uses X control). Your SG members' in-game map of Perez Park is replaced by one with a zoomable, detailed map of the forest maze. I cannot begin to tell you how much I want one.

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Funny, I already HAVE that. Go to vidiots, and download the allingame.exe patch. Install it and *poof* the maze is mapped for you, in-game (it doesn't remvoe the Fog-ofWar effect, though).

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The last thing I want is SGs saying "you can join when you reach the level cap" you'll generate more prestige then.

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QFT.

Right now, there's a real good reason to convincelower-level newcomers to join your SG - even give them "signing bonusses" of a few thousand infamy, say - because the amount of prestige they will earn for the group, by "living in SG mode" until they hit level 25, can be HUGE.

Make it so their prestige contribution is less than that os fomeone in their 30's, and you rob thegameof an IMO very interesting dynamic, where high-level characters are motivated to actively seek out and recruit low-level character into their SG..

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Bases, as they currently stand, really focus on mid and large sized groups earning Prestige - so the complaints have a good point. We're trying to work something out so that a smaller group can get something useful quickly - and also put Salvage to use! Can't promise a timeline, but we are working on it.

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Suggestion: multiply prestige earnings for each member, based on how few other members are in the SG. When that goes live, apply the same multiplier to each group's current Net Worth, and adjust "free" / "unspent" prestige accordingly.

First thing would be to decide what is a "mid-level" group; let's pick 40 members, just because it's a round number - and use a nonlinear progression, so that the increase to prestige earned is ever greater, for the same number of embers "short" of the previous threshold.

So, 36m to 40m = 100%

31m to 35m = 110% (like having ~34-39 people earning prestige) ...? That's a 10% gain, for 5 members "lost".

Make the next step 15%, for the same 5 "lost" members: 26m to 30m = 125% (like having ~32-38 people earning prestige) ...!

Continue the progression:

21m to 25m = 145% (like having ~30-36 people earning prestige)
16m to 20m = 170% (like having ~32-34 people earning prestige)
15m = 200% (like having 30 people earning prestige)

Wait. Pause a second, and re-evaluate. At this point, each member lost is also 20K prestige lost. Up the rate of gain, but make it linear, and per-member:

14m = 225% (like having ~31 people earning prestige)
13m = 250% (like having ~32 people earning prestige)
12m = 275% (like having 33 people earning prestige)
11m = 300% (like having 33 people earning prestige)
10m = 325% (like having ~32 people earning prestige)
9m = 350% (like having ~29 people earning prestige)
8m = 375% (like having 28 people earning prestige)
7m = 400% (like having 28 people earning prestige)

Pause again; nice round number ont eh bonus, let's kick things up a notch, with this few people prestige income will be extremely low, no matter what:

6m = 450% (like having 27 people earning prestige)
5m = 500% (like having 25 people earning prestige)
4m = 550% (like having 22 people earning prestige)
3m = 600% (like having 18 people earning prestige)
2m = 650% (like having 13 people earning prestige)
1m = 700% (like having 7 people earning prestige)

There. THAT, I think, would address the difficulties of small groups; it has flaws, yes (too many alts in the same group = shooting yourself in the foot WRT prestige income).

You can simply measure the current net worth of a group at the moment the patch goes live, spent and unspent prestige together, and multiply it by the appropriate number from above, based on how many people are in the group right then. Just put the patch live without warning, and noone should be able to pull off any exploits, either. ^_^

The benefit of doing it that way is, you don't need to evaluate the price of items, not now ... and not stuff you add in the future. If a group's membership changes, their base doesn't have to be re-evaluated for cost, so their "unspent prestige" total need never be touched.

All that changes, once the patch goes live, is how much Prestige each SG and Vg has at that moment ... and after that, how much prestige any given hero accumulates per defeated enemy ...!

This means less effort TOMORROW, net month, next year, and so on. Keep Base-building prices balanced for the mid-to-large group, and fluctuating memberships will take care of themselves ...!

Young Blood
The Young Blood are a new light-RP villain group on the Infinity server, and we are seeking .... well, as many members as we can manage to put together! We're a themed group, specifically .... young villains (hence the name).

To become one of the Blood, there are three key requirements:
[*] First, your character must be (and preferably look, if they're [mostly] human) seventeen, or younger. Essentially, the Blood is intended to be something like an "Evil Teen Titans".[*] Second, you must write out a good background for your character. It doesn't have to be pullitzer prize material, but it should be interesting .... and preferably not TOO formulaic / stereotypical.[*] "Must play nicely with others"; while personality conflicts do happen, anyone found to be consistently unpleasant all or most of the time will be "politely asked to leave", if you will.

The Blood holds a few basic precepts as well; in order of importance:
[*] There is no "One True Way";[*] Every Archetype, COH and COV alike, has a place on a team - and solo;[*] No powerset is required, and most powersets are perfectly viable choices;[*] Diverse, well-rounded teams are superior to single-archetype teams in all but a very few, very contrived cases.[*] You don't have to be the best example of your archetype to have fun, nor to be valuable to a team and SG;[*] We are alt-friendly, but please don't go crazy with eight or a dozen of them ...!

Anyone interested in joining should send a tell to Starshadow to arrange a meet-and-greet. Sending me a private message on this forum (with Young Blood in the subject line) is also okay, for now.

Especially, I'd like to hear from someone capable of setting up a website with a forum; if you're able and willing, there's a promotionor two in it for you!

Everything else is in a state of flux at the moment - especially as pertains to how promotions happen, othr than (for now) "when starshadow feels like it". Promotions will probably be based on a combination of how long you've been in in the SG, and what level you've reached.

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Apparently numerous bugs with contacts still exist too. A new one has cropped up, requiring us to log out after doing a newspaper mission in order to get into the next mission.

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You don't have to log out to fix this. Just open your missions list, click onceon the mission you want to do, and then ... click on "SELECT TASK" ...! Poof, problem solved. It's worked for me all six times that bug has reared it's head.

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I see where you're coming from, but...

...It's an -exploration- badge. The whole point is to reward people for NOT just going from point A to point B to point C. Remember, the devs don't tell us where these badges are. Every one of the things that shows up on a badge list on a fansite somewhere with exact coordinates was found by a -player-, who just felt like walking around a little before clicking on their next contact. ;p

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Which would be why I figured it'd be best for Badge and Guy-who-explains-badges to NOT be in the same cell. Maybe not even the sme floor (put the NPC on the second floor?) - and then say "I think there's one somewhere around here, if you look you might find it", then leave it at that. ^_^

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There is NO badge for defeating enemies in the tutorial. The ONLY badge attainable in the tutorial map is the exploration badge.

Now that being said, I rolled up my character last night, got him to level 6 and saw someone with the Tutorial badge and went "Doh! I forgot to get it!"

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You know what?

It occurs to me - why not have the first contact SEND you near that badge? Put someone else up there (say, in Cell #13), have the guy send you to bring some of that pain-killer up to his buddy, and when you talk to him, he EXPLAINS what badges are, how you get them, and so on. Even to the point of saying something along the lines of "I think there's one somewhere around near here, too".

For absolute newcomers, there's no in-game explaination of these that (if you'll pardon the metaphor) "jumps out and bites our backside", unlike most other game mechanics. When I started playing COH two months ago, I only learned about badges completely and solely by accident, while browsing a fan site! (Vidiot's Maps, FWIW - a site I recommend to all and sundry!)

So, it just seems to me that, since Breakout's badge is an exploration badge, that it's a prime opportunity to introduce the hoped-for new players to the idea of "badge hunting" right from square one - give them the idea that there's more to do in COH/V than just grind for XP and levels.

Just a thought.

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Do you really think they stand to lose more customers by opening the servers than not?

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Anal-retentive lovers of rules and law (guilty as charged, SIR!) would possibly feel compelled to point out, in no uncertain terms, that doing so was an explicit act of breach of contract, as said 2-day headstart was advertised as exclusive to pre-order custoemrs and defined as before anyone else can get into the game. Ergo, if they do not wait 48 hours, or reasonably close thereto, from when the servers opened for me to join ...

Yeah, it'd cause them more hell than catering to pantywaists like you. Now if you'll excuse me, I pre-ordered the CORRECT way, and have some characters to level up. Ta!

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So you're saying that its the retail industry's fault that they launched the game early, and not at all playNC's fault for locking the game out for anyone other than pre-order customers.

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It's the retail store to whom you gave your money that is at fault, here. THEY, and noone else, knew you had put money down towards the game. THEY, and noone else, should have known to contact you and let you know that the policy for the preorder, once it was OFFICIALLY ANNOUNCED, involved gettign a pre-order box with a special pre-order code.

NCSOFT HAS CHEATED YOU OF NOTHING. Your game shop did. Go beat on THEIR heads. Do it right now, and maybe, JUST MAYBE, you can get a pre-order box today, and be in the headstart tonight.

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Just sit back and imagine right now how many kids got this game on Friday from their local EB or GameStop or (fill in here) and got it home, only to find themselves locked out because they weren't a Super Special member? Think of the customers PlayNC is losing!

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Launch Day is October 31. Today is October 29. Think about it.

I'm working on doing a sort of "skit" / "micro-play" with my minions - once I'm high enough level to have them all of course. and I want to make sure of how the "/petsay" commands work.

If I want to set up a text file that sets a keybind that will make all my Zombies start panhandling - what would that line look like?

Maybe this ...?
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lshift+numpad1 petsay_pow Zombie "/em panhandle"

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And if I wanted a Lich to say some dialog, would this work as a line in that text file ...?
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lshift+numpad4 petsay_pow Lich "Ladies, gentleman, and scum of all ages, may I have your attention, please!"

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FWIW, the skit I have in mind is a brief humor piece "in fourteen keypresses", but if I get to like the effects, who knows. Maybe I'll get some other MM's together, and we'll start putting on full Shakespearean plays. A Midsummer Night's Dream, anyone ...?

Hmm ... a small SG with a decorative room set up JUST to function as a theater, and charging INFAMY (like, 50 infamy, tops) for tickets ... lol ... who knows, maybe I'll help found the "Rogue Isles Repertory Theater".

But anyway, some help with how keybind text files need to be formatted, especially with regards to [petsay] commands (both speech AND emotes) would be a GREAT help.

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My point was most of the posters who argued with me seemed to defend the fact that one shoting a hero( or villain depending your side) who was already almost dead was fun, just because it's PvP and they could do it.

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I for one never said it would be fun, simply that it is not griefing. Especially if it only happens to you once, at the hands of any particular character (from what I understand, Cryptic generally holds that griefing usually involves repeatedly doing something objectionable - as in, "at least twice").

If I'm playing a villain, I'm in a PVP zone, and I see a hero low on health, while IU'm in good condition still? You bet I'll take him down - at the drop of a hat! It's my character's JOB in that zone. One or another character I make might have a personal code of honor that says differently, but by and large .... prey is prey, easy or otherwise.

Now, regardless of what I'm playing, I won't go seeking out such targets - but I won't pass them by either. Take Siren's Call; dropping you might just make that hotspot over there more likely to fall to Arachnos' forces .... not dropping you might have the opposite effect. No matter what your HP and END bar look like (at worst, you would only be 2-3 blue and 2-3 green Inspirations from "what, me? hurt? HA!!").

In any event, it is not griefing JUST because your HP weren't at full. Frankly,it's no more griefing then, than if we're in an ARENA event, Free-for-All, and I wander along and find you .... with low HP/END, because you just fought off someone else.

The PVP zones are esentially giant, objective-laden, PvE-hazard-filled ARENAS. ANYthing that moves in there, and isn't on your team , is a legitimate target .... regardless of what it's status might (or might not) be.

You, however, are seeking to polarise this issue - either we have to agree with you that you shouldn't be attacked at low HP, OR, we're just lowlifes who're only out for easy prey.

Middle ground, Purple. Middle. Ground.

I won't be out for easy prey (just "doable" prey - stuff I think I have a decent chance of defeating). Yet, I won't consider it wrong to nail someone who is low on HP.

Yes, EVEN IF THE "SOMEONE" GETTING NAILED IS ME ...!! It's a risk undertaken, willingly, when one enters the PVP zone at all. "You pays your money, and you takes your chances."

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Tell me in the history of crime, at least a name of serial killer who killed anything else than helpless people.

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Stalin. Hitler. Vlad Tepes.

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I ask for serial killers names and I get Dictators names ?

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Well then, define serial killer.

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Can't you do better.

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There're more deaths attributed to any ONE of them, than to every madman locked up in prison for being a "serial killer", throughout the last century.

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It all comes down to this: hardcore PvPers like the easy preys and the not challenging game.

One shoting an almost dead character is no PvP, it lacks the "versus" part.

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Then don't be easy prey. Either be a hard target, or, stay out of the PVP zones.

Precisely what the hell is your major malfunction, anyway? PVP Zone. It is not neccessary for anyone to enter such a zone to do ANYthing non-PVP, at all, period, full friggin' stop.

If you go into a PVP zone, expect to be PVP'ed.

As for our "lacks the versus" comment ... "versus" bears no obligation that it be a fair, stand-up fight. You want those, stick to the Arena. It boils down to one simple thing: iffen ya don' LIKE what's in da PVP zones, den, don' be in 'em yerself, dummy!