Knight_Errant

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Some ppl said that there are several much harder games out there.
And maybe most ppl didnt play many other games to compare ?

[/ QUOTE ]More wild unfounded speculation while ignoring the evidence at hand? How obtuse can you get?

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Aehm you do think before posting do you ?
Since you did just prove by yourself that the mobs used to be much harder, so i wonder how you come up to the conclusion that my statement they were harder was wrong ???
I said there were times mobs were harder than now and that is true.

[/ QUOTE ]*cough* Wrong again (at least you're consistent ). I've just proved that you didn't read my post and that you don't think before posting.

My post shows that there was a total buff to Bosses and AVs in i3 they were not nerfed to a state weaker than they were before i3. They finished up stronger.

Of course AVs and GMs were buffed again later on to make them a bit tougher too. That was back in i7, again they over did it on the regen and had to tweak it back down to a reasonable level.
So you're still wrong. Mobs haven't gotten weaker, if fact where changes have been made they've gotten stronger.

Also Neko's post isn't telling the whole story. Lts and Bosses are still more accurate than minions. Unless the Surveillance power on my Blaster is lying every time I scan an LT or Boss.

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No you need to pay for your account with a credit card for recuring payment as the system no longer takes debit cards.

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My continued payment with my debit card disagrees with you.

EDIT: Maestro is a problem that is not the fault of NCSoft. Maestro has made itself such a problem that some banks dropped it entirely in favour of Visa just because it was easier for them. Complain to your bank about the poor utility of Maestro.

[/ QUOTE ]The fact remains that unless you have an "accepted" card you can't buy anything from the ingame shop. Which essentially sells items that are unavailable to purchase anywhere else.

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Oh, I forgot weird cackling 12th century sorcerer Richard O'Brian, but he seemed pretty sadistic too.

[/ QUOTE ]Ah, those were the days. That was when they made a decent Robin Hood TV series.

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Cox easier than all other mmorpg is proven wrong.
There are some few easier games but many harder ones.

[/ QUOTE ]I think the number of responses reporting their experiences in other MMOs has generally refuted that claim.

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Mobs used to be stronger cant be proven by me since they deleted old posts from US forum, but every dev can tell you that i am right.

[/ QUOTE ]Wrong! The earliest change to mobs since the game went live, and it's still there on the Developers section of the US Boards, was the change to Bosses, AVs and GMs. In i3 they were made harder. Both Health and Damage were buffed. Damage to the point where an even level Boss could two-shot an unprepared Defender. Bosses also had silly levels of regen (roughly equivalent to an AV before the last increase given to AVs and GMs in i7). This was partially rolled back and bosses ended up at the power level they are now. So no, you're wrong.

Even Emmert acknowledged that he over did it on that one.

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I very much doubt they were less powerful than they are now.

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At least on this one you are prolly alone.....
Denying chars got stronger with sets leads to the conclusion you never played the game with sets sry.

[/ QUOTE ]But you failed to take ED into account. And I very much doubt I'm alone, that's only your opinion. I've been playing this game since just after Villains was release so I am well experience with this game without IOs thank you very much
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Or you just disagree without thinking, just because you love to disaagree.

[/ QUOTE ]No, I'm, disagreeing with you because you haven't presented a single, not one iota, of evidence to back up any of your statements. Nothing at all.

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There arent any patch notes left from the time they buffed or nerfed mob strenghts

[/ QUOTE ]How very convienient.
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There have been many changes to the game which never appeared in patch notes... you might have noticed. :-)

[/ QUOTE ]Yes they're called bugs.

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What former power? Mobs weren't really changed at all. Hell CoT behemoths still use their i4 version of the Inv toggle.

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Mobs had much more HP than they have now and some did hit harder than they do now.

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This is the first time I've ever heard anything like this. And I've never noticed it ingame either.

[/ QUOTE ]Probably because it's just fantasy in an attempt to support a failing argument.

Edit: I'm still looking through ther patch notes to see if there's a "reduced NPC health by X%" anywhere. Something that big would have to be documented.

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There once was a time when chars didnt have sets therfore not beeing as powerfull.

[/ QUOTE ]I very much doubt they were less powerful than they are now.
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There once was a time when mobs used to be much harder than they are now.

[/ QUOTE ]When was that? Back before ED when tanks could herd an entire map so the rest of the team could blast then to shreds by the door? They certainly haven't changed the power level of standard mobs since issue 6 and I doubt that they have been made easier before then. I certainly haven't found any patch notes that say as much.
Of course if you have some solid proof that what you say is true (not: "a SG mate said...") then maybe you would have a point.

That's not a difficulty issue, that's a matter of predictability. If you've been through the 1-50 run half a dozen time and paid attention to the mobs then you'll know what they're going to do and when. That allows you to plan your course of action accordingly and the threat that those mobs would pose to a less experience player is partially negated. It's like reading the ending of a novel and it applies to all MMOs.

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If you're not finding the 'Invincible' difficulty setting a challenge then evidently you're to l33t for us.


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I think many players with more than 9 months vet rewards and several 50 dont find it very challenging anymore even on highest diff setting.

[/ QUOTE ]That's your assumption, without any relevent or even half conceived supportive evidence. Not a fact.

I think that the sky is pink and it rains teddy bears in game, oddly enough the truth says otherwise.

If you're so upset with CoX not being a challenge for you anymore then why are you still here whining about it. If you're not finding the 'Invincible' difficulty setting a challenge then evidently you're to l33t for us.

Moving mobs in other MMOs are just as uncommon as they are in CoX. With the exception of the odd patrol static mobs are the standard for MMOs, CoX is no exception. And frankly the idea of being ganked because I had to go answer the door is not an endearing game feature, so you can forget that 'idea'.

Oh and I'd like to see the non-twinked defender or blaster that can survive a genuine 8-man ambush on their own (although the odds of one being encountered while soloing is, well, as near to Zero as makes no difference).

As a Barbarian you should really know that there is no cake, only Death!

Happy no-cake day Khorak.

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One thing about this argument that hasn't been brought up yet. We don't know how this would effect powers for other ATs. Quite often when a power is reduced somehow the subsequent power in other sets will be reduced by the same percentages. Now I don't know how much control the devs have over this as there have been powers that have been made nearly redundant for some ATs whilst they became balanced for others and vice versa. That could have been the devs doing or they could have been linked in some way.

Don't forget, when you mess around with controller primaries, for example, you might also make changes to defender secondaries.

[/ QUOTE ]I think, for the most part, this isn't the case. I was under the impression (and I may be wrong) that the sets available to one AT were independent of those available to another. Tweaking Stalker EA to give a +200% buff to -ToHit effects would not carry over to Brutes.

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The only time this would affect a Fire/ who is not /Kin is if that Fire/ was TEAMED with a /Kin.

[/ QUOTE ]And that's ok for all those non-Kin Fire/ Controllers is it?
Remember that not everyone solos their way through this game.

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Well, firstly, well spotted on the first point.

Secondly, my statement is not false at all, I am arguing for possibility.

Examine again, you can Alter a set so its effect is different but the next effect is zero (maybe even a net buff)

I will use a hypothetical example (Too much resources to do, dont advocate it blah blah blah)

Fire Control gets +25% to its hold and stun durations.

Activating Hot feet makes you immune to +recharge buffs and -recharge debuffs.

Now, how does that effect the combinations:

Anything but /Rad or /Kin:
Woohoo I can hold for 25% longer! I am t3h ub3r!
Wow, im immune to -recharge debuffs. Thats pretty handy!
Hmmm, I cant get sped up anymore. Well, its not too bad, I cant do that to myself anyway
Overall, its hard to argue that this would be anything but an average buff for fire control (heck, Id be pretty pleased with this on my Fire/Storm).
Rad:
As above, with the sorrow that the +recharge from AM would be lost. Overall, Id say toon was about averaged out.
Kin:
[censored]! YOU NERFED MY TOON TO HELL! Em/ TOYS OUT OF PRAM!

Now, im not saying you cant ALTER the effects of sets by "targetted" nerfs or buffs, but you can target the combination (imperfectly). In the above example, One combination is CLEARLY more affected than the others.

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Actually no, it would affect every fire/ controller as they would not gain any benefit from any +recharge buffs from other players. Nice try, but no.

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Ill give a more extreme example of a buff, as my argument applies equally to this, and it will probably upset people less and make them look at the cold logic:

Say you wanted to SPECIFICALLY buff a DM/Energy Stalker:

ENERGY ABSORBTION:
Activating this power also increases the value of your "to hit" debuffs by 200%.

Bear in mind hypothetical, not avocating, it doesnt need to make sense, etc.

This is clearly a targetted buff. It will also effect those taking Soul Mastery epic (on two powers), but are you really suggesting this is not a targetted buff on the combination DM/Energy?

[/ QUOTE ]Yes I agree this would be specific.

You notice the one significant difference though?
One example has a detrimental effect (scale is irrelevent) that impacts on every combination of the power set. The other does not. Any other stalker can take EA and see no difference in how their toon plays. All Fire/ controllers get bitten by the +recharge nerf.
No matter how much you try to buff as a counter balance, you cannot nerf specifically, it's not a precision instrument.

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Again Mr M. you state my position better than I could.

[/ QUOTE ]Not really.

You said, and I quote for clarity:
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it is entirely possible to target specific combinations

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and,
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Some combinations are going to be overpowered, and, again, it is entirely possible to target those combinations.


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I asked how can that be done, given that you have advocated that it is possible.
Mr M said:
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Well, exactly, you can't really can you.

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So what you're saying isn't actually possible is it?

Now I don't deny that some balancing is needed but you seem to neglect that trying to target specific combinations that are seen as "overpowered" can be done without detrimentally affecting other related combinations. But it can't so your statement is false.

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Lastly, and again, I feel im repeating myself, it is entirely possible to target specific combinations - if you need too. Clearly some sets are going to be overpowered, and you just need to nerf the set. Some combinations are going to be overpowered, and, again, it is entirely possible to target those combinations.

[/ QUOTE ]Yes I saw this in one of your earlier posts and dismissed it as unfounded wishwash. How exactly can you reduce the power of a specific powerset combo without detrimentally affecting other combos that carry one of the sets from that "balanced" combo? I do not believe it is possible.

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And, as I have said, that point is irrelevant. If FoTM build goes from 10% overperformance and, when people swap to the next FoTM, its only 9%, you have acheived something.

Unless you are proposing that the next FoTM combo is equal to or surpasses the first FoTM, which is unlikely as it is by definition "second choice".

[/ QUOTE ]Ah but you see the problem there is that it's not the "second choice" any longer and any changes to the FOTM power sets has an impact on every toon that has one of those two sets. That precious 1% of "progress" has also nerfed a wohle tranch of non-FOTM toons with it, they too feel the bite of your 1% (or however much it took to "balance" the FOTM combo) nerf.

In attempting to "balance" one set combo you've nerfed a whole load of non-FOTM toons. The result is a lowering of the average base level of power for that AT. So now you go to "balance" the new "first choice" and the cycle begins again, the next "second choice" becomes the new "first choice" and the average base level of power for that AT drops again. It's even possible that the cascading effects of your "balancing" will widen the gap between the FOTM combo and the average power of the AT overall.

The spiral continues until we're stuck with toons that can't fight their way out of a paper bag, or an EMP/ Defender.

In the final analysis you cannot "balance" any power set based on one specific combination of sets (eg SS/Wp, Fire/Kin, etc.), it always has a detrimental effect on other set combinations that share part of that FOTM combo.
The only way to balance a set is to look at it in comparison to its peers and only its peers.

It would be nice if I could actually BUY anything on the in-game store. But I can't as it's prejudiced against non-creditcard holders!

Slows matter because if you can't do anything then you're not going to be much use at all. What good is a tank that can't Taunt because it's still a pinprick in the powerbar? Or a Brute that can't build fury because no attacks are ready for another 20 seconds? And ofcourse there's the matter of actually getting at your target.

In the end though, the SS/Will or Will/SS debate won't go anywhere. It's in the same boat as Fire/Kin. Too good together, but not up to that much apart.

I'm not so sure that would work with the recharge time in account, unless there's a discrepancy between time taken to complete the attack chain and the time to recharge.
If everything is recharged ready to use it again when the chain reaches it then the only time factor to account for is the cumulative animation time.
Then all you need is Total Damage of one cycle / Total Animation Time.

The old Hero builder tool had an attack chain calculator covering everything down to endurance used. Great for testing the End consumption of my Bs/Sr build before doing a respec.

Sure, if you go after a WP toon with what it's most effective against then you will get better results than some other defence sets.
Try the same comparison with say, Fire damage. Or maybe run a comparison with Stone Armour? (Granite + Stone Skin + Rooted, nuff said)

There are also some weaknesses in Willpower that you haven't taken into account that can be crippling during combat.
-Regen effects will get a WP Brute or Tanks killed in seconds.
Slow and -Regen effects will bring a WP toon to a halt with very little effort.
Any non-S/L/Psi damage can make very short work of a WP toon if it doesn't have a horde in melee to regen off of.

Effectively the raw survival of WP is dependent of being "in the thick of it", remove that factor and WP isn't really any stronger than other defence sets.

With a team of Scrappers/Blasters you can almost Tank in Nova Form

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BTW: Why on dxp do more teams seem to think that upping the rep and picking missions that are +4/5 to most of the team is the way to maximise xp flow? Number of teams (and of longtime vets) that seemed to do this and xp suddenly slowed from a torrent to a trickle interspersed by Hospital trips...

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Yeah, that's really quite irritating. Enemies that are +2/+3 are quite enough for a DXP weekend considering you'll be pretty much just running through entire armies of them non-stop. I think it's better that way at all times, it's just plain boring when you have to stand there sizing up each and every spawn until someone just Leeroys in.

[/ QUOTE ]I think it's a case of illusions. There's the continuing myth that Purple = uber XP. Secondly there's the temptation with a steamroller team to "up the diff a bit". Unfortunately that's not as linear as it seems.

Back on topic I forgot to mention getting my PB a few bars so she made it to 39.

I got my Axe/Will broot from 19 to 33 and the difference in play is dramatic. In a little over two days she's gone from anaemic slugger, to rampaging juggernaught.

I couldn't care less what other bells and whistles get packed in with the MA. I just want to know when it will go to open beta so I can give it a darn good testing!

Or at least an idea of what it can and can't do so I can start working on ideas that won't turn out to be impossible.