Judgement_Dave

We already established that spade isn't currently in the censored list of words - which is good as in RL I do tend to use the phrase call a spade a spade (which,afaik, derives from digging implements).

But I can see that the name as a whole being frowned upon - partly as, if spade is taken in it's offensive US usage, it could be reminiscent of caricatured blacks/africans being almost pitch black with just white eyes and grinning/smiling white teeth visible. An image from a bygone age which would be offensive to many these days.

I'm trying to recall what your avatar was and so what the old theatre style was... Did you have a vaudeville song & dance act as an avatar? Or was it a recreation of an early play at the original Globe?

Can't recall it being anything I spotted as potentially offensive (on either side of the pond) whereas the name was always likely to be problematic US side.

Just hope that if the server lists ever do merge that they don't make you change your in-game names (since they are not derived from spade used as a racial-epithet).


BTW - I say blacks/africans as I'm not sure what term is the accepted norm for readers... And acceptable terms may vary around the world.

The irony is that you were called a troll and an outcast by someone who gives their location as Texas. Last I checked that was in the US and the poster has made reference to their SGs/channels on the US servers - so this has absolutely nothing to do with the NA/EU merger.

So no need to blame those pesky Europeans.

The loyalty period you refer to is used for the 2nd tier beta testers - so the 1st tier may have already been in for some time.

And thinking about it, IIRC, isn't it the case that you don't get money refunded if you cancel - you effectively just don't renew your sub. So many who pay 6 or 12 months at a time may already have paid for the qualifying period and so could, theoretically, be let in now if GR beta was running (and tier 1 had been invited already).

I currently expect tier 2 testing to coincide with the loyalty badge though.
I'd hope this, but wouldn't assume it.

Currently waiting to see if non-GR/expansion gets much by way of story content or if the devs consider expansions the way to do most, if not all, story content in future.

I'd now guess that if GR does even reasonably well then we'll probably see expansions (rather than subs-funded issues) for Atlantis and Space/moon. And I expect GR to do very well with any players who've been here for 6+ months.

BTW I consider GR going live in December (as opposed to 2010) as coming soon(ish).

That could give us:

I16 in August.
Sept is bug fixing on I16.
GR Tier 1 testers Oct
GR Tier 2 tetsers Nov
Tier 3 start of Dec

With tier 3 (pre-order) getting just a week or so (maybe 2 weeks) of testing pre-release.

Isn't guessing fun!

Oh it's obvious that people thinking every colour needs testing with every power are overcomplicating things and that's not the case. But there are the proliferated sets to consider.

And it also does seem to suggest that there may not be anything major (or arc/TF/story content) left to announce for I16.

I didn't really think it likely that there would be, but until the devs state that there's not or reveal the beta (or final feature list) it's still a possibility.

And even if GR is coming soon(ish), I'd hoped that there might be some small progress made in the story. To help set-up GR and the next major story-issue if nothing else.

No - I'm just not that far behind you, age-wise. But then, my memory for names/faces/dates was never good to begin with - whereas theories/formulas and 'useless' trivia for quizzes is a different matter entirely.

Was that merely a cunning aide memoire?? If so I salute you, it's even easier to remember than my mariage on the 10th anniversary of first going out together (somewhat romantic and keeps important dates to a manageable level for a bear of little brain).

Just another thing that may be different in the americas - our older europeans have no shame in dropping hints about upcoming major birthdays so that surprise parties can be arranged.

Either that or he's beginning to lose his memeory already and telling people is just a way to help ensure that someone else remembers.

That makes me wonder if I16 is quite a bit closer than we thought - i.e. a shorter beta is expected.

Sorry but must realise that you may be barking up a wrong (related but wrong) tree when your strongest evidence to support your claim comes from a Golden Girl post like the one you quote.

They are segregated by region.

Another topic entirely, but hopefully if ever they do merge the server/region lists we'll get truly global channels alongside it.

BTW - just checked and there's an EU channel called PRIDE with but 4 members and no description.. may be an EU gay Pride channel. Though there's no-one online in it to ask at the moment.

Exactly what I was thinking earlier but forgot to put in my posts.

I don't actually know - do any already exist EU side?

My apologies, I misunderstood.

I thought it was an extreme case of being given the cold shoulder!

I wonder if part of that is down to ignorance in the younger demographic that many games have. Last stats I saw CoX had an older playerbase than the industry average and it's always come across (in-game and in the forums) as more mature than many games.

Of course you always get the odd 'unelightened person of questionable intellect' - but that doesn't mean that they are representative of the majority. And usually if I've seen racism/homophobia or pretty much any serious discrimination in-game then the common factor has been how most people have shouted down the bigots...

Oddly, depending on the exact question/context and possible answers, I'm surprised that it wasn't a higher percentage for 'somewhat hostile' as you can't eliminate all the bigots, and all it takes is meeting 1 or 2 to potential sour a game and leave a lasting impression of hostility.

Again I'd guess a young demographic is partly to blame.

But this isn't really an ailment of video games, but merely a reflection of ignorance and slang usage in general.

This only starts to change when the word stops being used in a derogatory sense in any realm of life.






About the only things games developers can do to stop it being used like this are:

• make GMs punish this sort of abuse, and make the policy well known
• censor the word 'gay'

The first possibly has prohibitive costs (for the first case, although maybe not for it used as an abusive epithet).

The second causes some annoyance among parts of the playerbase (as seen earlier in this thread when the word being censored was commented as being a failure to acknowledge homosexuals even exist, iirc).

Hell - I bet that when many people who do use gay in the first case (i.e. that's so gay meaning it's lame/poor) they don't even consciously link it to homosexuality. Many slang words lose there derivation/meaning and get used just for general effect...

e.g. Calling someone an illegitimate child is a great insult to many, even though actually being an illegitimate child isn't seen as such a big deal (if at all) anymore. Peopl euse the word as it is a word that causes a reaction, rather than using it for its meaning.

In this case, I'd say, petition and adopt a sticks and stones approach.

Hell - have you ever looked at how many heterosexual characters/relationships in games are written in a cringe-worthy manner??

And that's even given that those game developers probably have more direct knowledge of heterosexual relationships. Many game developers just make a complete mess up of relationships and emotional content full stop.

So maybe some of the stereotypical representations are just because all characters are stereotypical to a great degree. Heck - I bet that some of the people who designed stereotypical gays were really trying to do what they thought was a realistic, non-stereotyped character. It's just that they fail.

The 'refusal' to add gay characters may be along a similar line. WHat if the developers are worried that they couldn't write a realistic gay and would end up unintentionally falling into a stereotype or a parody?

Wouldn't it be better of the devs to not create a gay character in this case than to risk doing something that potentially harms players views on homosexuality??

Of course theres a difference between some hideously stereotyped camp queen and a well-intentioned attempt that didn't work... but it may be hard for a player to know the difference in the devs intent.


As for most of these results, I'd guess that more context/background is needed.

If that's just in games in general then 'so what'?

If it's in games where there is an established explicitly heterosexual community (i.e. groups of straight gamers who see their heterosexuality as a defining feature) then that doesn't sound good. But surely if it's player-organised groups/communities then it can be easily rectified by starting a gay group/community.

That last sentence may seem a bit odd since I obviously side with the 'you don't need a gay SG' side on this thread. But it's entirely consistent with the fact that I am not aware of any CoX groups or communities that are straight and see that as a defining/qualifying feature.

i.e. I don't know of exclusively/overtly straight SGs (and if there were, it sounds like it may, possibly, be EULA breaking) so exclusively/overtly gay SGs aren't needed imo.

Of course, if anyone sets up a gay SG then I've no problem with it. And I wish it great success - I just don't see one as being a neccessity.

Well I guess I'm one of the two posters who quoted you and that you you responded to.

So I'll explain why I've not responded since.

You started your reply to me with:
Whereas my actual post had said:
Notice the 'It strikes me' and 'you seem' - I wasn't putting words in your mouth or misquoting you. I was stating a personal opinion the your post came across to me as saying that there was an in-game bias shown by the lack of non-heterosexual relationships in the games dev-created content, and that I thought tit a shame that you seemed to have this view.

As far as I can tell very we know nothing about the sexuality of all but a very few NPCs in-game. Good - that's how it should be. This is a superpowered MMO not some kind of interactive afternoon soap opera.

Unless there's an important plot point or it really is vital to the character background, then I don't care what the NPCs do to what (as long as living entities are capable of giving informed consent)!

You went on to comment about "the Husband/Wife agro comment". I had already addressed that in the post that you were replying to, stating that I know non-heterosexuals and non-married people who occasionally refer to their partner as 'the wife'. These people are not married, and so it is not a legal wife that they are referring to.

As you say you make an assumption when people say 'the wife' - that is your assumption and, whilst probably correct more often than not, is not always going to be correct.

I see capitals used like this and it looks like the poster is getting a little worked up/emotional.

On this subject I can understand that. It's an emotive subject for many and it's very possible that you've suffered discrimination in RL before now.

But, coupled with the apparent miscomprehension of posts, this possibility of emotional involvement with the subject leads me to believe that there's a high possibility of flames from any response to be made.

Hence I didn't make a response - well, not until you posted that we seemed to 'freeze up' on you.

If you look at the thread, I think just about everyone hopes the OP finds an active SG that they can have lots of fun with - it's just that with only 2 or 3 possible exceptions the posters don't seem to think it matters what kind of SG the SG is.

You should be able to join any SG without suffering bigotry. And if you do suffer, whether from an SG or not, then make the GMs work - it's what they're there for.

And yet in common parlance we refer to gay marriage, even if it's not legally a marriage.

I actually said married (or equivalent) just as this is an international forum and the legal term (and indeed acknowledgement of same sex relationships) could vary greatly from state to state.

To be fair on this one, they can use either if they're trying to send me money - I won't even be fussy if they use US billions/trillions rather than good old British ones!




I'd guess that a rain check is a rain check and never a rain cheque though, as it is a single phrase of US origin, even though the check part refers to a non-monetary check/cheque.

They'd be a reality already but for the fact that all research is kept in files that are closed each night - and the EULA stops the Prof from looking in the pig files the next morning.

Can see the difference in only running with a core of 4 people.

The fire/rad trollers took about 2 - 2.5 months, whereas these have taken about 5.5 months so far.

Been fun all the way though

But isn't that because you're using non-RP player information (e.g. the little origin indicator in the target window)?

If a character plays the role of someone who got their powers from Hermes then they got their powers from Hermes, regardless of whether their game stats state that they are technological/natural/mutant/scientific or magic.

Indeed many origin stories can be created that may have different possible origins that are all valid. So even if a character has a magic origin and RPs an origin that they believe to be magical another RPer could look at it and think "that's not magic that's natural"...

So for straight RP purposes I'd say it's a waste of time - RP your character as you want to RP and ignore the attached game-stats.

But if it was simple to implement, then there is probably a good (though minor) reason to allow origin respecs: The vets rewards powers.

Since origin used to mean very little in game it didn't matter which origin you picked.

Virtually all my characters are natural mainly because the SOs had less cryptic names - and I know a few other players who do similar (sticking to one origin mainly because they are used to the SOs). But even the difference in enhancements vanishes if you move onto IOs or when you have finished your final slotting at 50.

But perma-temp vets powers that have bonuses for different origins introduce a permanent difference between the origins.

Like I say - it's minor, but given that the perma-temps were added long after many characters had picked their (pretty inconsequential) origins I can see that as a reason to bring in an origin respec.

Ah - the tuba-kay defence.

Dr Who started in 1963 and the Buffy film was 1992 - so the Doctor has a mere 29 years head start... unless we count his time-travelling to give him millenia.

BTW - I'm still not sure that recent outings for Dr Who have been up to the standard of Tom Baker. The new chappies don't even carry jelly babies and risk getting a stiff neck in chilly weather - something that would never happen to the fourth doctor.

Pretty sure that the Norman conquest of Britain came after Romans, Vikings and various Germanic tribes!

(Though I can't recall whether or not the vikings continued occasional shopping trips to England up until the 13th or 14th centuries... it went on for a while, but then we developed ferries and cheap flights and now wreak revenge sending stag parties marauding in the rough direction of the viking homelands.)

I didn't mention most of the Norman influence mainly because most of my tongue-in-cheek potted history of English was responding to the point that a large portion of English is courtesy of the French. Yes a fair bit is - but a lot more is due to other languages/races and a fair bit we just made up all by ourselves...

My guess is also that French probably owed hell of a lot to latin, and we'd already had bit of an infusion of that with the Romans.

Over time we managed to get a sort of mongrel language that finds it hard to trace all its ancestors - and it became all the richer for that.

Still not sure where the Greek came from...