Hemmingway
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Posts
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Joined
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Quote:^ Professional on being terrible right hereOriginally Posted by vindizzLe
Making sarcastic application posts in the draft thread to mask how terrible someone is is an unheard of tactic. -
Let's put it to a captain's vote.
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Quote:There is goal oriented PvP in capturing boxes in RV and Hotspots in Siren's and Launching a nuke in WB. The thing is, there is not a significant reward or incentive. Also, it is very repetitive.. You win RV once, and nothing special happens.. there is no victory screen.. just "Heroes/Villains Win!" All you get for a reward is a lame summon. If you could get a PvP IO by capturing pillboxes, (or something similar, does not have to be IOs) it might actually spring some competition. This may well lead to farming, but people already farm for IOs..Originally Posted by BattleWraith
goal-oriented pvp variation
These are just some thoughts to consider on that topic.
RE: Arcana's analogy
I think it would have been better to say the kid hates the gift but plays with it anyway because their old toys are replaced for this one. Too literal? I am not trying here.. -
Lol I forgot about this thread, but there is some valuable information in here now. Edit: there are also some more mostly ignorant posts from a certain poster who has found a new interest in being wrong in PvP related threads.
In response to mez durations: I would like to see some kind of skill based prevention/removal for mez. In PvE, you can pop a break free to get a CM. In PvP CM only marginally lowers mez duration and break frees do diddly. Hardly a worthwhile reason to apply it ever 85 seconds or so. (and that is not why people CM for the most part) Obviously, this is not an easy mechanic to add, because it trivializes mez if you can just remove it completely in one click.
Also, I do not think that DR was a bad idea. It was just implemented poorly and hastily. I think that DR could be applied to help balance the mez problem. Barring that, mez durations need to be normalized. See: Stalagmites, Stunning Shot, TK.
Will this happen? Not for a long time, at least. -
Quote:As founded as you think this statement may have been, you cannot and do not speak for all of the players, be it at launch, i4, or otherwise. You do not know why people bought this game.Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
While the edit to my post does indeed make it more accurate I still stand behind what I said. Arcana can say things a bit more eloquently than me though. My point was, I didn't buy this game for PvP and neither did anyone else before Issue 4, a year after launch.
The game was never advertised to have PvP before that time either. That is all. -
The suggestion brought up by the OP is flawed but has some desirable aspects. People have pointed those out already, so I will not. However, there are a lot of off-topic and ignorant posts in this thread, so I will focus on those.
Quote:There is plenty of interest in PvP, but most people do not stick with it because the mechanics are horrid.Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
There's almost no interest. I don't think a new FFA zone, even cross server if it were possible, would cure that.
There was a large PvP population and there still is a small population. The population would not have shrunk so if the mechanics had not been gutted in the first place.Quote:Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
Before any work is done creating an entire new zone for PvP, you'd need an active PvP population/ interest in, which we do not have.
PvP was plenty popular. Just because "a large chunk" of you were not/are not interested in PvP does not mean that there are not plenty of people who are interested.Quote:Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
PvP was never popular in this game. I joined a week before Issue 4 introduced Arena's. One of the things that drew me to this game over others was the fact that it had no PvP. Once it was added it was strictly created as being optional for that very reason, a large chunk of us didn't care for it and would've rioted if forced to do so.
This statement is as true as saying "I live in North Korea and there is no Democracy. Democracy is dead." Just because you do not see people PvPing on whatever under-populated server you play on does not mean that it does not exist.Quote:Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
After CoV launched, we started getting a serious PvP crowd. All the same, on most servers Siren's and Warburg were desolate zones. My namesake Blaster spent his entire 24 - 28 levels running the repeat missions in Siren's for the extra bonus they (at the time) gave. In the months I flew around the zone I only saw 2 villains. Ever. It was a blast being chased all over the place by a Stalker that was hunting me for a few days, He'd gank me coming out a mission door. I'd then stealth stalk him and wait for my chance. We had the entire zone to ourselves, during primetime, for days...
PvP is dead. No interest from us means no interest from the Dev's. Fact is, something would have been done by now if the PvP crowd was large enough to warrant it. Since PvP is all but ignored by the Dev's we must infer this to mean the vocal PvP crowd is insignificant to the big picture and would thus be a waste of valuable resources.
This has never been anything more than a convenient excuse. The developers knew that they were stabbing the existing PvP community in the back when they implemented the i13 changes.Quote:Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
It's not bashing a particular group because they are in the minority. It's pointing out the fact that, from the companies view, The manpower/hours and resources would be more profitable being spent on other areas.
Numbers have been given out in the past. The PvP community is not as small as you seem to think it is. It is not a non-issue. They have to decide who they will cater to with each update. So far, they have decided not to cater to the PvP community very many times.Quote:Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
They are the only ones with actual numbers concerning this. They are the only ones who can decide if it's worth it. Since they haven't it becomes apparent that you are, in fact, such a small percentage that it's a non-issue to them. I'm sorry if that hurts your feelings. Being left out is never fun.
Your idea of fact is laughable. You have contradicted yourself in this paragraph, alone.Quote:Originally Posted by MaestroMavius
Point of fact. Nobody in this thread has been negative towards those that like PvP. That's a kneejerk reaction based on your perception. The PvP crowd is shunned in most areas of the forums, so you assume anytime it's mentioned it's negative. Re-read the thread and you'll see most of us in support of the suggestion, while offering up alternatives and laying our facts about the history of PvP in this game. View that as bashing if you want, that's your call.
Is that some Espanol?Quote:Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
De nada.
Who are you kidding? Most people that have been playing more than a few months can start most SF/TFs by themselves.Quote:Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
RV sees a little activity, but if I put all the people I've run across in RV in the last year together, I'd have a hard time starting most task forces.
Just because there is no activity on your server does not mean there is no activity. I already made this point once.Quote:Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
And arenas? Don't make me laugh. They have never been all that busy. Perhaps you have scheduled events with a little group. I don't know. But other than starting a few myself with a friend or two, I've seen NO activity in those for a long time.
The former must precede the latter.Quote:Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
PVP needs fixing and it needs more widespread interest.
You have to be just as willing to stay on the move as they are willing to wait for you to stand still.Quote:Originally Posted by Remaugen
Years back I tried PvP and got tired of dying to the Stalkers every other heartbeat. Since then they have made it a bit easier to survive that first hit, but Stalkers still own PvP every time I have tried.
I see you are well educated in the ways of made-up statistics.Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Not really, the PvP crowd was only 5% or so of the overall population, with maybe an additional 5% that dabbled in it from time to time.
The only people that have a significant impact on the game are the developers. The developers decided it was justified to abandon a sizable portion of their players. They have lost revenue because of it. I don't see how you figure even one subscriber is irrelevant. The more people subscribed, the more active the game is in all areas and the more development money there is to imporve the game as a whole.Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
The fact that they haven't touched it much in the last couple years is pretty telling in that regard. If the PvPers who left had had any kind of significant impact on the game you can bet they would have made more of an attempt at fixing it. Since they didn't, it can be inferred that the PvP population was never big enough to make or break the game, and whether they stay or leave is largely irrelevant.
You forgot the part about those people paying good money to NCSoft that could have been/was used to improve the game.Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
The only effect PvPers having multiple accounts has is it artificially inflates the numbers and makes it appear that there are more people doing it than there really are.
Personally, I don't think you know very much about PvP in this game past or present, so what you think is about as irrelevant as any other random. See below:Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Oh, and if you look at what I said 5% of 120,000 is 6,000 people. If you add the other 5% that occasionally engaged in PvP you have about 12,000.
Personally, I think assuming there were ever 12,000 PvPers at any point in this game's history is an incredibly generous number. It was probably much less than that in actuality.
Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
My percentages are pure wild guessesAnd you do not know any better.Quote:Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
Agreed. If there were that many there would have been tournaments and the typical pvp activity every week.
There wasn't.
This describes several posters in this thread.Quote:Originally Posted by MAD UMLAUTS
je saist junior
tl;dr: Why do you post things as statements when you clearly do not know what you are talking about?
Sup Katalyst -
Quote:^ In case anyone needed to find confidence in the development team.Originally Posted by Arcanaville
PvP may have been a design intent of the alpha version of City of Heroes, but there is not even a hint of a trace of anyone involved in either the game mechanics or the powers system design thinking about PvP for even one millisecond in the release version of the game. Not only is there no evidence of someone designing things knowing they would one day have to deal with PvP, there is direct evidence all over the place of people doing things that even by extremely generous standards no one in their right minds would do if they knew PvP was coming - and I say that grading on a curve for what the devs were doing with the powers system that early.
They may have thought it was coming, but the devs acted, in the implementation of the game, like they were not obligated to avoid doing things that could severely impact it. So not only did they not design the game with PvP in mind, they actually designed it in a way to explicitly make PvP more difficult to implement. -
@Hemm
Available for matches on weekends - most likely, but I am living at school during the weeks and I do not yet know if I am going to move my computer back and forth. Also I may have sport-type things to do, don't know yet. -
With accolades you want HP to be at 1500 at least. Also you will not use maneuvers, so put the kismet in stealth or Ice shield. You dont really need phase shift if you have hiber already, so you may want to pick up fighting pool for tough.
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1500 is a good amount of HP, but you can get more, and you want as much as you can get.
I would not go out of my way to get that much damage buff, but it is good to have it. Diminishing returns does reduce it by a larger number the more you have.
The Accuracy bonus is good.
Are you using a Kismet proc in any defense power? You should, but note that the power must be toggled on to use it.
That is a lot of recharge bonus. It will get reduced by Diminishing Returns quite a bit, and you do not need that much.
Domination does refill your end bar. However, zone tends to be very spammy when it comes to using powers. This means you will run out of end if you do not have a good amount of recovery. That said, you have nearly 2.0end/sec net recovery. That is usually the point I try to aim for.
You want to have mag 48 KB protection for FF defenders with slotted up Force Bolt.
Make sure that your first priority is getting good slotting on you attacks (Flares, Fire Blast, Blaze) and your important mez powers (Levitate, Dominate, TK, even Confuse and Mesmerize - these should also have some/good damage enhancement). You also want to be near the travel speed cap - after DR. Diminishing returns makes it very difficult to get to the runspeed cap (especially if you run Stealth) so you will want to have near ED enhancement in Super Speed and some enhancement in Sprint aswell. It is easier to get to the jump speed cap, but you also want a lot of jump height so you can stay in the air longer and reach higher places. Try to get near ED jumping in Super Jump as well.
Do you have phase, hiber, or both? A resist shield? Tough? Stealth? -
I think as a community running this league, we need to try to help out anyone that wants to participate in this league. If it turns out that it is not viable to PvP as a premium player, so be it. However, if it is possible, then we need to do what we can to make it happen.
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Alpha slot is not game breaking, no, but it is a big advantage. End redux and +20% range on a blaster? Or 33% additional damage enhancement that partially ignores ED. That is a pretty big deal.
I do agree that the other incarnates are a much bigger deal, however. This gives more reason to ban them, obviously.
And on the topic of no access to IOs, a lot of vets do have toons IOd already, but they won't be able to safely respec. And that is a huge barrier stopping free players from joining. -
There is something else that needs to be added to this discussion. All incarnates (Alpha slot included) will be VIP ONLY. This means that if any incarnates are allowed, free players or premium players will be at a serious disadvantage. Basically, PvP is pay-to-win with i21.
Unless there is an Arena option to disable incarnates coming with i21, I do not see a way to have free/premium players participate in balanced PvP for this league. Even if you ban Alpha slot, unless you are level shifted you can't tell if someone has it equipped. -
This is not a trial account.
The issue not not only that they are a pain to grind out on multiple toons, but also that they are yet another group of powers that are not even close to balanced to PvP. -
Elec would do fine against builds that do not have an extra means of end recovery. e.g Fiery Aura. Even then, KM is better because Concentrated Strike is that OP.
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Incarnates are broken and horribly unbalanced.
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Quote:I did not tell you that you have no right to talk. I told you that you and your statements were ignorant, pretentious, asinine, contrived, and wrong. Based on this statement alone, I was warranted:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
*shrug*
When I have a bad customer experience, I take my business elsewhere.
As far as I can tell, the PvPers in CoH are gluttons for punishment. Any other group of people in this game, upon having the part of it they enjoy the most gutted, would have moved on to a game that gives them the experience they want. But PvPers here hang on in the (probably vain) hope that, someday, the devs might make it all better.
They will probably look at PvP again, and make changes. But, if the past is any indication, what they end up doing isn't going to be what PvPers want.
I'm not a hardcore PvPer, and I never claimed to be. What I am is a "casual" PvPer. I mess around with it on occasion just for fun, and I don't take it too seriously. I don't think I've ever made a dedicated PvP build (mostly because I don't want to farm my buttocks off to afford all the stuff I'd need for it), and I'm happy with where my PvP skill level is (honestly somewhere in the neighborhood of "mediocre")
So I guess since I'm not "invested" in PvP or "dedicated" to it, I'm not allowed to say anything about it?
And PvPers wonder why they're the red-headed stepchildren of this game. If you didn't come into a conversation with people outside your little circle throwing insults and derision at them, maybe you wouldn't be huddled your little corner and the REST of the game might actually care that you exist. I don't personally have anything against PvPers, but I gotta say, the attitude some of you have toward anyone who isn't one of you isn't helping your case any.
(The last part was directed at the guy who made his first post to tell me how I have no right to talk about PvP because I'm not invested in it)
Ignorant as you are, you may not know that many of the (past and present) 'best' or most active PvPers are among the 'best' and most active PvEers. Personally, I did not get into PvP because I revel trash talking or farming noobs. I became a member of the PvP community because I enjoy playing this game and the PvE content has long since stopped entertaining me. I joined the PvP community after years of almost exclusively PvEing. After my short time participating in this games PvP I find myself empathizing with most all the sentiments and wishes of the rest of the PvP community.Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffectSorry, this game does not live or die by the PvP population. That has been conclusively PROVEN already. Every single PvPer could up and leave right now and the game would not even notice.
I stated that you are not an invested member of the PvP community because it is obvious that you are ignorant to the current state of PvP and how it got there as well as ignorant of the people that participate in PvP. I did not tell you to shut up and go away, I told you to get it right next time you want to trash talk PvP and it's players.
You stated that the PvP in this game was not a significant part of this game. You seem to think that PvP is not a viable extension of the story based PvE in this game. Do you know the lore of the PvP zones? It speaks for itself. The reason people don't play it (as much as they would, or did) is because the mechanics are broken and have been ignored for years. PvP is part of the game that people payed for upon purchasing city of Heroes/Villains in the first place. Your subscription and mine also pay for the server resources that facilitate it.
Again you are wrong. Travel suppression helps melee to fight kiting ranged toons. It certainly is not the best way to help that situation, but it does help melee more than it helps ranged. Aside from that, it is not the case that range is in every case better than melee. You don't know a whole lot about PvP (obvious), so you do not know what a stalker, scrapper, brute, or tanker brings to the table in team based PvP.Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffectRanged ATs will ALWAYS have the advantage over melee ATs, and there's nothing that can really be done about that. Getting rid of Travel Suppression and Heal Decay will help, but it's not going to fix everything by itself.
Again, wrong. With i13, they made many changes that were not what the current PvP community wanted. They suggested many things to the Devs but were mostly ignored. Instead the Devs tried to cater to would-be PvPers among the rest of the community. They failed, as the mechanics they introduced were not fun for PvErs either. They also promised that they would continue to work on PvP with every issue following i13. That promise was then completely abandoned. So you still think that the animosity felt for the development team for what has happened (or not happened) to PvP is unwarranted? The Devs did plenty to earn the hostility that they have received. Some of it has certainly been out of line, and some understated. This is not so different to responses to nerfs or changes to PvE. Enhancement Diversification was not met with parties and parades either.Quote:Originally Posted by ClawsandEffectTheir work is cut out for them and anything they do will be met with scorn and anger.
I am sure there are other ways I could correct or berate you, but this post is long enough.
tl;dr To say that PvP is not a relevant part of this game is offensive and ignorant. You do not have the knowledge to justify your claims. -
Quote:I want you to know that your post makes you seem more ignorant than the OP. Sadly, he is a semi-successful troll and you actually believe in the garbage you just spewed onto these boards. You are obviously not invested in CoX PvP in any way, nor do you know people who are. You seem to be willing to put plenty of time showing off your opinion. Why not spend some of that time looking some things up, that way you might actually be right next time?Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Blah Blah Blah, words, and poorly constructed thoughts.
And because this line fits you so very well:
Quote:Originally Posted by Tom GabelYou're coming off kinda contrived and pretentious